Fred Norris
Banned
Oh god that's right-I forgot about the Netflix shows....this is awful. How do we keep him away?
Agents of S.H.I.E.L.D. |OT| Tahiti is a Magical Place (to...Hey guys, I found it!)
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Jorok Goldblade
Member
This man brought us Earth's Mightiest Heroes and Wolverine and the X-Men. Also, his name's all over Thor 2. He'd be a great choice.
It is a shitty thing to say, but honestly it's the simplest explanation.
As a counterpoint that doesn't exactly argue against what you're saying, I'd say look at something like Gotham Central. That was a comic series about grunt people doing grunt stuff in a world with super-powered people all over the place that was still interesting and a compelling read. Maybe that's what Whedon is aiming for, something along those lines dealing with "normal" people trying to manage a world with all these superpowered people and strange artifacts. There's every chance the concept could lead to interesting stories that still feel a part of the universe without all the super-powers, but whether the execution or the perception of the show compared to the movies is holding it back, I don't know.
There are two things that set GC apart from AoS. It was very well written and critically acclaimed, award winning even. Second it wasn't hamstrung into using nameless characters. The main cast still had established characters and each arc had at least one main Batman villain involved.
BlueScrote
Member
Lets take away a fan favorite character and create a new character and name him after my dead son. I'm sure that'll go over well with the fans.
GuitarAtomik
Member
I should clarify. This is what the MCU SHIELD does. Unfortunately, that universe doesn't have the breadth of powered characters the comics have and can use at any time for stories of working hand in hand with superheroes. The MCU SHIELD is dealing with a world whose super powered beings are just starting to come out of the woodwork so we are dealing with an organization that's all about the grunts. Wetflame's post pretty much illustrates why that concept CAN work and hopefully it will eventually.
I agree - I was just stating this to argue why Whedon/Marvel may have thought the concept was a good idea, although it's obviously lacking in the execution unlike Gotham Central.
Lets offer no explanation as to what happened to Richard Rider, and instead leave that to Bendis to explain whenever he pulls something out of his arse.
The Thor episode did "up the stakes a bit" with Asgardian weaponry and then an actual Asgardian. Are they not going to get out of the shitter without using more cameos?
BlackNMild2k1
Member
They also have Super Strength in 2 main characters, not sure for how long, but I would hope that it last for more than just that episode.
Maybe this show should start doing 2-3 episode mini-arcs since they are having trouble including and following a season long arc up to this point.
But maybe there is hope since some recurring characters will be making their way back to the show in the next few episodes.
Lone_Prodigy
Member
Had to look up the Asgardian since I remembered him from 24. Turns out he was actually a good guy.
Dollhouse reference was such a troll. I guess it deepens the Coulson mystery.
Dollhouse reference was such a troll. I guess it deepens the Coulson mystery.
Choppasmith
Member
Ironically, he's a huge fan of Doctor Octopus as well, voicing him in Spectacular Spider-Man.
Anyway, even though I don't have the personal vendetta against Loeb others have here, it does suck that he's really regressed the quality built by Yost and Kyle back to the 90s. Ultimate Spider-Man has its moments but damn Agents of Smash and Avengers are terrible (barely passable at best). At least SHIELD had been pretty decent and doesn't have his "keep it simple, kids are dumb" mentality behind it.
Look on the bright side, at least Loeb's Nova has the decency to be complete sales flop (even lower than DnA's Nova run) so it's well on it's way to cancellation.
Bendis' disgraceful excuse for the Guardians of the Galaxy comic is actually selling moderately well though so it's free to continue stinking up the place.
dead souls
Member
I might be showing my age, but whenever I see Peter MacNicol the first thing I think of is Ally McBeal.
Red Arremer
Member
And thank goodness for that.
Yeah, it's painful, considering how good cosmic Marvel was until after Annhilation and some of its followups.
I just hope that the movie is gonna be good and not shit like Bendis' GotG.
The first thing i though when i saw Peter MacNicol was this:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dST1q5CXgdU
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dST1q5CXgdU
angular graphics
Banned
8/22
SquiddyCracker
Banned
Fucking hell... probably like 12 more episodes before we find out what happened to Coulson.
Nah, we'll see that as a cliffhanger in the finale.
maquiladora
Member
My interest in this has waned massively since it started. Almost ready to give up on it.
You miss ... finding out that there are evil organizations creating superhumans. No wait, that happened this episode as well, just a little more low budget an organization and Asgadian handle instead of extremis serum.
What happened to that by the way? All these episodes could be stand alobe pilots and they would still work.
Jest Chillin
Member
You miss that:
- Skye has familial connections to SHIELD
- Fitz is actually a solid field agent
- Ward's childhood created his hero-syndrome
- There's an organization behind Extremis (not just a single Doctor)
- That organization views all of it's staff expendable.
- Origin of Graviton
- The Bus crew is looked down upon by the rest of SHIELD outside Hill and Fury.
- Skye developing trust for and caring about the team.
And that's just off the top of my head. But it's easy to exaggerate and say nothing's happened when you're disinterested in the show.
