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Berserk |OT| - Big men, bigger swords, OFF THE BOAT - Berserk #344 24/6/2016
- Thread starter EvilKatarn
- Start date
Coriolanus
Banned
Hmm, not Just that. Serpico's role is also to take care of the group when Shit Gets Real, since Guts will usually be too busy handling apostles. Without him, his action range would be severely constrained.
But yeah, he's mainly there for variety.
I'm expecting every character gets some serious progress in Elfhelm on all fronts. I expect Serpico to be throwing storms at armies with his sword by the time they are heading back to Midland.
I wonder how Isidoro will end up, what could be his end game? For some reason I imagine the manga ending with Isidoro as an old man retelling the story of Guts.
CrazyDiamond
Member
I want Casca to teach Isidro some sword moves sense her fighting style would suit him better than Guts'.
Sibersk Esto
Banned
People who view Guts current party as "too shounen" (their words) or usually the same sort of people who define the Golden Age arc with the eclipse.
Like, it's understandable that you would think that way, but you're wrong.
Like, it's understandable that you would think that way, but you're wrong.
CrazyDiamond
Member
Judeau, Corkus and Pippin weren't a third as developed as Serpico, Farnese, Isidro and Schierke.
One thing I noticed on a re-read is how the manga implicitly compares and contrasts Guts and Griffith. It's never explicitly stated but like Guts seems to draw companions and inspires confidence in much the same way Griffith did like how Farnese views Guts the same way that Casca viewed Griffith or how Guts could put his companions' minds at ease with a gesture or a couple of words. Guts seems to be just as charismatic as Griffith if not more so since even Griffith kinda gut suckered in by said charisma. Like when Guts was gonna leave the Falcons again he had an entire unit of Falcons basically beg to go with him and that was before the rest of the Falcons even knew that Griffith's injuries were permanent and debilitating.
Coriolanus
Banned
Tbf i'm more interested in seeing what will become of Zodd. His main challenger has been shown to be the Skull Knight, but much like with Guts, there doesn't seem to be a genuine desire to get rid of SK in there.
Plus with all that bit about his choice on where to stand and his respect for Guts, wouldn't surprise me if Miura decided to use him for something other than a Bigass Final Battle.
Plus with all that bit about his choice on where to stand and his respect for Guts, wouldn't surprise me if Miura decided to use him for something other than a Bigass Final Battle.
As many as it takes.
Berserk Volumes 1, 2 & 3
I hope you keep doing these.
JadedWriter
Member
I stand firmly with the opinion that Griffith wanted to sleep with Guts. Sex is a bit of a domination play for Griffith and it's been confirmed that Griffith isn't above sleeping with a dude
Oh shit, I never considered that parallel before.
There was even a conflict between Serpico and Guts that was used to determine whether Serpico stayed with the group, with Serpico having many parallels to Griffith.
JadedWriter
Member
I'd like to think Serpico wasn't as egotistical as Griffith. Seemed to think about his fights more. Griffith got through his fights on Griffith swag Serpico actually really did think his shit through.
The point of making a parallel is to find where the perpendiculars are.
Serpico, in this case, takes the role of Guts rather than Griffith, but he joins out of true friendship. One of the reasons that it's hard to articulate the feelings Griffith had toward Guts is because they were part genuine friendship and part ownership. With Serpico, it's just friendship with some concern over Gut's relationship with his sister.
JadedWriter
Member
It really is hard for me to view Serpico as the Guts but I see your point. I guess it's just because in some ways he's the inversion of Guts. But yeah he acutely sort of is like Guts once you realize that Farnese is pretty much his Casca.
I don't think one dimensional is the right way to put it. They kind of have depth, they feel like people with their own strengths, flaws, weaknesses, issues and whatnot, even if it's not necessarily explored all that much on the pages. As characters, they are who they are when Guts gets there and it's more that those people are there to affect Guts' development through the close companionship they develop than Guts affecting theirs. They have already gone through most of their character development off the pages, if that makes sense, and nothing that happens during the Golden Age arc is something that would cause such big changes/challenges/trauma in their lives that they'd need to develop as characters. They have their established roles in the Band of the Hawks and they don't need to adapt to any drastically new situations (well, except the stuff prior to the eclipse, even then they are more clinging on to hope of returning to the glory of the past by rescuing Griffith rather than facing the reality).
