dude, all those
homeless characters
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BEYOND: Two Souls (Ellen Page, Willem Dafoe) |OT| Press Triangle to Aiden
- Thread starter Replicant
- Start date
dragonbane
Member
I don't think Beyond was meant to have that (unlike Heavy Rain). It was meant to have one fantastic character and nothing more. And I think they succeeded on almost all fronts with this. The story is just there to support this one character. I happen to love the conclusion of said story, but for 80% of the game it doesn't really exist and you are left with this one character you either enjoy playing as or don't.
I treat each chapter as a vignette, an important moment of her life. I play it to find out about her, not so much about the story. How she got there is (at first) not really important to me either, although you can find answers if you look for them. I just roll with it and go onto a journey with her to find out who she really is together with her. All the emotions I felt during the game came through her pretty much.
thetrin
Hail, peons, for I have come as ambassador from the great and bountiful Blueberry Butt Explosion
I adored Navajo. It remains one of my most favorite sections in the whole game. I think I'm broken.
fvng
Member
It was emotive to me (and others in this thread obviously), depends on what tugs your particular heart strings. I felt like it had a total understanding of Jodie and why she is the person she is. the ending was an emotional punch in the stomach. I guess it's all relative
thetrin
Hail, peons, for I have come as ambassador from the great and bountiful Blueberry Butt Explosion
Yep, I immediately thought of D'wayne Wayne the first time I saw Cole show up. Was surprised to find out it was ACTUALLY HIM
thetrin
Hail, peons, for I have come as ambassador from the great and bountiful Blueberry Butt Explosion
Aw man...
The Dinner spoilers
I dressed up, I cleaned, I cooked and even behaved as Aiden (except when Ryan asked if Aiden was around, I blew out a candle because...obviously) and Jodie couldn't seal the deal. She freaked out
I'm curious if that's the only way it can end.
fvng
Member
sometimes an emotional scar or a traumatic sexual experience can ruin sex for a girl forever *hint hint*
HovaHovito
Banned
I thought the main one was a little to cliche.
he easily believes jodie after she speaks fr the wife or gets possessed r whatever. One minute he thinks shes a druggie the next hes awe struck by very broad words. The dialogue was bland as can be and i felt nothing.
when she jumps out the building why doesnt aiden drive off the thugs
Theres very little gameplay, youdont lose anything from watching a play through
HovaHovito
Banned
Why is she infatuated with
? Hes a dick throughout and doesnt treat her well from what is shown to us
ryan
Yeah... I figured. Haha.
Anyway, ended up playing till 2am and finishing. In many ways, it's much better than Heavy Rain but I think I enjoyed HR more.
I'm tired and it's bedtime...
Ending spoilers
Also what the hell was with that sequel tease? Haha, I want to see that but I'm guessing we never will.
You lose the most important aspect, player agency.
Anyone who says they 'watched' this game has an opinion of zero value.
fvng
Member
Hiding behind the opinion of well known commentators doesn't really strengthen your criticisms, especially when GAF has already torn apart Sterling's inconsistent and hypocritical dissection of the game.
If there is little to no gameplay in a Beyond you should tell everyone like me that grew up on LucasArts and Sierra adventure games that we weren't actually playing games with gameplay.
Too bad I couldn't post my impressions of this when they were fresh, oh well.
It may be the weirdest thing I've played since Indigo Prophecy, it's funny how the game goes full retard just like that one. Hopefully the of team writers Quantic Dream has hired rises to the occasion, because I believe creative control needs to be wrestled away from Cage.
The story for me is a mess, and the worst thing is you can see it could actually have been good. The non-chronological design is just baffling, I would even call it nonsense. Except for the last chapters everything seems to have been placed in a completely random order without any sense or reason. This is not conductive to good storytelling or to making me relate to the characters. Chapters are completely disconnected from each other and don't flow from one to another at all, there are no transitions of any kind. Going from one chapter to another is harsh, to say the least. For someone that is actively trying to create interactive movies this is truly a mystery. It was detriment to the experience I had with Beyond. I didn't really feel attached to Jodie, and as such the game was mostly emotionally cold to me, except for a some young Jodie moments where I truly felt sorry for her. But the apparently big gut punches were totally flat.
When it comes to gameplay I was hoping the demo wasn't indicative of the final game, regarding how little actual choice you have in here. Despite being able to free roam as Aiden and having all his powers, I never felt like I had options. Even less when you play as Jodie. I didn't feel like my actions were impacting the story, and the fact is they mostly did not. Undoubtedly another negative of using a non-chronological order. I replayed a couple of chapters for curiosity and the majority of my choices don't even impact the chapter itself AT ALL, things go just the exact same way. What is this? Why even bother? Even if you just want to give players the illusion of choice, you're not really doing it a good job at it.
