A Closer Look at How Xbox Series X|S Integrates Full AMD RDNA 2 Architecture

TimFL said:
Microsoft is a software company that takes whatever AMD gave them 1:1, whereas Sony is a hardware company that took RDNA2 and made it better in certain aspects (e.g. superior SSD mechanics), which naturally means they don't have full RDNA2.

Sony has RDNA2.5.
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Not sure if serious šŸ§
 
BeardGawd said:
First off we don't know if Sony has their own implementations. Digital Foundry has went on record that Sony has refused to answer if they have SFS, VRS, etc... equivalents.

Secondly even if Sony has custom implementations that doesn't mean they will be as good/performant as what MS and AMD were able to come up with.

If Sony's implementations were better AMD would be using those solutions on PC (Mark Cerny mentioned this himself) which AMD is not. So that should give you a clue.
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I highly doubt AMD would allow Sony to claim their RDNA2 architecture if they were removing standard features and not implementing something similar, or their own custom equivalent.

PS5 is RDNA2. The performance gains and architecture improvements proves that alone.
 
In our quest to put gamers and developers first we chose to wait for the most advanced technology from our partners at AMD before finalizing our architecture. Now, with the upcoming release of Xbox Series X|S and the new AMD Radeon RX 6000 Series GPUs, developers have a common set of next-generation tools and performance capabilities that will empower them to deliver transformative gaming experiences across both console and PC.
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I probably need to re-read the article but I'm still not sure what this actually means, a lot is mentioned about the DX12u feature set - and of course Sony doesn't use DX.
 
lol I told you all not to celebrate too early. I saw some posts claiming that it was PS5 that was full rdna 2.0 because it had higher clocks.

I will tell xbox fans to not celebrate too early either because at the end of the day, in game performance is what matters and if the ps5 and xsx have identical or 18% difference in pixels than it wont really matter who has full rdna 2.0.
 
CS Lurker said:
In our quest to put gamers and developers first we chose to wait for the most advanced technology from our partners at AMD before finalizing our architecture. Now, with the upcoming release of Xbox Series X|S and the new AMD Radeon RX 6000 Series GPUs, developers have a common set of next-generation tools and performance capabilities that will empower them to deliver transformative gaming experiences across both console and PC.
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Yes. To wait for the full standard RDNA2 feature set.

Sony went their own way.
 
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Concern said:
Some of you guys completely miss the point. Both consoles will mostly have parity besides maybe one with a better framerate or higher res or even better rt.

The point is the majority of people have been in the spec thread saying Xbox is RDNA 1.5 and that apparently today some secret sauce for ps5 would be unveiled.

The opposite happened. What was already known to everyone besides some fanboys was confirmed. Xbox is RDNA2 and no Ps5 secret sauce.

Guys are way too bent out of shape over this. The ones who were wrong just admit it and move on.
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such naivete, I envy you good sir. :)
you are severely underestimating the depths of depravity you're about to witness.
 
Black_Stride said:
Sony have said nothing about ML support if thats not part of the feature set they thought they needed, this is gonna be a long generation for them.
You are going to build in DirectML abilities after the fact from scratch and expect it to run in real time?
Alright.
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There was an article about ML around 2 years ago for the console as well as support for it in the Pro. Cerny was pretty interested in ML for some time now. But regardless, even if it's not supported I don't particularly expect much ML this gen anyways. Even the support on the Xbox doesn't add up to much in the long haul. But if somethings missing I expect it to not be ML honestly, probably a different feature.

I think ppl are overblowing this tbh, to this time we still haven't really seen any big differentiators between the two. Both are gonna be great.
 
I feel like this only matters to people that constantly quote tech features in hardware trying to one up the other guy. Sadly thats a lot of the Sony bridged on this forum. Might be upsetting to them.
 
TheContact said:
it's a tactic used in marketing, politics, propaganda etc... basically pushing disinformation to put a competitor at a disadvantage while appealing to others sense of fear. it's not always done intentionally (like in your case when you said XSX has software based RT (it doesnt)).
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Microsoft inside invented it
 
SlimySnake said:
lol I told you all not to celebrate too early. I saw some posts claiming that it was PS5 that was full rdna 2.0 because it had higher clocks.

I will tell xbox fans to not celebrate too early either because at the end of the day, in game performance is what matters and if the ps5 and xsx have identical or 18% difference in pixels than it wont really matter who has full rdna 2.0.
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It's funny how the sustained clocks came in much lower than what many were expecting (consoles don't thermal boost so desktop boost numbers that will be rarely hit on AMD cards don't figure in).
 
On Demand said:
Yes. To wait for the full standard RDNA2 feature set.

Sony went their own way.
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Which one are you?
4175361_color1-5c3b9069c9e77c0001c6c85f.png



Realistically you should probably stay out of Xbox threads they are causing you great distress anytime its even remotely good news.
 
