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Autumn Anime 2016 |OT| The seasons change, but we're still Falling for Euri

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This season once again goes to show that a series only needs a decent start and its audience at large barely cares if it shits its bed right after. Like, I look at Yuri on Ice or Flip Flapper reddit discussion threads and they're basically devoid of criticism and disappointment. Once people start to care for characters some it apparently doesn't matter what happens.

Not exclusive to anime of course. I mean, lul, The Walking Dead.
 

Shergal

Member
This isn't to defend Flip Flappers as a masterpiece or anything, but there was some foreshadowing for the eventual plot twists; it's not totally out of nowhere. (Which is perhaps why I was able to be apprehensive about the show based on the ending of the first episode.)

In places where the show was discussed extensively
aka /a/
most of the plot was basically predicted around the third or fourth week, and almost all the details right after the seventh.

The thing is when that stuff stays in the background you can enjoy the good stuff for being good, while optimistically hoping they might have the good sense to deal with these looming 'revelations' in an appropriate way; that's not possible anymore when the show starts to focus on it exclusively and reveals exactly how bad the plot was all along.
 

Ascheroth

Member
Well now we know why it was called Flip Flappers.
Because it was flip flapping between good and bad.

In all seriousness, looks like I'll just treat episode 9 as the end and forget about watching the rest (unless it turns really good again).
I liked Flip Flappers because of the weird and imaginative worlds, the loose mini-adventures, the great colors and animation.
I never gave a shit about the characters or the plot to begin with, so reading how it has tossed all the former stuff for the latter is dissappointing. (Does it at least still have sakuga?)
 

Szadek

Member
I always knew Raising Project would be the best magical girl show of the season. It's honest about going grimpderp, has some characters I don't hate, actually has less fanservice than some of the stupid costumes imply, and overall knows what it wants to be.
I rather give that title to Flip Flappers or even fucking Soushin Shoujo Matoi for that matter.
 
Flip Flappers 11

Man the brutality of Cocona's mother seems to come out of nowhere. She really seems to enjoy killing people who weren't actually out of kill her. Yeah the facility was fucked up but damn did she have to kill everyone in it?

Also I feel bad for Salt's Dad because that isn't the situation of him being a mad scientist, he was actually fine until Papika and Cocona started fucking around in his head and turned him crazy and we had already had a foreshadowing of that with Art senpai. Also calling it that Nyunyu or whatever her name is will be the key to stopping Mimi.
 

JulianImp

Member
In places where the show was discussed extensively
aka /a/
most of the plot was basically predicted around the third or fourth week, and almost all the details right after the seventh.

The thing is when that stuff stays in the background you can enjoy the good stuff for being good, while optimistically hoping they might have the good sense to deal with these looming 'revelations' in an appropriate way; that's not possible anymore when the show starts to focus on it exclusively and reveals exactly how bad the plot was all along.

Oh, so there was some foreshadowing to the whole Mimi subplot... still, I believe that the show could've split plot and adventures better, rather than giving us lots of adventures early on and now focusing almost entirely on plot.

I rather give that title to Flip Flappers or even fucking Soushin Shoujo Matoi for that matter.

Yeah. FlipFlap has done a couple interesting things at the very least, compared to the heaping pile of overdone tropes and boring stuff that is Raising Project.

Also, because I happened to pick it up in CR:

World Conquest Zvezda Plot - #1-5
The show so far has come this close to actually being fun, but for some reason I just can't bring myself to fully enjoy its absurd cast and plot. It's an okay-ish comedy about a goody two-shoes MC being roped into an organization that wants to take over the world, but the gags often fall short, and the cast is also pretty generic.

If I had to describe the show, I couldn't call it anything but bland, but I'm kind of bummed that it feels more interesting than some of the stuff I've been watching this season even in spite of being so bland and unremarkable itself.
 

zulux21

Member
There's some speculation since the first BD release comes with a box to store all the blu-rays, enough for six.

to be fair, even if this series is only 12 episodes, it doesn't mean that it won't end with a, TBC.