I thought Aiden was underused. Conceptually the mechanic is actually pretty great and Cage could've done way more with it if he would've just given us a bit more control. Why does Aiden go away when Jodie is in fist fights? That makes no sense to me. I consider the QTEs in this game to be awful. Every single time I felt completely uninvolved, the slowmo one-direction mechanic Cage has crafted here is just a mistake. The opposite feeling of another story-game I recently played, The Wolf Among Us. I enjoyed all of those very much. Honestly Tell Tale is nailing what Cage wishes he did. I don't think he's a good game designer or story writer, so I'm not quite sure what he brings to the table at QD.
Speaking of QD, this game is gorgeous and at times the best looking game on the PS3. Undoubtedly the most impressive real-time facial animation in a video game. It's funny how I'm not as impressed with the The Dark Sorcerer demo after playing Beyond, it looks more than achievable now.
I bought this as a curiosity and ended up disappointed despite not having many expectations about it. I would simply say this was not for me.
It may be the weirdest thing I've played since Indigo Prophecy, it's funny how the game goes full retard just like that one. Hopefully the of team writers Quantic Dream has hired rises to the occasion, because I believe creative control needs to be wrestled away from Cage.
The story for me is a mess, and the worst thing is you can see it could actually have been good. The non-chronological design is just baffling, I would even call it nonsense. Except for the last chapters everything seems to have been placed in a completely random order without any sense or reason. This is not conductive to good storytelling or to making me relate to the characters. Chapters are completely disconnected from each other and don't flow from one to another at all, there are no transitions of any kind. Going from one chapter to another is harsh, to say the least. For someone that is actively trying to create interactive movies this is truly a mystery. It was detriment to the experience I had with Beyond. I didn't really feel attached to Jodie, and as such the game was mostly emotionally cold to me, except for a some young Jodie moments where I truly felt sorry for her. But the apparently big gut punches were totally flat.
When it comes to gameplay I was hoping the demo wasn't indicative of the final game, regarding how little actual choice you have in here. Despite being able to free roam as Aiden and having all his powers, I never felt like I had options. Even less when you play as Jodie. I didn't feel like my actions were impacting the story, and the fact is they mostly did not. Undoubtedly another negative of using a non-chronological order. I replayed a couple of chapters for curiosity and the majority of my choices don't even impact the chapter itself AT ALL, things go just the exact same way. What is this? Why even bother? Even if you just want to give players the illusion of choice, you're not really doing it a good job at it.
I thought Aiden was underused. Conceptually the mechanic is actually pretty great and Cage could've done way more with it if he would've just given us a bit more control. Why does Aiden go away when Jodie is in fist fights? That makes no sense to me. I consider the QTEs in this game to be awful. Every single time I felt completely uninvolved, the slowmo one-direction mechanic Cage has crafted here is just a mistake. The opposite feeling of another story-game I recently played, The Wolf Among Us. I enjoyed all of those very much. Honestly Tell Tale is nailing what Cage wishes he did. I don't think he's a good game designer or story writer, so I'm not quite sure what he brings to the table at QD.
Speaking of QD, this game is gorgeous and at times the best looking game on the PS3. Undoubtedly the most impressive real-time facial animation in a video game. It's funny how I'm not as impressed with the The Dark Sorcerer demo after playing Beyond, it looks more than achievable now.
I bought this as a curiosity and ended up disappointed despite not having many expectations about it. I would simply say this was not for me.
okay, well how bout the majority of every review of the game?
pick the one whom is up to your standards and use that one i guess...
love that you're belittling their integrity as a rebuttal for why i and they are some how "wrong" just days after the Tevis Thompson article on the current state of game reviews.
ah yes, her father, the outstanding father figure that he was, in every scene of the game.
the swat team leader and cia coaches, yes all 2 minutes they were on screen, yelling at you during a training montage section finalized with a cheesy "pat on the back" moment at the end.
the 2 days in the desert with the Navajo family who are distant from you for 1 and a half of those days, but giving an option to makeout with one of the brothers as you leave for no reason at all, is apparently enough forced emotion for some people, to then think about them again the rest of the way, no really, the rest of the game past that point i was truly spending the entire time thinking of them and wishing i could just leave and go back and live them, because the story really made me care deeply about them.
same with the whole 2 days with the gang of homeless defects who all just happen to get along with eachother while also having at-least 1 of the stereotypical reasons someone would be "homeless" aspects.
