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[Ms.Galaxy]

It should be a civic duty but it is not, otherwise everyone would already have been automatically registered without exceptions, there would be an election day, and there would be less money involved. We are trying to get there, but currently this is not the case and the people you are claiming are not doing their duty still are. Duty do not mean "pick the candidate that will win", it is "pick the candidate that best defines you and the goal you want for the country." This is regardless of the candidate's chance of winning, that is what the party is for, to establish candidates that can win majority of the people's vote through their policies.

I don't know why you fear his election, only way he wins is if a dramatic amount of democrats do not show up for voting and this is the party's fault more-so than the voters.

Listen all that this is about is respect one another's choice, so long as it isn't an extreme choice *cough*Trumpvoter*cough* that completely disregards all the facts. This is about U.S election, it is very likely you won't change their mind by going about being a condescending prick basically, unless that isn't even your goal.

I'm going to make this clear, once again, and listen to it bluntly. I will not respect people who choose not to vote and sit at home while someone is running under a fascist and bigoted platform, nor will I respect them for voting foolishly on a 3rd party under a naive thinking of "protest".

I have plenty to fear, my life is always in the hand of the majority because I'm already a heavily oppressed minority (trans), to see people squabble and screaming "Bernie or Bust" over some of the most unintelligent, petty, and downright bizarre conspiracy theories that have been proven time and time again to be false is terrifying and anger inducing.

And ultimately, I'm tired of the mentality of "lol, I vote who I want", like this is a fucking game. I'm not entertaining these mentalities anymore after I've seen my own mother cry in fear of another Salazar type being in power, something she and the rest of my family from her side felt hard, nor will I entertain it after seeing how Trump's rise of power has made bigotry out of the closet and the norm to a lot of people.

I also hate the mentality that a vote should only go to what you think is best, what best represents you. It's the most selfish mentality one can have. You should vote for what will help everyone, what is best for everyone. You have that power, but you decided to use it for selfish wants and needs. I do not have that luxury, nor will I ever if this current climate continues, it's something I can't risk when the lives of myself and so many others that I have met, worked with, and befriended are on the line.

I'm not going to be a condescending prick, but I want you and others to know the true reality of things, of how this effects everyone else that maybe you'll never meet. What you do is your choice, I won't call you anything nor will I hate you, but I will not respect you if you sit in home and do nothing, or vote 3rd party under "protest".

 

[eBay Huckster]

so, like, can we start sharing the policies we like that are in Clinton's platform to maybe try and convince certain other people to stay open-minded, or is positivity a thing that's not allowed ITT for everyone but me?

 

[SneakersSO]

So you want your primary vote to be respected but you don't respect the votes of the majority who disagreed. Now you hold your GE vote hostage because you didn't get your way. Grow up.

And yet, she was never entitled to my GE vote. Many people have loudly, actively said they wouldn't be voting for her.

There is some mandate that says we HAVE to vote for our party's nominee? Nah, not at all.
If others felt as strongly about it were the shoe on the other foot, I'd understand.

It's not a hostage situation - me voting for her is never going to happen. It doesn't have to be Bernie on the Democratic ballot in order for me to vote Democrat for POTUS - it has to be anyone BUT HRC. It isn't, and the lead up to electing a nominee has only solidified my own personal reasons as to why I feel the way I feel.

She won the nomination, and last I checked her voter turnout in that process is higher than Trump's, so theoretically she should have no problem winning without asking me to do something I refuse to bring myself to do.

Except it didn't happen. Are you going to keep living in February or do you care to join us in the present day?

You're right, it didn't happen; that is the present. And nothing that was said then has changed. She'll have no problem winning, she just has to do it without votes from people who don't want her as their candidate. Last I checked, this shouldn't be too hard for her.

If she loses , it will be due to her own actions, not anyone elses.

 

[Ms.Galaxy]

so, like, can we start sharing the policies we like that are in Clinton's platform to maybe try and convince certain other people to stay open-minded, or is positivity a thing that's not allowed ITT for everyone but me?

