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[FunkMiller]

It would be nice if some you would actually do a bit of research into astrophysics to see some of the hard facts about the difficulties of space travel.

I thought much the same as some of you here, but I made a point to research, and learn more from people far more capable than me of understanding all this stuff. I’d strongly suggest you do the same, to arrive at a somewhat more realistic view of the universe.

Keeping an open mind does not mean keeping it free of knowledge.

 

[12Goblins]

It’s seems crazy to me that ppl in this thread have the arrogance to firmly declare what is impossible. Humans went from horses and wagons to human piloted space craft in a mere 80 years. Imagine what will be possible in another 80 years or even 1000 years if we survive?

Also, assuming that since we have not displayed a reverse engineering marvel such as anti grave it does not mean we are not trying. Imagine someone in 1650 trying to reverse engineer an iPhone. No matter how brilliant you are it’s going to be tough to even figure out what it’s purpose is with no internet and no charger ;P

I don’t know what’s real or not, but I think it makes sense to keep an open mind.

I am curious to see what will be released to the public in the next steps after the hearing..

You just need to be more discerning of the information you let in with an open mind (wanting to believe =/= having an open mind). Nobody is saying this stuff is impossible, it's just unlikely right now with the information that is available to us. Present evidence so we can evaluate your claims. Until then, we are at an impasse.

 

[AcrosstheSea]

It would be nice if some you would actually do a bit of research into astrophysics to see some of the hard facts about the difficulties of space travel.

I thought much the same as some of you here, but I made a point to research, and learn more from people far more capable than me of understanding all this stuff. I’d strongly suggest you do the same, to arrive at a somewhat more realistic view of the universe.

Keeping an open mind does not mean keeping it free of knowledge.

Eric Weinstein seems plenty well versed on the topic and he's a skeptic himself but he finds that people closed off to possibilities hinder progress and science.

We are thinking in terms of our current understanding. What we think means jack shit to a species that for all we know has been existing for millions of years. You don't know if they learned about secrets we are incapable of understanding. You just don't. We don't even know if they came from another world or just exist here somehow. We don't know anything right now but shutting down possibilities is a good way to never learn more.

12Goblins

Present the evidence. I mean that's what we are all waiting for Congress to do. Slowly reveal wtf is going on right now. Until then speculation on what David Grusch is implying is natural. These are respectable people. They deserve the chance to prove what they claim. Saying something is impossible... I mean a lot of things are impossible till it becomes possible. There's things that people would think were impossible hundreds of years ago until our understanding and knowledge grew.

 

[Crayon]

It would be nice if some you would actually do a bit of research into astrophysics to see some of the hard facts about the difficulties of space travel.

I thought much the same as some of you here, but I made a point to research, and learn more from people far more capable than me of understanding all this stuff. I’d strongly suggest you do the same, to arrive at a somewhat more realistic view of the universe.

Keeping an open mind does not mean keeping it free of knowledge.

I got to ask if you're operating off a model where civilizations are rare enough do not come up in the same galaxy. The "you can't get there from here" argument holds up a lot better that way.

 

[FunkMiller]

Eric Weinstein seems plenty well versed on the topic and he's a skeptic himself but he finds that people closed off to possibilities hinder progress and science.

Try to maybe look up, and look into, astrophysicists and quantum physicists (Weinstein's field is mathematical physics)... who don't turn up on the Joe Rogan show, and get lambasted by the scientific community as a result, for his poor research and methodology.

 

[Nester99]

You just need to be more discerning of the information you let in with an open mind (wanting to believe =/= having an open mind). Nobody is saying this stuff is impossible, it's just unlikely right now with the information that is available to us. Present evidence so we can evaluate your claims. Until then, we are at an impasse.

Others in the thread have used the word impossible.

I live in the world of “not probable but absolutely possible”

I am in the insurance business, it’s not probable your house will burn down, but I deal with that fact that they do on a regular basis.