David Cage demonstrating character development at its finest. the man who failed to become employed in actual hollywood, with writing scripts for actual movies.
Prince Vultan
Banned
Majority of reviews for the game have been positive ones though.
Maybe because he didn't try
dragonbane
Member
1. He believes her, because his wife's voice comes out of Jodie's freaking mouth.
2. Because Aiden has no 360 degree view. He didn't see them. Once Jodie is knocked out Aiden is powerless too. It happens too fast for him being able to react.
2. Because Aiden has no 360 degree view. He didn't see them. Once Jodie is knocked out Aiden is powerless too. It happens too fast for him being able to react.
He is only a dick during Separation, where she is 17. During Dinner she is 22. In 5 years a relationship can change a lot. She obviously has come to terms that she is with the CIA now. During the Welcome to the CIA chapter you can see how she starts seeking Ryan's appreciation when she smiles at him after she beats up the two guys during the training session. Happens again after she completes the training course "thank you sir". During the Embassy mission she is blushed when Ryan comments on how good she looks in her dress. Then when The Dinner comes along they start to date. After the Somalia mission she is pretty pissed at him again, although you don't know how much it was Ryan being an asshole and Ryan just doing his job. She is still pissed at him during the Chinese mission, but he does things to redeem himself, like enduring torture and saving her life. After that you can pretty much decide if it is enough and if you think he is genuine or not.
fvng
Member
Majority of the reviews are positive, and if you bother to scroll through the two big Beyond threads, the reception here is mostly positive as well, even if there are minor complaints.
yeah I am belittling sterling's integrity because he has criticized the game for certain things and given a pass to other games for the same reasons. This is just standard Jim Sterling stuff, so throwing his name in the disucssion does nothing for me. I don't know who Tevis Thompson is, not sure why you think his article would have any influence on me.
What the shit are you talking about?
dragonbane
Member
You didn't do much to defend your own position in this thread so far. Citing other reviews or people without any addition is worthless. Reviews are not gospel, they don't matter at all in this thread. Besides, the "majority" of reviews is in fact positive.
It doesn't help your position when you spread lies. Better leave now. You also come dangerously close of breaking one of the thread rules.
Too bad. The story makes perfect sense to me. Most chapters seem to be placed pretty deliberate, especially when it comes to reveals on how Jodie got to certain periods of her life and how the player is supposed to feel towards certain characters. Placing the Dinner chapter after the Separation chapter and then letting you play as Aiden was genius.
dragonbane
Member
Aw man...
The Dinner spoilers
I dressed up, I cleaned, I cooked and even behaved as Aiden (except when Ryan asked if Aiden was around, I blew out a candle because...obviously) and Jodie couldn't seal the deal. She freaked out
If you don't go to the bar you can have in fact sex with Ryan
Just accidentally GameSpot and Rev3Games happen to be the two sites I trust the most. I see one 9/10 and one 10/10. I also like Jesse's reviews of games. He gave Beyond a 9/10 (the same guy you cited earlier). All 3 pretty positive. What now?
Me too. You are not alone
Acquiescence
Member
Holy shit, even Keeping Up Appearances is getting the gif treatment now. Nothing is sacred.
thetrin
Hail, peons, for I have come as ambassador from the great and bountiful Blueberry Butt Explosion
If you don't go to the bar you can have in fact sex with Ryan
Fascinating! That makes a LOT of sense.
fvng
Member
I also trust Rev3Games and their review nailed it. I tend to agree with Chris Stuckmann when it comes to a populist viewpoint and his review nailed it as well
http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_detailpage&v=e-ZE3QoIieY#t=34
Really? I had heard a few others who were affected by the story as well and kept expecting it to draw me in but it never did. That left me kind of disappointed when I finished the game.
Heavy Rain had a much bigger impact on me. Possibly because I'm a father and could empathize with the lengths one would go to to get back their own child.
I thought Beyond was well acted but I never grew to care for the characters. I also thought the graphics were amazing (at particular moments) but the wonky character control kept pulling me out of being immersed in the game.
I would love to see QD's next project use more direct/responsive controls (think Uncharted or similar). I think Cage is trying to keep the controls simple so the don't detract from the story or make the game more accessible. However, I think it is having the opposite effect on me when I play. I don't have to think twice about what to do in Uncharted to control Nathan but had to realize when Beyond was wanting input from me versus when it wasn't.
