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[Carlisle]

Oh man these impressions have me really considering it when I wasn't too interested before. I'm perfectly content with my Air 2. It's the best tablet I've ever owned and still going strong. But that screen! And pen! I'm afraid to trying it out at the store will only push me further into getting it.

Why? Genuinely curious because that's my dilemma right now.

For me, it depends on what you're looking for. iPad Pro and Surface are similar products serving similar markets: laptop/tablet hybrids. But in the end Surface is a slightly better laptop than a tablet and iPad is a slightly better tablet than a laptop. If you already got a light laptop you're happy with, iPad should serve your needs better. If you already got a productive tablet you like, Surface might be the better choice.

 

[Oxn]

So whats so great about the screen? I tried both Air 2 and Pro side by side and didnt see some crazy diff.

 

[Carlisle]

It's the size for me. That's the most apparent difference. I don't know anything about the panel or color gamut or anything. I have an app that uses iPad as a second monitor for my mac and that larger screen size would be so sweet to have for it. And astropad as well--not to mention what the pen would bring to that.

 

[marc^o^]

So whats so great about the screen? I tried both Air 2 and Pro side by side and didnt see some crazy diff.

iPad Pro has the best contrast ever released on a LCD tablet: 1667:1 vs 1070:1 for the iPad Air 2 and 1099:1 for the Sony Xperia Z4.

In terms of color rendition, the iPad Pro establishes a new benchmark again: the delta E measure (difference between pefect colors and the screen, is only 1,8. Precedent record was held by the just released iPad Wmini 4 at 1,9).

Source and more details: http://www.lesnumeriques.com/tablet...pple-toujours-aussi-bon-sur-ecran-n47125.html

 

[pubba]

I bought one in Shanghai yesterday and it's a fantastic piece of tech. Used it to do a couple of business presentations today and it was great to prop it up in the cafe we were at and have keynote alongside a web browser.

No pencil till next month though unfortunately.. Estimated shipping date is 21 December

 

[EroticSushi]

Why? Genuinely curious because that's my dilemma right now.

It just depends on your need. I've been leaning towards the SP4 this entire time but there's no denying that the Pro has a much better drawing experience. For me it comes to:

iPP:
- Stuck on iOS 9
- Better drawing experience
- Better battery
- Less buggy OS

SP4:
- Full Window OS
- Can use desktop Adobe CC
- All the features of a desktop (file sharing, downloading any programs, etc)

If you don't need a full on desktop OS, I would go with the iPP but if you want an actual portable laptop in a tablet form, go with SP4.

I've been debating this myself for a long time. On one hand I love the drawing on the iPP and I've been on Apple's ecosystem for a long time but I work with Adobe CC. I feel like going with the Pro would just be something that would be used to sketch small ideas before going home and really working on it on the actual programs. With the SP4 you can do whatever you normally do at home on your desktop, anywhere you go. You can then export your psd files from photoshop and just continue working on it seamlessly on your desktop. The same can be said for anything that you're doing on your SP4. It's an easy transition from SP4 to your desktop Windows. You can't do that with the iPad since you're limited to the app store and iOS. It just boils down to your need and what you're willing to deal with.

Right now I think I'll go with the SP4, pick up a iPad Air 2 on Black Friday to replace my dying iPad 3. Then just wait and see what they do with the iPad Pro moving forward.

 

[Red]

The more I think about it the weirder it is to me that the Pencil does not have an eraser. A Wacom-esque stylus with eraser and an extra button or two would allow much more robust functionality. Maybe that gets away from the simplicity of an iPad... But if this is really aimed at a professional audience that's probably a moot point.

I would never advocate for OS X on an iPad. I don't think that makes sense. But allowing more feature-rich iOS apps could go a long way to bridging the gap between Apple's mobile and desktop OSes.

 

[Tendo]

Any experience with the apple smart cover? I'm thinking of getting one for when I'm not taking the keyboard/ until the keyboard case arrives

 

[MercuryLS]

The more I think about it the weirder it is to me that the Pencil does not have an eraser. A Wacom-esque stylus with eraser and an extra button or two would allow much more robust functionality. Maybe that gets away from the simplicity of an iPad... But if this is really aimed at a professional audience that's probably a moot point.

I would never advocate for OS X on an iPad. I don't think that makes sense. But allowing more feature-rich iOS apps could go a long way to bridging the gap between Apple's mobile and desktop OSes.

