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AusGAF 9 - F*** Off, We're Full (Of People With Different Ethnic Backgrounds)

Danoss (or any one else), have you played the Marvel Legendary deck building game? I was watching a review of it this morning and thought it looked interesting.
 
PC games are way cheaper than console games which balances out the lack of resale value (ignoring selling your Steam account of course....)

Yeah and I said as much, but those trying to have a conversation about possibilities are derided.

Yawn.

We have had plenty of Cloud threads though, there was a really great one in the OT a few months back that opened my mind a lot.

The Cloud won't duct tape 3 Xbox One together though.
Public name for the Cloud service should be Xbox Four

EDIT: Here is a thread for Omi!
 
2002 countdown! Woot! The year of Dave Grohl.

I expect a worthy thread roundup once a day from now on, along with the bargain posts. Thanks.

No one was talking about the lols so I wanted to make sure you didn't miss out

:(

Also Techland finally made a great game! And it is in the price bracket/game design spot that I love the fuck out of. No bullshit, no fat, just pure awesome.
 
So apparently some far right nationalist fuckwits calling themselves Restore Australia are planning an anti-Muslim protest in Brisbane this afternoon in response to that British soldier getting murdered by those two dudes. Among the stuff they claim to be protesting are Sharia Law and halal food.

Halal food.

I just hope nobody does anything stupid.
 

Shaneus

Member
Also go support the new B-tier! Reviews have been glowing. This is the route to sustainable AA gaming.
Know what? I like this route. Good quality AA (or even "A") titles like this and (from what I can gather, I'm yet to play it) Blood Dragon that are around the $15-$20 mark will probably be the saviour to single-player gaming. Games that you can finish in a few days, maybe replay a little bit that actually stand up in an apples-apples value comparison with going to the movies. Better value, but easier to compare because of roughly the same price and "disposability", I guess.

Yeah, I'm kinda hyped about getting some online action. Before I powered it off, I quickly went into a few lobbies and while the "L license" one (or whatever) I couldn't join an existing game, within about 15 seconds I found a full, proper lobby with what must've been 20 people.

That's why Lucid should be making PGR5 for 360. Potential audience? Few million. Potential audience for X1? Right now, zero.
 
So apparently some far right nationalist fuckwits calling themselves Restore Australia are planning an anti-Muslim protest in Brisbane this afternoon in response to that British soldier getting murdered by those two dudes. Among the stuff they claim to be protesting are Sharia Law and halal food.

Halal food.

I just hope nobody does anything stupid.

Imma go down there and cook my cat with them. Sounds like a fun group!
 

Omikron

Member
We have had plenty of Cloud threads though, there was a really great one in the OT a few months back that opened my mind a lot.

The Cloud won't duct tape 3 Xbox One together though.
Public name for the Cloud service should be Xbox Four

EDIT: Here is a thread for Omi!

Mmm, mate of mine is really into ARMA (does ShackTac stuff) and they are getting into distributed AI servers and such for online play. Which seems like a really cool implementation of essentially 'cloud' technology.
 
Confirmed. It is all in the thread.

Mmm, mate of mine is really into ARMA (does ShackTac stuff) and they are getting into distributed AI servers and such for online play. Which seems like a really cool implementation of essentially 'cloud' technology.

It does have its uses but is limited in relation to games due to latency and the like. Stuff like AI and physics can benefit from moving server side but again it will depend on how efficient they can make it. We will get there eventually but not as fast (or slow!) as some people posting in that XOXO thread are saying.

Will be a bitch getting those games going without the original servers though down the track.
 

Omikron

Member
It does have its uses but is limited in relation to games due to latency and the like. Stuff like AI and physics can benefit from moving server side but again it will depend on how efficient they can make it. We will get there eventually but not as fast (or slow!) as some people posting in that XOXO thread are saying.

Will be a bitch getting those games going without the original servers though down the track.

Oh for sure, but the overall theme is 'nope, its all fucking terrible', which is so wrong.
 
There is some hyperbole in there but I just cut it down to being mainly about XOXO.

Also Simcity.

Sorry quoted the wrong bit, I meant to quote the June PC part.

Oh, that is based around the whole 4-6 months delay from console release to PC release for GTA3, GTA VC, GTA SA, GTA4, GTA4 Eps.

Take 2 like money. PC gamers have money. GTA4 sold well. Take 2 will want that money again.
 