I guess I enjoyed the game and don't see it as a bad purchase buy I was expecting more from the experience than what I got.
fvng
Member
Your paternal instincts didn't kick in for you during Beyond? Because they did for me, especially since the game starts with her as a child very early on.
I started to care about jodie during the chapter with the snow fight.
D
Deleted member 80556
Unconfirmed Member
Wonder what are your thoughts on Kojima then, specially since what you're saying here is wrong..
Not really.
fvng
Member
Kojima's manifesto is merging games with movies and making them more cinematic. You can tell in his heart his dream would be to make movies, I don't see why David Cage gets shit for setting similar goals for his games. The industry is better with Kojima & Cage than without them.
BronsonLee
Member
Ran through this game in a couple days, finished it Thursday.
If David Cage would stop fucking with the supernatural stuff, he'd be probably top 3 game makers. The more realistic sections in this game are INCREDIBLE. The supernatural stuff isn't nearly as bad as it was in, say, Indigo Prophecy, though.
I also liked that you playing as Jodie really allowed you to shape the kind of character she was, unlike, say, Heavy Rain. Prophecy tried this but it was a bit shaky. Not so here.
BEYOND TWO SOULS SPOILERS FOR THE WHOLE DAMN THING
If David Cage would stop fucking with the supernatural stuff, he'd be probably top 3 game makers. The more realistic sections in this game are INCREDIBLE. The supernatural stuff isn't nearly as bad as it was in, say, Indigo Prophecy, though.
I also liked that you playing as Jodie really allowed you to shape the kind of character she was, unlike, say, Heavy Rain. Prophecy tried this but it was a bit shaky. Not so here.
BEYOND TWO SOULS SPOILERS FOR THE WHOLE DAMN THING
I played Jodie as more a truthful and honest person than anything. She wouldn't be evasive very often, and while rather shy about things, she was always trying to just be a normal person. Circumstances forced their hand on her, though.
Ryan was pretty clearly the canon romance: I had to look up why it said Zoey and not Stan, but that makes sense in retrospect, I suppose.
I didn't talk, so Ryan lost an eye, which I couldn't tell had happened at first. It did fit the motif of them both being broken people, just reversed for them (Jodie on inside, Ryan on outside).
Nathan was handled extremely well. You could see all throughout the game that he was a good man, but again, circumstances forced their hand on him, and on the outside he seemed fine, on the inside he was slowly being destroyed.
Ryan was pretty clearly the canon romance: I had to look up why it said Zoey and not Stan, but that makes sense in retrospect, I suppose.
I didn't talk, so Ryan lost an eye, which I couldn't tell had happened at first. It did fit the motif of them both being broken people, just reversed for them (Jodie on inside, Ryan on outside).
Nathan was handled extremely well. You could see all throughout the game that he was a good man, but again, circumstances forced their hand on him, and on the outside he seemed fine, on the inside he was slowly being destroyed.
Dictator93
Member
I think they could comment on dialogue quality and plot strenght cohesiveness.
D
Deleted member 80556
Unconfirmed Member
Oh, I'm not criticizing Kojima at all, just trying to point the ridiculous statement of person I was replying to.
Plus Kojima started doing games when he failed at doing films.
If you don't go to the bar you can have in fact sex with Ryan
You can
go to the bar but you have to make sure that you get out of the bar post ordering a drink
I have to say, as a huge Heavy Rain fan this game is a huge letdown, probably the letdown of the gen for me. The game is basically a series of interactive cutscenes. What's worse is those cutscenes are not very interesting. It's not really a bad game, just boring. I will beat it tho, but so far after maybe half the game it has been a huge dissapointment.
fvng
Member
Definitely....
And now Ken Levine is writing the screenplay for the new Logan's Run film. Right back into Hollywood.
Finished the game and love it.
The jumping around in the story was a bit annoying at first because it made it hard to follow an actual plot but in the end I was ok with it, it's more about getting to know Jodies life-story and less about some over-arching plot so it still worked. Plus I like Jodie's character, which helped a lot to enjoy this game. And a compliment on the design/writing/voice-acting for young Jodie. One of the better child-characters in games, which is very rare.
Oh and there is so much hugging through the whole game. Really cute
The jumping around in the story was a bit annoying at first because it made it hard to follow an actual plot but in the end I was ok with it, it's more about getting to know Jodies life-story and less about some over-arching plot so it still worked. Plus I like Jodie's character, which helped a lot to enjoy this game. And a compliment on the design/writing/voice-acting for young Jodie. One of the better child-characters in games, which is very rare.