Perspective can be a game changer.

We absolutely need more evidence, but we must admit a senior intelligence officer making claims about his work under oath in front of congress is a huge step..

 

[haxan7]

BRB advancing humanity’s science thousands of years to give the skeptics the evidence they want

 

[FunkMiller]

I got to ask if you're operating off a model where civilizations are rare enough do not come up in the same galaxy. The "you can't get there from here" argument holds up a lot better that way.

Quite possibly. Even civilisations in the same galaxy could exist without knowing another is there. Some galaxies are horrifically huge.

 

[AcrosstheSea]

Try to maybe look up, and look into, astrophysicists and quantum physicists (Weinstein's field is mathematical physics)... who don't turn up on the Joe Rogan show, and get lambasted by the scientific community as a result, for his poor research and methodology.

I don't care what any of them think. Established science has been wrong and/or limited in the past based on current understanding of their respective times. It was always someone who broke away from the grain that helped expand scientific thought.

Saying something isn't likely at all because well this is how we currently understand the universe to me is putting yourself in a hole. A species that potentially could have been around for millions of years could have figured out things we can't even comprehend.

That's the point ....I DONT know. Some of the very people claiming there are NHI here on this planet aren't even claiming they are necessarily from deep space. They aren't saying anything definitive on how they are here. All I'm saying is my mind is open and I'm willing to see where these hearings lead.

 

[MMaRsu]

A month???

Bruh how is that trustworthy.

All these people coming out of the woodworks now to discredit Grusch is fucking sus as hell

 

[MMaRsu]

I don't care what any of them think. Established science has been wrong and/or limited in the past based on current understanding of their respective times. It was always someone who broke away from the grain that helped expand scientific thought.

Saying something isn't likely at all because well this is how we currently understand the universe to me is putting yourself in a hole. A species that potentially could have been around for millions of years could have figured out things we can't even comprehend.

That's the point ....I DONT know. Some of the very people claiming there area NHI here in this planet aren't even claiming they are necessarily from deep space. They aren't saying anything definitive on how they are here. All I'm saying is my mind is open and I'm willing to see where these hearings lead.

 

[Nester99]

It would be nice if some you would actually do a bit of research into astrophysics to see some of the hard facts about the difficulties of space travel.

I thought much the same as some of you here, but I made a point to research, and learn more from people far more capable than me of understanding all this stuff. I’d strongly suggest you do the same, to arrive at a somewhat more realistic view of the universe.

Keeping an open mind does not mean keeping it free of knowledge.

“The more I learn, the more I realize how much I don’t know”. - Albert Einstein.

Our understanding of physics is in its infancy. Gravity was only “discovered” 360 years ago. In a cosmic scale that is what 1 second ago?

 

[FunkMiller]

I don't care what any of them think.

 

[MMaRsu]

It would be nice if some you would actually do a bit of research into astrophysics to see some of the hard facts about the difficulties of space travel.

I thought much the same as some of you here, but I made a point to research, and learn more from people far more capable than me of understanding all this stuff. I’d strongly suggest you do the same, to arrive at a somewhat more realistic view of the universe.

Keeping an open mind does not mean keeping it free of knowledge.

Well I find it hard to speak in certainties. I have watched videos by Michio Kaku, and some Lex Fridman podcasts, but can you perhaps point me to some somewhat easily digestable materials? Ofcourse im no astrophysicist and some stuff is difficult to fully grasp.

 

[AcrosstheSea]

Perfect.

“The more I learn, the more I realize how much I don’t know”. - Albert Einstein.

Our understanding of physics is in its infancy. Gravity was only “discovered” 360 years ago. In a cosmic scale that is what 1 second ago?

Yeah, I just hate hubris basically. Things change as more information and new details are observed and discovered. To pretend we all have the answers now is absurd.

Great quote and a good lesson to learn.

 

[Crayon]

Quite possibly. Even civilisations in the same galaxy could exist without knowing another is there. Some galaxies are horrifically huge.