Band of the Hawk was cool and all, but there wasn't that much to them because there was never any back story.
For me, the down time story telling parts of Berserk are my favorite. I do love the action, but character development is where it's at.
I personally didn't know there was such a hatred for Guts' new crew and for Puck. I like the current team better just because they have more depth to them than the old one. It seems weird and kind of unnerving that people just want to see constant blood and gore in the story. I wonder how many people who think like that actually own the any of the manga. Or maybe they are in some kind of angsty teenage/young adult phase in their life where they think more blood and acts of violence = a more mature story. That's when I really started appreciating the story more is when I had the books in front of me and a little more age on me.
I'm glad Miura decided to throw in some lightheartedness in the story. That's also a great way to set up for a devastating loss later on. Like if Azan gets whacked.. I would legit get startled by that. Such a good dude.
I would be even more upset if something happened to a member of Team Guts now that they are so developed as characters.
For me, the down time story telling parts of Berserk are my favorite. I do love the action, but character development is where it's at.
I personally didn't know there was such a hatred for Guts' new crew and for Puck. I like the current team better just because they have more depth to them than the old one. It seems weird and kind of unnerving that people just want to see constant blood and gore in the story. I wonder how many people who think like that actually own the any of the manga. Or maybe they are in some kind of angsty teenage/young adult phase in their life where they think more blood and acts of violence = a more mature story. That's when I really started appreciating the story more is when I had the books in front of me and a little more age on me.
I'm glad Miura decided to throw in some lightheartedness in the story. That's also a great way to set up for a devastating loss later on. Like if Azan gets whacked.. I would legit get startled by that. Such a good dude.
Seeing what happened to Pippin and Judeau was a gut punch for me.
Brian_FETO
Banned
Speaking solely for myself....I was drawn to Berserk because of the gore/violence and it's still a major part of why I like it. I appreciate the story and it's definitely starting to ramp up as I read more of the manga. Honestly as someone who loved the first two volumes I was pretty bummed by the majority of the Golden Age. It's absolutely necessary for story purposes and pays off big time obviously, but there are multiple volumes where I had a hard time caring (particularly the sections involving battlefield tactics and kingdoms I don't understand or care about). They hooked me with demon slaying and then pulled the rug out for slow-paced medieval drama lol
I don't prioritize the gore/violence because I think it's more "mature" or anything, I just dig how morbidly humorous it tends to be (like gratuitous kills in a slasher film). Plus the art is real pretty y'all.
Also, I like Puck! Granted I've only read through volume 19 but he's great
I don't prioritize the gore/violence because I think it's more "mature" or anything, I just dig how morbidly humorous it tends to be (like gratuitous kills in a slasher film). Plus the art is real pretty y'all.
Also, I like Puck! Granted I've only read through volume 19 but he's great
CrazyDiamond
Member
There's still a lot of violence and gore in the later volumes but there's definitely a more like mundanity to the encounters just because the group has been through so many situations that it takes a legit almost existential threat of a demon to give Guts' group some pause. And things seem less hopeless like out side of having to fight an army of demons everywhere he goes it seems that the universe has let up on fucking with Guts.
And yeah I was sold on Berserk by the visceral action and gothic nature but I began really appreciating the character interactions and growth which were loaded with tons of nuance, subtext and even a hint of vagueness to allow for interpretation. The people who complain about the lighter tone and Guts moving on from his 'allforrevenge' phase sound like the people who complained about 'Farmland Saga' and Thorfinn's evolution into a pacifistic character.
And yeah I was sold on Berserk by the visceral action and gothic nature but I began really appreciating the character interactions and growth which were loaded with tons of nuance, subtext and even a hint of vagueness to allow for interpretation. The people who complain about the lighter tone and Guts moving on from his 'allforrevenge' phase sound like the people who complained about 'Farmland Saga' and Thorfinn's evolution into a pacifistic character.
I get what you're saying about them being established characters but that doesn't matter from a reader's point of view. I am in the middle of reading the Golden Age arc and I do think they are one dimensional; you can describe each in a couple of words and it would fit them perfectly for most of the arc. There is enough variety between the characters for them to mesh well and give a likable identity to the Hawks that would attract Guts and foster his development.
