Support NeoGAF

[Count of Monte Sawed-Off]

Does anyone else find it incredibly difficult to follow/remember all the names in the Dany chapters?

I quit trying. Too many of them and her chapters all sucked anyway.

 

[yacobod]

I quit trying. Too many of them and her chapters all sucked anyway.

The bigger problem is you are introduced to a ton of new characters that you simply do not give a flying fuck about. And the whole eastern/middle eastern stereotypes flying around.

Only cool new character introduced in Mereen was the Shavepate. BOSS.

 

[CrunchyB]

Does anyone else find it incredibly difficult to follow/remember all the names in the Dany chapters?

You mean Zirgag uh Zurgag, Huzig zo Huzag and Zurzag also known as the Shavepate?

Hell yeah I had problems keeping them apart until almost the end of the book, and that almost never happens to me.

I did like how Arch called them all Hazzoo.

 

[thefro]

Finally got the book yesterday and knocked out a few chapters. Feels weird to be reading some more of the story.

 

[BeeDog]

Finding it a bit hard to get through this book, but the only reason I can think of is the absurd gap between each Bran chapter. Too much Tyrion/Daenerys shit for my liking.

 

[Purkake4]

Not sure if posted yet, full ADWD spoilers.

All of the little things

 

[PhoenixDark]

yacobod does your post have spoilers in it, should I wait to finish before highlighting?

 

[Basileus777]

yacobod does your post have spoilers in it, should I wait to finish before highlighting?

It's about the same Jon chapter you were talking about.

 

[Amir0x]

Not sure if posted yet, full ADWD spoilers.

All of the little things

.

Spoiler

"When the sun rises in the west and sets in the east," Quentyn Martell's death, he is the sun.
"When the seas go dry" The Dothraki Sea has gone dry.
"and mountains blow in the wind like leaves." Something something the Mountain that Shambles. We don't know what Qyburn did to him, presumably something that fulfills this bit."

shiiiiiiiiiii

God I just finished this book. What an amazing book. I am so glad Essos was given this time in the sun - now it feels like a fully fleshed out place whose politics matter in the scheme of the world, instead of this incredibly Western-centric epic which just incidentally had locations out East.

Next book wait will be terrible

 

[PhoenixDark]

you know nothing PD.

Spoiler

But how stupid is Jon for not keeping Ghost at his side at all times? He's like Dany level stupid for sending all his potential friends away from him. I doubt he's dead though because he's surrounded by wildlings that support him, ghost is nearby, and so is Melisandre. He's totally going to be AA reborn. Mel says something to the effect "I look for AA and all I see is Snow (with the emphasis that it's capitalized).

Spoiler

I understand him consenting to lock the wolf up during visits to the queen, but the decision not to bring Ghost to the meeting was pure madness. He could have demanded the warg keep his bull locked up. As a warg himself you'd think he'd know Ghost didn't want to harm the bull - if it did, wouldn't Jon's mouth begin to salivate at some point? Also, the decision to send his most trusted friends away was baffling. I "get" his logic, but at the same time his father would never send his closest friends/allies away in such a situation. Nor would anyone else...at least you'd think. Jeez.

I thought most of Jon's NW decisions made sense. The one that didn't make much sense was his idea to march for Winterfell, and the decision to save the wildlings at Hardhelm. Riding for Winterfell seemed like a blatant break of his vows, and the Hardhelm mission was a suicide mission. Would have made more sense to send a few ships to watch the coast, and turn back once they saw the slave ships. It may not be honorable, but a life of servitude is certainly preferable to dying and being reborn as a wight.

With Jon on the brink of death, what does the Watch possibly hope to do against the Wildlings? They're severely outnumbered, and Stannis is allegedly dead alongside his host.

 

[Sirpopopop]

Overall Jon arc spoiler.

Spoiler

They couldn't send some more ships to Hardhome. 1. I don't think they had more ships. 2. Dead things in the water. Overland route or nothing, and you can't leave that many people up there to become wighted. So, he had to resolve that situation. At the very least you get there just in time to do a mass burning.