Kssio_Aug said:
And thanks to that, it has also probably higher temps!! Don't forget it Xbox fanboys!!
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True, since the PS5's SoC is a bit smaller than the Series X' and also clocked higher, it indeed generates more heat.
Since it's somewhat harder to dissipate enough heat from a smaller diesize than a bigger one, it's not surprising they went for a liquid metal insulator.
 
consoles are not going to get infinity cache

Navi 21 will have a 128MB Infinity Cache. Meanwhile AMD isn't speaking about other GPUs, but those will presumably include smaller caches as fast caches eat up a lot of die space. On which note, doing some quick paper napkin math and assuming AMD is using standard 6T SRAM, Navi 21's Infinity Cache would be at least 6 billion transistors in size, which is a significant number of transistors even on TSMC's 7nm process (for reference, the entirety of Navi 10 is 10.3B transistors). In practice I suspect AMD has some optimizations in place to minimize the number of transistors used and space occupied, but regardless, the amount of die space they have to be devoting to the Infinity Cache is significant. So this is a major architectural trade-off for the company.
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Though at least one console maker, have worked with Amd on gpu cache. :messenger_savoring:

On-chip caches for GPU usage are not a new idea, especially for AMD. The company included a 32MB eSRAM cache for the Xbox One (and Xbox One S) SoC, and even before that the Xbox 360 had an on-package cache as well. But this is the first time we've seen a large cache on a PC GPU.
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www.anandtech.com

AMD Reveals The Radeon RX 6000 Series: RDNA2 Starts At The High-End, Coming November 18th

www.anandtech.com www.anandtech.com
 
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Wandering Leopard said:
I probably need to re-read the article but I'm still not sure what this actually means, a lot is mentioned about the DX12u feature set - and of course Sony doesn't use DX.
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Yeah I don't think this is different to what we knew. Sony would have to implement their own custom libraries to have the 'custom' RDNA2. There's an argument over whether native is better (I personally believe it is), but custom stuff can be tailored better with a higher support overhead. Either way, it's a win for MS but it's not necessarily a loss for Sony. I'd probably err on the side of being excited than crowing personally.
 
This thread is slightly embarrassing. And to be honest I think the MS marketing team should also be slightly embarrassed with themselves.

But you could argue that it is working given some posts in this thread. The key sentence is: "Xbox Series X|S are the only next-generation consoles with full hardware support for all the RDNA 2 capabilities AMD showcased today."

So it is not that they have all hardware features of RDNA2. it means they support all RDNA2 capabilities that was shown today. Or in other words there is at least one feature on this slide that Sony has chosen to have their own solution for:

 
Yeah, it's obvious that it is more of an 'off the shelf' part. Which is fine because it fits Xbox's strategy better for PC integration etc.

But I expect PS5 to be a better optimized piece of hardware on a per game basis...we already see that there is no advantage to the supposed power difference between the two and ray tracing seems to be implemented more easily and better on PS5.

Of course you can get around that by playing the games on a high end PC through GamePass, if you have one.
 
TheContact said:
it's a tactic used in marketing, politics, propaganda etc... basically pushing disinformation to put a competitor at a disadvantage while appealing to others sense of fear. it's not always done intentionally (like in your case when you said XSX has software based RT (it doesnt)).
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I know what it means, was just confused why he just posted FUD when I only quoted the article.

But what you said just confused me more.
So far I got that it's Software RT with dedicated hardware to accelerate it.
But now you're saying it's not software based so how can it be Hardware Accelerated if it has hardware based RT Cores?
 
wow Xbox is taking no prisoners this generation. Absolutely coming out swinging. On a related note, in order to not upset fans of Sony's camp, how doesn't MS market their advantages over the PS5 without angering them or is it impossible?
 
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Xiung Wang Wei said:
Microsoft announces PS5 is not full RDNA 2

that means it can be half, custom, but not full
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Sony claimed PS5 is RDNA2.

MS claims Series S/X are the only fully integrated RDNA2 consoles.

It can literally mean PS5 is 1% RDNA2. You'll never know because Sony shut their mouths about RDNA2 feature set.
 
Elog said:
This thread is slightly embarrassing. And to be honest I think the MS marketing team should also be slightly embarrassed with themselves.

But you could argue that it is working given some posts in this thread. The key sentence is: "Xbox Series X|S are the only next-generation consoles with full hardware support for all the RDNA 2 capabilities AMD showcased today."

So it is not that they have all hardware features of RDNA2. it means they support all RDNA2 capabilities that was shown today. Or in other words there is at least one feature on this slide that Sony has chosen to have their own solution for:

Click to expand...

Whats embarrassing is people fighting for a piece of plastic constantly trying to claim they are smarter than everyone else and then when its proven for the 100th time they are talking out their ass they still double down.

These threads wouldnt be so toxic if that didnt happen.
 
XboxGAF doesn't realize that this doesn't mean PlayStation 5 isn't RDNA 2.

Watch RedGamingTech video. Sony doesn't need all RDNA features for console.
 
StreetsofBeige said:
Sony claimed PS5 is RDNA2.

MS claims Series S/X are the only fully integrated RDNA2 consoles.

It can literally mean PS5 is 1% RDNA2. You'll never know because Sony shut their mouths about RDNA2 feature set.
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I wonder why Sony just won't just come out and explain their in house or custom solutions for mesh shaders, VRS, etc. Editors at Digital Foundry have been pestering them for months with no answers at all or just dodging the questions. There needs to be more transparency.
 
Goal post has moved geordiemp geordiemp now says its rdna 3 in the spec thread guys. We'll just have to wait a little longer for that event

www.neogaf.com

Next-Gen PS5 & XSX |OT| Console tEch threaD

Please, read the article instead of just the tweet if you want to comment on what they say and they don't. You quoted a post where one of the quotes come from the article lol "Xbox Series X|S are the only next-generation consoles with full hardware support for all the RDNA 2 capabilities AMD...
www.neogaf.com www.neogaf.com
 
DForce said:
XboxGAF doesn't realize that this doesn't mean PlayStation 5 isn't RDNA 2.

Watch RedGamingTech video. Sony doesn't need all RDNA features for console.
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The funny thing is that having a custom solution of somethig usually is a pointer for an even better implementation, is not even discussed here;-)
 
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