I do think Miura realized all the Hawks would be killed during the Eclipse and decided to stick to a better pacing of the story than try to give them more development.
RadioHeadAche
Member
Isidro has grown on me, and I've been a fan of puck since the post-eclipse chapters.
JadedWriter
Member
I've been fine with most of the Berserk crew in and out of Guts' JRPG squad. Only shitty character is Magnifico cause he has no job class to level grind. Even Rickert's group is cool. Only one from the Falconia demon squad that I don't seem too interested in is Lord Mule. I want more creepy ass Sonia though and "here's some cake Griffith" Princess Charlotte.
In Guts's quest to replace his long lost friends in the Band of Hawk, he had to find a new Corkus somewhere which he partly found in Magnifico.
*Looks up Mule*
Yeah. Don't care about him and he's never made me laugh. Magnifico at least kinda brings a different brand of humor compared to Isidro and Puck.
*Looks up Mule*
Yeah. Don't care about him and he's never made me laugh. Magnifico at least kinda brings a different brand of humor compared to Isidro and Puck.
JadedWriter
Member
Magnifico is so damn useless. Kind of makes me wish those cat lion things just ate him, but without Magnifico who is Puck going to tease? He can't really tease Farnese anymore. What is Mule even there for again? Sonia's protector or something? I don't even think he's even plot relevant.
Magnifico is going to take the Red Behelit and become the sixth finger of the God Hand.
JadedWriter
Member
He'll probably be useless there too. He'll probably either just be another immortal football or Slann's play thing.
Hey. That doesn't sound too bad.
Then again, Slan's probably into some pretty hardcore shit.
JadedWriter
Member
She'll probably
fuck a dude in every hole imaginable and then when she's done make new holes and then continue.
JadedWriter
Member
Don't worry based on our spoiler tags, we're both very aware of who and what Slann is lol. "Slann Gun Gib It To Ya."Might want to rethink that one...
CrazyDiamond
Member
Might want to rethink that one...
I always found this scene very interesting because of how it's framed.So we got a nightmarish landscape while a main character is held up by their arms in almost like a T-pose and immediately afterwards their armor is just like ton off leaving them exposed all the while experiencing intense, debilitating pain. Basically, to me, this scenes screamed 'hey remember what happened to Casca' which while Guts didn't go through anywhere near the pain that Casca did always fascinated me. Hell Skull Knight even shows up to save him.
I don't know if there's any significance to the similarities but found it pretty cool.
Its actually a pretty interesting reading of the scene as basically Slan was basically going to rape Guts while cooing about how she wished he could have joined her on the Godhand because of how interesting and unique he is. Casca fought and tried to escape with her friends from the Eclipse but was caught, disrobed and restrained by monsters and lifted into the air to be raped by a God Hand. In Quilpoth Guts was fighting the trolls and other monsters with his friends while trying to escape before being restrained and being forcibly stripped by Slan and she almost gets him. Then of course they are both saved by the Skull Knight. Its funny I never thought about it like that either but the similarities are pretty glaring.
I've always found the original Black Swordsman Arc to be the best introduction to Berserk ever written, even if Miura or some anime producers disagree. Yes Guts is a BIT off character in some aspects, but considering the trauma he's went through later on we understand Guts' psychology a lot more in this arc, and even in Lost Children arc he was pretty much still the same old Guts from the Black Swordsman arc up to another level.
Everything about it lays the foundation of what's to come, and gives context to why the audience should believe Griffith is a bad guy (rather than some promotional mateiral saying, "This is Griffith, leader of the Band of Hawk, and main antagonist of Berserk." We're shown, right off the bat, that the supernatural runs roughshot on the world, which makes the appearance of Zodd and even the Godhand make more sense despite the Golden Age arc introducing us to a fairly gritty and realistic world.
Everything about it lays the foundation of what's to come, and gives context to why the audience should believe Griffith is a bad guy (rather than some promotional mateiral saying, "This is Griffith, leader of the Band of Hawk, and main antagonist of Berserk." We're shown, right off the bat, that the supernatural runs roughshot on the world, which makes the appearance of Zodd and even the Godhand make more sense despite the Golden Age arc introducing us to a fairly gritty and realistic world.