What's there to say, to be honest? Clinton's entire platform is out in the open, there's nothing that hasn't been discussed over her actual policies. It's not her platform or policies that's the issue with these Bernie or Bust people, it's the person behind it.

 

[eBay Huckster]

basically i'm unrealistically optimistic that with enough hammering in that it's the policy template we're gonna get regardless of whether they actually trust her, at least someone is going to buy in

(but then i'm also overestimating how many people aren't considering voting for her, so, like, probably not worth all that effort for just GAF)

e: but mostly i just wanna see people in the habit of positively promoting clinton's candidacy rather than sticking to "she's not Trump" as the go-to circular argument

 

[The Adder]

There is some mandate that says we HAVE to vote for our party's nominee? Nah, not at all.
If others felt as strongly about it were the shoe on the other foot, I'd understand.

Point me to three examples of a Hilary voters saying they wouldn't vote for Bernie if he won.

 

[cdyhybrid]

And yet, she was never entitled to my GE vote. Many people have loudly, actively said they wouldn't be voting for her.

There is some mandate that says we HAVE to vote for our party's nominee? Nah, not at all.
If others felt as strongly about it were the shoe on the other foot, I'd understand.

It's not a hostage situation - me voting for her is never going to happen. It doesn't have to be Bernie on the Democratic ballot in order for me to vote Democrat for POTUS - it has to be anyone BUT HRC. It isn't, and the lead up to electing a nominee has only solidified my own personal reasons as to why I feel the way I feel.

She won the nomination, and last I checked her voter turnout in that process is higher than Trump's, so theoretically she should have no problem winning without asking me to do something I refuse to bring myself to do.

No one is saying you HAVE TO vote for anyone. But people that refuse to vote want to be treated like someone who did. If you don't want to vote and don't give a fuck about the consequences of that, fine. You need to own it, that's all.

Don't say I should respect you and your political views when you refuse to help defeat the candidate that would shit all over the quality of life for every disenfranchised group of people in this country.

 

[The Adder]

No one is saying you HAVE TO vote for anyone. But people that refuse to vote want to be treated like someone who did. If you don't want to vote and don't give a fuck about the consequences of that, fine. You need to own it, that's all.

Don't say I should respect you and your political views when you refuse to help defeat the candidate that would shit all over the quality of life for every disenfranchised group of people in this country.

Bingo.

You can't have it both ways.

You vote however you like. No one has to respect you, or speak respectfully of you, for doing it.

As far as I'm concerned? You're no better than a Trump voter.

 

[SneakersSO]

Point me to three examples of a Hilary voters saying they wouldn't vote for Bernie if he won.

I'm not saying there were or that I'd seen it - I'm saying if people felt as strongly against Bernie as some do within the Democratic party about HRC, then I understand why they would choose not to vote for him.

The same thing is happening among Republicans and Trump. Tons of GOP supporters have been loudly shouting Never Trump for over a year, and they won't be voting for him come November.

 

[The Adder]

I'm not saying there were or that I'd seen it - I'm saying if people felt as strongly against Bernie as some do within the Democratic party about HRC, then I understand why they would choose not to vote for him.

And I'd be telling them to fuck off too.

 

[Ms.Galaxy]

basically i'm unrealistically optimistic that with enough hammering in that it's the policy template we're gonna get regardless of whether they actually trust her, at least someone is going to buy in

(but then i'm also overestimating how many people aren't considering voting for her, so, like, probably not worth all that effort for just GAF)

e: but mostly i just wanna see people in the habit of positively promoting clinton's candidacy rather than sticking to "she's not Trump" as the go-to circular argument

I want that too, to be honest. And I'll gladly promote what she stands for and what her platform is whenever I can if someone is genuinely curious. But other people just do not want to vote for her because of her, not her policies.