I think the lack of eraser is just for simplicity's sake, they probably just assume there will be an eraser icon on the screen that you can quickly toggle with your other hand when you need to. Also, constantly flipping over the pencil (which is much longer than most stylus pens) would be annoying.

iOS9 is pretty powerful, it's really up to app developers. I think the biggest roadblock to really powerful pro apps on iPad is how Apple set up the App Store. It's not set up to support expensive software with ongoing improvements. They need give devs the options to do free trials, optional paid content updates, things like that if they want to encourage more pro-level apps. Companies like Microsoft and Adobe are getting around it with subscriptions and strong brands they can leverage to gain traction. Smaller devs don't have that luxury.

One things for sure, with the iPad Pro the discussion around whether or not the silicon in these devices are powerful enough to support high end apps is dead. It's up to Apple to rethink the App Store discovery and economics for devs in order for the Pro to really reach is potential.

 

[……forgetit]

Just curious, how does this bench compared to the Macbook air?

 

[commish]

I hope they add mouse support some time in the future. I know it's not going to happen, but a guy can dream.

 

[mrklaw]

iPad pro 128GB only £600 equivalent in Japan - thanks exchange rates

 

[Hoo-doo]

I hope they add mouse support some time in the future. I know it's not going to happen, but a guy can dream.

What would you use it for?

 

[mrklaw]

What would you use it for?

Selecting text, clicking icons, selecting cells in excel. Reaching across to the screen if you are using a physical keyboard is not good ergonomics

 

[Guess Who]

Selecting text, clicking icons, selecting cells in excel. Reaching across to the screen if you are using a physical keyboard is not good ergonomics

It's kind of hilarious that the iPad Pro is guilty of the same thing Jobs cited as the reason why MacBooks aren't touchscreen, and it's only proving his point.

I doubt we'll ever see full-on mouse support but they need to implement *something* to make interaction better without having to reach up to the screen when using a hardware keyboard.

 

[freenudemacusers]

Selecting multiple cells works fine, just not as rapid as I could do it with a mouse. I personally am ok with the trade off of no mouse vs an environment tailored to a touch interface. I don't want it being compromised. There are also a number of benefits to a large multitouch display, too.

And IME stands are lame; just sit it flat on a desk and use a bt keyboard and pound away.

 

[MercuryLS]

It's kind of hilarious that the iPad Pro is guilty of the same thing Jobs cited as the reason why MacBooks aren't touchscreen, and it's only proving his point.

I doubt we'll ever see full-on mouse support but they need to implement *something* to make interaction better without having to reach up to the screen when using a hardware keyboard.

This is the biggest issue with any keyboard dock, it absolutely sucks. The iPad pro would be better on a table, laying flat and using he software keyboard. You can quickly select text with the two finger tracking and touching targets in the screen is far more comfortable as your fingers are already on the screen.

I can't wait for 3D Touch to come to iPads, I think it will be far more powerful on these devices compared to iPhones. Things like peaking and popping on a huge iPad screen would be amazing, same thing with force touching to activate cursor movement (vs two finger), also using force touch with multitasking and screen splitting would make it even easier/faster. You could even use 3D Touch with the Taptic Engine to provide haptic taps for the keyboard, to give it a tactile feel. With 3D Touch you could even rest your fingers on the software keyboard and not have it activate until you apply the right amount of pressure.

Things like this along but with processor improvements, iOS improvements and app improvements are going to help make the iPad even better for power users in the future. The potential is huge.

I'm interested in getting the MacBook 12 next year when they refresh it. But my dream iPad that I speak about above, may come late next year and it may just be worth the wait.

 

[Union Carbine]

I didn't buy the keyboard yet, I might just roll with the Bluetooth keyboard I've got. For casual stuff, I don't even mind the software keyboard. I like the layout; in portrait, I can grip the iPad and reach all the keys with my two thumbs and type pretty cleanly and quickly. I wouldn't mind seeing what some third parties come up with in a few months.

 

[killertofu]

This thread went from me wanting to get an iPad Pro to wanting to sell my iPad Air 2 to get a used 15 inch Mid 2010 with anti glare Macbook Pro....

Am I dumb? Is that dumb. I can't tell anymore.

 

[mrklaw]

It's kind of hilarious that the iPad Pro is guilty of the same thing Jobs cited as the reason why MacBooks aren't touchscreen, and it's only proving his point.

I doubt we'll ever see full-on mouse support but they need to implement *something* to make interaction better without having to reach up to the screen when using a hardware keyboard.

Plus they have accepted that people need at least basic cursor movement by including the two finger tap on iPad (or force touch on iPhone 6s) which turns the are into a trackpad. They just don't have a physical alternative which is a real oversight IMO.


