After the PS3 slim the next question is...when does MS redesign the X360?

ivedoneyourmom said:
I don't think there will be a re-design, I mean there is no precedent in Xbox history. All the work is going to go into the innards and the cooling system so that they 360 is finally able to have a failure rate lower than 50 percent. Also, there is the whole faceplate thing, they will not be able to sell over priced faceplates with a redesign (not to mention other expansions that require the shape of the Xbox 360 to remain the same). Sony doesn't sweat these details, they just don't care, but Microsoft, they want to maximize their profit from inexpensive plastic doo-daads.
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Ridiculous points. Of course there is no precedent; we are fast approaching a point where the 360 has been on the market for a longer period of time than the original Xbox. I haven't seen first-party faceplates for sale in years, either.

Some real options they'd have to weigh are a.)do you abandon compatibility for the current HDD enclosures and b.) do you have built-in wifi like every other system on the market or continue raping customers with the $100 adapter?
 
As much as I want one (havent "Jumped In" yet), I hope they improve the reliability and probably think of a redesign at 40nm. 32nm should be available next year.
 
Roto13 said:
They can't even get the fat one right.
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bhy4k1.jpg
 
alr1ghtstart said:
Sony sends some of their hardware engineers over to MS, and MS sends some software guys over to Sony. Win-win.
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QFT

I would love to MS and Sony get together for a console best of all worlds.
 
Microsoft would have really hard time shrinking the Xbox 360. The console was designed in a way that they could profit from stupid Xbox branded peripherals. If they ever come to a console redesign, they would have to remove the memory card slots (which defeats the purpose of the Arcade model), get rid of the big ass power brick, make a new proprietary hard drive (which also fucks up those with an Arcade unit) and find a new way for cooling/reducing the chances of the system itself from failing. There would be a whole chain reaction of negatives if there was a redesign.
 
Making it smaller will make the cooling and noise issues even harder to solve. I really hope they don't do a 360 slim.
 
If they made the console width thinner, the hard drive wouldn't be top compatible anymore. The two memory card slots would also have to be stacked. Do you guys want a refreshing or a full on redesign?
 
I always had the belief they'd do a slim 360 release alongside Natal, but I'm not so sure now. I think they'd have a much tougher time than Sony when it comes to shrinking their console.

Microsoft is just not a hardware company. The 360 has already suffered from reliability issues which cost them a lot of money/bad publicity. I'm not sure if they would want to risk that again by completely redesigning the innards.

Then there's the issue of the proprietary accessories, things like the two memory unit slots (which are rather large) and the hard drive enclosure which is designed in a specific way. I guess they could abandon these on a 360 Slim, but they'd still have to sell these accessories for the old consoles out there. It wouldn't be quite as smooth of a transition.
 
Sean said:
I always had the belief they'd do a slim 360 release alongside Natal, but I'm not so sure now. I think they'd have a much tougher time than Sony when it comes to shrinking their console.

Microsoft is just not a hardware company. The 360 has already suffered from reliability issues which cost them a lot of money/bad publicity. I'm not sure if they would want to risk that again by completely redesigning the innards.

Then there's the issue of the proprietary accessories, things like the two memory unit slots (which are rather large) and the hard drive enclosure which is designed in a specific way. I guess they could abandon these on a 360 Slim, but they'd still have to sell these accessories for the old consoles out there. It wouldn't be quite as smooth of a transition.
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I think some of the points you made aren't valid here. It's been almost four years since the Xbox 360 came on the market. Microsoft has made efforts to shrink the chipset and we've actually seen several revisions of it. Frankly part of the reason that the 360 hardware has such bad reliability issues is because of the design of the system in the first place. Microsoft made the system's shell first and crammed the stuff in it. They could easily use different parts and slim it down considerably. Like using a laptop slot drive instead of their regular DVD drive. If they put a hard drive on the redesigned system then it makes the memory card slots basically unnecessary for most of the population. Too much of their stuff was proprietary anyway.
 
Sean said:
I always had the belief they'd do a slim 360 release alongside Natal, but I'm not so sure now. I think they'd have a much tougher time than Sony when it comes to shrinking their console.

Microsoft is just not a hardware company. The 360 has already suffered from reliability issues which cost them a lot of money/bad publicity. I'm not sure if they would want to risk that again by completely redesigning the innards.

Then there's the issue of the proprietary accessories, things like the two memory unit slots (which are rather large) and the hard drive enclosure which is designed in a specific way. I guess they could abandon these on a 360 Slim, but they'd still have to sell these accessories for the old consoles out there. It wouldn't be quite as smooth of a transition.
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I see what you are saying. I guess a 45nm gpu/cpu on a chip with same form factor with a internal power supply might make more sense because of the peripherals. I am not worried about heat or other issues on a redesign as they have had a long time to iron that stuff out. Unlike rushing out to the market first like they did with the first 360s.
 
