I watched RAW from two weeks ago it sucked so much I didn't even feel like watching the go home show. I don't think you could fill 1,5 hours and make it good.
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August Wrasslin |OT| The Sunday of Summer
- Thread starter Plywood
- Start date
I watched RAW from two weeks ago it sucked so much I didn't even feel like watching the go home show. I don't think you could fill 1,5 hours and make it good.
Except when they do things like have an established character (from NXT even) who is a bully like KO run away when things are not going his way; people get mad at the promotion rather than the character. PG WWE has plenty of ways to get people to hate the bad guys; but if a certain part of the crowd doesn't want to hate the bad guys because a) ironic hipsters or b) they like the wrestler from previous promotions / work and want to cheer them or c) they are booked strongly and people like to cheer winners - there isn't much WWE can do about them.
Hell - look at New Day - supposed to be faces, crowd changed them into heels - they do lots of dastardly things - and now that crowd wants to change them back into faces even they are annoying and cheating and etc. Or even Hall of Pain Mark Henry - who was starting to get cheers even after beating up JR.
Yep. Sheamus is one of the most over heels in the company because a) people never got over the false rumors that he was a HHH pet project, b) he's considered stale, and c) he looks stupid. He doesn't do anything less dastardly than any other heel.
To quote KO - many wrestling crowds are now the John Cena of fans. That line is so perfect.
D
Deleted member 47027
Unconfirmed Member
Speaking of top shelf themes, Negro Casas has one of my favorites
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=H9_0Hix00UE
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=H9_0Hix00UE
Depends on how lapsed of a fan you are but I would recommend:
All of the Takeover specials
WWE 24
Beast in the East network special (Except the last match)
WWE Monday Night Wars Doc (Some issues with how much trither there is to some shit but its still a good watch)
Nitro is pretty awesome
Table for 3
WWE Countdown
WWE Beyond the Ring Docs
Some people like Swerved
Legends of Wrestling Panel shows are pretty awesome
The Austin and Y2J podcast are pretty good if you like the guests
31GhostsIV
Banned
My favourite is the Monday Night War series, where you learn all about D-X, the most important wrestling faction of all time, and how Vince was in the 'entertainment' business unlike that evil Ted Turner, and how Turner buying all the talent in the mid 90's was really bad but Vince buying all of the talent in the early 80's was really great.
It's the best comedy series of the past twelve months.
brisk tacos
Banned
Not sure it's a PG thing at all. It's an issue with guys not wrestling to match their styles. Top heel slimy piece of shit Seth Rollins shouldn't be doing three dives in a row and phoenix splashes. Bruiser bully KO shouldn't be doing a tope in the first minute of a match. It has nothing to do with PG or edginess and everything to do with guys being more worried about popping the crowd. 80s heels were hated and they weren't doing edgy stuff at all.
But tonight though!
Why would I watch tonight? I was committed to Summerslam. I'm done again,
Probably just setting up the Taker/Brock rematch for WM.
Angry Grimace
Two cannibals are eating a clown. One turns to the other and says "does something taste funny to you?"
The impression I get is that he does what they ask him to.
avengers23
Banned
In Your House 13: Final Four (Rocky vs. HHH, Bret Hart vs. Austin vs. Vader vs. 'Taker)
No Mercy 2007 (Triple H vs. Orton, Triple H vs. Umaga, Triple H vs. Orton)
Unforgiven 2006 (Johnny Nitro vs. Jeff Hard, Cena vs. Edge TLC match)
Payback 2014 (Evolution vs. The Shield, Sheamus vs. Cesaro, Big E vs. Rusev)
Vengeance 2003 (Mysterio and Kidman vs. World's Greatest Tag Team, Eddie vs. Benoit, Vince vs. Zach Gowen)
Backlash 2007 (Cena vs. Michaels vs. Orton vs. Edge, 'Taker vs. Batista Last Man Standing)
In Your House: Canadian Stampede (Austin, Goldust, Shamerock, LOD vs. Hart Foundation, Great Sasuke vs. Taka Michinoku, Mankind vs. HHH, 'Taker vs. Vader)
Frecklestein
Banned
Seth's statue being unveiled of course!
D
Deleted member 47027
Unconfirmed Member
Joker Sting Debuts
A) Sting return
B) Enzo and Cass take on New Day in Brooklyn (They have the stamp of Cena approval)
Less likely
C) 'Taker "retires" to drag out Lesnar / Taker 3 till WM.
D) Reigns and/or Ambrose heel turn (I kinda want both to turn...) - joins Rollins
E) Stewart takes a more permanent role on WWE (GM)
F) US Title merged into WWE title.
vvvv
^^^^
dream
Member
For all the talk of how homogenized "WWE Style" is, I think the two examples you cite serve as evidence that it's an important style to learn. Both Kevin Owens and Seth Rollins are indie guys, who do indie shit, constructing matches with indie psychology. I've been wondering for months why Top Heel Seth Rollins does Phoenix Splashes. But I think I get it--he does them because that's what popped the crowd in ROH, and he probably didn't spend enough time in NXT to learn not to do it. Same with Kevin Owens. "Oh look, 300 lb Kevin Steen is doing a tope! THIS IS WRESTLING!" What works in a 300 seat "armory" just falls flat when it's on national TV.
