Amplitude (Harmonix) PS3/PS4 - KS (Funded, final day)

TheBatman said:
Agreed, 300k plus more just for online multiplayer?
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The entire project is budgeted at around 1,550,000 for two platforms, so 300k for multiplayer on both consoles sets the budget at 150k for a programmer/netcode specialist to work on each platform. It really isn't that much.
 
A killer 4-player local multiplayer experience and asynchronous features like leaderboards were always a part of the core experience that we plan to deliver. So why is “Online Synchronous head-to-head Multiplayer” our first stretch goal? This feature has been at the top of our “dream features to add” lists since the beginning. We worked out a few different stretch goal scenarios, and we’ve decided to dive in headfirst and go for the gold, instead of putting any smaller roadblocks ahead of that goal.
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So I mean, the leaderboard kinda qualifies as online feature. Its probably important to remember too that the 775k (now 800+) isn't funding the whole game, and they're talking about putting up 1M plus of Harmonix money as well.
 
driver116 said:
Me too. Kind of a dick move.
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How is that a dick move? You think they are holding it hostage just for the sake of getting more money out of people? It's not a switch you just turn on. This stuff takes work, time, and lots of testing. All of that costs money.
 
Tsundere said:
The entire project is budgeted at around 1,550,000 for two platforms, so 300k for multiplayer on both consoles sets the budget at 150k for a programmer/netcode specialist to work on each platform. It really isn't that much.
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I would *hope* there's at least a reasonable amount of unified design to the PSN interface for each platform - I would have expected one programmer to be able to handle both systems. That said, it's entirely dependent on how competently Sony designed the backend, there!
 
I don't care if it has online multiplayer. Sure it would be nice, but I'm just happy to have the thing being made period. I'll stick with single player and local multiplayer over the game's lack of existence.
 
mclem said:
I would *hope* there's at least a reasonable amount of unified design to the PSN interface for each platform - I would have expected one programmer to be able to handle both systems. That said, it's entirely dependent on how competently Sony designed the backend, there!
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Sony doesn't really handle any of that they just certify the servers that can be connected to. Harmonix would have to purchase and design the server software and infrastructure they use. Now sony may have some API's designed to make this easier but who knows since this game requires precise input timing.
 
Wereroku said:
Sony doesn't really handle any of that they just certify the servers that can be connected to. Harmonix would have to purchase and design the server software and infrastructure they use. Now sony may have some API's designed to make this easier but who knows since this game requires precise input timing.
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If it's one-on-one multiplayer, I'd expect it to be simple peer-to-peer. I suspect timings would be kind of irrelevant, in that there's not actually much interaction between the players (of course, that depends on the precise design); everything time-sensitive would be entirely handled locally.
 
Online leaderboards is enough for me, I'm happy to play high score chases with my friends list. We've done that in the past with Rock Band Blitz (among others) and we'll do again here.

Vita port was my hope, as I would lose hours and hours playing this to and from work. I'm still hopeful that it might happen eventually.

Perhaps we could tweet Gio Corsi & Shahid Ahmad and see if they will donate Vita dev kits to Harmonix now and let them play with them in their own time as the game develops and we might get lucky that a Vita version might naturally develop, if not for release day, but maybe released a couple of weeks/months later.

Anyway, just completed my backing, this is my first Kickstarter and I'm down for $100, gimme that sweet boxart!
 
highly unlikely that they'll hit that stretch goal. also, the idea that a vita stretch goal would magically increase funding is a pipe dream
 
Canis lupus said:
Turns out, non-pc console exclusive kickstarters can be pretty successful, and it was achieved in just 18 days for a game that bombed on PS2 more than 10 years ago. I imagine series that were more popular back in the day will manage to bring in even more money, and I believe this kickstarter will be a model for future console exclusive kickstarters(if only for the fact that OG developers want to revisit their old games but can't make it multiplatform because the IP is owned by someone else).

