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[BenjaminBirdie]

We're referring to DC's pictures that they put once and a while like that, which yes, are supposed to be symbolistic and hint at things. Not sure what Secret Invasion has to do with that really.

But yeah, this whole R.I.P. thing is turning into a clusterfuck. I do hope that picture is nothing but symbolism because having 7 Batmen running around is fucking stupid.

It's sad because RIP itself ended up fantastic this week. It should be in the same Absolute Edition as Final Crisis now.

 

[Lazy vs Crazy]

But yeah, this whole R.I.P. thing is turning into a clusterfuck. I do hope that picture is nothing but symbolism because having 7 Batmen running around is fucking stupid.

Worked with Superman!

 

[Skittleguy]

Worked with Superman!

I wonder if Battle for the Cowl will tie into Blackest Night, kinda like how Reign of the Supermen tied into Emerald Twilight?

Oh DC, you and your crossovers :lol

 

[BenjaminBirdie]

I wonder if Battle for the Cowl will tie into Blackest Night, kinda like how Reign of the Supermen tied into Emerald Twilight?

Oh DC, you and your crossovers :lol

The only thing that needs to crossover with Blackest Night from the Batman universe is Thomas and Martha Wayne with motherfucking power rings.

 

[ToyMachine228]

I don't think everyone in that teaser image is actually going to become Batman. I think this is just a teaser at everyone who's somehow involved with Battle for the Cowl. Hence the presence of Alfred and Harley. Here is who I think all of them are though...From left to right.

- Batman on the far left is Tim Drake currently Robin. The staff gives it away.
- Harley Quinn is there...Missing the Joker? Wherever he is. Last seen being ran off the bridge by Damian.
- Alfred will obviously be involved in the series. Tim and Dick are living in Wayne manor with Alfred.
- The Batman in the middle is Dick Grayson, currently Nightwing. Apparently that's the costume that Bruce wore when Dick became Robin.
- Next over is indeed Two-Face. It was said before that he would be involved in the Battle for the Cowl series.
- Batman with guns. To me that says Jason Todd.
- Batwoman, investigating something...
- Damian, Batman's son who I think will become Robin by the end of it all.
- And Hush. Yes, that is not Bruce Wayne, it is Hush who has had facial surgery to "become" Bruce Wayne. That's been his plan all along. The bandages around the leg that Damian is holding give it away.

So based on what I think, here's the characters that will actually be involved in the trying to take over as Batman...Dick Grayson, Tim Drake, and Jason Todd.

Other characters will be involved in the Battle for the Cowl series, but not seeking the mantle. Gordon, Catwoman, Batgirl, and Alfred.

Then there are the villains. Two-Face was last seen out of the Asylum, but had been hinting at "big plans" for him and Nightwing. Not sure if he'll actually try to become Batman. Seems far-fetched.

Hush, who's plan has always been to "become" Bruce Wayne. In Bruce's absence he will no doubt be able to pull it off, but will he also try to become Batman? I'm not so sure. Bruce Wayne may be enough for him.

Then Damian, who's not a villain obviously. But he is definitely going to be involved. Didio has said he's looking to inherit the Wayne family fortune. And has ALWAYS wanted to become Robin.

Then through in the Azrael, and Oracle mini-series...Also take note of the feminine looking hand coming out of the coffin that the supposed Jason Todd Batman is sitting on.

 

[BenjaminBirdie]

Good lord, what a mess.

 

[ZeoVGM]

Couldn't they take some notes from Brubaker and mak the transition to the "next" Batman really simple? There's no need for all this gimmicky shit. Cap is one of, if not the, best superhero book out because it doesn't play with this crap. Bucky became Cap, boom.

Just have Tim be Batman and there you go.

(And preferably have Tomasi write it.)

 

[DarienA]

Someone said that's how he looks in Trinity. I wouldn't know, as it's too shitty to buy weekly.

Oh I dropped that crap a long time ago.

I'm going to go with Jason Todd.

Good call and it fits. Thanks.

Because it's probably Hush.

Damn you 2 for 2!!!! I forgot he got the plastic surgery....

