Big Brother 19 |OT| Fake Apples, Real Snakes

Josh is giving a cam talk
indicating that he is leaning to taking Paul to F2 if he wins HoH because he thinks that Paul would be easier to beat than Christmas. LOL. I suspected Paul would be able manipulate him into this
.

Josh thinks that him, Paul, and Christmas are going to be best friends and travel the world together. I think that Josh will be lucky if Paul responds to his texts.
 
JettDash said:
Josh is giving a cam talk
indicating that he is leaning to taking Paul to F2 if he wins HoH because he thinks that Paul would be easier to beat than Christmas. LOL. I suspected Paul would be able manipulate him into this
.
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That is sad. So, so incredibly sad.
 
giphy.gif
 
Paul's goodbye messages are very lackluster. I believe he really ignores how Jury works. He keeps swiveling through his sneaky actions and conspiracies. He thinks that houseguests won't find out about it but I believe it will backfire. If he knew how to answer some of the questions last season and had a better speech he would've won but he's really overplaying it this time.
and LOL and josh unconsciously ruining Paul's plan to win Kevin's vote by spilling the beans on their alliance.
 
Tounsi_Tag said:
Paul's goodbye messages are very lackluster. I believe he really ignores how Jury works. He keeps swiveling through his sneaky actions and conspiracies. He thinks that houseguests won't find out about it but I believe it will backfire. If he knew how to answer some of the questions last season and had a better speech he would've won but he's really overplaying it this time.
and LOL and josh unconsciously ruining Paul's plan to win Kevin's vote by spilling the beans on their alliance.
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No he doesn't know how jury works. He didn't go there last year and he doesn't watch the show.

He shouldn't do it but I doubt it will make a difference. Jason would hate Paul either way and Kevin doesn't care.
 
JettDash said:
No he doesn't know how jury works. He didn't go there last year and he doesn't watch the show.

He shouldn't do it but I doubt it will make a difference. Jason would hate Paul either way and Kevin doesn't care.
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Kevin doesn't care but what if he mentions the conflicting goodbye messages to the other houseguests and they start figuring out the scheme they're already figuring out?
It might go two ways :
1) Some might be impressed with it and think Paul is a great player even if he played a role in their elimination, after all, it's a game
2) others will feel backstabbed by it and vote to whoever is next to him
 
Seems like jury votes always devolve into nonsense at the last second. I'm not going to begin trying to predict how each person will vote. About the only thing I expect is for Cody to blindly pick a key out of his bag and then walk off set after he locks it in.
 
Tounsi_Tag said:
Kevin doesn't care but what if he mentions the conflicting goodbye messages to the other houseguests and they start figuring out the scheme they're already figuring out?
It might go two ways :
1) Some might be impressed with it and think Paul is a great player even if he played a role in their elimination, after all, it's a game
2) others will feel backstabbed by it and vote to whoever is next to him
Click to expand...

Kevin isn't even in the jury house. He is doing the roundtable with Dr Will and they all go to sequester.

And they all already know that Paul is the puppet master. Well except for Raven who thinks she was co puppetmaster even though she is in jury.

Only one seems bitter is Jason.
 
Tregard said:
Current rumour floating around that
The jury is super super bitter and only Maven intend on voting for Paul in F2
Click to expand...

I saw that too. Could be a fake leak from production to increase the suspense for finale night. Or maybe it is real but they will cool down and change their mind by the time they vote. Could depend on if Paul tries to maintain his lies in his speech/answers. Or maybe Josh wins HoH, cuts Paul and we will never know for sure.

Either way things are more interesting now.
 
Tregard said:
Current rumour floating around that
The jury is super super bitter and only Maven intend on voting for Paul in F2
Click to expand...

It would put this season totally into perspective,
but you can't just manipulate everyone and then think you will get away with it and just win the game. The same rookies he manipulated are the same who don't give a fuck about the history of the game and would appreciate the good gameplay, it's a double edged sword.
 
Tregard said:
Current rumour floating around that
The jury is super super bitter and only Maven intend on voting for Paul in F2
Click to expand...

If production didn't help Paul this season I would be upset, but production was so far up his ass early on that I'm really okay with this. Would love it if Josh won.
 
And what if Matt and Raven are so obnoxious that they turned the others away from Paul. Somebody mentioned this could happen but I didn't take it seriously.