That's the big question on the distance hypothesis. Unfortunately (or maybe just an is-what-it-is sort of thing without passing judgement) with a sample size of 1, we can't get that far without invoking speculation. My possibly controversal opinion on that is that it's really hard to go that far into speculation without ideology having a mark on it. That includes me, and I suspect most anyone else who is going so far into speculation. For my part, I'm operating off the *intuitive* idea that nothing only happens once. But that is again a shaky leg to prop up the idea that we have a plurality of civilisations in this galaxy. I do think it's more down to earth to acknowledge that we suck at space and shouldn't push it in regards to theories extrapolated so far from what we actually know.

 

[Tygeezy]

I have a problem with the thinking it’s not possible if it doesn’t obey the laws of physics as we know it. We have plenty of eye witness testimony as well as video footage of objects that don’t to appear to be operating under our current understanding of physics.

 

[AcrosstheSea]

The battle has begun.

 

[Romulus]

It would be nice if some you would actually do a bit of research into astrophysics to see some of the hard facts about the difficulties of space travel.

I thought much the same as some of you here, but I made a point to research, and learn more from people far more capable than me of understanding all this stuff. I’d strongly suggest you do the same, to arrive at a somewhat more realistic view of the universe.

Keeping an open mind does not mean keeping it free of knowledge.

The people "more capable than you" know next to nothing though, that's the point. You can ask the best in the world a few tough questions and they'll respond "we don't know how that works."

The science you're basing this on is incomplete. The same way man was saying crossing the ocean was impossible and flight was impossible. Those are recent statements our best minds made in the last 600 years. You have to think in terms of thousands of years.

We're just in a ridiculous phase were we know just enough about space to say its "dangerous and big." The same way the altantic was hundreds of years ago. Think very long term. The gap seems impossible because it's filled with small, incremental steps.

 

[FunkMiller]

Well I find it hard to speak in certainties. I have watched videos by Michio Kaku, and some Lex Fridman podcasts, but can you perhaps point me to some somewhat easily digestable materials? Ofcourse im no astrophysicist and some stuff is difficult to fully grasp.

The problem is none of it is really easily digestible Not once you get down into the weeds, anyway. I'd say look at the stuff people like Professor Brian Cox makes. He's made a career of making some of the more complex aspects of astrophysics palatable. Loads of his stuff on YouTube. There's a good channel called SEA on there too (https://www.youtube.com/@sea_space) that collates a lot of information about the universe is a manner that's easy to both understand and get through without falling asleep. Kip Thorne's public work is worth checking out as well. He was the consultant on Interstellar for Chris Nolan. Obviously Neil DeGrasse Tyson as well.

 

[MMaRsu]

The battle has begun.

Well not really a battle since Kirkpatrick is obviously lying. Not only did he testify in court that they only had title 10 clearence instead of title 50, now he says he has everything he needs to investigate.

Also nobody ever claimed to have worked at AARO. Guy is making a joke of himself.

 

[MMaRsu]

I dunno man Neill Degrasse Tyson.. That guy seems like a fucking clueless hack to me.

 

[FunkMiller]

The people "more capable than you" know next to nothing though, that's the point. You can ask the best in the world a few tough questions and they'll respond "we don't know how that works."

The science you're basing this on is incomplete. The same way man was saying crossing the ocean was impossible and flight was impossible. Those are recent statements our best minds made in the last 600 years. You have to think in terms of thousands of years.

No one has ever claimed we know everything. Scientific discovery is being made all of the time. But your claim that they know 'next to nothing' is possibly the most fatuous statement I've heard in a long time. Especially when it comes to the chances of aliens visiting this little mud ball of ours.