 

[MIMIC]

No one is saying you HAVE TO vote for anyone. But people that refuse to vote want to be treated like someone who did. If you don't want to vote and don't give a fuck about the consequences of that, fine. You need to own it, that's all.

Don't say I should respect you and your political views when you refuse to help defeat the candidate that would shit all over the quality of life for every disenfranchised group of people in this country.

It's funny how everywhere on this forum, you'll hear that the odds of a Trump presidency are slim to none, but as soon as someone dares to withhold their vote from Hillary, you get fear mongering about the dark days under a Trump presidency.

 

[SneakersSO]

No one is saying you HAVE TO vote for anyone. But people that refuse to vote want to be treated like someone who did. If you don't want to vote and don't give a fuck about the consequences of that, fine. You need to own it, that's all.

Don't say I should respect you and your political views when you refuse to help defeat the candidate that would shit all over the quality of life for every disenfranchised group of people in this country.

Who says you should be respecting my political views on anything? We're strangers on the internet. Heck, platform positions isn't even being brought up. Double Heck, I agree with almost all of HRC's platform positions. It's not the positions I'm against, it's the candidate.

And yes, I will be voting. It's too important not to vote. I just won't be voting for her. I'll be down ticket voting, and either skipping on my POTUS selection, or picking a 3rd party or fill-in candidate.

 

[Nickle]

I'm going to make this clear, once again, and listen to it bluntly. I will not respect people who choose not to vote and sit at home while someone is running under a fascist and bigoted platform, nor will I respect them for voting foolishly on a 3rd party under a naive thinking of "protest".

I have plenty to fear, my life is always in the hand of the majority because I'm already a heavily oppressed minority (trans), to see people squabble and screaming "Bernie or Bust" over some of the most unintelligent, petty, and downright bizarre conspiracy theories that have been proven time and time again to be false is terrifying and anger inducing.

And ultimately, I'm tired of the mentality of "lol, I vote who I want", like this is a fucking game. I'm not entertaining these mentalities anymore after I've seen my own mother cry in fear of another Salazar type being in power, something she and the rest of my family from her side felt hard, nor will I entertain it after seeing how Trump's rise of power has made bigotry out of the closet and the norm to a lot of people.

I also hate the mentality that a vote should only go to what you think is best, what best represents you. It's the most selfish mentality one can have. You should vote for what will help everyone, what is best for everyone. You have that power, but you decided to use it for selfish wants and needs. I do not have that luxury, nor will I ever if this current climate continues, it's something I can't risk when the lives of myself and so many others that I have met, worked with, and befriended are on the line.

I'm not going to be a condescending prick, but I want you and others to know the true reality of things, of how this effects everyone else that maybe you'll never met. What you do is your choice, I won't call you anything nor will I hate you, but I will not respect you.

It's good that you want people to vote for the candidate that helps your community the most. However, maybe you should (also) be critical of Hilary Clinton's campaign for not doing more to appeal to liberals and independents who don't want to vote for Clinton. It may be selfish to abstain from voting for Clinton, but it's also selfish for the Clinton campaign to not try to appeal to more voters.

 

[cdyhybrid]

I want that too, to be honest. And I'll gladly promote what she stands for and what her platform is whenever I can if someone is genuinely curious. But other people just do not want to vote for her because of her, not her policies.

Yep. Policy has been brought up already in this thread and in many others. It's freely available to anyone that gives a single fuck about it, it's only a simple Google search away.

This thread is about people who don't care about policy. Any Bernie supporters that actually, legitimately cared about the policy he wanted to implement are already supporting Hillary, because that's the best way for it to happen. That's why Bernie himself is supporting Hillary.

It's funny how everywhere on this forum, you'll hear that the odds of a Trump presidency are slim to none, but as soon as someone dares to withhold their vote from Hillary, you get fear mongering about the dark days under a Trump presidency.

Hillary is still favored. I'd just rather not 1) leave it up to chance, and 2) leave any semblance of the notion that Trump's views are acceptable to the majority of the people of this country. He needs to lose and he needs to lose badly.