I am fully expecting it to be garbage though, since chaos;head was garbage.
 
to be fair, even if this series is only 12 episodes, it doesn't mean that it won't end with a, TBC.

I am fully expecting it to be garbage though, since chaos;head was garbage.
I thought the Chaos;Head VN was pretty good though, just got a bad adaptation because Madhouse. Hearing that C;C is basically all the good things in C;H made even better on top of it being rated higher than S;G gave me a bit of hope that it wouldn't get shafted in terms of an adaptation.

I guess I can hope it ends with a TBC and split cour though.
 

Qurupeke

Member
Flip Flappers 11

To be honest, it was better than expected. There's actually enough foreshadowing and ties to the start, for the most part at least, the twists and the developments make much more sense than I thought. I find it fascinating how they managed to connect to it a lot of plot elements, like the gate that changed Cocona's senpai or Cocona's dreams. There are still unanswered questions, like what was the entire objective of the good guys or what exactly are those fragments they collect, hopefully they'll be able to answer those.

That said, I'm disappointed in the show's current direction. For 8 episodes or so, the plot barely moved and it was relying on a big amounts of random hints. Characters like Salt or even the entire evil organization, had little purpose other than being an enigma. Others like the "third child", seem to be less important that what we were led to believe. The worst offender was the lack of chemistry between Cocona and Papika though. Their relationship just doesn't feel real to me, they could be the best friends ever and then Cocona says she doesn't like Papika. I feel it was really incoherent, and for a show that focuses so much on their ties, this doesn't sit right to me.

And then the gates of hell open and unfortunately, everything is explained via flashbacks. Maybe with more episodes and better planning, they could make it work. As of now though, it's really messy. Other than Yayaka and Cocona, the rest of the cast didn't really change since the first episode, as a lot of stuff felt like it was resetting after each episode's ending. Also, while I found Salt's story pretty nice, how am I supposed to care about him when he barely appears and only acts as a mysterious guy? Mimi is also really cool, but this is the part I feel they failed to properly foreshadow. They just made a crazy, evil persona on her. Not any hints on that, of course, because she was basically introduced in flashbacks...

The plot has some interesting ideas, but I don't think they work on their full potential. They feel like part of an entirely different show. An overarching plot like that just doesn't fit to a 13 episodes show that experimented with various themes and concepts on its first 8 episodes and it was almost episodic. A shame, really. The show continues to look really good and the animations is top notch...
 
I did find it interesting that the S1 OP had the red string of fate and everything, which of course is long gone. Was book 2 out when KyoAni was scripting S1?

No, the second and third novels in the Sound Euphonium series were published subsequent to the production of the first anime season.
 
This season once again goes to show that a series only needs a decent start and its audience at large barely cares if it shits its bed right after. Like, I look at Yuri on Ice or Flip Flapper reddit discussion threads and they're basically devoid of criticism and disappointment. Once people start to care for characters some it apparently doesn't matter what happens.

Not exclusive to anime of course. I mean, lul, The Walking Dead.

First impressions in a tv show is everything. As long as you start out good, and don't majorly shake up the status quo and keep your cast of characters appealing, you can coast off that initial goodwill forever because there will always be that 'maybe the show will get that good again' carrot dangling in front of the audience.
 

Angry Grimace

Two cannibals are eating a clown. One turns to the other and says "does something taste funny to you?"
No, the second and third novels in the Sound Euphonium series were published subsequent to the production of the first anime season.

The third novel came out like 4 days before the first episode aired, but they almost certainly could have figured out what was actually going to happen if they cared enough to ask. Hell, SNAFU's second season contained material from a volume that hadn't been released at the time it aired.
 
The third novel came out like 4 days before the first episode aired, but they almost certainly could have figured out what was actually going to happen if they cared enough to ask. Hell, SNAFU's second season contained material from a volume that hadn't been released at the time it aired.

