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Agents of S.H.I.E.L.D. |OT| Tahiti is a Magical Place (to...Hey guys, I found it!)

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S

SRG01

Member
Haha, I was watching the Lego Marvel Superheroes short on Netflix and this is the top comment at the moment:

"They should seriously consider removing Agents of Shield and replacing it with 20 min episodes of this."

And, honestly, that 22m short was way better than any of the AoS episodes to date.
 
D

Dirtyshubb

Member
Cornballer said:
- Collider: Marvel’s AGENTS OF S.H.I.E.L.D. Executive Producers Jeph Loeb and Jeffrey Bell Talk Slow-Burn Storytelling, Cross-over Possibilities and More (some spoilers, TCA tour recap)
Click to expand...

Really good interview in my opinion and addresses many of the points I have thought with regards to the criticism of the show.

So far I have really enjoyed the show, I mean I actually had realistic expectations going in and realised that they weren’t going to have huge characters on each week and that with like all sci fi shows the first season tends to be a lot of build up for the characters, story, world etc and from season 2 they can really let go.

It does just seem that many people these days are very impatient and need almost immediate answers/gratification otherwise something will be called boring or just dragging it out.

I mean people have been going on about Coulson since episode 1 regarding why he is still alive, and even when they showed you what basically happened to him people still complained about not knowing every little detail. Of course they aren’t going to tell you everything, have you never watched a TV show before? They showed enough to get across that what SHIELD did to Coulson was not only horrible but also without his knowledge and broke his trust and to have him change his whole perspective with regards to his teams role and how they should handle themselves going forward, and of course it leaves it open enough to explore it further with regards to why Fury did what he did, why he didn’t tell Coulson etc.

I also really enjoyed Sky’s story so far, the way they have managed to turn her opinions on government and security on its head and now have her determined to help SHIELD (Well at least their team) to do whats right, despite her previous beliefs was very well handled, the scene where Coulson tells her of her past was very emotional and a great sequence.

Also, people complained about the episodes, saying that we need more over arching story, then of course (as I and im sure some others expected) you find out that 99% of those episodes that people thought were just stand alone were actually connected and will help build towards the bigger threat/story.

Anyway, enough complaining otherwise I might end up like some of the posters in this thread who keep coming back for more when they say they hate it. I just wish people had more patience and actually tried to put themselves into the characters shoes and imagine how they might react in those situations and I feel they might get some more out of the show.

*EDIT*
TheOddOne said:
http://i.imgur.com/vGK39.gif[/MG][/QUOTE]
LOL very nice :)
Click to expand...
 
T

TheOddOne

Member
Funky Papa said:
Oh, FFS.

Edit: Wait, I'm actually caring about this show. WHAT DOES THAT MEAN.
Click to expand...
vGK39.gif
 
X

xandaca

Member
Jeffrey Bell seems to have forgotten that The X-Files was a monster-of-the-week show far more often than it was a serialised show. It got away with keeping the Samantha stuff hanging for a while (although people were getting sick of all the semi-resolutions after a few years) because 1) it served primarily as background motivation for an awesome character in Mulder, and 2) there were fantastic individual stories happening each week, meaning the show wasn't dependent on resolving the bigger questions for viewers to have a good time anyway. Not to mention that, in the early years before everything got completely out of control, the X-Files mythology was being deepened and deepened every time one of those episodes came around, so the show's world was constantly expanding and you always felt like you were learning something new and amazing even if there weren't any concrete answers on the table.

S.H.I.E.L.D. is sort of alright, but its big questions have been overemphasized without bringing anything new to the show, developing its world or our perspectives of it, and have mostly had predictable answers related to under-developed characters. In other words, it feels like the questions are there for the sake of having questions, a big problem in common with the only other work I know Jeph Loeb from (at least, I think it was him), Heroes.
 
F

Father_Brain

Banned
HP_Wuvcraft said:
Slow Burn only works if everything else is good.

That "Mulder's Sister" comparison is bullshit, and if they don't understand why the two are different, they should go back to class.
Click to expand...

Exactly, but slow burn also only works if the slow burn itself is done well.