Who says you should be respecting my political views on anything? We're strangers on the internet. Heck, platform positions isn't even being brought up. Double Heck, I agree with almost all of HRC's platform positions. It's not the positions I'm against, it's the candidate.

And yes, I will be voting. It's too important not to vote. I just won't be voting for her. I'll be down ticket voting, and either skipping on my POTUS selection, or picking a 3rd party or fill-in candidate.

The amount of cognitive dissonance in this post is astounding. Candidates are their policy. You are supposed to elect candidates because of their policy. You are letting your hurt feelings/conspiracy theories/whatever get in the way of helping enact actual policy that will push the country towards your ideal.

It makes zero sense.

 

[Ms.Galaxy]

It's good that you want people to vote for the candidate that helps your community the most. However, maybe you should (also) be critical of Hilary Clinton's campaign for not doing more to appeal to liberals and independents who don't want to vote for Clinton. It may be selfish to abstain from voting for Clinton, but it's also selfish for the Clinton campaign to not try to appeal to more voters.

I've mentioned that earlier.

We need to prevent Trump from ever touching the white house, that's what we can do for our country, for what it stands for, and since Clinton is the only clear path to prevent Trump, we may criticize her, we may push her to the left, we may hold her feet to the fire to make sure she sticks to her progressive policies, but in the end, we must get her in that house in order to stop Trump.

I'm all for pushing her to go left and maintain those promises. I have nothing against that. I think Bernie did a great job on that remark and now we have the most progressive party platform in history because of negotiations between the two.

It's funny how everywhere on this forum, you'll hear that the odds of a Trump presidency are slim to none, but as soon as someone dares to withhold their vote from Hillary, you get fear mongering about the dark days under a Trump presidency.

He has a chance, and I do not want to risk it happening

 

[The Adder]

It's funny how everywhere on this forum, you'll hear that the odds of a Trump presidency are slim to none, but as soon as someone dares to withhold their vote from Hillary, you get fear mongering about the dark days under a Trump presidency.

If I put a bullet into a gun with 1,000 chambers and a chamber was selected at random, would you be okay with someone pointing it at you and pulling the trigger?

Trump's chances are better than that.

 

[eBay Huckster]

However, maybe you should (also) be critical of Hilary Clinton's campaign for not doing more to appeal to liberals and independents who don't want to vote for Clinton.

any other fucking person would not be chastised for doing everything short of literally prostrating herself in front of a large crowd of "undecided voters" to appeal to them like the clinton campaign actually has by exposing its right flank in an attempt to win the left over

campaigns do not adopt platforms and policy as a vanity project, they adopt them to fucking implement them on the grounds that a) they personally believe in them to at least some extent and b) they will lose the next election if they don't

 

[Nickle]

I've mentioned that earlier.



I'm all for pressuring her to go left and maintain those promises. I have nothing against that.

My apologies, though there are many others on this forum who are very resistant to any outside influence on Clinton's campaign.

 

[Bam Bam Baklava]

It's funny how everywhere on this forum, you'll hear that the odds of a Trump presidency are slim to none, but as soon as someone dares to withhold their vote from Hillary, you get fear mongering about the dark days under a Trump presidency.

His odds are shockingly good right now, that's why I'm personally pleading to anyone who will listen.

 

[The Adder]

Now that you've read this:

If I put a bullet into a gun with 1,000 chambers and a chamber was selected at random, would you be okay with someone pointing it at you and pulling the trigger?

Trump's chances are better than that.

And are already formulating your bullshit "Well of course I would" post.

10 chambers. 3 Bullets.

Still willing?

Because Trump's chances are still slightly better than that.

 

[jack_package_200]

one is an upgrade, the other is a downgrade

Way to not answer his question

 

[The Adder]

one is an upgrade, the other is a downgrade

To you.