It's important to note that Sound Euphonium was not intended to be a continuous novel series. There was one novel written in 2013; that was the novel that people at KyoAni liked and arranged to adapt. After the anime production had begun, the novel author was prevailed upon, I assume by her publisher, to write sequels to capitalize on the upcoming anime that were both published in 2015 in the leadup to the anime airing. That's why the dramatic conflicts that make up the second and third novels that this second anime season is adapting feel like afterthoughts invented after the fact rather than organic outgrowths of the material of the first season, which felt pretty complete in itself. Or at least that's how I feel.

I haven't read the novels myself, so I can only go on second-hand information for them. But for the most part, I don't feel like the problems with Sound Euphonium S2 are the result of KyoAni screwing up perfectly good source material, but rather inherently weak source material that KyoAni has not been able to perfectly patch up, despite very strong visual craft.
 
I don't really give a shit if there was one or two scenes setting up Reality Warper Mimi to come in and True Final Boss the series because it still doesn't feel earned and I still don't care about the main trio.

Its like in a JRPG if there was some villager that had a line halfway through the game where they say "You know, there is an old story about the ancient evil God from another dimension. I think his name was Lavos-Zeromus-Gary Oak and he kind of likes to pop out of fucking nowhere after you kill the evil lord MagusWhatever"

Sölf;226670381 said:
So, the first teaser of the Gintama live action movie is here.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LkFaw2XGDMw

Benizakura arc?

Looks okay
 

Quasar

Member
Great Passage 10 - Another consistently good episode. My one complaint is the lack of sign subs in the word check sequence. I got the gist but I would have preferred some of the text translated.
 
Keijo!!!!!!!! 11

3qsxCsq.jpg

im not sorry

I laughed out loud at how speed girl beat the Char clone. I had forgotten. That's some Joseph Joestar level shit.

There was just too much good shit to screencap em all this episode (and some nsfw) but Iai-do tits stands out as being the funniest
 
So after finishing my Ajin Anime to Manga comparisons articles today I've been thinking a lot about adaptations, particularly since that's at least 2/3rds of the new anime every season.

How faithful do people want them to be? I know some crowds want a pure 1:1, some don't mind the entire thing being fuddled with, etc.

My opinion has kind of changed after seeing how much was changed, and I think for the better with Ajin. They expanded and reworked certain plot lines that were underdeveloped or appeared out of the blue, rearranged scenes to tell the story in a more chronologically consistent way, and attempted to bring the season to a close with a more satisfying climax than what the manga had offered with as far as they adapted. But they kept many of the core elements, characters, and developments the same.

So I was wondering what are other people's version of a perfect adaptation? How much should be changed, kept the same etc? And do you have a series that exemplifies how you feel?
 
So after finishing my Ajin Anime to Manga comparisons articles today I've been thinking a lot about adaptations, particularly since that's at least 2/3rds of the new anime every season.

How faithful do people want them to be? I know some crowds want a pure 1:1, some don't mind the entire thing being fuddled with, etc.

My opinion has kind of changed after seeing how much was changed, and I think for the better with Ajin. They expanded and reworked certain plot lines that were underdeveloped or appeared out of the blue, rearranged scenes to tell the story in a more chronologically consistent way, and attempted to bring the season to a close with a more satisfying climax than what the manga had offered with as far as they adapted. But they kept many of the core elements, characters, and developments the same.

So I was wondering what are other people's version of a perfect adaptation? How much should be changed, kept the same etc? And do you have a series that exemplifies how you feel?

The perfect adaptation is something that takes its source material and makes it work within the context of its new medium. So, in the context of an anime adaptation of a manga/novel, that would be a work that takes advantage of motion/sound/framing/color/etc., whether or not it makes significant changes in the narrative events. I'm not entirely against a straightforward "here's the panels" adaptation of a manga, but ideally I think an adaptation should strive to present its own take on the material in some fashion, some reason to justify its existence beyond just being a marketing tool. That's why I dislike seeing manga/novel readers criticize the lack of faithfulness in an anime adaptation. The manga or novel already exists and will still exist in the future; an anime, whether adapted or not, should strive to be a work that succeeds on its own merits rather than coasting on someone else's work.
 

duckroll

Member
The Great Passage - Episode 4

The best part of the episode was Jisyo-tans rap. The worst part of the episode was the random insert song montage. Not only was the insert song bad and ill fitting for the tone of the series, the actual montage was pretty poorly directed. I think there was an attempt to match some beats of the song or something and make it feel a bit like a music video, but the overall effect was clumsy and lacked impact. The date scene later was about as awkward as one could expect, and again highlighted how good the character drama in the show is at saying stuff without saying much at all.