I'd actually be ok with laying it down, but not completely flat. If you take the Smart Cover and use it to prop the iPad Air up from the back, that gives it a nice angle. Trouble is it can't support it at that angle, it falls down all the time. But that would be good if it worked.

The lack of trackpad just means I won't buy the smart keyboard, like others have mentioned I'd just use the software keyboard so that selections etc aren't so bad. And then maybe have a portable BT keyboard if I'm doing a lot of text entry (but then I'd probably just switch to my computer)


MercuryLS, I was thinking the same about a 3D Touch keyboard that allowed you to rest on the home keys. It'd need to be very sensitive but could work really well. Typing on the iPad Air I'm still hunting and pecking but usually with two fingers per hand (middle and ring) plus thumb for spacebar. Proper touch typing would be great to pull off.

 

[Future]

It's kind of hilarious that the iPad Pro is guilty of the same thing Jobs cited as the reason why MacBooks aren't touchscreen, and it's only proving his point.

I doubt we'll ever see full-on mouse support but they need to implement *something* to make interaction better without having to reach up to the screen when using a hardware keyboard.

Back in the day when I tried to use my iPad as a productive device, I never got used to this. They will need to add mouse support if they really want this to be a workhorse option in the future. They will add the mouse just like they added the stylus and the world will rejoice.

And it will work because they don't need to redesign anything around it. Individual apps will take advantage of it, just like individual apps take advantage of the stylus. The front end OS will have touch screen like gesture control from the touchpad just like their MacBooks. The OS cursor will only appear when your finger is on a touchpad, preserving the touch centric design, although individual apps can keep it on if needed

 

[Chao]

The more I think about it the weirder it is to me that the Pencil does not have an eraser. A Wacom-esque stylus with eraser and an extra button or two would allow much more robust functionality. Maybe that gets away from the simplicity of an iPad... But if this is really aimed at a professional audience that's probably a moot point.

I would never advocate for OS X on an iPad. I don't think that makes sense. But allowing more feature-rich iOS apps could go a long way to bridging the gap between Apple's mobile and desktop OSes.

I've had a Cintiq for what now... 5 years? And I can count the amount of times I've used the eraser with one hand.

Takes more time to turn your pen around to erase and then turn it around again to go back to painting than just simply selecting the eraser/pen tool on the screen.

It's a non issue.

 

[JonathanNemo]

This thread went from me wanting to get an iPad Pro to wanting to sell my iPad Air 2 to get a used 15 inch Mid 2010 with anti glare Macbook Pro....

Am I dumb? Is that dumb. I can't tell anymore.

Not at all, though I'd definitely spring for an SSD to run any version of Mac OS X after 10.6.

I have an iPad 4 and it's become the guest computer, precisely because there's nothing that it does that I can't do better on my phone or any one of my laptops. That includes my Chromebook.


EDIT: And even then, the Chromebook has an honest to goodness guest mode if you don't want to log into the Google account to import apps and settings. I can see why K12 educational institutions really love these things, they're much better than I imagined as a longtime iPad user.

 

[Dreamwriter]

Selecting text, clicking icons, selecting cells in excel. Reaching across to the screen if you are using a physical keyboard is not good ergonomics

I select text (and cut/paste) with my keyboard, works perfectly, no need to reach across the screen. And when browsing the web with the keyboard hooked up, I use cursor keys to scroll up and down as I read the page, spacebar if I want to scroll farther/faster (though I wish spacebar scrolled one screen's worth, rather than a screen and a half).

 

[freenudemacusers]

Something to also note, that seems to be an underground feature, is holding the command key on a bt keyboard will display a number of app specific shortcuts.

They're fairly rudimentary but they do prevent the need for screen pokes.

 

[nicoga3000]

I do a TON of Excel work for work. Is there Excel for iPad? And how easy is it to work between desktop and mobile Excel?

 

[mrklaw]

I do a TON of Excel work for work. Is there Excel for iPad? And how easy is it to work between desktop and mobile Excel?

Yes there is. iPad version is free. syncs files using onedrive or I think maybe Dropbox (not sure on the latter)

 

[sc0la]

Plus they have accepted that people need at least basic cursor movement by including the two finger tap on iPad (or force touch on iPhone 6s) which turns the are into a trackpad. They just don't have a physical alternative which is a real oversight IMO.

Would be cool if the entire surface of the keyboard was a touchpad. Could just act as a cursor mover like 3D Touch on the phone. unlike the iPad soft keyboard though touching with two fingers wouldn't work since you typically have many fingers on the surface at once, and unlike the iPhone 3D Touch would be the same as a key press.

