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AusGAF IV - A No Hope, Government - Double the price, region locked and now adults
- Thread starter VOOK
- Start date
roosters93
Member
What about when you give it to others?
HolyCheck said:
As jambo says, essentially you don't 'own' the game, you just have a licence to play it. (yes, second hand sale blah blah whatever), but it is true.
I would argue that goes for a lot of products these days, not just those that are digital. You have a licence to use said product, but don't really 'own' it.
Marshmellow
Member
Jintor said:
There is still time left in the day for it to break!
I am holding onto that hope!
ClivePwned
Member
Gazunta said:
can't see it on PSN.
codswallop
Member
I would think Assassin's Creed Revelations is as big or bigger than Skyrim, so add that to the list.Gazunta said:
codswallop
Member
Interesting... Wikipedia says that the 'Robin Edition' of Arkham City was supposedly exclusively available to Game and Gamestation in the UK, but OzGameShop has it.
jambo said:
Functionally, you do own it. You can lend it, resell it, keep it or whatever. It is exactly the same as owning a book. What you dont own is the copyright on it.
If any industry pushes too hard on the "you dont own it, trollface" line, the prices will crash as people will stop buying.
RandomVince said:
can't resell steam games.
Vince i get what you're saying but most EULAs ban you from reselling the software in both corporate and entertainment software. You don't have a EULA on console software (except the online services) so therefore yeah you can sell it second hand but there are examples where you cannot (such as the aforementioned digital games)
im not saying this is the correct way for people to do business, but its there.
Jintor said:
Pay attention then.
All I'm suggesting is that if these companies think you "dont own it", then I'd love to see what they consider grounds to revoke your "license" and stop you playing it. Because we have all broken the agreements they impose every time we lend it to a friend or attempt to resell it.
Obviously the rights holders don't seem intent on enforcing the "license only" model, so does that constitute an abandonment of the license only model in a functional sense?
ie we own what we buy, just as always.
Marshmellow
Member
ShyGuy said:
Did you just post and not read anything on this page?
codswallop
Member
Interesting that game second-hand sales are fine, but when was the last time you saw anyone selling MS SQL Server 2005 licenses second-hand, or Oracle licenses?
Marshmellow
Member
ShyGuy said:
Lol,ok. No nothing yet and choc said it is not going to, but i am holding hope.
Need professional help with the minefield of software licensing? Random and Vince Lawyers are here to help. At Random and Vince, we will fight to get every one and zero you deserve. No license agreement too big, no case too small. Our old-fashioned approach will give you piece of mind, because at Random and Vince, we believe that if you can fit it on a DVD it's yours and nobody can take away that right, not even you when you sign a contract saying otherwise.RandomVince said:
codswallop
Member
My point is that software is software is software. It shouldn't matter whether it is for entertainment, productivity or something automated.RandomVince said:
However, the licenses for things like SQL Server probably explicitly say you can't resell them whereas boxed games probably don't. Has anyone actually bothered to read them in their entirety?
RandomVince said:
What does absurdity have to do with it? Law is law. An appeal to rational emotion or gut feeling isn't going to get you anywhere here. (Unless we're talking, I don't know, in equity or something).
Practicality aside, of course.
Note: This is a purely legal thing and I'm not arguing against your position, just trying to understand it.
You guys will have to forgive me here. I'm coming at this topic from a science background where facts are what is dealt with, unlike a corporate law background which is a minefield of logical inconsistencies.
Bare with me here...
A software is sold with three main concepts in play.
The first is that of copyright. That is, only the content owner has the rights to make duplicates for sale. That's perfectly fine by me, even though Disney bastardised the law's original interpretation.
The third is ownership. That is, the person who pays the money gets something in return. A good or product if you like. You know, that standard principle of human commerce that is only predated by bartering.
The second, in the middle, is licensing. Licensing serves no real purpose if copyright exists. Copyright essentially says "don't pirate" and that's legitimate. Licensing says dont lend it to a friend, display in public, resell it, hire it, broadcast it or use it outside the home. Further, resale is expressly prohibited unless authorised by the publisher, according to the manual I just checked then. It also says the same about rentals, but I figure we all know that blockbuster pay more for a rental copy so I wont argue that.