Still though, that rap... so good. I don't really understand why this show has totally random chibi talking dictionaries doing weird cute stuff in lieu of traditional eyecatches, but I'm glad it does! Lol.
 

Quasar

Member
So I was wondering what are other people's version of a perfect adaptation? How much should be changed, kept the same etc? And do you have a series that exemplifies how you feel?

I tend to prefer it unchanged in terms of plots and dialog pretty close too. But I'm fine with non important scenes trimmed for time. Of course thats probably in the eye of the beholder.

Part of it of course is the fact that adaptions almost never tell the complete story, and are just a jumping off point for reading the manga or novel and so I prefer them made so that I can just jump straight from the end of the anime to the next volume of the story unhindered for the most part.
 
So after finishing my Ajin Anime to Manga comparisons articles today I've been thinking a lot about adaptations, particularly since that's at least 2/3rds of the new anime every season.

How faithful do people want them to be? I know some crowds want a pure 1:1, some don't mind the entire thing being fuddled with, etc.

My opinion has kind of changed after seeing how much was changed, and I think for the better with Ajin. They expanded and reworked certain plot lines that were underdeveloped or appeared out of the blue, rearranged scenes to tell the story in a more chronologically consistent way, and attempted to bring the season to a close with a more satisfying climax than what the manga had offered with as far as they adapted. But they kept many of the core elements, characters, and developments the same.

So I was wondering what are other people's version of a perfect adaptation? How much should be changed, kept the same etc? And do you have a series that exemplifies how you feel?

Sure 1:1 adaptation are nice, but I do like it when adaptation takes some liberties and it's these liberties that make them better.

Shonen fights are big examples of moments where I like anime to bring their A game. Just recently, from the adaptation of MHA, while I agree that the manga is better in general, the All Might vs Noumu fight was much much better in the anime. I was so surprised by the huge difference, that it actually made me fanboy a LOT. In the manga it was 2 pages, in the anime it was 3 minutes of pure amazing hype. That is one example of many. Studio Pierrot did an amazing job with the Naruto vs Sasuke fight and the original stuff they added amplified the strong moments.

I'm trying to think of story elements that I liked changed in adaptation, but I can only really think of negative stuff. So yea, being original in anime fights is very important imo.

Edit:I just thought about the current Twin Star Exorcist adaptation, now this is a title they took lots of liberties with the material to the point where the manga and the anime are entirely different storie at this point. While at first it might sound terrible and yes I think the anime is weaker then the manga, but It's actually pretty cool since it basically gives me a new story in the TSE universe. So I get the manga story and the anime story.

Edit2:If we are talking perfect adaption, Haikyu is an example of a perfect one. it took everything about the manga and multiplied it by 100.
 

Kansoku

Member
The best adaptation I've ever seen in my life is Aku no Hana. The manga is great and all, but it's art doesn't really fit with the theme IMO. The anime adaptation did everything right. The sound design and OST was fantastic, the visuals were great, very fitting and complimented the story a lot, the slower pacing adds a lot, making what happens more impactful.
 

duckroll

Member
The best adaptation I've ever seen in my life is Aku no Hana. The manga is great and all, but it's art doesn't really fit with the theme IMO. The anime adaptation did everything right. The sound design and OST was fantastic, the visuals were great, very fitting and complimented the story a lot, the slower pacing adds a lot, making what happens more impactful.