 

[FunkMiller]

That's the big question on the distance hypothesis. Unfortunately (or maybe just an is-what-it-is sort of thing without passing judgement) with a sample size of 1, we can't get that far without invoking speculation. My possibly controversal opinion on that is that it's really hard to go that far into speculation without ideology having a mark on it. That includes me, and I suspect most anyone else who is going so far into speculation. For my part, I'm operating off the *intuitive* idea that nothing only happens once. But that is again a shaky leg to prop up the idea that we have a plurality of civilisations in this galaxy. I do think it's more down to earth to acknowledge that we suck at space and shouldn't push it in regards to theories extrapolated so far from what we actually know.

Ask most physicists and other experts on this stuff and they'll probably say that the chances of intelligent advanced life existing somewhere in this universe other than here is pretty damn high - because the laws of probability suggest that in an infinite universe where we came to exist, the chances of us being the only ones it happened to is vanishingly small. We are surely not that unique.

But the same physicists would also state that they don't believe aliens have ever visited earth, because A) there's zero evidence to suggest they have, and B) the science of being able to do so is so extraordinarily unlikely.

We do indeed suck at space, but we suck less every day, especially with things like James Webb now up there and having a nose around.

 

[AcrosstheSea]

No one has ever claimed we know everything. Scientific discovery is being made all of the time. But your claim that they know 'next to nothing' is possibly the most fatuous statement I've heard in a long time. Especially when it comes to the chances of aliens visiting this little mud ball of ours.

You make a lot of assumptions. The point is we aren't claiming we know the answers. The way you are approaching this sounds like you know what they could or couldn't do, what they would or wouldn't want to do based on what? If they exist we don't know how capable, we don't know their intentions, we don't know how far ahead they are of us, we don't know if there's even a connection between us and them.

The point isn't us claiming we know it's us being humble enough to say we don't. That is why the investigation is important. These are serious charges being made.

 

[Romulus]

No one has ever claimed we know everything. Scientific discovery is being made all of the time. But your claim that they know 'next to nothing' is possibly the most fatuous statement I've heard in a long time. Especially when it comes to the chances of aliens visiting this little mud ball of ours.

No one claimed we know anywhere near everything, not my point.

Scientists just proved gravity had waves in the last 16 years, that's a foundational pillar of physics lol.

They have no idea what dark matter is, which makes up the MAJORITY of the universe.

Ever wonder why they're smashing particles in accelerators etc? Because they trying to prove theories correct.

We're still in the phase of proving basic theories lol

It seems impressive to you because you have a difficult time understanding much of it,(as do most of us) but in terms of space and space travel, we know next to nothing.

 

[FunkMiller]

The prof says it best here really:

 

[Romulus]

Ask most physicists and other experts on this stuff and they'll probably say that the chances of intelligent advanced life existing somewhere in this universe other than here is pretty damn high - because the laws of probability suggest that in an infinite universe where we came to exist, the chances of us being the only ones it happened to is vanishingly small. We are surely not that unique.

But the same physicists would also state that they don't believe aliens have ever visited earth, because A) there's zero evidence to suggest they have, and B) the science of being able to do so is so extraordinarily unlikely.

We do indeed suck at space, but we suck less every day, especially with things like James Webb now up there and having a nose around.

We suck at space but also listen to scientists about aliens traveling in space. "Impossible because of science!"

 

[Crayon]

I dunno man Neill Degrasse Tyson.. That guy seems like a fucking clueless hack to me.

His ideas on this are not very sophisticated. Check him on the recent toe podcast with kurt's alien-like patience and gentle prodding. Tyson is pretty much losing it by the end of the ufo conversation. I think his message was easy to throw out in twitter slap fights 5 years ago but things are different now.

 

[FunkMiller]

We suck at space but also listen to scientists about aliens traveling in space. "Impossible because of science!"

Nobody said impossible. Just highly, highly, improbable. Follow the science, that’s the conclusion.

I can’t definitely say it’s impossible that the entire universe was sneezed out of the nose of a giant supercosmic being… but I can also say for certain it’s highly, highly improbable.