 

[LegendofJoe]

Spoiler

With Jon on the brink of death, what does the Watch possibly hope to do against the Wildlings? They're severely outnumbered, and Stannis is allegedly dead alongside his host.

Whole Book spoilers:

Spoiler

The Watch is screwed. The Wildlings are going to massacre Marsh and his co-conspirators. They could not have picked a worse time to attack Jon.

 

[PhoenixDark]

Overall Jon arc spoiler.

Spoiler

They couldn't send some more ships to Hardhome. 1. I don't think they had more ships. 2. Dead things in the water. Overland route or nothing, and you can't leave that many people up there to become wighted. So, he had to resolve that situation. At the very least you get there just in time to do a mass burning.

Spoiler

They could have still sent smaller, fewer ships to watch the situation then gtfo. Sounds like slavers are taking a good amount of the group.

 

[yacobod]

Spoiler

With Jon on the brink of death, what does the Watch possibly hope to do against the Wildlings? They're severely outnumbered, and Stannis is allegedly dead alongside his host.

Spoiler

Well I don't think Jon is dead, but I can see the NW taking heavy casualties because I don't see any scenario where this doesn't end in violence. Tormund Giantsbane is there with his foot long member and 50 warriors to support Jon, and the book says the odds of freemen to NW members is like 5 to 1. It seems that Marsh and company picked a real bad time to Julius Caeser Jon.

 

[PhoenixDark]

Spoiler

Well I don't think Jon is dead, but I can see the NW taking heavy casualties because I don't see any scenario where this doesn't end in violence. Tormund Giantsbane is there with his foot long member and 50 warriors to support Jon, and the book says the odds of freemen to NW members is like 5 to 1. It seems that Marsh and company picked a real bad time to Julius Caeser Jon.

Spoiler

I don't think he'll die either, just that he's on the brink; chances are by the time he's well again, the violence will have already occurred or be ongoing. I can't imagine Tormund doing nothing. It would have made far more sense to kill Jon on his way to Winterfell...

 

[Count of Monte Sawed-Off]

Spoiler

I don't think he'll die either, just that he's on the brink; chances are by the time he's well again, the violence will have already occurred or be ongoing. I can't imagine Tormund doing nothing. It would have made far more sense to kill Jon on his way to Winterfell...

<Final Jon Chapter Spoiler>

Spoiler

I'd just let him go to Winterfell and hope that either the winter or the Bastard of Bolton would do him in, and if not execute him when he got back for breaking his vows. Then again if were successul he'd probably have himself an army of wildlings and northmen.

 

[yacobod]

I am so glad Essos was given this time in the sun - now it feels like a fully fleshed out place whose politics matter in the scheme of the world, instead of this incredibly Western-centric epic which just incidentally had locations out East.

I really don't think Slaver's Bay is all that fleshed out. I think its just a bad middle-eastern/oriental caricature.

Reasons why Dany's chapters sucked:

The more she drank, the more she shat.

I would give up my crown if he asked it of me, Dany thought...but he had not asked it, and never would.

If I look back, I am lost.

-Introduced several characters with similarly exotic names that nobody gives a $0.02 about, or are of little of no importance.
-"If I look back, I am lost." No maybe if she looked back from time to time she might learn something.

Spoiler

-She spurns an alliance with Dorne, a major power in Westeros, so she can marry a slaver in Slaver's Bay.
-She married the Harpy, or the Harpy's thrall. Wait how did this guy have the Sons of Harpy immediately stop killing in the streets immediately after requesting the violence to stop. I guess that it never occurred to her that she was being played for a fool and for the crown.
-Caging up her dragons, and not looking after them.
-Allowing the city to fall under siege.
-Not going to Astapor.
-Ignores any and all good advice from her council, and always justifies it with "oh I'm only 16, and I'm young and do not know the ways of ..."
-Fucking a sell-sword with a golden tooth.

 

[ZephyrFate]

I do not see the area as a bad caricature. A poster here commented that the fretting and dealing and bartering all the people do with Dany is very, very reminiscent of how dealings actually go on in the Middle East and, I would say, Egypt in particular.