The studio that produced it, Zexcs, is really making a name for themselves for producing alternative character drama shows which are critically acclaimed but sells 0 copies and probably makes no money at all. They also produced Shonen Hollywood, which somehow got two seasons AND crowdfunded enough money to produce an enhanced version of the finale episode. Now they're adapting The Great Passage, which is probably the best show airing right now.
 

Quasar

Member
The studio that produced it, Zexcs, is really making a name for themselves for producing alternative character drama shows which are critically acclaimed but sells 0 copies and probably makes no money at all. They also produced Shonen Hollywood, which somehow got two seasons AND crowdfunded enough money to produce an enhanced version of the finale episode. Now they're adapting The Great Passage, which is probably the best show airing right now.

Wonder how they stay in business.
 
The Great Passage - Episode 4

Still though, that rap... so good. I don't really understand why this show has totally random chibi talking dictionaries doing weird cute stuff in lieu of traditional eyecatches, but I'm glad it does! Lol.

The dictionary mascots are designed by Sanrio, so I assume it's a financial thing where Sanrio is investing some money in the anime while getting to sell merchandise based off these mascot characters.

The best adaptation I've ever seen in my life is Aku no Hana. The manga is great and all, but it's art doesn't really fit with the theme IMO. The anime adaptation did everything right. The sound design and OST was fantastic, the visuals were great, very fitting and complimented the story a lot, the slower pacing adds a lot, making what happens more impactful.

Yeah, Aku no Hana is a very strong adaptation. The only problem I have with it is that it didn't find a graceful note to end its final episode on, but otherwise its brooding mood and super-strong sound direction is completely up my alley.

The studio that produced it, Zexcs, is really making a name for themselves for producing alternative character drama shows which are critically acclaimed but sells 0 copies and probably makes no money at all. They also produced Shonen Hollywood, which somehow got two seasons AND crowdfunded enough money to produce an enhanced version of the finale episode. Now they're adapting The Great Passage, which is probably the best show airing right now.

I remember the choice of Zexcs (how are you supposed to pronounce that anyway?) for Flowers of Evil raised a bunch of eyebrows at the time, given their weak track record at that point. Now that Kuroyanagi has had a number of productions there, it's not looking quite so out of place among their oeuvre.
 
So I was wondering what are other people's version of a perfect adaptation? How much should be changed, kept the same etc? And do you have a series that exemplifies how you feel?

Either do a wholly original storyline with an anime original character going through the same events but providing a different perspective, or do a wholly 1:1 take with anime original content to world build where the writer had to skip world building for the sake of meeting the page limitations.

The worst are adaptations that try to condense entire LN volumes/manga volumes in an episode, like Zetman.
 

Quasar

Member
Either do a wholly original storyline with an anime original character going through the same events but providing a different perspective, or do a wholly 1:1 take with anime original content to world build where the writer had to skip world building for the sake of meeting the page limitations.

The worst are adaptations that try to condense entire LN volumes/manga volumes in an episode, like Zetman.

One thing I hate is adaptations that just focus on say ecchi/action elements of a story and throw away the rest (and more interesting part) of the story ruining it (at least for me). Thats what started me reading more and watching less.
 

duckroll

Member
So I was wondering what are other people's version of a perfect adaptation? How much should be changed, kept the same etc? And do you have a series that exemplifies how you feel?

The perfect adaptation is one which matches the source material with a creative team and/or vision most consistent with the tone of the work. I feel that looking at the content is a shallow way of critique when it comes to adaptation works. Instead it should be treated no different from an original work, but with the awareness that it is drawn from a source material. As long as the adaptation is true to the intent of the original, it should not matter -at all- how much is changed or whether there is even any specific narrative similarity in content between the original and the adaptation. What is important is that the people adapting a work successfully identify the defining themes, characterizations, and tone of the work, and are able to express them as effectively in a new medium. That to me, is the true value of adaptation. Not just taking a comic or book and turning it into moving pictures for fans who lack the imagination to do it themselves. I'm not interested in that, I'm interested in interpretation and expression.
 