The problem with the Coulson resurrection storyline, for instance, isn't just that it took until halfway through the season to start going somewhere. It's that, rather than gradually teasing bits and pieces of the answer, the show spent half the season unsubtly reminding viewers that his resurrection was supposed to be a big mystery (much as it's still doing with the Clairvoyant), without establishing any dramatic stakes or reason why we were supposed to care other than that it follows up on a plot point from a movie that grossed a billion dollars.

By comparison, the mystery of Skye's parentage isn't the greatest storyline, but at least it's been perceptibly moved forward a bit every time it's been brought up, IIRC.
 
H

HP_Wuvcraft

Banned
Father_Brain said:
Exactly, but slow burn also only works if the slow burn itself is done well.

The problem with the Coulson resurrection storyline, for instance, isn't just that it took until halfway through the season to start going somewhere. It's that, rather than gradually teasing bits and pieces of the answer, the show spent half the season unsubtly reminding viewers that his resurrection was supposed to be a big mystery (much as it's still doing with the Clairvoyant), without establishing any dramatic stakes or reason why we were supposed to care other than that it follows up on a plot point from a movie that grossed a billion dollars.

By comparison, the mystery of Skye's parentage isn't the greatest storyline, but at least it's been perceptibly moved forward a bit every time it's been brought up, IIRC.
Click to expand...

Yup, yup, yup.
 
S

Saya

Member
So I just saw a promo about this show on tv and they were talking about
Coulson being the next Ghost Rider or something?
They mentioned 3 episodes from now, but mind you I saw this in Asia.

I think I should catch up on this, I stopped at episode 4 or something.
 
B

Boem

Member
Saya said:
So I just saw a promo about this show on tv and they were talking about
Coulson being the next Ghost Rider or something?
They mentioned 3 episodes from now, but mind you I saw this in Asia.

I think I should catch up on this, I stopped at episode 4 or something.
Click to expand...

First time I heard that, and Google turns up nothing. Can't really believe that that would be true, it doesn't really make any sense. Are you sure they weren't just promoting one of the older Nicholas Cage movies?
 
S

Saya

Member
Boem said:
First time I heard that, and Google turns up nothing. Can't really believe that that would be true, it doesn't really make any sense. Are you sure they weren't just promoting one of the older Nicholas Cage movies?
Click to expand...

I just saw caught half the promo again and this is what they showed:

Footage of the team looking at Ghost Rider on screens and refer to him as an 'unregistered'. Preview from the coming episode?

Then there is a promo voice over "Did Coulson trade his soul to be re-born as the Ghost Rider?"

If they got Ghost Rider mixed up in here somehow I'll definitely be watching again.
 
R

Rafa=FedKilla

Banned
Saya said:
I just saw caught half the promo again and this is what they showed:

Footage of the team looking at Ghost Rider on screens and refer to him as an 'unregistered'. Preview from the coming episode?

Then there is a promo voice over "Did Coulson trade his soul to be re-born as the Ghost Rider?"

If they got Ghost Rider mixed up in here somehow I'll definitely be watching again.
Click to expand...
What? Hahahahaha
 
F

Funky Papa

FUNK-Y-PPA-4
Saya said:
I just saw caught half the promo again and this is what they showed:

Footage of the team looking at Ghost Rider on screens and refer to him as an 'unregistered'. Preview from the coming episode?

Then there is a promo voice over "Did Coulson trade his soul to be re-born as the Ghost Rider?"

If they got Ghost Rider mixed up in here somehow I'll definitely be watching again.
Click to expand...

No way in hell.

That's goes above and beyond Loeb's usual terribleness.
 
F

Father_Brain

Banned
Saya said:
I just saw caught half the promo again and this is what they showed:

Footage of the team looking at Ghost Rider on screens and refer to him as an 'unregistered'. Preview from the coming episode?

Then there is a promo voice over "Did Coulson trade his soul to be re-born as the Ghost Rider?"

If they got Ghost Rider mixed up in here somehow I'll definitely be watching again.
Click to expand...

I don't believe this at all, sorry.
 
