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Agents of S.H.I.E.L.D. S4 |OT| Ghost Riders in the Skye - Tuesdays 10/9c

S

StarCreator

Member
vivftp said:
The mist is harmless to normal humans. It was the Diviner metals that turned them to stone. In the Framework it seems they have purified the terrigen. This is why normal humans weren't affected by the fish oil pills
Click to expand...

We already saw a purified terrigen crystal in the late senator's office also.
 
Z

Zautruche

Banned
The Kree said:
Why are they giving wish fulfillment to a dead villain? LOL

Fan service gone wrong.
Click to expand...

They most likely realized having a narrative that glaring had to stop at some point.
When your protagonists say over and over they are the good guys, while they are clearly doing some evil shit isn't the best thing to have. Most of the team are murderers, they constantly threaten and torture people, they create a lot of the threats they try to stop.

It was a long time coming they start to face consequences for their actions, even if it's just at a personal level of "well shit I didn't handle that very well and caused more trouble than I've fixed".
Coulson is the only reason Hive was a thing, knowing he went too far he toned it down for a moment but then resumed doing whatever the fuck he wanted again, just like he did after the second shield.

This whole arc has been about fucking with the team emotions and perception of reality. Having Coulson knowing that Ward might not have killed everyone he did (including Rosalind) if he just left Ward rot in a cell instead of trying to "invent new ways to ruin his life", is plenty to fuck him up even more.
Him not being a shield agent isn't close to anything the others are going through.
 
C

Claude Augario

Member
If Fitz can be a big bad, VirtuWard can be a good guy. I was never on the Ward redemption train but this is one way to do. I figured they were going to bring him back as an LMD or something to torment the team but this is so much better. This show keeps subverting my expectations.
 
D

Deleted member 20920

Unconfirmed Member
Jackpot said:
But then why not just turn off the life-support machine?
Click to expand...

Miles Quaritch said:
That makes for boring television.

She could kill all of them, we know she's not bound by a no kill directive but she's keeping them alive and they'll escape to foil her dastardly plans because that's what heroes do and we all know villains become more incompetent the closer they get to realising their plans.
Click to expand...

I don't think Aida in the real world can kill any of them.

Khaz said:
I really thinks she is exploring free will, choice and consequences here. She shown no emotion after the fact, she unplugs Mace like we would unplug the vacuum cleaner once we're done with it. She had no specific desire to kill him or keep him alive.
Click to expand...

Callibretto said:
I wonder if outside Aida and framework Ophelia is exactly the same. Maybe outside the framework. Aida is still limited by her programming, which is why she can't just kill all the SHIELD member except Radcliff who basically kill himself with his stupid mouth.

Framework Aida on the other hand, is not limited by her programming and have been abusing her position to manipulate a lot of things. her final goal is basically to upload Ophelia to Aida in the real world. Another thing to keep in mind is that Ophelia need Fitz to try finish project looking glass. Maybe because Ophelia don't have Darkhold knowledge so she can't do it herself. While Aida in the real world may actually know how to do it, but cant execute it because it's not in her programming.
Click to expand...

I believe this is so. Being in the framework allows her to do whatever she wants. But it's interesting to wonder whether Madame Hydra is Aida or just a copy of Aida's mind that has develop independently.
 
S

StarCreator

Member
Zautruche said:
They most likely realized having a narrative that glaring had to stop at some point.
When your protagonists say over and over they are the good guys, while they are clearly doing some evil shit isn't the best thing to have. Most of the team are murderers, they constantly threaten and torture people, they create a lot of the threats they try to stop.

It was a long time coming they start to face consequences for their actions, even if it's just at a personal level of "well shit I didn't handle that very well and caused more trouble than I've fixed".
Coulson is the only reason Hive was a thing, knowing he went too far he toned it down for a moment but then resumed doing whatever the fuck he wanted again, just like he did after the second shield.

This whole arc has been about fucking with the team emotions and perception of reality. Having Coulson knowing that Ward might not have killed everyone he did (including Rosalind) if he just left Ward rot in a cell instead of trying to "invent new ways to ruin his life", is plenty to fuck him up even more.
Him not being a shield agent isn't close to anything the others are going through.
Click to expand...
... what did I just read?

I don't see how Ward could have turned out any different. In reality, he was already a psychopath long before Coulson even met him, as a result of his tortured relationship with his brother and Garrett's mentoring.

Also remember that it was not Coulson's decision to not let him stay jailed indefinitely. He broke out during an attempt to transfer him.
 
K

Khaz

Member
Hive would have been a thing even without Ward as a vessel, he would have kept using the other guy's body. It's not like that flare to the chest would have slow him down much, the thing could animate skeketons.
 
B

Broken Joystick

At least you can talk. Who are you?
BrokenFiction said:
Preview for Tuesday. A bit spoilery, but worth it if you want to know more about FrameWard:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OEGAVwlBgQA
Click to expand...