 

[Amir0x]

I really don't think Slaver's Bay is all that fleshed out. I think its just a bad middle-eastern/oriental caricature.

It is immeasurably more fleshed out than before - it's a place with real people and complicated political issues as far as the characters perspectives are concerned. It makes sense the pieces on the chess board are moving the way they are, and without the exposition, we wouldn't have the clarity we now have. It's as much a "bad middle-eastern/oriental caricature" as Westeros is a bad Britannia caricature.

It's the writing that underpins it, of course, and GRRM's only problem as ever is pacing. As it has always been in his books. The multiple character perspectives are both a blessing and a curse, depending on the curve of the story progression.

I am very happy with this book. I expected after hearing some impressions about how the plot was slow moving that it would be, ya know, slow moving instead of having a metric shit ton of important events go down as it was the case in Dance with Dragons. I also have zero problems with the Dany chapters. She is a child. Telling your dragons to burn down a fucking city != ruling a city. <entire book spoilers>

Spoiler

Here we see that thus far she is a lot like Robert Baratheon - made for war, not ruling. Or is that even the case with Dany? She showed courage raising the dragons, but so far much of her spoils have been off their backs which is something Robert did not require. I don't find her "stupid" as much as ignorant of how to rule, which completely makes sense. She is as ever ignorant of the world, and burning a few slavers did not change that.

If this is "slow", I hope we have another "slow" book with lots of "worldbuilding."

 

[PhoenixDark]

I should be done tonight. Definitely want to start discussing this book as a whole, and I want to see Amir0x's thoughts on the explosion of fantasy elements in this book.

 

[elrechazado]

come to the spoilers thread, lots of good discussion there.

 

[BlueTsunami]

I really hate Darrio's character and how Daenerys flutters around him. It's awful.

Also Danny, in general, is pretty insufferable halfway into this book. She has many chapters (the most, I believe) and they've all been bad.

 

[sooperkool]

Has Dany ever proved that she has any control over her dragons now that they're grown? I don't think so but she did neglect them.

Does anyone other than me wonder whats happening at Casterly Rock? Its the one place we've never seen, it seems to be undefended and sitting on a pile of gold in a time of war.

 

[Veelk]

If this is "slow", I hope we have another "slow" book with lots of "worldbuilding."

Do you have any complaints about the book at all? Mine were only that certain PoV's were useless (see previous page for specifics). Besides that, while I found certain plotlines to not be as entertaining, they were certainly well written, and in rereads, I will probably enjoy them much more with my expectations in check.

 

[Laekon]

I'm only 40% through the book but I don't like the feeling of it. All I keep thinking is that its ending up the same as Jordan around book 5 were the story just goes no where.

Did I miss some talk about slave revolts? How can a region have free to walk around slaves for hundreds of years without a few major revolts? They should be part of the lore but I don't remember any.

 

[Amir0x]

Do you have any complaints about the book at all? Mine were only that certain PoV's were useless (see previous page for specifics). Besides that, while I found certain plotlines to not be as entertaining, they were certainly well written, and in rereads, I will probably enjoy them much more with my expectations in check.

Yes. It has horrendous pacing problems. There are indications of clearly rushed editing. There were detours that had no purpose but to serve as detour, when he could have saved pages and taken a more direct route as some of those chapters barely had any worldbuilding even. He made a lot of stuff needlessly more difficult for himself.

But it is a terrific book, packed with plot progression, Song of Ice and Fire mysteries finally unveiled and (mostly) above average writing with a bit of repetition built in.

 

[brentech]

But it is a terrific book, packed with plot progression, Song of Ice and Fire mysteries finally unveiled and (mostly) above average writing with a bit of repetition built in.

Good to know though. Mostly avoid the thread but have it subbed for quick glances.
I'm reading on the kindle and only about 14% done. Some good moments so far, but as stated, I just got through a chapter that didn't feel like it served too much purpose. But it's not to say I found no interest in the material, so whatever.