 

[Nickle]

any other fucking person would not be chastised for doing everything short of literally prostrating herself in front of a large crowd of "undecided voters" to appeal to them like the clinton campaign actually has by exposing its right flank in an attempt to win the left over

campaigns do not adopt platforms and policy as a vanity project, they adopt them to fucking implement them on the grounds that a) they personally believe in them to at least some extent and b) they will lose the next election if they don't

Most people don't have a huge problem with Hilary's policies, it's that they think that she isn't trustworthy. Regardless of whether this is true or not, that's what a lot of people believe. Her campaign needs to do a far better job of convincing people that she genuinely cares about the issues she talks about.

 

[Ms.Galaxy]

Most people don't have a huge problem with Hilary's policies, it's that they think that she isn't trustworthy. Regardless of whether this is true or not, that's what a lot of people believe. Her campaign needs to do a far better job of convincing people that she genuinely cares about the issues she talks about.

Well, if it makes people who have a cynical view of this feel better, Clinton will run to be reelected in 2020 should she win this. It'll look really bad if she doesn't follow through with at least a good chunk of her platform.

 

[Clefargle]

It's funny how everywhere on this forum, you'll hear that the odds of a Trump presidency are slim to none, but as soon as someone dares to withhold their vote from Hillary, you get fear mongering about the dark days under a Trump presidency.

It's funny how people misuse "fear mongering" when they are talking about something terrifying. Like, if it actually is something worth fearing, it's not fear mongering. Just like calling someone justified in defending their country from invasion couldn't be called a "war monger".

 

[NEO0MJ]

I'm going to make this clear, once again, and listen to it bluntly. I will not respect people who choose not to vote and sit at home while someone is running under a fascist and bigoted platform, nor will I respect them for voting foolishly on a 3rd party under a naive thinking of "protest".

Something people should take into consideration is that aside from complacency one of the reasons the Brexit voters won is that there were a number of protest voters who chose Brexit not because they believed in it but because they were angry with the government and confident that Stay would win. And when you look at the end result and see just how small the difference was you can't help but wonder if they might have helped turn it around.

 

[ArjanN]

Now that you've read this:





And are already formulating your bullshit "Well of course I would" post.

10 chambers. 3 Bullets.

Still willing?

Because Trump's chances are still slightly better than that.

Nah, I think the 1 in 1000 example is actually pretty close.

 

[eBay Huckster]

Most people don't have a huge problem with Hilary's policies, it's that they think that she isn't trustworthy.

and they tend to think she isn't trustworthy because of all manners of nebulous bullshit that they can never seem to explain beyond "there's just something about her"

so, like, neat, she has to work harder to win these people over when even they can't tell anyone why, and this somehow doesn't apply to any other national politician

 

[Clefargle]

and they tend to think she isn't trustworthy because of all manners of nebulous bullshit that they can never seem to explain beyond "there's just something about her"

Invariably the word "feel" is somewhere in most explanations

 

[MIMIC]

and they tend to think she isn't trustworthy because of all manners of nebulous bullshit that they can never seem to explain beyond "there's just something about her"

She managed to get investigated by the FBI while running for President. That's quite a feat.

 

[eBay Huckster]

i was the subject of an investigation once (and very obviously got cleared), i guess that means no one should ever hire me

 

[Ms.Galaxy]

i was the subject of an investigation once, i guess that means no one should ever hire me

I was investigated by the FBI and Homeland Security two years ago, would explain 100% why I can't get a job.

(The accusations were a load of crock and I'm glad we settled it with an hour long talk. Love that I was temporarily in the no fly list for awhile though.)

 

[BouncyFrag]

She managed to get investigated by the FBI while running for President. That's quite a feat.

...which led to these findings:
FBI director refutes Hillary Clinton's statements about her emails.

 

[WhateverItTakes]

'Fear-mongering' as a response to statements you see as negative is weak. You're essentially complaining someone is pointing out the potential consequences to your actions. Either refute them logically or say you're willing to take those risks, don't whine that someone is strengthening a their side in a debate.