If that happens...lol. I did say that it was a huge possibly game losing error for Paul to get rid of Raven. Though my reasoning was that she was 100% loyal to him and would definitely take him to F2, not because she would unintentionally poison the jury.
NYR said:
It would put this season totally into perspective,
but you can't just manipulate everyone and then think you will get away with it and just win the game. The same rookies he manipulated are the same who don't give a fuck about the history of the game and would appreciate the good gameplay, it's a double edged sword.
Click to expand...


Derrick manipulated everyone and got away with it and they all knew he was the puppet master.

Farsi said:
If production didn't help Paul this season I would be upset, but production was so far up his ass early on that I'm really okay with this. Would love it if Josh won.
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If Josh wins he will be one of the worst winners ever. One who only got there by being a loyal minion that Paul believed he could beat. I guess I will still be happy for him. Certainly he needs the money more than Paul.
 
It all makes sense.

There's a few in jury (Cody, Mark, Jason) who will most likely NOT vote for Paul, because they see themselves as assertive alpha males, and had a 24 year old kid make them all look like fools and ultimately kicked out of the game. It's now their turn to say FUCK YOU PAUL and refuse to vote for him to win.
 
It could be that the rumors are true but a little misleading.
That Matt and Raven and the only two clear Paul votes, but for some of the others it depends on whether he's next to Christmas or Josh. If he's against Josh which is Paul's plan, I could easily see 2/6 (say Cody and Kevin) of them refusing to vote for Josh. Which along with Christmas would be enough to give him the win.

Maybe I'm giving them too much credit. Because I really don't understand being so bitter that you got outplayed that you would rather give it to a puppet than the puppet master. If it was me, I would be impressed that he managed to trick me and everyone else.

Anyway, this makes for a more exciting finale night than I figured.


(
 
What would be really funny is if Josh wins part 3, decides to clip Paul, and loses to Christmas. And it turns out that the jury really was bitter enough to give him the win over Paul.


Actually, now that I think about it, even if the jury is super bitter, if Josh wins HoH and doesn't clip Paul, they would probably be disgusted by Josh's lack of a spine and decide that he doesn't deserve to win.
 
JettDash said:
It could be that the rumors are true but a little misleading.
That Matt and Raven and the only two clear Paul votes, but for some of the others it depends on whether he's next to Christmas or Josh. If he's against Josh which is Paul's plan, I could easily see 2/6 (say Cody and Kevin) of them refusing to vote for Josh. Which along with Christmas would be enough to give him the win.

Maybe I'm giving them too much credit. Because I really don't understand being so bitter that you got outplayed that you would rather give it to a puppet than the puppet master. If it was me, I would be impressed that he managed to trick me and everyone else.

Anyway, this makes for a more exciting finale night than I figured.


(
Click to expand...
I think they all realize his game, but if he's going to deny it like he has in his goodbye messages they will easily be bitter and award the win to someone else. Paul really has to read the jury for this.

Option Friendship: He loses.
Option Puppet Master: He wins.
 
Koomaster said:
I think they all realize his game, but if he's going to deny it like he has in his goodbye messages they will easily be bitter and award the win to someone else. Paul really has to read the jury for this.

Option Friendship: He loses.
Option Puppet Master: He wins.
Click to expand...

I agree. Owning up to it is definitely the best option. If he tries to deny that he was the puppet master and loses, he will deserve it.
 
I can see any of them winning now:

If Paul wins HoH, he will certainly clip Christmas. Even if the jury is bitter, they might not be bitter enough to give the win to Josh, depending on how Paul handles the speeches/questions. It could go to ether way.

If Josh wins HoH and clips Christmas, they will be upset at him for remaining a spineless Paul puppet to the end, and probably give it to Paul out of disgust.

If Josh win HoH and clips Paul, I can see it go either way depending on how he handles it. If he is able to articulate that he knew that Paul ran the house and that the only way for him to win was to get in tight with Paul and get rid of him at the end, the jury will respect that and probably give him the win.

But this is Josh we're talking about. He's an emotional trainwreck. And Paul has done everything he can to make it so that Josh wouldn't be able to cut him without feeling terrible. Josh thinks they're going to be best friends outside of the house, swore on his family that he would take Paul to F2 (he shouldn't give a shit about breaking such a coerced promise but he probably will), ect. So he will probably be very upset if he cuts Paul. And he may not be able to pull his shit together in time. Him crying about evicting Paul would just make him look pathetic and less deserving of winning. So they might give it to Christmas instead. Hell, they might decide that he only did it because she convinced him to which would mean that she was the one who beat Paul.
 