 

[q_q]

Spoiler

I understand him consenting to lock the wolf up during visits to the queen, but the decision not to bring Ghost to the meeting was pure madness. He could have demanded the warg keep his bull locked up. As a warg himself you'd think he'd know Ghost didn't want to harm the bull - if it did, wouldn't Jon's mouth begin to salivate at some point? Also, the decision to send his most trusted friends away was baffling. I "get" his logic, but at the same time his father would never send his closest friends/allies away in such a situation. Nor would anyone else...at least you'd think. Jeez.

I thought most of Jon's NW decisions made sense. The one that didn't make much sense was his idea to march for Winterfell, and the decision to save the wildlings at Hardhelm. Riding for Winterfell seemed like a blatant break of his vows, and the Hardhelm mission was a suicide mission. Would have made more sense to send a few ships to watch the coast, and turn back once they saw the slave ships. It may not be honorable, but a life of servitude is certainly preferable to dying and being reborn as a wight.

Spoiler

Yeah I think one of GRRM'S biggest flaws as a writer (and he's a great writer, don't get me wrong) is that he seems to get his heart set on doing something to a character and then builds the story around that to get the character there. In this particular case, as in the case of Robb and the Red Wedding, the things he has the character do to eventually lead to his downfall seem out of place and hardly believable. I think he had in his mind that he wanted Jon to be betrayed by his captains, and so he threw together a bunch of shit to make it happen as an after-thought.

 

[IAmtheFMan]

So I've been taking my time with this book, mainly because I've been busy with work.

Overall I'm really digging it... I'm liking the Essos stuff and I like getting a lot of the lore and descriptions of the cities.

My biggest problem is the divide Feast and Dance in two though. I just think it's too jarring when you're trying to remember whatever the hell's supposed to be going on in King's Landing and such and how it relates especially if it's a somewhat vague recollection.

Up to page ~370 spoilers in the hardcover

Spoiler

A couple impressions:

The two Bran chapters so far were far and away the most interesting chapters in the book so far. I just love how they jumped into the history/mythology of the series. It's mysterious but in the best sort of way. Can't wait till his next chapters.

The whole "oh Baby Aegon is alive" definitely threw me for a loop. It was just so far out there. I want to see where this goes.

I assume the "Mereenese knot" that Martin wrote about was his trouble of what to do with Dany and how to get her out? Granted I'm only about 1/3 of the way through, but I can see this causing a huge problem.

I like the Jon stuff, but right now he just seems kinda resigned to his position as Lord Commander. He needs a shakeup. Off-ing Slynt like that was badass, though my radar is up. EVERY Stark that's beheaded someone doesn't do well in the book... (Ned in GoT, Robb in ASOS) hopefully Jon doesn't fall to the same pattern.

The Asha chapter was annoyingly long at first, but then ramped up. I ASSUME that she's dead since everything points that way, but this IS GRRM...

Do me a favor and don't hint if you quote...

 

[scosher]

.



shiiiiiiiiiii

God I just finished this book. What an amazing book. I am so glad Essos was given this time in the sun - now it feels like a fully fleshed out place whose politics matter in the scheme of the world, instead of this incredibly Western-centric epic which just incidentally had locations out East.

Next book wait will be terrible

I agree. I love the world building in this book, even moreso than Feast (which really only gave us glimpses of Dorne/Iron Islands). Whereas prior to ADWD, I saw the East as a vast wasteland littered with podunk villages ripe for the Dothraki horde to rape and pillage. And even farther east we had warlocks and witches and shadowlands, that literally told me nothing. Now,

Spoiler

I see a Greco-Roman inspired land set in a Persian/Byzantine backdrop. I see the groundwork of a global economy, in which the Dothraki enslaved men, Meereen/Yunkai trained them, and Volantis/Myr/Lys and other port-cities grew filthy rich off of it. And when Dany incidentally crushed the slave trade at her girly whims in ASOS, you can see the major repercussions. Even the free cities like Pentos that denounced slavery only do so in name.

My disappointment in all the chapters out East (ie. Tyrion/Dany/Quentyn chapters) had little to do with the great bricklaying GRRM did in Essos...but rather

Spoiler

how stagnant (Dany), or contrived (Tyrion), or meaningless (Quentyn, and Tyrion post-Griff) their story arcs were.