I'm also British, and let me tell you that in recent experience, 'fear-mongering' has shown to be pretty goddamn prophetic.

Only ever make a choice where you can accept the outcomes in which your choice made possible.

 

[Foolworm]

I'm gonna tell you guys something.

'Fear-mongering' as a response to statements you see as negative is weak. You're essentially complaining someone is pointing out the potential consequences to your actions. Either refute them logically or say you're willing to take those risks, don't whine that someone is strengthening a their side in a debate.

I'm also British, and let me tell you that in recent experience, 'fear-mongering' has shown to be pretty goddamn prophetic.

Only ever make a choice where you can accept the outcomes in which your choice made possible.

Agreed, so much.

To those third party voters, I'm alright if you genuinely believe that your vote will propel said party into office. That's in keeping with the spirit of democracy and I applaud that no matter how slim the chance.

However, don't fucking tell me you're abstaining or voting third party as some sort of protest. By that, you don't signal your dissatisfaction with both parties - it signifies your willingness to live with either. If you really aren't happy, pack up and leave the US.

 

[Ponn]

Our actions and inaction has ethical and moral consequences, not sure your point?

If you eat chic-fil-a(and I occasionally do) you are in fact contributing to the pocket books of an anti-gay company. You just are.

But the consequence of that pales in comparison to that of throwing a vote away in a potential swing state in an election with such direct consequences like stacking a supreme Court for possiblly a generation and giving a possible totalitarian figure a likely rubber stamp Congress and Supreme Court.

My point is people are going to the extreme of outright calling non-voters/third party voters bigots/helping Trump in the name of ethics and moral consequences yet will inevitably turn a blind eye to their own choices or downplay them. I brought up Chick-fil-a because its one of my pet peeves seeing people who otherwise claim to be for gay rights and supporters yet can't give up a fucking sandwich to hold to their convictions. Saying that support pales in comparison is a way of making oneself feel better about your decision. Those profits go to Republican donations, numbering in the millions, inevitably which will be going to helping Trump's campaign. You literally donate to Republicans when you buy a chick fil a sandwich, think about that. People will try to rationalize it as being insignificant but then people will turn around and condemn abstainers/third party voters for using the same rationale.

I guess my point is before raining judgment down on others check to make sure your own shit doesn't stink. Maybe try to listen to those that are disfranchised with your candidate and not shut them down. Maybe actually listen to your candidate about building bridges and not walls. Oh and I never said I wasn't voting for Hillary, personally I always preferred her stronger stance on gun control.

 

[gutter_trash]

If only we had nominated someone that wasn't Hillary Clinton. We had ample opportunity, and plenty of people made it well known that this is what they'd be doing should she get the nomination.

yeah okay, he would have gotten Michael Dukakissed

 

[LiveFromKyoto]

And ultimately, I'm tired of the mentality of "lol, I vote who I want"

I also hate the mentality that a vote should only go to what you think is best, what best represents you.

Democracy. The word you're looking for for the thing you hate is "democracy."

 

[tanooki27]

trustworthy? frankly I'm sure she'll line her family's pockets. But she'll get the sausage made.

I believe Clinton loves America. I can see it in her obstinacy. the job will get done, and she'll use whatever tools available to do so

 

[Ambient80]

So are we actually seeing 35-50k people protesting? Just wondering what the real number is.

 

[BronsonLee]

So are we actually seeing 35-50k people protesting? Just wondering what the real number is.

12

 

[lastflowers]

Agreed, so much.

To those third party voters, I'm alright if you genuinely believe that your vote will propel said party into office. That's in keeping with the spirit of democracy and I applaud that no matter how slim the chance.

However, don't fucking tell me you're abstaining or voting third party as some sort of protest. By that, you don't signal your dissatisfaction with both parties - it signifies your willingness to live with either. If you really aren't happy, pack up and leave the US.