Paul will for sure talk circles around Josh. They ask Josh any question at all about game moves he did himself and he will have nothing. I have no idea what Josh or Christmas would be able to say to differentiate themselves from Paul enough to win. Everyone on that jury knows they did exactly as Paul said to do.

Now if Josh wins the final HOH and cuts Paul, he wins. There is again zero reason to vote for Christmas over him in that scenario.
 
I think Paul's biggest mistake was not knowing when to stop lying. I get that he wanted to secure jury votes but did he not realize the jury can talk to each other in the jury house? It's really transparent and unnecessary and I can totally see it resulting in a bitter jury.
 
streetsahead123 said:
I think Paul's biggest mistake was not knowing when to stop lying. I get that he wanted to secure jury votes but did he not realize the jury can talk to each other in the jury house? It's really transparent and unnecessary and I can totally see it resulting in a bitter jury.
Click to expand...

Not the best idea.

But I remember Derrick lying to people that were about to be evicted. In goodbye messages too.

I dunno, maybe they didn't care as much because he wasn't pretending to be in a F3 with all of them.

Also, he didn't lie in his speech or answers, if I recall, though he didn't tell the whole truth.

If Paul still lies to the jury on finale night (assuming he is in F2) and pretends that it isn't his fault they got evicted, maybe they should just give the money to Josh. And just to troll Paul, claim they gave it to Josh because they think he's the puppet master.
 
NYR said:
Paul
has beasted almost
every survey comp whereas Josh had arguments with almost everyone. Don't see this happening.
Click to expand...

Part 3 is basically random.

Last year Paul won by only picking B.

Year before that Steve won by only picking A, I think.
 
If Paul is in the final he will win. Doesnt matter who is next to him. It also doesnt matter what he has to say in the final speech.

The Jury members wont change their mind last second. They also wont "troll" him or try to get back at him for "playing them". These houseguests wont act like children infront of a live studio and knowing that millions are watching the final. They want to show their best side and dont want to be called a bad loser.

When you are in the house i`m sure it`s possible to forget for a second and say and do stuff you wouldnt do normally but now that they were outside ( well jury house) for a while they wont act like crazypeople.

They know Paul is the puppetmaster and they will talk about it with Dr. Will and the production is gonna make it look like they are undecided. It`s a show. It`s about ratings. At the end paul will win because everybody knows he played the best game. Cody will vote for him i`m sure.

will he get every vote? no because BB likes do to the " he voted X she voted Y "etc. so it`s 1:0, 1;1, 2;1 etc.

show, ratings
 
blackdevil said:
If Paul is in the final he will win. Doesnt matter who is next to him. It also doesnt matter what he has to say in the final speech.

The Jury members wont change their mind last second. They also wont "troll" him or try to get back at him for "playing them". These houseguests wont act like children infront of a live studio and knowing that millions are watching the final. They want to show their best side and dont want to be called a bad loser.

When you are in the house i`m sure it`s possible to forget for a second and say and do stuff you wouldnt do normally but now that they were outside ( well jury house) for a while they wont act like crazypeople.

They know Paul is the puppetmaster and they will talk about it with Dr. Will and the production is gonna make it look like they are undecided. It`s a show. It`s about ratings. At the end paul will win because everybody knows he played the best game. Cody will vote for him i`m sure.

will he get every vote? no because BB likes do to the " he voted X she voted Y "etc. so it`s 1:0, 1;1, 2;1 etc.

show, ratings
Click to expand...

I certainly believed that Paul would win easily
until the rumors that the jury was very bitter at the round-table with Dr Will, with only Matt and Raven intending to vote for him. Though even if true, it doesn't necessarily mean that all six others are intent on voting against him. Or that the bitterness was only directed towards Paul.

Or it could be nonsense leaked for ratings


If I was on the jury, I would go in there intending to vote for him. But I might change my mind if he's still lying. Like if he is asked about Jason's blindside and tries to blame Christmas and Josh even though everyone watching knows that it was him. If he won't take credit for his great game play, why should anyone else give him credit?