 

[KuwabaraTheMan]

My disappointment in all the chapters out East (ie. Tyrion/Dany/Quentyn chapters) had little to do with the great bricklaying GRRM did in Essos...but rather

Spoiler

how stagnant (Dany), or contrived (Tyrion), or meaningless (Quentyn, and Tyrion post-Griff) their story arcs were.

Spoiler

I think that Tyrion and Jorah throwing in with the Second Sons is going to be a pretty big deal going forward. I suppose Quentyn's storyline wasn't really meaningful (outside of them promising Pentos to the Windblown which Barristan seems intent on keeping), but I still enjoyed Quentyn's overall arc.

 

[Dresden]

Done, and... what a maddening book. The biggest problem is that it sets up a ton of plotlines it never bothers to resolve, and so you have a book that raises lots of questions but never bothers to answer most of them.

But I still liked it all the same. When The George is rolling and people are dying, it's magnificent.

 

[PhoenixDark]

Just finished. I really liked the book, although I must say the final couple chapters (including the epilogue) kind of left me feeling meh. Maybe I'll change my mind in the morning when I'm more...awake. Some thoughts:

ADWD brings Martin's world to life like no other book in the series has. While the first three books certainly feature a host of impressive worldbuilding, ADWD and AFFC take things to another level by introducing more culture and worldviews. Slavery and humanity play major themes throughout the novel, and this is best illustrated in the Jon and Dany chapters; they essentially mirror each other. Each attempt to do what's best for not only the men and women they preside over, but also the rest of mankind.

The book works best in the North, where nearly every POV is good or great. In Essos things are more complicated. Dany easily has the worst POV in the novel, but it improves over time. The biggest problem is what while the worldbuilding in Essos is quite impressive, the characters that inhabit it simply aren't nearly as interesting. Dany's council seems a poor substitution for that of King's Landing, or the power players in Dorne. While the overall Dany arc is certainly fascinating, watching it unravel is less so.

I'll put the rest in spoilers

Spoiler

I loved Tyrion's entire arc. The Tyrion in ADWD is a broken man yet displays all the charm and wit that make him the best character in the series. His travels with Griff were some of my favorite chapters in the books. But perhaps my favorite part of his POV was the introduction of Penny, who seemed to capsulize the novel's focus on slavery. She sees herself as nigh worthless and is more than content to dance and entertain her betters, never daring to get in their way or demand any type of dignity. As a street performer and as a slave her personality doesn't change. Tyrion's reaction to her mindset makes for some great moments.

-Loved Jon's arc. It reminded me of the story of the Hightower lord who ordered Oldtown to be put to torch to stem the spread of disease; shortly after his actions he was dragged off his horse and murdered. And yet he saved the realm. Jon's actions may just hold off the Others long enough to save it. And on a side note, that story makes me wonder whether Dany will burn all of Mereen when she returns, to stop the spread of the flux...
-I also loved Reek's chapters. I felt sorry for him, something I never thought I'd do. His chapters also served to illustrate just disgusting the Boltons are. Holy shit, they both need to die.

-Davos had few POVs, but they were all amazing - including what is my favorite moment of the book: The North remembers.

-Quentyn...I must say his POVs were good, but I was baffled by his decision to tame the dragons. I understand he didn't want to fail his father, but for such a cautious man it seemed like quite an idiotic decision to free the dragons. They were about to claw their way out eventually. And considering Dorne would declare for Dany regardless, it seems almost a waste to kill him off like that.

Griff's chapters were great as well. It seems obvious Aegon is not the real Aegon, given the prophesy. Yet he seems like quite a badass. Could he possibly be a bastard of Rhaegar's? On one hand Ned doubts Rhaegar visited brothels (GoT), on the other hand Cersei suggests he frequented them (AFFC). The boy clearly displays physical traits of a Targeryen. I wonder if he'll end up having greyscale though.

-Haven't seen much discussion on the epilogue. It kind of left me cold. I loved seeing Varys again but it seemed almost like a superhero villain monologue, revealing his master plan. I kind of wonder if my disappointment has more to do with me thinking Arya was about to assassinate Tommen. The tomcat in the window, the veiled little boy at the gate...I thought for sure a Faceless Man attack was about to happen. Still, the chapter means we get more Cersei action. Yesssssss

-Speaking of Cersei, what was that septon trying to whisper about Loras...