So apparently some far right nationalist fuckwits calling themselves Restore Australia are planning an anti-Muslim protest in Brisbane this afternoon in response to that British soldier getting murdered by those two dudes. Among the stuff they claim to be protesting are Sharia Law and halal food.

Halal food.

I just hope nobody does anything stupid.
Ugh. I'm willing to bet good money none of them even knows what halal food IS. Speaking of which, they should really be making all food halal. It doesnt cost any extra.
 

senahorse

Member
Oh, that is based around the whole 4-6 months delay from console release to PC release for GTA3, GTA VC, GTA SA, GTA4, GTA4 Eps.

Take 2 like money. PC gamers have money. GTA4 sold well. Take 2 will want that money again.



Agreed, though it's weird and a shame that Red Dead didn't come to PC.
 
Ugh. I'm willing to bet good money none of them even knows what halal food IS. Speaking of which, they should really be making all food halal. It doesnt cost any extra.
Halal isn't about preparation of food (besides slaughtering animals in a specific way), it's a list of rules relating to what muslims can/can't eat (e.g. pork, blood), just like kosher is with jews.

Edit: Maybe you are thinking of HAACP?

Agreed, though it's weird and a shame that Red Dead didn't come to PC.
Damn straight. That's one of the few games this generation I would've been disappointed not to have missed out if I were a PC-only gamer.
 
Yup. I like the ideas behind it all. Makes more sense to me than other religious stuff I won't point a finger at.

Agreed, though it's weird and a shame that Red Dead didn't come to PC.

I remember eventually reading the designers saying it would be a complete rebuild to get it running on PC as the whole project was a fucking mess cobbled together and that they were shocked how well it all held up in the end in terms of glitches and bugs.

That could have been bullshit from a pissed off developer but it seemed to be accepted at the time by the usual insiders.

Since Max Payne 3 ended up on PC my worry of GTA5 skipping PC despite the huge market they would be missing out on has been lifted. If MP3 was worth doing then GTA5 will be high on the priority list (still behind DLC though I bet).
 

senahorse

Member
Oh for sure, but the overall theme is 'nope, its all fucking terrible', which is so wrong.

Typical GAF knee jerk reactions taking everything they hear literally and not being able to apply their own analysis over any little bit of text or sound bite that comes along. Of course there is plenty of hyperbole mixed with truths, it's a console launch. At the end of the day it's a video games console, are the games good? Well obviously we can't answer that, instead it's all "GDDR5" this, "DRM" that, "Microsoft kidnapped my baby" etc.
 
Ugh. I'm willing to bet good money none of them even knows what halal food IS. Speaking of which, they should really be making all food halal. It doesnt cost any extra.
Halal bacon cheeseburgers and black pudding.

There are some very conservative Christian and Jewish groups that forbid the consumption of halal food on religious grounds (just as food prayed over by Catholics might be haram to some Muslim groups) and there may be some argument regarding animal cruelty as well. Thing is, it's complicated and it doesn't affect 99% of the population.

These guys are opposed to it because it's associated with Muslims. Watch them try to ban algebra next.
 
Halal bacon cheeseburgers and black pudding.

There are some very conservative Christian and Jewish groups that forbid the consumption of halal food on religious grounds (just as food prayed over by Catholics might be haram to some Muslim groups) and there may be some argument regarding animal cruelty as well. Thing is, it's complicated and it doesn't affect 99% of the population.

These guys are opposed to it because it's associated with Muslims. Watch them try to ban algebra next.

On some foods there is a tiny logo with arabic text on some products pronouncing it is halal certified. There may be some tiny payment to an Islamic organisation the same way having the heart smart logo would involve a licensing payment.

My current in-laws were the receivers of emails saying to not buy certain cheeses because the money goes to Muslims. I think it's an overreaction to be sure. Cheese is cheese.
 

Danoss

Member
My current in-laws were the receivers of emails saying to not buy certain cheeses because the money goes to Muslims. I think it's an overreaction to be sure. Cheese is cheese.

I ate some Cracker Barrel cheese that said it was halal. It tasted nice, but now I'm not so sure. Will I be okay? I'm worried.

In case it's not clear, I'm absolutely joking.