D
Deleted member 47027
Unconfirmed Member
I'll clutch the pearls if Enzo and Cass debut, I'll be pretty fuckin thrilled.
But here's the catch 22. If you aren't popping crowds you run the risk of getting no response from crowds at all, which means you saw goodbye to your spot for a while.
avengers23
Banned
The El Texano theme is hot.
Q
Queen of Hunting
Unconfirmed Member
both brock and taker arent going to be on raw tonight ffs
well brock isnt confirmed to be appearing but this is status for taker
http://wrestling-edge.com/undertaker-confirmed-to-not-appear-at-raw-tonight/
well brock isnt confirmed to be appearing but this is status for taker
http://wrestling-edge.com/undertaker-confirmed-to-not-appear-at-raw-tonight/
avengers23
Banned
Jason's agNEWS ‏@AgnewJason 2m2 minutes ago
I think we all heard it on @WONF4W radio... @bryanalvarez says CONOR MCGREGOR is showing up on RAW tonite!
What the fuck
It's a joke. Alvarez said that the way WWE is hyping it, you'd need McGregor to show up. And then he begged the sites to not report that, which is why Jason Agnew threw in that winking smiley face, playa.
Everyone in that crowd better already know the fucking words to their intro or i'll be REAL MAD
If they can say "Full Sail Sucks", I can truly believe that they know the words to the intro.
According to who? The internet?
Wrestlers need to get reactions, not cheers.
Seth had a fantastic match last night -- if he weren't the heel. He was total dogshit because he was, in fact, the god damn heel champion.
brisk tacos
Banned
I would say Daniel Bryan worked in a similar way when he was a heel, as well, which turned him face. Same for Cesaro. Twice. Luke Harper also frequently does dives. The indie mindset is just hard to break, I suppose. There was a brief period in NXT when Owens was getting actual heel heat because he wasn't giving the fans what they wanted. And then he went right back to the indie mind set of popping the crowd is more important than logic.
Spoilered just in case, re RAW tonight
Jason's agNEWS ‏@AgnewJason 2m2 minutes ago
I think we all heard it on @WONF4W radio... @bryanalvarez says CONOR MCGREGOR is showing up on RAW tonite!
What the fuck
Who?
Well, lets be real though, he got a much bigger face pop than the actual face of the fight. If there's no way you're going to turn a crowd against you, you might as well play to them. Plus Rollins' whole gimmick is "I'm the future and I'm going to show you it", so while he is a slimy heel who runs he should also be showing what he's got when he needs to.
31GhostsIV
Banned
I don't know if they have historical Smackdowns on there yet (I haven't subbed for months) but there's one around 2003 where Kurt and Brock have an ironman match. Watch that if you can.
Early Nitros are fun for nostalgia, watching it go from wrestlecrap like dungeon of doom to the NWO invasion is entertaining.
How you gonna turn a crowd that cheers a man getting his nose shoot horrifically broken. How you gonna turn a crowd that has it ingrained in them that booing the top face is part of the show. How you gonna turn a crowd who has been addressed by that same face and told "its okay that you boo me".
Sheamus would get cheered in a Cena feud by that crowd. Seth was the face and the match was worked as such I think.
Funny enough - Ambrose and Reigns have perfect heel move sets (they both average 3-4 non straight punch / kick unique moves per match) in that respect.
Because it's harder it's not worth doing?
Wrestlers aren't the only one trapped in this indie wrestling, alignment doesn't matter, dope spots and workrate matter mindset. Fans are too.
Headlocks. Chinlocks. Slow shit down. Eye rakes. Be a villain.
Don't do three consecutive dives to the floor and then ham it to the crowd like you're the damned underdog good guy.
It's pretty good
I mean the wrestlers on it are probably pretty good too
It's pretty good
I mean the wrestlers on it are probably pretty good too
....
*puts CMLL binge watching on Google calendar*
This is also a very major part of the problem. WWE is actively saying it's okay to boo the top face of the company
because fuck you he isn't turning heel ever
Angry Grimace
Two cannibals are eating a clown. One turns to the other and says "does something taste funny to you?"
So we're expecting Seth to drop the US title between now and Night of Champions, right?
Jesus, can please this be it for Taker? At least with Brock, for his own sake. Either pair him up with someone equally old and slow like Sting, or just let him fade out the way he should have after WM30.
That statue though.
D
Deleted member 47027
Unconfirmed Member
I can't remember, when CJ Parker gave Owens that palm strike, how did the crowd react to that?
31GhostsIV
Banned
Nope, Cena will get them both back. Then he'll undo his weeks of restoring prestige to the belt by dropping it for a tournament, that will be won by the Big Show.
avengers23
Banned
Oh good, Evolve booked the same venue for when they're back in Queens in October. I liked that venue a lot.
FlammableD
Banned
The crowd is not the problem with WWE right now.