The Aku no Hana anime was still supposed to take place in middle school, right? Given the actors' age they should've just shifted it to high school with virtually no negative aspect for the storytelling anyways. It's nothing big but still kinda bizarre when you realize they supposed to be middle schoolers.
 

JulianImp

Member
So I was wondering what are other people's version of a perfect adaptation? How much should be changed, kept the same etc? And do you have a series that exemplifies how you feel?

Like with localization, narrative tropes or game mechanics, I don't think there's a single "right" way to handle things, and that it all depends on how much love, time and money the adaptation gets.

While I haven't watched the original FMA (only Brotherhood), I've heard both versions are well-regarded, so I'd say that it isn't like one form of adaptation is strictly better than the other. One thing I can say, though, is that at least some kind of changes are required for when you're transitioning from one media into another, and that trying to shoehorn everything from the source material into the adaptation could end up doing more harm than good.

As another example, I could cite the Monogatari TV show and the Kizumonogatari movies as two radically different ways to adapt the same series. The movies managed to portray Araragi's long-winded monologues visually, which was stunning, but the TV show also did well enough with its music and Shaft's quirky visuals to make sure verbalized monologues were still interesting to watch.

On the other side of the coin there's stuff such as the early episodes of Detective Conan, were the anime team made a particularily large mistake in an episode where they had removed the men in black from a case where their intervention was the sole reason Haibara would end up defecting from the black organization, so they had to air the original version of the case over a hundred episodes later to patch things up before Haibara's arc could actually start in the anime.
 

Haly

One day I realized that sadness is just another word for not enough coffee.
The Aku no Hana anime was still supposed to take place in middle school, right? Given the actors' age they should've just shifted it to high school with virtually no negative aspect for the storytelling anyways. It's nothing big but still kinda bizarre when you realize they supposed to be middle schoolers.

It's in line with how most anime is set in high school or whatever. You just have to resadjust the scale to go from elementary to high as you would high to college in Western stories.
 
The perfect adaptation is one which matches the source material with a creative team and/or vision most consistent with the tone of the work. I feel that looking at the content is a shallow way of critique when it comes to adaptation works. Instead it should be treated no different from an original work, but with the awareness that it is drawn from a source material. As long as the adaptation is true to the intent of the original, it should not matter -at all- how much is changed or whether there is even any specific narrative similarity in content between the original and the adaptation. What is important is that the people adapting a work successfully identify the defining themes, characterizations, and tone of the work, and are able to express them as effectively in a new medium. That to me, is the true value of adaptation. Not just taking a comic or book and turning it into moving pictures for fans who lack the imagination to do it themselves. I'm not interested in that, I'm interested in interpretation and expression.

It kinda sounds in your last few sentences though that you don't appreciate adaptations that are 1 to 1. But with the criteria above wouldn't a 1 to 1 technically pass through since it would inherently explore the same themes/vision/tone?
 

zulux21

Member
I thought the Chaos;Head VN was pretty good though, just got a bad adaptation because Madhouse. Hearing that C;C is basically all the good things in C;H made even better on top of it being rated higher than S;G gave me a bit of hope that it wouldn't get shafted in terms of an adaptation.

I guess I can hope it ends with a TBC and split cour though.

i should try to get the motivation to play the chaos;head VN. but the anime was so bad that I still haven't gotten around to watching stein's gate despite the praise because of how sour of a feeling CH left me with all those years ago @_@
 

Wanderer5

Member
I see Kabaneri is getting a second season, and hey I be up for some more.XD Despite being dumb and having a really weak sauce of a villain, the first season had a lot of enjoyable moments and coolness!:p
 
Haikyuu S3 10 END

I thought this might be the end of the anime, but it'd better continue with an ending like that. Loved the final rally though; the anime staff really outdid themselves on that one. I wasn't expecting the choice of the theme of Handel's "See, the Conquering Hero Comes", which I'm most familiar with as the tune used for the hymn "Thine is the Glory", as the background music for the awards ceremony. I wonder if that tune is actually used for athletic award ceremonies in Japan - given its triumphal tone it is appropriate for that situation.
 
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