I had an argument with friends over the exact thing above. They felt it was their right to eat things that aren't halal. I asked them how it affected them, how does any food being halal actually affect their lives? They said that by eating it they're supporting their religion which they don't agree with, it means that the Muslims are winning.

We are no longer friends.
 

Jintor

Member
I ate some Cracker Barrel cheese that said it was halal. It tasted nice, but now I'm not so sure. Will I be okay? I'm worried.

In case it's not clear, I'm absolutely joking.

I had an argument with friends over the exact thing above. They felt it was their right to eat things that aren't halal. I asked them how it affected them, how does any food being halal actually affect their lives? They said that by eating it they're supporting their religion which they don't agree with, it means that the Muslims are winning.

We are no longer friends.

I wonder how they feel about religious tax exemptions.

Or the inbuild exceptions for anti-discrimination re religious organisations
 
I ate some Cracker Barrel cheese that said it was halal. It tasted nice, but now I'm not so sure. Will I be okay? I'm worried.

In case it's not clear, I'm absolutely joking.

I had an argument with friends over the exact thing above. They felt it was their right to eat things that aren't halal. I asked them how it affected them, how does any food being halal actually affect their lives? They said that by eating it they're supporting their religion which they don't agree with, it means that the Muslims are winning.

We are no longer friends.
Sidebar: The religious grounds for not eating food that has been prayed over in the name of foreign gods, by people of other faiths or "offered to idols" are flimsy within Christianity, but *may* be a legitimate cause for concern among super-uptight denominations.

This was actually a debate in the very early Christian community.

The Greek city temples would have ritual sacrifice of crops and livestock, offerings to the gods. Rather than burn these offerings in an act of ritual consumption, as was the Eastern practice, they kind of just sat there through the ceremony as the gods did not physically consume the food. Afterward, the food would be divided among the temple priests and any excess would be sold in the marketplace.

This food would then be bought by ordinary people and eaten like any other food, with no way to distinguish the sacrificed food from non-sacrificed food.

The issue for the early Christians sprung from the fact that, Christianity being a very Jewish phenomenon at the time, some early Christians considered themselves as being subject to Jewish food laws, including one that forbade the eating of food offered to other gods. This gets complicated, as Greek-born worshippers of Yahweh were in many cases considered exempt by the synagogues from the majority of Levitical law, apart from the Ten Commandments, and there was heated debate among Christian groups as to how Jewish they actually needed to become (circumcision was another debate), but the big takeaway here is that people were worried about sinning by eating food offered to the Greek gods.

On one side of the debate were the richer, more educated Greek Christians, who, citing historical precedent and the idea that since the Greek gods don't exist in the Christian worldview, going over to their friend's houses and eating whatever food is offered to them is fine, even if it's not kosher or was originally temple food. On the other side of the debate were ordinary Greek Christians, who held that the Greek gods did exist, but were in actual fact demons, so eating food offered to them was spitting in the face of God.

The conflict, when you boiled it down was between those who wanted to remain a part of the Greek civic community and those that did not.

The people who thought it didn't matter eventually won out, with Paul writing in one of the letters to the Corinthians that they were technically right, but to not to be dicks about it by flaunting delicious temple steak in front of those that disagreed. Other Jewish food laws were also dropped from Christian practice, though the basis for doing so is more textually clear.

The thing is, without categorically condemning the concept, the shade of reasonable doubt remained within the text, so I could see an argument on religious grounds why someone would refuse to eat halal-certified food, especially if you're Jewish.

TL;DR: The only Australians who should be worried about eating halal food are super devout Jews and those belonging to some very obscure Christian sects who don't think that the debate was settled 2000 years ago. Even then, you always have the choice of not buying this food.

Maybe some animal rights people too, who object to the method of killing used on animals.
 

Danoss

Member
The only Australians who should be worried about eating halal food are super devout Jews and those belonging to some very obscure Christian sects who don't think that the debate was settled 2000 years ago. Even then, you always have the choice of not buying this food.

Thanks for that history lesson, that's pretty cool and I had no idea.

Those friends weren't religious at all, just bigoted arseholes. Give them a reason to rail against another race, religion or culture and they'd take it. I'm glad I have nothing to do with them any longer.
 

Clipper

Member
Danoss (or any one else), have you played the Marvel Legendary deck building game? I was watching a review of it this morning and thought it looked interesting.
I've heard plenty of good things about it and it does sound kind of fun. Deck builders aren't really my thing, though (I can't stand the constant shuffling), so I can't speak from personal experience, but I don't think I've seen many negative opinions of it.