Things I didn't like:

Spoiler

-Towards the end of the book it started to feel like Martin was dragging things along. Based on his editor's comments it seems pretty obvious the Stannis/Bolton conflict was removed from the book. I honestly felt cheated. Nor do I like the idea of Stannis' entire host near starving in a blizzard and somehow barely losing any men. Seemed unrealistic to me. I can't really see how he'll break Winterfell with a starving, frozen host. More than likely Tormund will lead the Wildlings off to save the day in the next book.

-I hated Dany's last chapter. I had been under the assumption that the book was "really" 1013 pages or so, so when I got to the end of her chapter and saw the Epilog was next I was pissed off. It just struck me as a boring, bland end to an arc that had been getting exciting. It just left a bad taste in my mouth, nor did I care for the ending with her finding the Khalasar. I'm guessing she'll either kill them all or lead them all to the walls of the city and free her people.

-Finally, I was majorly disappointed not to get any information on the issue of Robb's heir and the location of the Blackfish. Rickon being alive makes the heir issue null, but I still couldn't help but be upset there was no new information on this. And the Blackfish...bah. Maybe I should have expected it, considering he's probably going to the Eyrie.

 

[Rekubot]

Spoiler

Griff's chapters were great as well. It seems obvious Aegon is not the real Aegon, given the prophesy. Yet he seems like quite a badass. Could he possibly be a bastard of Rhaegar's? On one hand Ned doubts Rhaegar visited brothels (GoT), on the other hand Cersei suggests he frequented them (AFFC). The boy clearly displays physical traits of a Targeryen. I wonder if he'll end up having greyscale though.

Spoiler

Doesn't he have purple eyes like the other Targaryens? Which prophecy are you referring to?

 

[cubicle47b]

Spoiler

Doesn't he have purple eyes like the other Targaryens? Which prophecy are you referring to?

Spoiler

The cloth/mummer's dragon from the House of the Undying.

 

[scosher]

Spoiler

I think that Tyrion and Jorah throwing in with the Second Sons is going to be a pretty big deal going forward. I suppose Quentyn's storyline wasn't really meaningful (outside of them promising Pentos to the Windblown which Barristan seems intent on keeping), but I still enjoyed Quentyn's overall arc.

Spoiler

Tyrion's arc is meaningless in the sense that he accomplishes nothing (besides convincing Young Griff to sail to Westeros) throughout the book, despite having a considerable amount of pages devoted to his journey. His arc is contrived because his journey is consistently waylaid by some random plot event thrown in by the author. In the past, Tyrion was a character who took the reins in the direction of his life, but now he's just riding along the current and going wherever the plot conveniently takes him. I'm sure that's supposed to denote the change in his character since he killed his father, but the only purpose of his chapters seem to be to give us a first-hand PoV of all of Essos.

I think part (a lot) of my frustration also comes from my expectations that Tyrion would meet up with Dany in this book and we'd finally get some meaningful interaction between two major characters. Especially when Dany acts incredibly stupid in this book and needs a dwarf to smack her upside the head.

 

[Count of Monte Sawed-Off]

Before the books were split, Tyrion was only supposed to have 4 or 5 chapters and it shows.

 

[Sirpopopop]

Spoiler

They could have still sent smaller, fewer ships to watch the situation then gtfo. Sounds like slavers are taking a good amount of the group.

Again PD:

Spoiler

Dead things in the water. Also: Storms. The ships couldn't get there. The slavers got there once, I don't think they will be getting there again.

As for Quentyn:

Spoiler

At this point, he's a plot point to show why Dorne will declare for someone other than Dany.

 

[bionic77]

About 60% done the book and I am enjoying it so far. Even when nothing is happening (which is most of the book) Martin is such a good writer that I still find myself being entertained.

And with us being 5 books into the series I find the earlier comparison with Jordan's Wheel of Time series to be humorous now because this series has also clearly lost its way. Not saying that WoT is better (it isn't, though the story is definitely easier to follow), but this series is starting to show some of the same problems we had with WoT.