R

Ripclawe

Banned
Well lick me, Clark Gregg

http://www.sltrib.com/sltrib/entertainment2/57462732-223/episodes-sltrib-fans-gregg.html.csp

If you’ve given up on "Marvel’s Agents of S.H.I.E.L.D.," Clark Gregg has pretty much given up on you. Even if you’re a self-identified geek.

"Those aren’t geeks. Those are losers," the man who plays Agent Coulson said on the set of his show, somewhere in Los Angeles. (The producers want to keep exactly where kind of quiet, perhaps to keep the fanboys and fangirls away.)
Click to expand...

Network TV is not the most patient of mediums. Series get yanked after two or three episodes. And yet the people behind "S.H.I.E.L.D." seem surprised that viewers haven’t been altogether patient with a show that took 12 episodes working toward the good stuff.

Ming-Na Wen, who stars as Agent Melinda May, admitted she’s frustrated with some of the fan reaction.

"I love our fans so much, but they want the end of it already," she said. "We have 22 episodes and, hopefully, years to come of stories and developing characters, and all we want is our fans to just be patient and not come down hard. Go with us. It’s a slower ride."

"Hopefully, a five-year-plus ride," interjected Brett Dalton, who stars as Agent Grant Ward. "And I think all of the stuff that they want, we have in store."
Click to expand...
 
C

curb

Banned
Htown said:
The Star Trek fan in me is hurt by this.

also the show's not that bad
Click to expand...

Good grief, you're right. Think if Next Generation got cancelled half way through the first season. That show got so good in the later seasons. People are too impatient these days.
 
P

Pai Pai Master

Banned
curb said:
Good grief, you're right. Think if Next Generation got cancelled half way through the first season. That show got so good in the later seasons. People are too impatient these days.
Click to expand...

There are so many shows that really rush things these days that being a slow burner has become an inherently bad thing. If you think about some recent shows and what they'd be like if they aired a decade or two ago it's pretty fun. Like, I'm thinking Walter White wouldn't have found out about his cancer until halfway through season one instead of in the first episode.

That said, if they wanted to take their time setting up the major plot points then the first half of the season should have been loaded with character development which is where I think most of the complaints are stemming from. There were a lot of episodes in the front half where practically nothing was pushed forward. Simmon's episode was kind of the first one where that started happening and from there it's been pretty sporadic, but there were a lot of episodes wasted on what, at the time, seemed like standalone plots with no later consequence.
 
R

Ripclawe

Banned
exactly what pai pai said above, I am all for a slow burn of major plot development, but agents is acting like a show that knows it has full season and half assed thru the first half.

no one is saying go thru plots quickly but expectations for this show was set in marvel universe to be about living in a marvel universe with known , even C list villians that agents have to contend with on a daily basis.

until last two episodes none of this happened and even when it did it was executed poorly. it also has the problem of being compared to arrow that has exceeded expectations on a much smaller budget and a plot pace with DC villians done in a way that works.
 
T

Thunder Monkey

Banned
Hey!

Don't make me hate you Clark Gregg.

You're the reason I watch the show, but you ain't going to insult us when your show misses more often than it hits. Usually I follow the Whedon name anywhere, and the show has seen a quality uptick these past two weeks but we have every right to think it's not living up to its potential.
 
R

remnant

Banned
Gherid__lacksGPS said:
It never was that bad. Its had its share of rough spots, but not nearly as bad as all the mothers basement screenwriters would claim it to be.
Click to expand...

yes it is.

Slow burn is a bullshit excuse, and the reason why television has moved away from it is because it sucks. People aren't impatient, they just want quality, and the argument that we should wait for it, when pretty much every other show delivers consistently and does it earlier is a feather in their cap.

Compare AoS to a show like True Detective. TD have delivered more character progression, and advanced an intriguing plot in 2 episodes with half the cast. AoS on the other hand, how far are we now? Look At Arrow, or the Walking Dead.

This isn't slow burn. This is meandering
 
J

Jest Chillin

Member
remnant said:
yes it is.

Slow burn is a bullshit excuse, and the reason why television has moved away from it is because it sucks. People aren't impatient, they just want quality, and the argument that we should wait for it, when pretty much every other show delivers consistently and does it earlier is a feather in their cap.