 

[ToyMachine228]

Tony Daniels, the author and artist of Battle for the Cowl talked about the teaser image and confirmed that the teaser image is just representational, not actually depicting anything that is going to happen in the series. So rest assured, there won't be four Batman's running around Gotham:lol

 

[Prime crotch]

Tony Daniels, the author and artist of Battle for the Cowl talked about the teaser image and confirmed that the teaser image is just representational, not actually depicting anything that is going to happen in the series. So rest assured, there won't be four Batman's running around Gotham:lol

awwww crud, I was kinda hyped for it

 

[ZeoVGM]

Tony Daniels, the author and artist of Battle for the Cowl talked about the teaser image and confirmed that the teaser image is just representational, not actually depicting anything that is going to happen in the series. So rest assured, there won't be four Batman's running around Gotham:lol

Thank.

Fucking.

GOD.

 

[LiveFromKyoto]

As it stands, RIP and Final Crisis are pretty airtight together.

Then I think there are some things you need to explain to me. As I recall it: Batman jumps on helicopter going after Hurt. Helicopter explodes, Bats disappears and every stands around saying "I will avenge your death." Later, Nightwing and Oracle in Detective are all gloomy that Bats is gone and Nightwing has to pick the slack and become all grim & stuff.

Meanwhile, Batman, apparently fine, shows up to a meeting at JLA HQ, performs an autopsy, then goes off and somehow winds up strapped into the lump device in Command-D.

I find there to be a disconnect or two in there. Unless Denny O'Neill's story is meant to be post Crisis, or unless Bats crawled out of the drink, grabbed some extra Bat gear and went off to FC without being noticed by any of his associates in Gotham, it doesn't make sense to me.

Thank.

Fucking.

GOD.

Don't worry. They're going to dumb the whole story down into super-simplistic terms. It'll just be a bunch of 2-page spreads of Nightwing with giant muscles punching guys, then he'll look at Highfather and say "LOL!" and punch him into the moon. Then he'll beat up Superman, Green Lantern and every Shazam character at the same time, and afterwards pick up Thor's hammer and start spinning it around while wanking off.

 

[Prime crotch]

Then I think there are some things you need to explain to me. As I recall it: Batman jumps on helicopter going after Hurt. Helicopter explodes, Bats disappears and every stands around saying "I will avenge your death." Later, Nightwing and Oracle in Detective are all gloomy that Bats is gone and Nightwing has to pick the slack and become all grim & stuff.

Meanwhile, Batman, apparently fine, shows up to a meeting at JLA HQ, performs an autopsy, then goes off and somehow winds up strapped into the lump device in Command-D.

I find there to be a disconnect or two in there. Unless Denny O'Neill's story is meant to be post Crisis, or unless Bats crawled out of the drink, grabbed some extra Bat gear and went off to FC without being noticed by any of his associates in Gotham, it doesn't make sense to me.

DC editorial screw-up? Kinda looks like it, because FC and RIP tie-in to each other pretty well while other RIP tie-ins don't.

 

[Blader]

I'm beginning to wonder if DC even has editors anymore.

 

[BenjaminBirdie]

Then I think there are some things you need to explain to me. As I recall it: Batman jumps on helicopter going after Hurt. Helicopter explodes, Bats disappears and every stands around saying "I will avenge your death." Later, Nightwing and Oracle in Detective are all gloomy that Bats is gone and Nightwing has to pick the slack and become all grim & stuff.

Meanwhile, Batman, apparently fine, shows up to a meeting at JLA HQ, performs an autopsy, then goes off and somehow winds up strapped into the lump device in Command-D.

I find there to be a disconnect or two in there. Unless Denny O'Neill's story is meant to be post Crisis, or unless Bats crawled out of the drink, grabbed some extra Bat gear and went off to FC without being noticed by any of his associates in Gotham, it doesn't make sense to me.

I'm ignoring anything Morrison doesn't write. He intended for certain things to shake out the way they will. Whatever Paul Dini or Denny O'Neill feel compelled to embellish and/or get wrong is kind of none of my concern.

 

[BenjaminBirdie]

I'm beginning to wonder if DC even has editors anymore.

You realize that without editors, none of the books you enjoy reading would even arrive every week. The last thing on their mind is what the handful of superfreaked obsessors about continuity are thinking, especially since they're the ones guaranteed to buy their books every month. It's kind of a swell gig. The loudest, most annoying section of their fanbase is the one that can be trusted to buy their books with the most reliability regardless of how much attention is paid to them.

 

[LiveFromKyoto]

DC editorial screw-up? Kinda looks like it, because FC and RIP tie-in to each other pretty well while other RIP tie-ins don't.

