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[Sciz]

I'm not sure why there's so much complaining about the loss of moves. Most of them were highly situational, to the point where you could only use them at predefined points marked by glowing pads. Tooie was even worse, giving them all kinds of maneuvers that had no practical use for general movement or combat. Just specific keys for a specific locks. The transformations were even worse, since you had to go to a certain point to activate one, at which point you lost almost all of your abilities for the sake of doing one specific thing. As for the deemphasis of the partnership, let's not forget that Tooie was the game that had them splitting up and running around individually for the sake of pushing buttons.

I'll admit that there's probably a certain amount of charm lost by externalizing the abilities, but the tradeoff is a huge step forward for the core gameplay.

 

[RiskyChris]

Of course. I also remember that Banjo Kazooie did not use acrobatics at all.

Okay.

 

[TTG]

That sounds fucking brilliant, with the lack of character moves and all. I can't wait to run around that sprawling landscape without a vehicle! Hey guess what, you can also play through MGS4 in first-person mode. You wouldn't want to, but you can!

You can get through Halo 3 without using a vehicles as well... doesn't mean you should.

The jury is still out on this one. Not exactly day 1 material in that clip.

 

[Odrion]

GAF hates change.

 

[Loudninja]

You use Kazooie to pick up blocks in order to build vehicles instead of using Kazooies moves from the previous games. Those were removed.

Hmm, a waste of Kazooie talents!

 

[Diffense]

From someone who owned and N64 and both banjos and now only has a Wii, this makes my life a whole lot easier. The concept doesn't sound all that bad, but it's not really banjo gameplay so I can pass.

 

[CrunchinJelly]

The highlight of this thread so far is someone complaining about Rare's use of primary colours. :lol

 

[Celery&Lager]

What a retarded post.

Thanks!

You're saying that BK3 is a spin off, with less intricate and more simplistic gameplay than the 'main' series. Read up on the game and watch the trailer and convince me that this is a spin off.

Never said it is a spin-off, wish it was. Banjo-Kazooie is a much loved game series and it feels like a huge departure (for the worse) from the originals. [/QUOTE]

It has a complex building mechanic you use to make tools to help you cross boundaries in the world. If anything there isn't one way to get to your goal now, but more since you have the choice as a player. There's still platforming and exploration.

I do not want any fuckin' complex mechanizmz. I want to have fun. This does not look like fun. I don't want to spend hours and stress out trying to build a stupid boat or plane. Also read other posts about lack of charm etc.[/QUOTE]

Keep in mind that BK wasn't the most 'hardcore' platformer to begin with.

Don't be silly.

We've seen one flash of gameplay and you're able to come to this conclusion already?

Yes. It's obvious this vehicle-building innovation will be at the core of the gameplay and it feels boring and wrong. I have very good intuition too.

 

[Steroyd]

I wonder when the Ratchet vs. Banjo screenshot comparisons will start.

It's already happened.

Oh Kazooie what have they done to thee!? :'(

 

[VALIS]

i insist that anyone still excited about this game is fooling themselves.

I insist that you're a very insecure person.

 

[Twig]

Sure it doesn't have the fanbase that M64 does, but does that make it an inferior game?

No. But they're not the same, either.

Unlike Super Mario 64, Banjo-Kazooie is an action-adventure game with platforming elements.
Unlike Banjo-Kazooie, Super Mario 64 is a platforming game with action-adventure elements.

 

[Loudninja]

I wonder why he never uses a Banjo as a weapon?

 

[abacab driver]

The vehicles feel like a shoehorned mechanic when you nerf your protagonists to match.

- Vehicle designs can play a large role in missions. We saw one where you had to collect coconuts from a field and got a small truck that could suck them up. Unfortunately you couldn't fit all the coconuts in the truck and had to back and deliver them in a large barrel. We were then shown how you could create a helicopter with a hook, that could pick up this large barrel, fly to the coconut field and fly low to scoop the coconuts in the barrel.

Yeah, that sounds shoehorned alright.

 

[TDG]

Wow, Rare tries to take Banjo in a different direction, and look at the hate.

Y'know, you guys aren't fooling anybody, I know that if Banjo 3 had been revealed as more of the same N64 game, now in HD, you guys would hate all over it and Rare.

 

[batbeg]

I wonder when the Ratchet vs. Banjo screenshot comparisons will start.

Page 7, with Fable 2 thrown in for good measure? -.-

 

[proposition]

how anyone can watch that trailer and actually be excited by the gameplay is beyond me. all we can do is speculate. and all i see are vehicles, planes, the occasional explosion, and the occasional neat moment (e.g. plane turning into smaller plane). the graphics are impressive, even though i don't like the art style.

i insist that anyone still excited about this game is fooling themselves.

I insist that you're wrong. I think it looks great.

 

[Uncle]

So they want to evolve the platform genre by not focusing on the platforming, what?!