It's funny when this thing really exploded a few days ago(around pages 30), the whining about a PC version suddenly stopped.
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Thanks for including me in your list but there have been console exclusive kick starters with big names attached that failed miserably. The biggest I can think if was a car combat with David Jaffe attached to it that was also exclusive to Playstation consoles. It wasn't some crazy baseless prediction from people that not having a PC version might end up killing this one.

I'm glad Harmonix got funded and I was wrong as they're one of my favorite devs but I think it's disingenuous to paint people doubtful of its success as crazy.
 
Moosichu said:
I think they would get more money with a Vita stretch goal instead of the online one.
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Yup, I haven't backed yet because I find it rather shady of Harmonix to go the Kickstarter route. If there was a Vita version, I'd back it anyway to basically "pre-order" a Vita version of a game I used to love on PS2.
 
Hellsing321 said:
Thanks for including me in your list but there have been console exclusive kick starters with big names attached that failed miserably. The biggest I can think if was a car combat with David Jaffe attached to it that was also exclusive to Playstation consoles. It wasn't some crazy baseless prediction from people that not having a PC version might end up killing this one.

I'm glad Harmonix got funded and I was wrong as they're one of my favorite devs but I think it's disingenuous to paint people doubtful of its success as crazy.
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That was PC exclusive: https://www.kickstarter.com/projects/1517270521/motorgun-return-of-the-auto-duel?ref=live
 
Neuromancer said:
You don't know that. Vita people buy a lot of games.
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my original post was maybe a little too negatively slanted. I just question what the number of people that own a vita + are interested in amplitude enough to back it + aren't afraid of kickstarter + didn't already back it because they are likely a playstation fan is enough to give it a big boost

don't get me wrong the DESIRE for a vita version is strong, and very appealing, I just think most people that want one probably already backed it
 
mclem said:
I suspect timings would be kind of irrelevant, in that there's not actually much interaction between the players
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If you say that, then you don't know what Amplitude online multiplayer was like. Misdirection and track blocking to end your opponents streak was just as important as playing notes. That stuff takes absolutely precise timing.
 
takoyaki said:
Yup, I haven't backed yet because I find it rather shady of Harmonix to go the Kickstarter route. If there was a Vita version, I'd back it anyway to basically "pre-order" a Vita version of a game I used to love on PS2.
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There's nothing shady about them going Kickstarter. Can people stop with this BS and educate themselves of the matter already. Sony didn't want to do anything with the IP anymore because the previous two didn't sell all that well. Harmonix DID want to do a new Amplitude after a decade after the first Amplitude. Sony was cool enough to let Harmonix use the IP, but they had to arrange funding themselves. Harmonix doesn't have some magical pile of cash anywhere they could use to completely fund this themselves, so they went to Kickstarter to get the minimum amount of funding they'd need for it to be viable for them. Sony has been cool enough (for their selfish reasons) to promote the Kickstarter. That's really all there is to it. If you think there's anything more to it, you should join the tinfoil hat club, as that's where you belong.
 
Famassu said:
There's nothing shady about them going Kickstarter. Can people stop with this BS and educate themselves of the matter already. Sony didn't want to do anything with the IP anymore because the previous two didn't sell all that well. Harmonix DID want to do a new Amplitude after a decade after the first Amplitude. Sony was cool enough to let Harmonix use the IP, but they had to arrange funding themselves. Harmonix doesn't have some magical pile of cash anywhere they could use to completely fund this themselves, so they went to Kickstarter to get the minimum amount of funding they'd need for it to be viable for them. Sony has been cool enough (for their selfish reasons) to promote the Kickstarter. That's really all there is to it. If you think there's anything more to it, you should join the tinfoil hat club, as that's where you belong.
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This really sums it up perfectly. People have to remember that the previous two games were huge sellers and household names like Rock Band and Guitar Hero were and from a business standpoint, it would be quite dumb for a publisher (like Sony) to fund a sequel/spiritual successor to a game series that didn't sell, at all. Thankfully, we have programs like Kickstarter and Harmonix is able to get the money to fund the development of a new title in the series and they were able to achieve the goal
 
I'm a little worried about the difficulty. They say on the Kickstarter page that it will be as hard as the original, but even the last levels on Expert weren't all that hard. The hard songs were the remixes people played online.
 