They should figure something out. I got frustrated just trying it in the store. Other option is to make iOS keyboard navigable / controllable.

 

[freenudemacusers]

Yes there is. iPad version is free. syncs files using onedrive or I think maybe Dropbox (not sure on the latter)

iPad pro version is a mandatory office 365 sub for anything aside from viewing (so mandatory). can do dropbox, onedrive and icloud.

works well enough, touch controls make sense and it's easy to edit. It's more streamlined and probably missing some advanced features, but for for everything I do in office, I can't find anything I'm missing

Still waiting on full data for 2015, but I think I can improve my metrics. 👌🏻

 

[LCfiner]

tried the keyboard today at the apple store. not really loving the feel of the material and the spacing of the keys. i’m not a fast typer anyway so its not like it slows me down but i’m not in love with the feel. I prefer my logitech keyboard ultarthin keyboard accessory for the ipad air. more traditional chiclet feel.

i guess part of the reason the ipad pro keyboard feels that way is the whole waterproof nature of the cover. But i much prefer the surface pro 4 type cover if we’re comparing these types of official accessories.

and i think most of gaf would disagree but i even prefer the shallow retina macbook keys to the ipad pro keyboard cover keys.

edit: also tried the pencil. but just in notes. I was able to do my silly doodles just like on paper - lag was very low - but since i’m no artist, i can’t really comment further. I was able to also do the same pencil-style drawings on older iPads with my finger. so it’s not like i’m setting a high bar.

 

[nicoga3000]

iPad pro version is a mandatory office 365 sub for anything aside from viewing (so mandatory). can do dropbox, onedrive and icloud.

works well enough, touch controls make sense and it's easy to edit. It's more streamlined and probably missing some advanced features, but for for everything I do in office, I can't find anything I'm missing



Still waiting on full data for 2015, but I think I can improve my metrics. 👌🏻

How much is an office 365 sub? And does the iPad version offer formula tracing, conditional formatting, and macro support?

 

[Red]

I've had a Cintiq for what now... 5 years? And I can count the amount of times I've used the eraser with one hand.

Takes more time to turn your pen around to erase and then turn it around again to go back to painting than just simply selecting the eraser/pen tool on the screen.

It's a non issue.

I have an Intuos Pro. I usually avoid the eraser tool completely, and instead use some undo hotkey function depending on what program I am in. But the eraser has been standard on professional tablets for a long time now. I am not willing to extrapolate from my own experience, and call the lack of an eraser a non-issue. I would not miss it (though I would definitely miss the extra buttons). You might be right. The eraser could be useless to everyone. But I would not use an anecdote to prove that.

 

[freenudemacusers]

How much is an office 365 sub? And does the iPad version offer formula tracing, conditional formatting, and macro support?

Unfortunately no. I hope Microsoft bumps up the office app capability for the pro beyond pen tools. I think they will, the office team has been very good about making their software work well with iOS 9 so far.

It's $6.99/month iirc and you get word, PowerPoint, excel and one note on one tablet, phone and pc. Or something to that effect.

 

[mrklaw]

Unfortunately no. I hope Microsoft bumps up the office app capability for the pro beyond pen tools. I think they will, the office team has been very good about making their software work well with iOS 9 so far.

It's $6.99/month iirc and you get word, PowerPoint, excel and one note on one tablet, phone and pc. Or something to that effect.

And a multi device license so you can install office on 5 (6?) computers and share it with your family, plus 1TB onedrive space.

 

[Stinkles]

Btw Microsoft makes a decent all purpose Universal Mobile keyboard with chiclet keys and up to three Bluetooth profiles on a physical switch. The tablet sits in and leans on a slot. $60.

Comes in black or white.

http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B00GWGLUZ0/?tag=neogaf0e-20

Has functioning iOS media/home keys too.

 

[MercuryLS]

Btw Microsoft makes a decent all purpose Universal Mobile keyboard with chiclet keys and up to three Bluetooth profiles on a physical switch. The tablet sits in and leans on a slot. $60.

Comes in black or white.

http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B00GWGLUZ0/?tag=neogaf0e-20

I own this and it's pretty good.

 

[SCULLIBUNDO]

I found the key travel on the Smart Keyboard Cover decent in store, but overall found myself making a lot of mistakes on that keyboard. Didn't feel good.

 

[MercuryLS]

I found the key travel on the Smart Keyboard Cover decent in store, but overall found myself making a lot of mistakes on that keyboard. Didn't feel good.