I had an argument with friends over the exact thing above. They felt it was their right to eat things that aren't halal. I asked them how it affected them, how does any food being halal actually affect their lives? They said that by eating it they're supporting their religion which they don't agree with, it means that the Muslims are winning.

We are no longer friends.
Man, that is some crazy stuff. I guess it is mostly driven by ignorance, but you did the right thing to distance yourself from it, given they wouldn't listen to reason. I'm sorry you were forced to make such decisions, though.
 

Fredescu

Member
Thought this was a good article on the Ford closure on Crikey and since it's a paid article I'll paste the whole thing here as free marketing.

Who’s afraid of Ford’s closure? It was logical and no bad thing
GLENN DYER AND BERNARD KEANE | MAY 24, 2013 11:49AM

In the context of its struggling global operations, Ford’s decision to shut up shop in Australia is logical. And recent economic history tells us it will have few repercussions, say Glenn Dyer and Bernard Keane.



Ford’s decision to close its Australian operations is yet another of those giant economic Rorschach inkblots in which everyone sees what they’re predisposed to see.

The opposition sees a business destroyed by the carbon price (not, of course, by the whopping paid parental leave tax it is promising to place on Ford and other businesses). The unions and politicians like Labor Senator Doug Cameron see a compelling case for yet more government support for unviable companies. And the usual suspects at the national dailies see more evidence that Australia is a “high-cost, low-productivity” (copyright, The Australian Financial Review) economy shackled by bad IR laws and too much regulation.

Meantime, twice as many jobs were lost immediately when the Sydney cleaning company Swan collapsed on Wednesday, without anyone feeling the need to opine about its implications for the economy. But manufacturing exerts the sort of influence on both Left and Right that service industries don’t, presumably because manufacturing is a “real job”.

We could point out the usual things, like how throwing more money at foreign multinationals to stay here would amount to sending good money after bad. Or that labour productivity fell under WorkChoices and has grown (strongly) under the Fair Work Act. Or that India is more heavily regulated than Australia but Ford is about to open a massive new plant there. Or that Ford’s biggest problem was not high costs, or even the strong dollar, but that Australians, at a time when they were buying more new cars than ever before, were ignoring Ford’s vehicles in droves, which suggests the company’s management didn’t know what they were doing.

(Any parallels with News Limited, another whingeing, subsidised US subsidiary facing a remorseless decline in sales of its key products here, are of course coincidental.)

But let’s look at the international context. Ford’s decision to close its Australian car-making operations was an accounting adjustment for the car giant and nothing more. Compared with the size of the losses and headaches in some of the company’s other markets — Europe and South America — leaving Australia was a straightforward decision. Ceasing manufacturing and retaining a presence with an import-based retailing operation was always going to be an easy option for the company to take.

That’s a tribute to the openness of the Australian economy and the ease of entry and exit. Compare that with the way Ford remains trapped in loss-making businesses elsewhere.

The Ford 2012 accounts and the March quarter report disclose some startling losses. Ford lost a total of nearly $US3.5 billion each year in Europe in 2011 and 2012, and it said in April it expected this year’s losses to be around $US2 billion. Since then, Ford has said it managed to eke out a tiny increase in sales across Europe:

“The decline in Ford Europe’s first quarter pre-tax results primarily reflected higher structural costs, including restructuring effects (principally accelerated depreciation) and higher pension charges due to lower discount rates. Market factors and exchange also were unfavourable. Full year 2013 guidance for Europe remains unchanged, with the company expecting a loss of about $US2 billion. The outlook for the business environment in Europe remains uncertain. While it is possible economic and industry conditions will begin to stabilise later this year, recent economic indicators are mixed.”

Ford says it remains confident of returning to profit by “mid-decade” (!) which could mean another couple of billion dollars in losses. You’d expect Ford to be looking to cut its losses and retreat from Europe as well. But it is staying the distance, for the moment; can you imagine exiting car-making in Germany, Belgium and Britain with the ease with which Ford is exiting Australia? As part of its efforts to stay in Europe, Ford is launching a new marketing campaign tomorrow night at the Champion’s League soccer final between Dortmund and Bayern Munich in London. An estimated 150 million will watch the final, and Ford is planning a campaign based on the technologies in its new range of cars, rather than the current models.