Compare AoS to a show like True Detective. TD have delivered more character progression, and advanced an intriguing plot in 2 episodes with half the cast. AoS on the other hand, how far are we now? Look At Arrow, or the Walking Dead.

This isn't slow burn. This is meandering
Click to expand...

The success of Netflix' original programming that puts an entire season at once actually shows that people are impatient. Even a show as widely panned as Hemlock Grove was watched in huge chunks by viewers because people clearly don't want to wait if they don't have to.

Comparing AoS to True Detective is awful due to the nature of the two networks. An HBO original can and will intrigue more teens and adults due to the nature of the content even before we start talking about the pace. Once we do discuss pace, a show with a much shorter episode run will progress more in a single season than a show with a longer episode run.

Arrow is a slightly better comparison but still a bad one again because of huge differences in the Network, target demo, and even the structure of the Universe (Arrow doesn't have to match continuity with DC Movies). TWD also handles much more mature content as afforded by being on a Cable Net but even with that, TWD has suffered from slow pacing due to their own reasons (constant showrunner replacement, cost of the sets, etc..).
 
R

remnant

Banned
Jest Chillin said:
The success of Netflix' original programming that puts an entire season at once actually shows that people are impatient. Even a show as widely panned as Hemlock Grove was watched in huge chunks by viewers because people clearly don't want to wait if they don't have to.
Click to expand...
It shows that people, if given a choice will consume content however they want to, and plenty of people don't like the weekly drip of content we are accustomed to. Plenty of people have netflix and started a series and never finished it, or finished it in chunks. Hemlock Grove only proved that people like new content on netflix and don't give a damn about critics when it comes to shows dealing with the supernatural.

People are suprised at how many people "purge" on new shows, but realistically speaking, why wouldn't some people watch a series they like in big chunks. it's the biggest appeal of DVD boxsets

Jest Chillin said:
Comparing AoS to True Detective is awful due to the nature of the two networks. An HBO original can and will intrigue more teens and adults due to the nature of the content even before we start talking about the pace. Once we do discuss pace, a show with a much shorter episode run will progress more in a single season than a show with a longer episode run.
Click to expand...
The show being on HBO is irrelevant. HBO isn't telling the creative team "hey drag out this story for 3 months when it could have been solved in 2 episodes

Jest Chillin said:
Arrow is a slightly better comparison but still a bad one again because of huge differences in the Network, target demo, and even the structure of the Universe (Arrow doesn't have to match continuity with DC Movies). TWD also handles much more mature content as afforded by being on a Cable Net but even with that, TWD has suffered from slow pacing due to their own reasons (constant showrunner replacement, cost of the sets, etc..).
Click to expand...
Nothing AoS has done has suggested that they are holding the show back to match up with marvel movie contunity.
Contunity? Really? Before New York/After new York. I imagine that must be very difficult for the writers
and despite the fact that AoS has had a consistent writing team and huge support for the network, it still feels much more sluggish than a show with all the problems TWD had and a fraction of the budget Arrow did.

It meanders and it's boring.
 
R

Ripclawe

Banned
I can see a revolution type reset where season 1 is purged but they would have to eat some crow by admitting mistakes and so far from public comments I am sensing a fuck you attitude from the people on the show
 
K

kirblar

Member
Not everything is terrible from this season- the biggest problem was a complete lack of meat in the characters and stakes in the storytelling.
 
K

kirblar

Member
Scalemail Ted said:
What else is there in television serials?
Click to expand...
The stakes are easier to establish than the characters early on. The problem was that they just threw "mysteries" out there that the audience wasn't actively invested in - they finally started rectifying this in the last two episodes.
 
S

Scalemail Ted

Member
kirblar said:
The stakes are easier to establish than the characters early on. The problem was that they just threw "mysteries" out there that the audience wasn't actively invested in - they finally started rectifying this in the last two episodes.
Click to expand...

Ok, I can see that. Its like the the first 10 episodes they would merely drop a line of dialogue referencing the presence of some background info never to be fully explored and then the rest of the episodes played out as if it was independent from every other before it.
 
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