With the smart connector, there should be lots of interesting keyboards coming in the future. Apple kinda phoned it in with the Smart Keyboard.

It would be interesting to have an iPad version of this:

 

[Union Carbine]

...there's nothing that it does that I can't do better on my phone or any one of my laptops. That includes my Chromebook.

For me, I like the ergonomics of a tablet much more than a laptop in most situations, particularly if I'm alway from a table. I love the screen and, because I've got no keyboard attached, it's got a very slim footprint if I want to set it up somewhere to do some web-surfing, video-watching, etc. If I want to do something heavier, then it's time for the laptop.

 

[draughn101]

With the smart connector, there should be lots of interesting keyboards coming in the future. Apple kinda phoned it in with the Smart Keyboard.

It would be interesting to have an iPad version of this:

That would be awesome!

Btw Microsoft makes a decent all purpose Universal Mobile keyboard with chiclet keys and up to three Bluetooth profiles on a physical switch. The tablet sits in and leans on a slot. $60.

Comes in black or white.

http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B00GWGLUZ0/?tag=neogaf0e-20


Has functioning iOS media/home keys too.

Do you use this with your IPad, Stinkles?

 

[freenudemacusers]

Btw Microsoft makes a decent all purpose Universal Mobile keyboard with chiclet keys and up to three Bluetooth profiles on a physical switch. The tablet sits in and leans on a slot. $60.

Comes in black or white.

http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B00GWGLUZ0/?tag=neogaf0e-20

Has functioning iOS media/home keys too.

That's pretty nice; if I didn't have a keyboard already I'd bite. Might bite anyway, I assume they have these at Microsoft stores?

 

[Majine]

Why doesn't the pen come in black?

This is an outrage.

 

[Stinkles]

That would be awesome!



Do you use this with your IPad, Stinkles?

Yep - Galaxy tab and iPad. I wrote a novella on it so it's pretty decent for serious typing. On sale at Amazon right now but available at ms store too.

 

[Zeyphersan]

Delivery date for the iPad is still Nov 27-Dec 1

Delivery date for the pencil is still Dec 16-Dec 22

😭😭😭😭😭😭😭😩😭😭😭😭😭😭😭

 

[freenudemacusers]

Why doesn't the pen come in black?

This is an outrage.

Because you were supposed to take the hint and get the best iPad colorway aka white.

 

[Majine]

Because you were supposed to take the hint and get the best iPad colorway aka white.

It's distracting when you're watching video on it.

 

[freenudemacusers]

It's distracting when you're watching video on it.

Just hold it up to a white wall and your screen seems to hover in infinite space as if by magic 🙌🏻

 

[killertofu]

Btw Microsoft makes a decent all purpose Universal Mobile keyboard with chiclet keys and up to three Bluetooth profiles on a physical switch. The tablet sits in and leans on a slot. $60.

Comes in black or white.

http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B00GWGLUZ0/?tag=neogaf0e-20

Has functioning iOS media/home keys too.

Mine broke within 7 months

 

[eyeball_kid]

The more I think about it the weirder it is to me that the Pencil does not have an eraser.

I feel you, but where would they have put it? Once they decided they wanted it to be rechargeable with a Lightning connection, there's only really the top and bottom. Maybe they could've done inductive charging for the Pencil, but that could be really slow, and extra gadgets is not usually Apple's style. They like to simplify as much as possible.

Any experience with the apple smart cover? I'm thinking of getting one for when I'm not taking the keyboard/ until the keyboard case arrives

I got a Smart Cover because there's no Smart Keyboards available anywhere. It's the same as the other iPad model covers. Does its job, but way overpriced. I plan to return it once I can find a keyboard.

I hope they add mouse support some time in the future. I know it's not going to happen, but a guy can dream.

Ain't never gonna happen. iOS is not designed for the mouse. But what we'll probably see is iOS support for the Focus Engine found in the Apple TV's tvOS; in fact, a developer already found the code sitting idle inside iOS 9. What I think we'll probably see is an external trackpad, either standalone or integrated into an external element like the keyboard, which can drive the Focus Engine. My guess is this will show up in iOS 10.

 

[TheMink]

Picked one up yesterday and loving the hell out of it. I got it mainly for reading comic books and Hearthstone and both look absolutely incredible on that big ass screen.

I tried the Pencil in the store as well and would have bought one on the spot. I used to draw allot and playing with it for a while in the store really got me wanting to practice again.

Mines ordered, I will be using it for the same stuff! Can you speak a little more about Hearthstone in particular?