I don't really see how it's not supposed to be platforming. Instead of using a special move or whatever that allows you to reach certain place, you have to build a machine that allows you to reach certain place. The basic idea seems awfully similar to me.

 

[Linkhero1]

Hmm, a waste of Kazooie talents!

Yup they might as well remove Kazooie and just give Banjo the laser.

 

[sprocket]

Got to say .. I am not fan of the vehicles being a main part to the game. Still day one purchase for me anyway.

 

[RiskyChris]

Wow, Rare tries to take Banjo in a different direction, and look at the hate.

Y'know, you guys aren't fooling anybody, I know that if Banjo 3 had been revealed as more of the same N64 game, now in 3D, you guys would hate all over it and Rare.

Great argument, really? Considering a lot of us WANT an HD BK, I have no idea how you come to that conclusion.

 

[Crushed]

Okay.

What? Using Kazooie for a mid-air jump, doing simple jumps over obstacles, hopping along some flowers or rocks at a few points, the occasional backflip to reach high objects, that's not Mario-style platforming or acrobatics. Banjo could never wall-jump to the top of a castle or do a running gymnastic triple jump and dive.

 

[Opus Angelorum]

Mario 64 is considered a classic and still to this day one of the best platformers of all time.

So every developer should just give up? According you Mario 64 is so indefatigable it's not even worth the effort...

 

[Speevy]

Page 7, with Fable 2 thrown in for good measure? -.-

Nah, that wasn't blatant enough.

 

[batbeg]

Yeah, that sounds shoehorned alright.

Don't be stupid, we're not going to read the numerous impressions and articles on a game before making damning blanket statements from the 2-minute trailer! I mean, there were vehicles, what more is there to know?!

 

[Shockgamer]

So you are only interested in games that will cause a big fuss sales wise? :lol

I wish I were. Then maybe Sega Rally Revo and Earth Defense Force would get the sales and mass market appeal they deserve.

I'm sorry, but that's quite sad.

Yes, it is sad that for all the bang going on in this thread, the actual game is going to come with a whimper. Regardless of its platforminess(or lack of).

 

[Francias Castiglione]

I think he does the ghostbuster like ray thing. I'm as confused as you :lol

He? Kazooie is a bird... in both senses of the word.

 

[Mithos Yggdrasill]

GAF hates change.

When

1) They don't make sense

2) they're gimmick

3) They ruin the game

4) they don' add anything good and/or revoluionary to the gameplay.

Choose.

 

[Speevy]

more of the same N64 game, now in 3D.

The original game's 3D was an optical illusion.

I knew it!

 

[RiskyChris]

Don't be stupid, we're not going to read the numerous impressions and articles on a game before making damning blanket statements from the 2-minute trailer! I mean, there were vehicles, what more is there to know?!

I'm not saying shoehorned into the game, can you guys read context?

It feels shoehorned to take an established set of characters and radically change their roles.

The game itself looks great. But I can't help but scratch my head.

 

[PepsimanVsJoe]

Because each level in BK was amazing and played well to the abilities of B-K, that's why.

Sure it doesn't have the fanbase that M64 does, but does that make it an inferior game?

What makes Banjo 64 the inferior game is the fact that it only does well what Mario 64 does brilliantly.

Why as a game designer would Rare be interested in doing "well" when they can shoot for "brilliance"? Most developers don't even have this luxury but Rare with the time & the budget they're working with why should they settle for doing something "well"?

Part of the reason I love the idea of this new Banjo is that it showcases the freedom of a developer to do what they want to do, ignoring what anyone else thinks. Why would they want to make a straight platformer that's just going to end up buried in Galaxy comparisons when they could create something fresh, different, and maybe even a bit creative?

I mean damn it's a bunch of guys who can only make Mario-64 clones working on the shooterbox.

 

[harSon]

Great argument, really? Considering a lot of us WANT an HD BK, I have no idea how you come to that conclusion.

Want to know what happens when a developer slaps pretty graphics over an old formula? People bitch.

 

[Flakster99]

I wonder when the Ratchet vs. Banjo screenshot comparisons will start.

Even though I do notice the similarities, I pity the fools who try.

The teaser trailer you released over a year ago suggested this game would be a conventional platformer. What changed?

The teaser trailer showed Spiral Mountain, a Jiggy, a note. I think it was kind of tongue in cheek, purposely done to make people think we were doing a hi-res version of Tooie. I still think we've done the right thing. It was time to do something different and with this generation of consoles it's allowed us to do that.

Heh. A deliberate cock tease. ;(

 

[Crushed]

When

1) They don't make sense

2) they're gimmick

3) They ruin the game

4) they don' add anything good and/or revoluionary to the gameplay.

5) It's not a straight-up port of an N64 game, the mechanics have been evolved

Choose.

5.

 

[~Devil Trigger~]

i not sure about what i see here

looks like RARE is experimenting, but...i dunno

 

[MisterHero]

Wow, Rare tries to take Banjo in a different direction, and look at the hate.