MercuryLS said:
It's really long overdue for one, a die shrink would really help with the overheating issues and a complete redesign/shrinking could really boost the systems image again. Do you think it's time for a X360 redesign?
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I don't think they will try,since the time they could have invested in it have been invested on improving the console fail rate,if they start now i think it would hit by 2011 or late 2010 the nearest.
 
Tormentoso said:
I don't think they will try,since the time they could have invested in it have been invested on improving the console fail rate,if they start now i think it would hit by 2011 or late 2010 the nearest.
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I am sure they are working on it. It is the chip foundry that has had issues with die shrinks recently. There was going to be no complete redesign until 45nm (360 on a single chip) and well it has not gone good for most of the industry.
 
no point really, until it looks like the slim is going to make any difference in marketshare they really have no need.
I'd like to see it though, something smaller at least.
 
a redesign follows a properly working design... so far MS is working on a properly working xbox360. They have stated that it will take 10 years for that.
 
beermonkey@tehbias said:
Price is all that matters. Not size of console.
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The 45nm(360 on a single chip) should be a major help with price. You get rid of the heat problems, cut cost by making the board much simpler and cutting the cooling costs in half since it is only 1 chip.
 
chubigans said:
Natal Launch + 360 redesign= Holiday of Awesome.
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They slated Natal for the second half of 2010 didn't they?

So wouldn't that mean Holiday 2010-2011? Pretty far off.
 
Tormentoso said:
I don't think they will try,since the time they could have invested in it have been invested on improving the console fail rate
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I'm sure slapping on a heatpipe and some glue took a ton of time.

Everything else has been achieved through die shrinks.
 
a Master Ninja said:
Coordinating a hardware overhaul with the Natal launch is probably the smartest thing to do at this point. They'll lose ground in the meantime, but by effectively launching a "new" console at a competitive price they could have a monstrous holiday 2010 and beyond.
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At which time the PS3 will be at $249 or possibly even $199.
 
Didn't MS actually design the exterior of the console before they had finalized the interior components? Wasn't that a major contributing factor to the failure rate of the 360 initially?

It seems silly to waste all that time on exterior design only to redo it halfway through the generation, especially with all the custom peripheral ports they've built (hard drive / faceplates). I doubt we'll see a new 360 design anytime soon.
 
a Master Ninja said:
Coordinating a hardware overhaul with the Natal launch is probably the smartest thing to do at this point. They'll lose ground in the meantime, but by effectively launching a "new" console at a competitive price they could have a monstrous holiday 2010 and beyond.
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This, Make the Natal launch also include a drastically overhauled system.

Not trying to play out the meme, they did kinda shoot themselves in the foot with their HDD. Since it is a snap in, they'll either want to make a groove for it to fit or. Or else it's going be staying the same height.
 
shintoki said:
This, Make the Natal launch also include a drastically overhauled system.

Not trying to play out the meme, they did kinda shoot themselves in the foot with their HDD. Since it is a snap in, they'll either want to make a groove for it to fit or. Or else it's going be staying the same height.
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The HDD is the least of their concern really.
 
I don't know why people think the Natal will be built into the console. It should be a separate piece. I don't see how anyone would want to try to place their console in a proper place because it has the camera on it.

It'll just be a bundle.
 
360 should get a redesign, its internals are pretty messy in there. At the very least, reduce the size of that damn power brick.
 
shintoki said:
Or else it's going be staying the same height.
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Or more likely, and given it's Microsoft, they'll do something completely different with the HDD forcing existing owners to spend even more if they want to upgrade.

Because it's Microsoft, and you really know they will.
 
Ok I have a question that's maybe been answered elsewhere but:

Is MS even at GamesCom?? Are they presenting anything? Or are they just laying low while SONY calls in air strikes?
 
Truespeed said:
At which time the PS3 will be at $249 or possibly even $199.
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If anyone actually gives a shit about motion controls (I don't) on the HD consoles, MS's controller design will give them a huge price advantage. One controller = four. (or more...)
 
adversesolutions said:
Ok I have a question that's maybe been answered elsewhere but:

Is MS even at GamesCom?? Are they presenting anything? Or are they just laying low while SONY calls in air strikes?
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Yes they are, air-strikes though seriously? :lol
 
ivedoneyourmom said:
I don't think there will be a re-design, I mean there is no precedent in Xbox history. All the work is going to go into the innards and the cooling system so that they 360 is finally able to have a failure rate lower than 50 percent. Also, there is the whole faceplate thing, they will not be able to sell over priced faceplates with a redesign (not to mention other expansions that require the shape of the Xbox 360 to remain the same). Sony doesn't sweat these details, they just don't care, but Microsoft, they want to maximize their profit from inexpensive plastic doo-daads.
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also horse armor
 
Asking Microsoft to create a smaller 360 is liking telling them to make a timebomb.

In other words, notatall....say it 10 times....notatall notatall natal natal natal....
 
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