Ward:
4eb3258c5245a764ddaea1719ef02dc3.gif
 
O

Orbis Tabula

Member
Finally caught up. I kept hoping Mace's death would be a fake out, but Aida switching him off in the real world was pretty conclusive. Dammit. He was a lot of fun.

Also, yeah, just like everyone else, I'm scared to death about how Fitz comes out this. He's my favorite, dammit. He's been through enough!
 
E

Egg0

Banned
entrydenied said:
\I believe this is so. Being in the framework allows her to do whatever she wants. But it's interesting to wonder whether Madame Hydra is Aida or just a copy of Aida's mind that has develop independently.
Click to expand...

I'm wondering the same thing. When she was turning Mace's life support off, she had a sullen or melancholic look on her face. As opposed to Madame Hydra, who almost always has an evil smirk on.
 
Z

ZeoVGM

Banned
Just watched. Another amazing episode. It'll suck having Mace gone -- and Radcliffe soon -- as they were both great characters. But you can't say the Framework didn't matter.

So there are two spoilers I've taken from the upcoming episode synopses. ABC released this information willingly but they're both fairly large spoilers. (The first is speculation in regards to the guest cast list. The second is bigger and related to the Framework story itself.)

1) Next week's episode
is the last one that Brett Dalton is listed as a guest star. Then again, B.J. Britt was not listed until the episode aired so maybe they have some other surprise up their sleeves. The finale is the only episode there is no synopsis for yet.

2)
They're out of the Framework for the final two episodes. What in the hell do the writers have planned exactly!?

Also, no two-hour finale this year.
 
S

SRG01

Member
Jorok Goldblade said:
And now we know why fake Ward is a good guy:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XDGWYF7A194
Click to expand...

Oh, oh man.
In the real world, Ward killed Victoria Hand... wow.

Razgriz-Specter said:
Never even realized he is the voice of Batman in all the current continuity DC animated movies

Or that he was the original Wesker in Resident Evil 3.
640


Mind is being blown.
Click to expand...

How did I not notice this? I've watched every single live action RE movie multiple times...
 
P

Pachimari

Member
I'm just disappointed that May is basically May, Quake is still Quake etc in the Framework. They should have taken much bigger liberties with what they had but I guess they didn't have enough amounts of episodes left to do anything with complete new pages of characters.
 
F

Fuu

Formerly Alaluef (not Aladuf)
I wish they made May a cheerful person in the Framework, it would have made sense and would be amusing as hell. She cracked jokes and smiled a lot in that one flashback with Coulson (last season, I think).
 
Jag

Jag

Member
Fuu said:
I wish they made May a cheerful person in the Framework, it would have made sense and would be amusing as hell. She cracked jokes and smiled a lot in that one flashback with Coulson (last season, I think).
Click to expand...

Happy May was weird. I prefer dark broody May.
 
R

Renpatsu

Member
Would merely changing her personality have made sense? They spent an entire episode establishing that so much of May's sense of self is derived from conflict whether it be internal or external. Hence Aida tending to her reality in the Framework by putting her in a position of endless obstacles to overcome. Beyond the novelty of having an overtly happy May nothing in her new reality changes the fact that she's an intensely duty bound individual with an exceptional penchant for challenge.

But I do agree that she's been underutilised a bit thus far - I really liked her Frankenstein's Monster LMD portrayal.
 
F

Fuu

Formerly Alaluef (not Aladuf)
Renpatsu said:
Would merely changing her personality have made sense? They spent an entire episode establishing that so much of May's sense of self is derived from conflict whether it be internal or external. Hence Aida tending to her reality in the Framework by putting her in a position of endless obstacles to overcome. Beyond the novelty of having an overtly happy May nothing in her new reality changes the fact that she's an intensely duty bound individual with an exceptional penchant for challenge.
Click to expand...
Good call actually. They did go out of their way to show that it wasn't as simple as flipping a switch.

Which makes Fitz's case even more worrisome. Not sure how his character will come back from this.
 
P

Platy

Member
Fuu said:
Good call actually. They did go out of their way to show that it wasn't as simple as flipping a switch.

Which makes Fitz's case even more worrisome. Not sure how his character will come back from this.
Click to expand...

Maybe they go full Angel and he shoots his dad in the framework =P
 
L

Lonestar

I joined for Erin Brockovich discussion
Trying to think, when did we last see the real May (walking and talking), in the real world? Has she ever technically been in this season? It's all been Framework May or LMD May.
 
L

Luigi87

Member
Lonestar said:
Trying to think, when did we last see the real May (walking and talking), in the real world? Has she ever technically been in this season? It's all been Framework May or LMD May.
Click to expand...

Last time we saw her was walking... When she was all paranoid in the SHIELD base thinking everyone was some alien demon thing during the Ghost Rider arc.
 
R

Renpatsu

Member
Luigi87 said:
Last time we saw her was walking... When she was all paranoid in the SHIELD base thinking everyone was some alien demon thing during the Ghost Rider arc.
Click to expand...
Yeah, basically everything up to her being checked in to Radcliffe's to check up on her brain is really her. I think that's the case.
 
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