SparkleMotion said:
I'm surprised they can even make a game on $775,000
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They can't. They are spending something like (at least) $900k-1mil of their own money on this, based on their comments that 775k is less than half of the full budget for the game. But that's as big a risk they can take on a passion project like this on their own, given how PS2 Amplitude sold.
 
SparkleMotion said:
I'm a little worried about the difficulty. They say on the Kickstarter page that it will be as hard as the original, but even the last levels on Expert weren't all that hard. The hard songs were the remixes people played online.
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Speaking of which, have they said whether or not remixing is in this game? I haven't seen any reference to it, I spend like equally as much time remixing as I did playing the songs. And UGC could really give the game some legs with how much better online functionality is compared to the first game.
 
SparkleMotion said:
If you say that, then you don't know what Amplitude online multiplayer was like. Misdirection and track blocking to end your opponents streak was just as important as playing notes. That stuff takes absolutely precise timing.
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If it's a solved problem, it's going to remain a solved problem. The only thing that strikes me as a possibility for slowing things down is a requirement to encrypt the packets, which I'm not sure was a necessity in PS2 days. The gameplay side of things ought to be able to be lifted pretty much wholesale. Different code, perhaps, but the flow and design should be able to remain intact, and that's the tricky part of developing netcode.
 
biglittleps said:
Why no Vita? They've already said in FAQ its a stretch goal.
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Woke up and saw the lack of Vita in their listed stretch goals as well as the extra 350,000 they want just for MP. I said two words, and I said them loudly.

Bull.
Shit.

Pipe dream/pie in the sky? HD collection with this, FreQ, and Amp1.

attachment.php
 
Canis lupus said:
It's just an observation of how many people thought it wouldn't succeed without a PC version, and how insistent they were the one and only reason it could be failing was because it didn't have that version. While it's true that there was fear, there really wasn't any precedent for console only kickstarters not succeeding right? Because high level console only KS were really never done before. Amplitude is the first console only KS that had a huge funding goal and rose to be like one of the highest funded games there.
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Then why am I on your list? I never said this game wouldn't be funded, just that it would have a hard time... which it did.
 
Famassu said:
There's nothing shady about them going Kickstarter. Can people stop with this BS and educate themselves of the matter already. Sony didn't want to do anything with the IP anymore because the previous two didn't sell all that well. Harmonix DID want to do a new Amplitude after a decade after the first Amplitude. Sony was cool enough to let Harmonix use the IP, but they had to arrange funding themselves. Harmonix doesn't have some magical pile of cash anywhere they could use to completely fund this themselves, so they went to Kickstarter to get the minimum amount of funding they'd need for it to be viable for them. Sony has been cool enough (for their selfish reasons) to promote the Kickstarter. That's really all there is to it. If you think there's anything more to it, you should join the tinfoil hat club, as that's where you belong.
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Yeah, I disagree on that one. I just don't like big, established developers using kickstarter. All I'm saying is that a Vita version would have convinced me to back the kickstarter anyway, even if it feels more like being part of a viral marketing campaign than helping out someone who really needs it. I'm sure you and others have good reasons being backers and Harmonix have their reasons for doing the kickstarter, but as long as a Vita version isn't part of the kickstarter, I'll stick to my tinfoil hat; thank you very much.
 
SpasilliumX11 said:
Beautiful. Hope you don't mind me saving this and archiving it :)
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Sure! That's totally cool.

Darknight said:
That looks amazing. You are very talented I must say. You should of covered it or sealed it with that plastic stuff man. Shit looks dope as hell. Cant imagine what it would look like at night. + rep!
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Thank you! Yeah, I definitely wish I'd had the foresight to seal it or protect it better. I actually didn't even know I'd kept it, and back then I only spray sealed charcoal and conte works. I thought about trying to restore the glowy bits but I don't want to ruin what's survived. Maybe I'll do a new piece when the new game comes out, because I've definitely come a long way since then, artistically. Could be a cool personal project.