Honestly though as long as Tyrion is alive I know I will be hooked. One of the best characters ever. I have officially jumped off the Dany bandwagon as well. Man alive has her stuff been beyond boring. Spoiler -->

Spoiler

not a good sign when a character named Reek is more interesting than the 'Dragon Queen'

 

[yacobod]

The first 2 Tyrion chapters with Illyrio were quite bad, it's like GURM had to get all of his lavish food descriptions out of the way in 2 chapters. All they did for 20+ pages was eat course after course. I did enjoy his travels with the Griffs & Co. down the river, it was kind of neat in a Heart of Darkness kind of way, but after he hooked up with

Spoiler

Jorah and Penny

and started to dwarf joust on a pig, man was it bad. At least the last chapter hooking up with

Spoiler

Brown Plumm Ben

sort of redeemed it.

I didn't really care for emo-Tyrion in this book, a little too much self loathing for me.

 

[cubicle47b]

And with us being 5 books into the series I find the earlier comparison with Jordan's Wheel of Time series to be humorous now because this series has also clearly lost its way. Not saying that WoT is better (it isn't, though the story is definitely easier to follow), but this series is starting to show some of the same problems we had with WoT.

I'll start to worry when Dany starts tugging on her braid to show she's pissed off (all the time) and Jon turns into Superman but only when fighting the Great Other.

 

[Akuun]

I think I just passed the halfway point through the book and I'm still recovering from the mass of depressing and rage-inducing chapters that I just finished. I keep mentally screaming for characters to grow a brain, a heart, a spine, or some combination of them.

Dany chapters:
- I hate

Spoiler

how Dany is completely smitten with Daario. The guy is a jackass. What does she see in him?

-

Spoiler

She seems to have lost her wits entirely and become far too softhearted. She risked her best men when going to see/help the people with the flux outside the walls. She isn't sending out the people who have the flux in her city, and just hopes it'll go away by itself. She is so unsure about the war that she is just kind of letting people convince her to marry that jackass that she neither likes or trusts. She is trying to avoid the issue of her dragons going wild altogether, when she should be spending time with them and trying to tame them again. WTF DANY.

Spoiler

Theon

chapters:
- I alternate between

Spoiler

feeling sorry for this guy and hating him for not growing a spine. I don't remember the details of what he did in previous books, but I do remember hating him, but I don't think I'd wish anyone to suffer what he's been through. After all that, it's understandable that he has had all the fight beaten out of him, but I still can't help but hate the fact that he's not standing up for himself and doing what he knows he should.

Also, the Boltons need to die in a fire. Both father and bastard.

 

[CrankyJay]

The first 2 Tyrion chapters with

Spoiler

Illyrio

were quite bad, it's like GURM had to get all of his lavish food descriptions out of the way in 2 chapters.

I must be the only person who enjoys his food descriptions. Mmmmm.

edit: And shouldn't you be spoilering some of that?

 

[IAmtheFMan]

SPOILER.

Fuck dude. I just passed that point last night but spoiler-tag that shit.

 

[CrankyJay]

Fuck dude. I just passed that point last night but spoiler-tag that shit.

3 day ban! Just like in Westeros, if you don't follow through on your punishments you show weakness.

 

[Jarmel]

Fuck dude. I just passed that point last night but spoiler-tag that shit.

Then don't quote it without spoiler tags.

 

[Dynedom]

Finished the book today. Incredible book. Did not care for

Spoiler

Victarion's

chapters at all though. I know they are important but the

Spoiler

Ironborn chapters

continue to bore me

Spoiler

(with the exception of Asha's)

.

Excellent book. I enjoyed it more than Feast.

 

[IAmtheFMan]

Then don't quote it without spoiler tags.

I didn't quote the more spoilery part, asshole.

 

[Jarmel]

I didn't quote the more spoilery part, asshole.

Apparently in this thread a spoiler is a spoiler. No need to become a jackass about it.

 

[siddhu33]

How much better is this book, than A Feast For Crows? That book was boring as hell.