Y'know, you guys aren't fooling anybody, I know that if Banjo 3 had been revealed as more of the same N64 game, now in 3D, you guys would hate all over it and Rare.

No I wouldn't have. Even as a Nintey fanboy I've always felt that BK was the only game that could exceed Nintendo's own efforts (until Galaxy came along of course ).

I'm not attacking Rare or BK3, but like the surprise at the 'hate', I wonder why just because it 'changed' it needs so much defending/praise.

I loved the 1st N64 game (I never owned the 2nd one) and I have hopes for this one.

C'mon guys let's chill.

 

[Francias Castiglione]

What? Using Kazooie for a mid-air jump, doing simple jumps over obstacles, hopping along some flowers or rocks at a few points, the occasional backflip to reach high objects, that's not Mario-style platforming or acrobatics. Banjo could never wall-jump to the top of a castle or do a running gymnastic triple jump and dive.

Exactly, and I would bet that all the movement based moves are still in to help with the platforming elements (see that balance beam pic with Kazooie aiding with her wings spread.)

Do Banjo and Kazooie still have teamwork moves?
What we wanted to do was cut back on Banjo and Kazooie's teamwork moves, because for every move the characters had, it took away one of the reasons for people to build something. But we're going to play on it - that Kazooie's not happy at all about her moves being taken and will complain at every opportunity. But at least now she's got a wrench.

Cut back is not the same as gone entirely. Plus she gets to complain about it, which was always a hilarious element to the character.

 

[antiloop]

It looks fun.

I don't know why but reminds me about LBP in some ways.

 

[RiskyChris]

I mean damn it's a bunch of guys who can only make Mario-64 clones working on the shooterbox.

It's not a crime for a developer to make a slightly inferior game to M64. It's not even a waste of talent.

Rare is shining in lots of new areas. Could they not make this game as well as a "true" BK3?

I mean, they managed to make VP too.

Is the future of gaming a series of one-off genres with great games, but nothing alike?

 

[Loudninja]

The thing is, I don't think people would be as upset if the vehicles was not the main focus.

It seems Kazooie does not have her signature moves as well,I guess it just do not feel like a Banjo game to some people.

 

[GhaleonEB]

It looks fun.

Fun is over-rated.

 

[Crushed]

It's not a crime for a developer to make a slightly inferior game to M64. It's not even a waste of talent.

Rare is shining in lots of new areas. Could they not make this game as well as a "true" BK3?

I mean, they managed to make VP too.

Is the future of gaming a series of one-off genres with great games, but nothing alike?

They ARE making a true BK3. This is it. It's not a one-off. It's BK3.

 

[Opus Angelorum]

I mean damn it's a bunch of guys who can only make Mario-64 clones working on the shooterbox.

I've nothing against you, but that is straight up bullshit.

 

[FunkyMunkey]

Fuck you all. This is far from what I was expecting but it still looks fun as hell .

Can't wait.

 

[mellowbob]

the environments in those trailers seem so barren and lifeless...

mehh at these veichles (contraptions), I would have preferred a normal platformer that looked like the very first trailer they showed

 

[Odrion]

Cut back is not the same as gone entirely. Plus she gets to complain about it, which was always a hilarious element to the character.

Banjo Kazooie always had awesome self-referential humor.

 

[Diffense]

I think BK was different enough from M64 to stand on its own merit.
It's DK64 (also by Rare) that was made redundant by BK.
I think that's why conker had to go crazy.

 

[FabCam]

Wow, Rare tries to take Banjo in a different direction, and look at the hate.

Y'know, you guys aren't fooling anybody, I know that if Banjo 3 had been revealed as more of the same N64 game, now in 3D, you guys would hate all over it and Rare.

No we wouldn't. Look at what Insomniac did with Ratchet and Nintendo have done with Mario. They have stuck to the platforming genre but added to it and made it better and better with each game. Why Rare decided to take it into a totally different direction is strange to me.

 

[CrisKre]

ugh. NOOOOOOOOOO. thats not how to do a sequel to put BK back to top shape.

This looks like Blast Corps meets half assed BK references or something. I DO NOT like the direction this is heading. Ill reserve judgement till i can try it for myself, but damnit, i just wanted breathtaking environments and back to roots banjo gameplay. This seems like a disjointed amalgamation of styles that dont look good all together

That said some segments, especially the water areas, look graphically amazing.

 

[Crushed]

No we wouldn't. Look at what Insomniac did with Ratchet and Nintendo have done with Mario. They have stuck to the platforming genre but added to it and made it better and better with each game. Why Rare decided to take it into a totally different direction is strange to me.

Yeah, Ratchet is just the most platformy platformer of straight-up 3D acrobatics ever.

 

[Steroyd]

Wow, Rare tries to take Banjo in a different direction, and look at the hate.

Y'know, you guys aren't fooling anybody, I know that if Banjo 3 had been revealed as more of the same N64 game, now in 3D, you guys would hate all over it and Rare.

There were 2D BK games!?