It’s a different story in the US. Ford announced this week it was lifting production in the US by 200,000 cars and adding the equivalent of 3500 jobs to its plants this year because of rising demand. The US is where the money is for Ford (to pay for the losses in Europe and South America). Compared with the growth in the US car market, Australia was never going to last as a manufacturing outpost. The logic for Ford is crushing — quitting Australia (with its small manufacturing business) is not really a problem.

The company’s local losses of $A600 million in the past five years, and the losses between now and 2016 when the closure actually happens, will mean Ford will be able to turn Australia into a highly profitable import-wholesale-retail business and add some extra volume to its plants in Europe where many of the imports will be sourced from. And courtesy of those losses, Ford won’t be paying any Australian company tax.

Finally, all the reports have forgotten what happened when another Ford plant closed in 1994, when the usual litany of doomsters, gloomsters and “experts” complained and agonised about this decision and the signals it sent. Around 436 jobs were lost when Sydney’s Homebush plant ended operations. That plant put together Ford Lasers imported as what were called CKDs — Completely Knocked Down. Cars were shipped from Mazda in Japan and rebadged here. They were reassembled (expensively) at the Sydney plant because tariffs allowed that to happen.

That old Ford plant has been turned into a business park and has led the revitalisation of the area around Parramatta Road at Homebush, with many more people being employed in the mostly service-sector businesses that moved there (or started) than ever lost jobs there. That’s the story of the Australian economy in the past 20 years. It’s a story that politicians, union officials and the ideologues at the national dailies prefer to ignore.
 

markot

Banned
To be fairly. Most of those cleaning jobs will still be there tomorrow needing to be cleaned.

The same cannae be said of car makering.
 

Fredescu

Member
To be fairly. Most of those cleaning jobs will still be there tomorrow needing to be cleaned.

The same cannae be said of car makering.
"It had been losing money on several contracts" meaning those jobs may not have been necessary and not all will be replaced. It's certainly true that no one needs to buy a Falcon though, and that's kinda the point of the first half of the article.
 
I thought everyone was blaming the closure on Ford doing a shit job at selling their cars? Or was it another FUCKING LABOR, CARBON TAX KILLIN MA JOEB thing. They said they lost $300 million or something.

Hey, do you want me to post Blur to you, in case you don't want to wait for PAX?

Hmmmmmmmmmmm maybe. I don't have many games to play right now. AusPOST costs are painful though. Do you have a carrier pigeon you could duct tape it to?
 

markot

Banned
"It had been losing money on several contracts" meaning those jobs may not have been necessary and not all will be replaced. It's certainly true that no one needs to buy a Falcon though, and that's kinda the point of the first half of the article.

Well, they may have been over paying their management, its been known to happen! Dont know many cleaners who are over paid or under worked >.< (Although they may have been lowballing tenders to get contracts!)

Also, what if theres a war?! What factories can we turn into tank makers or plane makers? None! Cause we closed all our factories down. But at least we have catering and cleaning down! So at least we can clean and cater to our conquoring Chinese factory having overlords!
 

Danoss

Member
I've heard plenty of good things about it and it does sound kind of fun. Deck builders aren't really my thing, though (I can't stand the constant shuffling), so I can't speak from personal experience, but I don't think I've seen many negative opinions of it.

A number of people have said if you take away all the cool Marvel characters that they love, it's an average to good deckbuilder. Since the characters they love are there, they enjoy it more than they would if they weren't. I think I've managed to say the same thing twice there, but the point is there.

Man, that is some crazy stuff. I guess it is mostly driven by ignorance, but you did the right thing to distance yourself from it, given they wouldn't listen to reason. I'm sorry you were forced to make such decisions, though.

Ignorance is one thing, willful ignorance is another and that's absolutely what it is. It is maddening and not something I'm willing to tolerate.
 
Had my job interview with the ABC this morning. Went pretty well, but they said there's only one position going, not a bunch like I'd thought/hoped. So I'm not mega confident, but still hopeful. I'll hear back next week apparently
 
Had my job interview with the ABC this morning. Went pretty well, but they said there's only one position going, not a bunch like I'd thought/hoped. So I'm not mega confident, but still hopeful. I'll hear back next week apparently

Did you have to write long winded selection criteria?
I fucking hate those.
 
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