But even the end of RIP is "ZOMG he's dead I will avenge you kill every bad person in Gotham." I guess you could chalk that up to an honest mistake on the characters' part, but I think that's putting too much on the reader. Don't shine a floodlight on something as your grand conclusion and then expect us to afterwards mentally write in that it was just a misunderstanding and served no narrative purpose.

 

[Dead]

I'm ignoring anything Morrison doesn't write. He intended for certain things to shake out the way they will. Whatever Paul Dini or Denny O'Neill feel compelled to embellish and/or get wrong is kind of none of my concern.

Dinis run has been way more entertaining than Morrisons imo

 

[Splatt]

Then I think there are some things you need to explain to me. As I recall it: Batman jumps on helicopter going after Hurt. Helicopter explodes, Bats disappears and every stands around saying "I will avenge your death." Later, Nightwing and Oracle in Detective are all gloomy that Bats is gone and Nightwing has to pick the slack and become all grim & stuff.

Meanwhile, Batman, apparently fine, shows up to a meeting at JLA HQ, performs an autopsy, then goes off and somehow winds up strapped into the lump device in Command-D.

Ouch. My head hurts trying to figure out the timeline... better not to try :S

Don't worry. They're going to dumb the whole story down into super-simplistic terms. It'll just be a bunch of 2-page spreads of Nightwing with giant muscles punching guys, then he'll look at Highfather and say "LOL!" and punch him into the moon. Then he'll beat up Superman, Green Lantern and every Shazam character at the same time, and afterwards pick up Thor's hammer and start spinning it around while wanking off.

Drawn by Rob Liefeld.

More pouches!

 

[Prime crotch]

But even the end of RIP is "ZOMG he's dead I will avenge you kill every bad person in Gotham." I guess you could chalk that up to an honest mistake on the characters' part, but I think that's putting too much on the reader. Don't shine a floodlight on something as your grand conclusion and then expect us to afterwards mentally write in that it was just a misunderstanding and served no narrative purpose.

None of the characters actually said anything resembling that, the last thing you see of Bat-family is Nightwing holding Batsy's cowl.
What you're refering to seems more like the Outsiders's RIP tie-in.
As far as Morrison's story goes the FC events happen so close to RIP that I'm surprised Batman got time to shave. Heck even some FC tie-ins have some dodgy time-line stuff going on.

 

[Blader]

You realize that without editors, none of the books you enjoy reading would even arrive every week. The last thing on their mind is what the handful of superfreaked obsessors about continuity are thinking, especially since they're the ones guaranteed to buy their books every month. It's kind of a swell gig. The loudest, most annoying section of their fanbase is the one that can be trusted to buy their books with the most reliability regardless of how much attention is paid to them.

Well since the comics in question are RIP and Final Crisis, and neither of them have been released on time, maybe I'm onto something after all. :lol

 

[Sanjuro]

Dinis run has been way more entertaining than Morrisons imo

I agree with this, however his will be not be remembered as time passes.

Nothing against Morrison though, I'm glad to have two great Batman series ongoing at once.

Spoiler

Three if you count All Star Bats. Which is a throwaway but incredibly entertaining and over the top.

 

[ToyMachine228]

Grant Morrison has said several times that he never intended for there to be RIP tie-ins and whatnot. He knew there would be obviously, but he only worked out the time line for his own stuff, and other authors were left to do what they'd like. Morrison says that he has both RIP and Final Crisis' time lines planned down to the day, so just wait for it all to pan out and see what happens.

 

[BenjaminBirdie]

So, yeah, I think we can safely say that

Spoiler

Batman R.I.P. is officially over.

Speculators picked up the wrong comic today, man.

 

[borghe]

So, yeah, I think we can safely say that

Spoiler

Batman R.I.P. is officially over.

Speculators picked up the wrong comic today, man.

technically obama spidey is up to $35 on ebay right now... (fucking speculators)

regarding this though... it depends on how they handle it going forward. it can either be really well done

Spoiler

like cap or thor

or really poorly done

Spoiler

oh I don't know, pick a time any of the other major heroes has died for like 1-10 issues

 

[BenjaminBirdie]

technically obama spidey is up to $35 on ebay right now... (fucking speculators)

regarding this though... it depends on how they handle it going forward. it can either be really well done

Spoiler

like cap or thor

or really poorly done

Spoiler

oh I don't know, pick a time any of the other major heroes has died for like 1-10 issues

Uh. It's Batman.