I guess you could call them an organization? Really they seem more like a political group that happened to succeed where others failed in locating pieces of the staff. Definitely nowhere near the capabilities of the group that created extremis.
Forgot girl in the flower dress, and the clairvoyant.
You know the problem with all the points you brought up? None of them have any bearing on later episodes. You just listed events that happened.
Jest Chillin
Member
I listed points where the plot or characters have developed further than where they were in the first episode... which is what Ripclawe claimed was non-existant.
And they do have an influence on later episodes. They're just not pushing the plot at a break-neck pace. Maybe the pace is moving too slow for some, but I'm not having a problem with it. The show was always going to be heavy on the precedural side in order to be casual viewer friendly. The serial elements are there though and I'm sure they'll ramp up as we move forward.
the point is none of those elements are simmering in the background in every episode. you could take those episodes run them after the last and it wouldn't add anything.
unlike arrow,supernatural, the originals, sleepy hollow where every episode adds a layer or has a recurring theme.
unlike arrow,supernatural, the originals, sleepy hollow where every episode adds a layer or has a recurring theme.
Jest Chillin
Member
3 CW shows and a show with a 13 episode season. CW shows really shouldn't be used for comparison at all because being on that network gives so much leeway it's insane. They get away with horrible romance tropes, awful plotlines, and have the advantage of never having to build any suspense. And I point this out as someone who watches Arrow, Supernatural, and Nikita.
Sleepy Hollow was always planned as being heavily serial and being locked to 13 episodes means the pace will move quite well.
I get that you prefer the faster pacing but SHIELD is just not that kind of show and there have been plenty of shows that move with a slower pacing that don't get criticized for it. Personally I think it's simply due to expectations.
Joe Shlabotnik
Banned
I don't think the show is working particularly well right now just because neither the characters nor the self-contained plots have felt compelling. But the show is clearly not intended to be a serialized drama. It is setting up longer background arcs but to complain that is not placing those front and center eight episodes into the first season of a 20-something episode season is silly.
The show needs better characters and more exciting standalone episodes. Long-term mystery boxes are the least of its problems.
The show needs better characters and more exciting standalone episodes. Long-term mystery boxes are the least of its problems.
BlackNMild2k1
Member
I like the show, but I agree that this would take it from where it is now, to something much better.
There is no looming threat being progressed throughout each episode. They just kinda move from one unconnected thing to the next every week. It doesn't actually appear to be building up towards anything big or going anywhere very fast.
If only a majority of the episodes somehow, even in the most minute ways, let back to "AIM" and whatever they are planning, then this show would be much better off. They could keep every episodes plot more or less intact, just weave it into the overarching "AIM" as a super criminal organization story line and everything suddenly begins to click. Even if the SHIELD team hasn't caught onto the connection yet, tease it out to the audience so that we feel like we know something that they don't and we have an idea of where this is all headed and what to look forward to.
I don't know if anyone here watched Fringe, but that started out in the same sort of way. Little mysteries here and there, but generally monster-of-the-week unconnected episodes with a little mythology thrown in here and there. By the end of the show it was very serialised and there was all sorts of in-depth stuff getting thrown around. There's time for the show to build background stuff slowly while allowing for them to have adventures each week.
I've been wondering if Whedon is avoiding the long backstory this time since so much of what he's done before did the slow build and got cancelled just as it was revealing itself. Isn't this format closer to the shows that seem to last the longest?
SquiddyCracker
Banned
The problem here is that the weekly adventures are boring.
dead souls
Member
Yep. Fringe season one wasn't revolutionary, or even very good, but it was way more interesting than what SHIELD is offering so far.
The_Inquisitor
Member
Me and my gf lost interest. Cancelled off of DVR. Other shows like Almost Human seem far more interesting.
Red Arremer
Member
Yeah, I've been saying this all along. The first seasons of a shitload of shows - a lot of which are by now regarded as really amazing - were terrible.
Vlodril
Member
Yea first season of fringe was bad there is no doubt about it. I actually dropped the show on episode 8 or 14 or something and only come back to it due to gaf raving about it. It now sits at my top 5 scifi shows.
Everyone said ana torv couldn't act to save her life etc in season 1. I thought she did a great jbo on later seasons it was the way the character was in the first season.
In general few shows start with a bang(heroes for example.. too bad about the rest. Firefly too for me). In dollhouse i hated topher in the first episodes and the actor and character were brilliant by the end.
TacticalFox88
Banned
This show would be pretty great if we had a counter team/organization of characters, like a Modern Day Hydra?
Sure it has the cliche of "Villain Counterpart", but I'd imagine a lot of people would be interested in where it goes.
Red Arremer
Member
Well they've setting up what most of us believe to be AIM as an antagonist. In several of the episodes, they've been hinting at a high-tech evil organization working in the background.
But since it's the beginning of the first season, they won't already figure it out and bust some yellow bucket heads, they're setting up the environment and the team dynamic, and elaborate some on the characters.
These posts just read like "I want this to be more serial than procedural."
Fringe or no Fringe, this has been true. Either boring or straightforward. I've actually enjoyed the more straightforward episodes because they focused on some character drama or development in the meantime.
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