Oh and there is so much hugging through the whole game. Really cute
Maybe I'm over-interpreting, but I thought this was just meant as a subtle hint, why decisions in the game don't affect much besides how the actual moment plays. Once people know about the rift they will open new ones again, so this will always stay the same and happen. The game never implies to tell a story to follow a major plot and achieve anything. Instead it was meant as a personal story about her life and the people around her. The only thing that changes is how Jodie's story ends and how you reach it.
So as a ending-scene, you didn't change the world, but had an impact on how her life worked out. Maybe that's just nonsense but I like to see it this way
So as a ending-scene, you didn't change the world, but had an impact on how her life worked out. Maybe that's just nonsense but I like to see it this way
Every Time I Die
Banned
I can see now how that first post would seem like I was baiting anyone who liked the game into an argument, sorry about that. I intended to say the story is a retelling without a re-imagining and that the characters seem to be trapped by this lack of inspiration.
Too much of the story and character development was predictable or one note.
When the first two vignettes we were given are the police interrogation and the experiment, the story is revealed immediately as one of a rather stock origin. The hero has superpowers and thus suffers a lonesome childhood, finds relevance in some manner only to be exploited or manipulated, go on emotional walkabout, return and save the day, and then come to some conclusion to reject or embrace the a world that has wronged the protagonist throughout his/her life.
When we find out about the car accident, it becomes all too evident that Nathan will thus ultimately become "evil" as a result of his tragedy. A huge letdown for what could have been a much more interesting character.
When you're sent on that mission in Africa and told to execute Gemaal, it was entirely obvious that he was going to be a good guy and also that when you found Salim you would inevitably murder his father. I guessed Gemaal was Salim's dad and that he was just a peaceful guy trying to build schools in a wartorn nation and was heartily disappointed when I wasn't too far off.
This predictability in story and character absolutely murder the illusion of choice throughout the game, particularly in the last chapter. Without the illusion of choice well maintained, this game loses most nearly all of its appeal for me. In its defense, I did enjoy very specific things Cage did with the story
such as the explanation as to why Jodie's memory is confused, and the entire vignette as she lives by the river. The game would have been better served to have ended right there than to have presented that silly four way decision
A total nitpicky aside is the choice of vocabulary. In science fiction when you choose terrible words to describe interesting things, it makes those interesting things a lot less intriguing for me. Infraworld and entity are both uninspired, but at least there wasn't anything named Neo-Paris or something of that ilk. It speaks to a lack of imagination when you name things poorly in science fiction, which is a crime when imagination is first in foremost in the realm of fiction.
dragonbane
Member
Yeah the story really affected me. Much more than The Last of Us, Heavy Rain and most other recent games. I teared up like 4 times and really cried at one point. My personal ending especially hit me hard.
Wow. I'm glad I didn't predict any of that haha. So these surprises worked for me. Weirdly enough in movies I often predict the twist early on, but in games I just go along with it and most of the time I don't really think about the whole story until I beat it. I can see where you are coming from though.
Awesome. You learn something new about this game every day
I thought about this as I was typing my previous post. Funny that Jodie never evoked those emotions in me. Perhaps I never felt that she was helpless due to Aiden. That isn't to say that I felt bad for her abandonment but the story in Beyond never really resonated with me on an emotional level.
KungFucius
King Snowflake
I had a hard time getting past the awful QTEs. They are fucking ridiculous. Keep mashing X to stand up - What fucking Idiot thought that was fun or entertaining? QTEs need to die.
Is this your first Quantic Dream game?
Every Time I Die
Banned
Yeah the story really affected me. Much more than The Last of Us, Heavy Rain and most other recent games. I teared up like 4 times and really cried at one point. My personal ending especially hit me hard.
Wow. I'm glad I didn't predict any of that haha. So these surprises worked for me. Weirdly enough in movies I often predict the twist early on, but in games I just go along with it and most of the time I don't really think about the whole story until I beat it. I can see where you are coming from though.
Awesome. You learn something new about this game every day
Yeah and I think there is something to be said about just experiencing the story instead of trying to guess what is going to happen but I don't think I can do that. I think that's why Heavy Rain worked so well for me because its story was built around the player trying to solve the mystery along with the characters. I just hope the next story is a really interesting one or one that hasn't been used extensively before.
Definitely. Far more positive in-fact. I was nearing the end but had to come down to London for a series of weddings etc, but man I want to go back and play it lol.