On my search for my remaining Berserk Manga, I had found an extra Volume 32. If it will help anyone's collection let me know.
On that note I just completed ng whole collection 1-37
I'm missing volume 32. And it is the ONLY one I'm missing. I have it on order through Amazon, but it hasn't shipped. It's been like that for 2 weeks now because of not having any stock.
We don't really spend enough time with the Hawks though. We don't know anyone but Casca's backstory by the time the Golden Age finishes. Rickert not being anything more than that enthusiastic kid is fine because he's still around but I feel like Judeau is the only guy that got enough 'screen time' so to speak. For example, I didn't even know who Gaston was on my first read through, it wasn't until I watched the anime and he was voiced by fucking Goku that I took notice of him.
The general idea behind the Falcons is they were the army of the people. They often went around with women and children in tow. They took anyone and they had a woman as second in command. Its also why they were looked down upon all the uptight stick up their ass nobles and often underestimated. Peasants couldn't come together to become the premier fighting force in Midland and do what the knights with all their fancy armor and bluster couldn't for a century. Of course this was all for ulterior motives but hindsight is 20/20 on such things.
This image of Griffith being from the people and for them even if he was so far beyond them was a big part of the leverage used to get people to love him upon return. Of course the angelic Griffith will come back and save us once more and slaughter those demonic invaders. I actually like how "set up" the story is in a meta textual sense. Things are allowed to flow as they will but the Godhand are there on the edges tinkering with this little thing or that to play the long game and get the result only they were expecting. And of course how Guts might be the monkey wrench in the gears of their huge master plan whatever it may be.
Pm'd you
True Savior
Member
What they thought would be essential to animate in 2d? The beloved Horse. Lmao.
So I decided to finally get the print manga after getting tired of no digital version coming out. I've only watched the 90s anime which is one of my favourite animes of all time. What am I in for? How does the first volume relate to the 90's anime? Is it in a different timeframe?
Once I finish work today Im gonna go to my local comic shop and see if they have volume 1. If not I'll just buy it off amazon.(There is only one English print version right?)
Once I finish work today Im gonna go to my local comic shop and see if they have volume 1. If not I'll just buy it off amazon.(There is only one English print version right?)
The first three volumes of the manga is like the first episode of the '97 anime series, but much much darker and Guts is somewhat different... coldhearted you could say (it's from '89, so it's a bit different). After that the Golden Age Arc begins and it's mostly the same like in the anime but it has more stuff.
You can start with the first 3 volumes and then continue from after the Golden Age arc at volume 13 I think (I haven't gotten this far, someone else can confirm this for you).
True Savior
Member
It might have gone unnoticed, but I started to think how Guts was going to survive future challenges if any tree, apostle or army of nobodies kick is ass (3 episodes, 3 ass kicking). They changed Guts. In this adaptation he is an incompetent fighter but has legs made of iron
He chews Guts for a while (even say it feels soft), yet this strong mofo is keeping his legs. They could have went there and make our hero a one handed/legged swordsman but it might have been too much. So they made him have iron legs. I suppose. Or else how do we explain this 3 minutes of leg-chewing?
He chews Guts for a while (even say it feels soft), yet this strong mofo is keeping his legs. They could have went there and make our hero a one handed/legged swordsman but it might have been too much. So they made him have iron legs. I suppose. Or else how do we explain this 3 minutes of leg-chewing?
Coriolanus
Banned
Given his facial structure, that isn't Guts, so anything goes.
JadedWriter
Member
Maybe that's Punished Guts and the real guts is just doing something else? Lalilulelo are the fucking God Hand.
Ordered volume 1-3 on Amazon since my local comic shop doesnt have any Berserk.
Since Im now watching this 2016 Berserk anime,(which has the worst production values of any show Ive ever seen) I wonder how much it will differ from how the manga tells the story. The show will most likely finish before I get to the same arc in the manga.
Since Im now watching this 2016 Berserk anime,(which has the worst production values of any show Ive ever seen) I wonder how much it will differ from how the manga tells the story. The show will most likely finish before I get to the same arc in the manga.
JadedWriter
Member
The show doesn't do a real good job of showcasing Berserk. Like imagine if JJBA Diamond is Unbreakable used the Duwang subs as canon and then had the Duwang translator write and draw more JJBA.