And Spidey better go higher. Poppa needs an iPhone!

 

[borghe]

Uh. It's Batman.

Spoiler

and cap was arguably the second or third most recognized Marvel character with sales pre-#25 still in the top 10 or top 20 and they've left him dead. just saying.. DC could do something really awesome with this.. not saying it has to be Barry Allen awesome.. but it would be nice to see a company have the balls to keep their a-lister dead for more than just half a year.

 

[BenjaminBirdie]

Spoiler

and cap was arguably the second or third most recognized Marvel character with sales pre-#25 still in the top 10 or top 20 and they've left him dead. just saying.. DC could do something really awesome with this.. not saying it has to be Barry Allen awesome.. but it would be nice to see a company have the balls to keep their a-lister dead for more than just half a year.

DiDio has already hinted that it's at least a year of Superman, Batman, and WW in whatever state they are currently (space, etc).

 

[ToyMachine228]

Final Crisis #6 today! Can't wait to read it and hopefully get the "fate" for Batman that we we've all been waiting for.

 

[DarienA]

Final Crisis #6 today! Can't wait to read it and hopefully get the "fate" for Batman that we we've all been waiting for.

Here's a preview comment... incredibly lame.

 

[BenjaminBirdie]

Here's a preview comment... incredibly lame.

Here's an "I Read The Whole Thing" comment...

:O

 

[DarienA]

Here's an "I Read The Whole Thing" comment...

:O

Oh I read the whole thing... and I think its crap... I see no purpose for the character DC choose to do that to be Batman, nor do I see how RIP has any ties to Final Crisis.

Personally I'm not happy to see Bruce Wayne/Batman go in any shape form or fashion I love the Bruce Wayne/Batman character, but if he HAD to go, I'd rather it have been through R.I.P.'s just concluded storyline rather than the crap I just read in FC.

 

[BenjaminBirdie]

Oh I read the whole thing... and I think its crap... I see no purpose for the character DC choose to do that to be Batman, nor do I see how RIP has any ties to Final Crisis.

Personally I'm not happy to see Bruce Wayne/Batman go in any shape form or fashion I love the Bruce Wayne/Batman character, but if he HAD to go, I'd rather it have been through R.I.P.'s just concluded storyline rather than the crap I just read in FC.

But...I think he saved the universe....

That's....like....awesome...

 

[Sanjuro]

Read it last night. I liked it.

But still seeing that shot of Bats... =(

 

[Prime crotch]

This shit was epic, Morrison is the ultimate Bat-fanboy, move over Barry there's a new true hero in town.

 

[BenjaminBirdie]

This shit was epic, Morrison is the ultimate Bat-fanboy, move over Barry there's a new true hero in town.

Hi5. This is what I'm saying.

 

[Tamanon]

FYI, Morrison's JLA run had a kinda bizarree parallel meeting between the two, hehe.

http://pics.livejournal.com/psyjoe_dilandau/pic/0006d3ez

 

[DarienA]

But...I think he saved the universe....

That's....like....awesome...

Yeah but as I said in the other thread... that doesn't make his death as the character Batman mean anymore to me. Saving the universe is some metaphysical heroic act.... going out saving a specific person, or Gotham in a big way... that would make more sense for the death as the character Batman to me.

 

[Prime crotch]

Yeah but as I said in the other thread... that doesn't make his death as the character Batman mean anymore to me. Saving the universe is some metaphysical heroic act.... going out saving a specific person, or Gotham in a big way... that would make more sense for the death as the character Batman to me.

Well Gotham is inside the universe, but I get your point, basicly you like Batmn rooted on Gotham and not as much when he's out with his JL buddies.

 

[Sanjuro]

Well Gotham is inside the universe, but I get your point, basicly you like Batmn rooted on Gotham and not as much when he's out with his JL buddies.

I'm with this philosophy as well. I still really enjoyed the story however. Although I can't really imagine any of the villains taking him down at all.

 

[BenjaminBirdie]

Well Gotham is inside the universe, but I get your point, basicly you like Batmn rooted on Gotham and not as much when he's out with his JL buddies.

That's what I liked about Moz's take on him, and why RIP is central to this when taken as a whole. Whether its Darkseid, the Joker, alien metaphysics or whatever, it's all just a case to Bruce Wayne.

 

[DarienA]

Well Gotham is inside the universe, but I get your point, basicly you like Batmn rooted on Gotham and not as much when he's out with his JL buddies.