Neuromancer said:
Wow that's super cool!
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Thank you very much! Now I'm starting to wonder if it would have been worth showing the guys at Harmonix somehow.
 
takoyaki said:
Yeah, I disagree on that one. I just don't like big, established developers using kickstarter. All I'm saying is that a Vita version would have convinced me to back the kickstarter anyway, even if it feels more like being part of a viral marketing campaign than helping out someone who really needs it. I'm sure you and others have good reasons being backers and Harmonix have their reasons for doing the kickstarter, but as long as a Vita version isn't part of the kickstarter, I'll stick to my tinfoil hat; thank you very much.
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sure Harmonix is more established than most but they're hardly EA or Activision....

also, they're making mostly motion based music games, which aren't exactly flying off the shelves
 
icespide said:
sure Harmonix is more established than most but they're hardly EA or Activision....
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Of course. I'm still glad the game is funded and as a long-time Harmonix fan, I'll buy it when it's released. We just disagree on how we feel about the funding process, but I'm pretty sure the game itself will be great.
 
I'm still shocked people are accusing them of holding things like online MP back. That's not at all what happened. They wanted to keep the scope of the project small so that they we able to make sure it actually got completed to their vision. Then they had a list of "nice to have" features they could look at implementing AFTER their core goals were achieved.
 
Glad that this is funded and that I played a very small part in it.

Surprised that the Vita wasn't the first stretch goal though
 
takoyaki said:
Yeah, I disagree on that one. I just don't like big, established developers using kickstarter.
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That's fine if you don't like it, but it doesn't make it shady in the least. They don't have a publisher funding this game and they can't justify throwing $2 million into a risky project without some help and evidence that there's demand for the game.

SparkleMotion said:
I'm a little worried about the difficulty. They say on the Kickstarter page that it will be as hard as the original, but even the last levels on Expert weren't all that hard.
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The difficulty level was called Insane :P. But some of us got really, really good at this game when it came out. That means it's not hard for us, but it is for 99% of the rest of the people out there. I've seen a lot of people play Frequency/Amplitude back in the day. And while I eventually got to the level where I could hit everything with ease on Insane, they still had trouble beating songs on Brutal because most people just don't have that kind of skill/coordination. It's easy to forget how hard the game is for most people after you personally master it.
 
Why do some of you feel the right to port beg/whine for a Vita when this game didn't look like it was even going to be made four days ago? Just be thankful, dammit.
 
border said:
.
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I see you edited your original post but here's the answer anyway

From the Stealth Inc Devs:
"I think Vita has been a surprise success for us," he said.

"If you compare it to the PS3, for example, you'd expect the home console would be selling the most. Vita's doing way better for us though. That's not proportionally, that's in terms of unit sales."

"There's a more dedicated set of people who appreciate the kinds of games that are coming to Vita," he said.

"And you don't have the kind of competition that you have with PS3, because there aren't triple-A games on Vita. You don't get the big games on Vita any more, but you are getting a lot of the same sized digital games. These are gamers' games. They're small and can kind of be experimental in some way, but they're all interesting and there's loads of them."
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From the Guacamelee Devs:
"Honestly, Vita owners are the ****ing best," McQuinn said. "People rag on the Vita so much, and I think people who rag on the Vita don't understand, at least from a business perspective, the purchasing power of Vita owners. Vita owners are serious purchasers of games. It's an amazing system."

"If people don't see the Vita doing the same number of sales as the 3DS, then it's automatically a failure," McQuinn said. "But I think what people fail to understand is the purchasers of Vitas are very, very engaged game consumers. For them, the attach rate with games is very high. There might not be a lot of Vitas out there, but the people who do own Vitas are very serious consumers; they buy a lot of games."
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I believe there's a quote from a Sony exec as well, but I can't find it at the moment.
 
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