 

[Crayon]

I don't think the standard of evidence changes on the basis of arbitrarily deeming a claim extraordinary. It's a cute quote but that's about it.

 

[FunkMiller]

His ideas on this are not very sophisticated. Check him on the recent toe podcast with kurt's alien-like patience and gentle prodding. Tyson is pretty much losing it by the end of the ufo conversation. I think his message of was easy to throw out in twitter slap fights 5 years ago but things are different now.

Tyson’s smelled his own farts a bit too much, and got caught up in the whole fame thing. A brilliant man to be sure, but also someone who long ago left serious scientific research behind.

 

[Tygeezy]

The prof says it best here really:

I don’t think anybody here is satisfied with the evidence provided. What we all want is this to be investigated further… Are you at least on board with that? If we can’t even get on the same page as far as taking this seriously and allocating resources to verify these claims then we are just going to spin in circles here.

 

[Romulus]

Nobody said impossible. Just highly, highly, improbable. Follow the science, that’s the conclusion.

Improbable to humans that haven't figured out the foundations of the universe and base most everything on theories.

That doesn't say much at all.

I'm not asserting we won't find out, I'm saying we are likely many, many years away.

The point is, I'm not taking a scientist's word on the potential of space travel when they outright admit they don't understand the potential of space travel. It's as simple as that.

 

[Crayon]

Tyson’s smelled his own farts a bit too much, and got caught up in the whole fame thing. A brilliant man to be sure, but also someone who long ago left serious scientific research behind.

I don't know if it cool down yet, but for a minute there it seemed like there were so many physicists gunning to be a talking head. Neil actually succeeded along with kaku and greene. But it seemed like there is a bunch of little ones going for it.

 

[SirKicksalot]

The prof says it best here really:

I hate this extraordinary evidence thing so much. Ordinary evidence is all that's required! And you don't need proof that something exists in order to investigate if it exists!

Starting right now, every person requesting proof is a fucking cretin in my book. Three dudes with impeccable credentials came out saying objective data exists and certain persons and organizations know shit and asked for mechanisms for discovery and investigation. Instead of going "yeah dude we should investigate, let's write to our reps or whatever" a lot of mouthbreathers ask THESE DUDES for the proof they just said OTHER DUDES have. Or ask that one dude to go straight into a cement box for 23 hours per day for the rest of his life.

 

[FunkMiller]

The point is, I'm not taking a scientist's word on the potential of space travel when they outright admit they don't understand the potential of space travel.

None of them say that though. A good scientist never claims to be 100% right, because that’s bad science. But they also know it’s bad science to disregard the evidence that does exist, in order to justify a theory about the potentiality of space travel.

 

[Crayon]

I don’t think anybody here is satisfied with the evidence provided. What we all want is this to be investigated further… Are you at least on board with that? If we can’t even get on the same page as far as taking this seriously and allocating resources to verify these claims then we are just going to spin in circles here.

What's his name... the mean physicist lol. He put this in such good words when he said he's never seen something with so much circumstantial evidence and so little direct evidence. And that alone says something weird is going on. Not aliens, just weird.

 

[midnightAI]

It’s seems crazy to me that ppl in this thread have the arrogance to firmly declare what is impossible. Humans went from horses and wagons to human piloted space craft in a mere 80 years. Imagine what will be possible in another 80 years or even 1000 years if we survive?

Also, assuming that since we have not displayed a reverse engineering marvel such as anti grave it does not mean we are not trying. Imagine someone in 1650 trying to reverse engineer an iPhone. No matter how brilliant you are it’s going to be tough to even figure out what it’s purpose is with no internet and no charger ;P

I don’t know what’s real or not, but I think it makes sense to keep an open mind.

I am curious to see what will be released to the public in the next steps after the hearing..

I think you'll find not many are saying it's impossible, the word you are looking for is... Improbable.