Yeah that's a good way to put it. I couldn't figure out how to word it... but to flesh it out a bit more, I like Batman with the JLA, but he's rarely in FRONT of JLA if that makes sense... sure he's in the fights, etc... but he's usually the thinker that comes up with the plan that the full group implements... the death just reads strangely to me...

That's what I liked about Moz's take on him, and why RIP is central to this when taken as a whole. Whether its Darkseid, the Joker, alien metaphysics or whatever, it's all just a case to Bruce Wayne.

and with that said RIP would have been a better death IMO.

But now I've gone cross-eyed again... what's the timeline connection between RIP and the events in FC? He goes missing he comes back, he dies in FC?

 

[Snaku]

So I have to read Final Crisis to get he real end of RIP?

 

[BenjaminBirdie]

But now I've gone cross-eyed again... what's the timeline connection between RIP and the events in FC? He goes missing he comes back, he dies in FC?

Yeah.

 

[Tamanon]

So I have to read Final Crisis to get he real end of RIP?

Nope, not at all.

Although I could've done without one scene. FC spoilers:

Spoiler

The page of Superman emerging with Batman's body. I would've rather people thought he disappeared in the helicopter crash and then not even known about him saving the universe

 

[DarienA]

Yeah.

Well then what was going on in Gotham from the End of RIP to his reappearance in the FC series?

I guess I'm wondering when the Batman books(including Battle of the Cowl, etc) and the rest of the DCU will catch up to FC.

DC timeline makes me cross-eyed.

 

[Prime crotch]

Yeah that's a good way to put it. I couldn't figure out how to word it... but to flesh it out a bit more, I like Batman with the JLA, but he's rarely in FRONT of JLA if that makes sense... sure he's in the fights, etc... but he's usually the thinker that comes up with the plan that the full group implements... the death just reads strangely to me...



and with that said RIP would have been a better death IMO.

I don't think RIP was about Batman actually dying, if anything it was about how Batman always overcomes his obstacles and heck in RIP he was attacked in all fronts. I guess you could say that Morrison's run was to accentuate Batman's identity before his big sacrifice, the paralel to Barry's and Supergirl's previous deaths seems pretty clear.
I'm still too damn excited with the book though, not just Batman's sacrifice, I mean you cannot read the book and take just that, stuff was happening at such an incredible pace that to simply talking about it's big event is diminishing it's mertis.

Well then what was going on in Gotham from the End of RIP to his reappearance in the FC series?

I guess I'm wondering when the Batman books(including Battle of the Cowl, etc) and the rest of the DCU will catch up to FC.

DC timeline makes me cross-eyed.

FC happens literaly a couple of hours after RIP

 

[BenjaminBirdie]

I don't think RIP was about Batman actually dying, if anything it was about how Batman always overcomes his obstacles and heck in RIP he was attacked in all fronts. I guess you could say that Morrison's run was to accentuate Batman's identity before his big sacrifice, the paralel to Barry's and Supergirl's previous deaths seems pretty clear.

I'm still too damn excited with the book though, not just Batman's sacrifice, I mean you cannot read the book and take just that, stuff was happening at such an incredible pace that to simply talking about it's big event is diminishing it's mertis.

Seriously! Talking fucking Tawny!

Also, those who have read Mister Miracle can see how this will all play out anyway. It's the same Death Trap (The Omega Sanction) that Dark Side pulled on Shilo Norman.

And I agree about RIP, especially considering they were written by the same guy. They were absolutely meant to be read in concert with each other, with RIP being the ultimate encapsulation of the casebook that is his career as Batman and Final Crisis being his ultimate act of heroism, especially considering what it involves him doing.

 

[Tamanon]

I wonder if RIP had a second meaning about the nature of Batman. And how he can ultimately rest in peace....

 

[LiveFromKyoto]

Yeah but as I said in the other thread... that doesn't make his death as the character Batman mean anymore to me. Saving the universe is some metaphysical heroic act.... going out saving a specific person, or Gotham in a big way... that would make more sense for the death as the character Batman to me.

Dude. He's the God-damned Batman.

Spoiler

Murdering motherfucking Darkseid while getting Omega Sanctioned is like the craziest fucking way you can go out in comics. He went out as badass world saving Justice League Batman, that is in no way less true to who he's been as a character.

Also, Superman going apeshit after was so awesome.