Americans are so great sometimes.

 

[Korigama]

12

With more food trucks than actual protesters.

 

[effzee]

I still don't get why people dislike her so strongly. Most of the stuff she gets blamed for was either done by her husband, for a war she supported but is ultimately the fault of Bush and the faulty evidence they fabricated, and Obama's decisions in Syria and Libya.

Now we can hold her beliefs in those situations against her and be critical. But the level of hate and blame for those events attached to her is ridiculous.

 

[Ron Mexico]

12

There were almost 13.

True story-- I take the train from South Jersey to Philly every day for work. This morning there was a protester, complete with sign and that clear sense of rage in his eyes.

He was missing something though.

$2.60 for the train.

Apparently, righteousness alone isn't enough to get on board. Fucking PATCO.

I lol'd.

 

[Jonm1010]

My point is people are going to the extreme of outright calling non-voters/third party voters bigots/helping Trump in the name of ethics and moral consequences yet will inevitably turn a blind eye to their own choices or downplay them. I brought up Chick-fil-a because its one of my pet peeves seeing people who otherwise claim to be for gay rights and supporters yet can't give up a fucking sandwich to hold to their convictions. Saying that support pales in comparison is a way of making oneself feel better about your decision. Those profits go to Republican donations, numbering in the millions, inevitably which will be going to helping Trump's campaign. You literally donate to Republicans when you buy a chick fil a sandwich, think about that. People will try to rationalize it as being insignificant but then people will turn around and condemn abstainers/third party voters for using the same rationale.

I guess my point is before raining judgment down on others check to make sure your own shit doesn't stink. Maybe try to listen to those that are disfranchised with your candidate and not shut them down. Maybe actually listen to your candidate about building bridges and not walls. Oh and I never said I wasn't voting for Hillary, personally I always preferred her stronger stance on gun control.

You are trying to conflate a chic fil a sandwich to directly contributing to a bigot holding the highest office in the nation.

On a scale of personal ethical compromises it is like comparing a 1 to a 10. Where with one of the decisions it can easily be offset and more by comparative actions. An abstain or third party vote literally does nothing but harm. And you can't undue a Trump election.

So yes, both actions can be judged but one is a much more problematic, consequential and harmful choice.

 

[Liberty4all]

Is Hillary really favoured still? CNN is putting Trump ahead of Hillary by 5 points in the polls once you include third party candidates.

http://www.cnn.com/2016/07/25/politics/donald-trump-hillary-clinton-poll/index.html

 

[Ponn]

Our actions and inaction has ethical and moral consequences, not sure your point?

If you eat chic-fil-a(and I occasionally do) you are in fact contributing to the pocket books of an anti-gay company. You just are.

But the consequence of that pales in comparison to that of throwing a vote away in a potential swing state in an election with such direct consequences like stacking a supreme Court for possiblly a generation and giving a possible totalitarian figure a likely rubber stamp Congress and Supreme Court.

You are trying to conflate a chic fil a sandwich to directly contributing to a bigot holding the highest office in the nation.

On a scale of personal ethical compromises it is like comparing a 1 to a 10. Where with one of the decisions it can easily be offset and more by comparative actions. An abstain or third party vote literally does nothing but harm. And you can't undue a Trump election.

So yes, both actions can be judged but one is a much more problematic, consequential and harmful choice.

One is directly contributing to a bigoted campaign. Rationalize it however you wish to enjoy your sandwich.

 

[Jonm1010]

One is directly contributing to a bigoted campaign. Rationalize it however you wish to enjoy your sandwich.

There is not rationalizing. You wanted to make the comparison so we are doing so.

No on can live and honestly say their slate is clean of all ethical comprises. Not gonna happen.

But you get one vote, just one. No do overs, no take backsies. To conflate the ethical consequence of that with a $4 sandwhich to eat is a gross conflation. Not even in the same ball park. Especielly if you live in a swing state.