I think it's improbable but would like to be proven wrong (the biggest issue for me... size, space is frickin ridiculously unimaginably huge, it's like finding a spec of dust on a needle in a haystack the size of our solar system)

 

[FunkMiller]

Starting right now, every person requesting proof is a fucking cretin in my book.

Very short book, I presume.

 

[AcrosstheSea]

I hate this extraordinary evidence thing so much. Ordinary evidence is all that's required! And you don't need proof that something exists in order to investigate if it exists!

Starting right now, every person requesting proof is a fucking cretin in my book. Three dudes with impeccable credentials came out saying objective data exists and certain persons and organizations know shit and asked for mechanisms for discovery and investigation. Instead of going "yeah dude we should investigate, let's write to our reps or whatever" a lot of mouthbreathers ask THESE DUDES for the proof they just said OTHER DUDES have. Or ask that one dude to go straight into a cement box for 23 hours per day for the rest of his life.

THANK YOU.

He's handed in his evidence. People making judgements based on the first hearing with three witnesses we already heard a lot from. They are very respectable but what did everyone expect? This is just the start of a long process.

Let's be clear here, if this is even remotely true....does anyone really think the government would roll over and let this info out easily? No way. You see how Kirkpatrick responded already.... This is gonna be a battle and hopefully we actually get some answers one way or another at the end of it.

M Midnight Bliss

Right but again that's going off one possibility. We just don't know. What if they are in another dimension popping in and out? What if they've lived here for thousands of years in our oceans? It was seen a lot near water. ( The TIC TAC is said to be able to go underwater )

I get that the idea feels improbable it's just if this is even remotely true we don't even know where to start on where they could be from, how they are here, what they know, what tech they have...etc.

 

[Romulus]

None of them say that though. A good scientist never claims to be 100% right, because that’s bad science. But they also know it’s bad science to disregard the evidence that does exist, in order to justify a theory about the potentiality of space travel.

It would be nice if some you would actually do a bit of research into astrophysics to see some of the hard facts about the difficulties of space travel.

 

[FunkMiller]

I think you'll find not many are saying it's impossible, the word you are looking for is... Improbable.

I think it's improbable but would like to be proven wrong (the biggest issue for me... size, space is frickin ridiculously unimaginably huge, it's like finding a spec of dust on a needle in a haystack the size of our solar system)

Bingo.

Things aren’t either impossible or probable. The scale of improbability is incredibly long. And aliens having visiting earth already is right up at the far end, kissing impossible on the ass cheeks.

 

[FunkMiller]

The fact you think there’s a contradiction in those two statements speaks volumes Romulus

 

[Romulus]

The fact you think there’s a contradiction in those two statements speaks volumes Romulus

The fact that you don't see it speaks even more.

EDIT. Wait, of course you do because you have science!

 

[Crayon]

I don't think it's an issue that space is unimaginably huge. No need to imagine. That's why we use math instead. We can fling a solar sail at the nearest star going .1c and be there in 40 years. That's technologicaly like shooting a rock out of a slingshot. Weak sauce.

edit: not counting the time it takes to accelerate the sail. Don't be pedantic!!! >:O

 

[FunkMiller]

The fact that you don't see it speaks even more.

EDIT. Wait, of course you do because you have science!

You'd have a point.... if there was like... one scientist in the world, and independent confirmation through observation and/or experimentation wasn't a thing.

 

[Romulus]

You'd have a point.... if there was like... one scientist in the world, and independent confirmation through observation and/or experimentation wasn't a thing.

I'm basing my posts on the hard facts, but not 100% sure on their accuracy

 

[Inuteu]

Maybe with this alien tech, nVidia can figure out how to release a 4060 worth buying.

I bet on liquid metal, like T1000

 

[sono]

They believe in established science because anything outside of that to them makes them look crazy.

Established science can't explain the flight characteristics of the craft reported by the pilots at the hearing 60miles in 60seconds (3600mph in air ) instaneous accelerations on our radar etc etc. It's time to be humble about how smart we think we are..