So what company X says is that I need to get a written letter from them before I'm allowed to sell it to a third party, be it jb, eb or a mate down the road, or on ebay.
If you agree with licenses jintor, as you said earlier, then you must never ever sell or lend your games to anyone.
Further, licenses are region limited, so it is also violating the license if you import games as well. Or sell them overseas like a limited edition of Infamous 2 to a Scandinavian AusGAF visitor.
So since I can only assume you are pro-license, and have never imported, loaned, sold or bought a game used, then you most certainly aren't a hypocrite in which case I cordially invite you to notify Warner Bros Interactive that I intend to trade in my copy of Batman at EB Games Carousel, in the suburb of Cannington tomorrow morning. I trust you will arrange the necessary documentation to prevent this heinous crime from taking place.
edit: sorry, jambo said it but the point stands.
Dont import is, as that violates the software license.
Bare with me here...
A software is sold with three main concepts in play.
The first is that of copyright. That is, only the content owner has the rights to make duplicates for sale. That's perfectly fine by me, even though Disney bastardised the law's original interpretation.
The third is ownership. That is, the person who pays the money gets something in return. A good or product if you like. You know, that standard principle of human commerce that is only predated by bartering.
The second, in the middle, is licensing. Licensing serves no real purpose if copyright exists. Copyright essentially says "don't pirate" and that's legitimate. Licensing says dont lend it to a friend, display in public, resell it, hire it, broadcast it or use it outside the home. Further, resale is expressly prohibited unless authorised by the publisher, according to the manual I just checked then. It also says the same about rentals, but I figure we all know that blockbuster pay more for a rental copy so I wont argue that.
So what company X says is that I need to get a written letter from them before I'm allowed to sell it to a third party, be it jb, eb or a mate down the road, or on ebay.
If you agree with licenses jintor, as you said earlier, then you must never ever sell or lend your games to anyone.
Further, licenses are region limited, so it is also violating the license if you import games as well. Or sell them overseas like a limited edition of Infamous 2 to a Scandinavian AusGAF visitor.
So since I can only assume you are pro-license, and have never imported, loaned, sold or bought a game used, then you most certainly aren't a hypocrite in which case I cordially invite you to notify Warner Bros Interactive that I intend to trade in my copy of Batman at EB Games Carousel, in the suburb of Cannington tomorrow morning. I trust you will arrange the necessary documentation to prevent this heinous crime from taking place.
edit: sorry, jambo said it but the point stands.
codswallop said:
Dont import is, as that violates the software license.
RandomVince said:
A) I never said anything about being 'pro' or 'anti' licence. They just exist. Stop being so bloody antagonistic.
B) I disagree with the assertion that licencing serves no purpose if copyright exists, since licencing - as you have noted - deals with an associated bundle of rights that the intellectual property holder can essentially offer or trade to others.
I guess you can disagree with the idea that intellectual property holders have the moral right to impose certain licence terms upon consumers, but that's a disconnect between the law and perceived moral rights. In purely legal terms the IP holder possess the rights.
EatChildren
Currently polling second in Australia's federal election (first in the Gold Coast), this feral may one day be your Bogan King.
VOOK said:
It speaks volumes that I hiked to EB many years ago after moving out of home for the first time, to the city no less, to pick up a Collector's Edition copy of Oblivion for PC, and this year I couldn't give a single fuck about Bethesda's latest turd.
Call me when the modders fix it.
BanShunsaku
Member
Just got an email from HN saying they've invoiced my UC3 SE preorder.
Someone on Whirlpool just got the call to pick it up.
Street date broken I guess? They haven't called me yet...
Someone on Whirlpool just got the call to pick it up.
Street date broken I guess? They haven't called me yet...
I like games. Sometimes I buy them at the shop, sometimes from Steam, sometimes I import. Sometimes I lend them to my friends, sometimes I borrow them. I've even been known to rent them from a video shop.
This utterly useless post brought to by your local Rez.
And leave Skyrim ALONE!
This utterly useless post brought to by your local Rez.
And leave Skyrim ALONE!
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