If this happens, it won't be the jury that looks bad rather the guy who bs'd himself out of $450k on live tv.
 
JettDash said:
I certainly believed that Paul would win easily
until the rumors that the jury was very bitter at the round-table with Dr Will, with only Matt and Raven intending to vote for him. Though even if true, it doesn't necessarily mean that all six others are intent on voting against him. Or that the bitterness was only directed towards Paul.

Or it could be nonsense leaked for ratings


If I was on the jury, I would go in there intending to vote for him. But I might change my mind if he's still lying. Like if he is asked about Jason's blindside and tries to blame Christmas and Josh even though everyone watching knows that it was him. If he won't take credit for his great game play, why should anyone else give him credit?

If this happens, it won't be the jury that looks bad rather the guy who bs'd himself out of $450k on live tv.
Click to expand...

He's simply throwing the final vote to avoid getting blood on his hands
/s
 
See Paul is in a tricky spot. He spent all season "not getting blood on his hands" His final 2 speech has to reveal he got blood on his hands to show he made moves. Does he think it is less likey to sting if he admits in final 2? His speech will basically say how he controlled everyone and everything...but he will try and put it nicely. The jury at that point will either applaud him for doing it , or want to show they arent followers anymore and have the last laugh
 
Scofield94941 said:
See Paul is in a tricky spot. He spent all season "not getting blood on his hands" His final 2 speech has to reveal he got blood on his hands to show he made moves. Does he think it is less likey to sting if he admits in final 2? His speech will basically say how he controlled everyone and everything...but he will try and put it nicely. The jury at that point will either applaud him for doing it , or want to show they arent followers anymore and have the last laugh
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It looks like he is planning doing just that.

If they give the win to a puppet who banged pots and pans and cried all the time, they are just super bitter that he was able play all of them.
 
So Christmas plans
on telling Josh and Paul that they should take each other to F2.

Pretty sure nobody has every just fallen on their sword for their team at F3.

Seems as though she doesn't feel she deserves it over Josh and Paul. I guess cause Paul dragged her. But he dragged Josh too. Josh barely beat her in part 2 of HoH. LOL

I think that was the current plan anyway but it is hard to know for sure.

It is possible that Josh changes his mind and blindsides Christmas and Paul if he wins HoH.
 
Right, final gut check (including all 6 permutations to avoid spoilers):

Christmas takes Paul -> Paul wins
Christmas takes Josh -> Christmas wins
Paul takes Josh -> Josh wins
Paul takes Christmas -> Christmas wins
Josh takes Paul -> Paul wins
Josh takes Christmas -> Josh wins
 
Tregard said:
Right, final gut check (including all 6 permutations to avoid spoilers):

Christmas takes Paul -> Paul wins
Christmas takes Josh -> Christmas wins
Paul takes Josh -> Josh wins
Paul takes Christmas -> Christmas wins
Josh takes Paul -> Paul wins
Josh takes Christmas -> Josh wins
Click to expand...

I think Paul wins no matter who he takes if he wins that final HOH. It would have to be the most bitter jury of all time to not give him the win. He played the game from day 1, as a vet, and controlled EVERYTHING and everyone.

Josh did nothing and was handed HOH, Christmas was handed 2 HOH otherwise SHE did nothing.

Ok maybe nothing is extreme... but I mean come on. They did what Paul said to do, and they worked in a house that Paul setup for them and they were clueless the entire time... except maybe Josh a little at the end but he was not onto Paul completely, just realizing Paul is in it to win it.
 
Stuggernaut said:
I think Paul wins no matter who he takes if he wins that final HOH. It would have to be the most bitter jury of all time to not give him the win. He played the game from day 1, as a vet, and controlled EVERYTHING and everyone.

Josh did nothing and was handed HOH, Christmas was handed 2 HOH otherwise SHE did nothing.

Ok maybe nothing is extreme... but I mean come on. They did what Paul said to do, and they worked in a house that Paul setup for them and they were clueless the entire time... except maybe Josh a little at the end but he was not onto Paul completely, just realizing Paul is in it to win it.
Click to expand...
(Except for that time the producers gave him arbitrary immunity for 3 weeks and saved him from being evicted week 2. If he loses, that may be part of why they're voting against him.)
 
He was still playing harder than most those first three weeks. Let’s not get confused here. He was immune but he also built relationships that lasted for the entire season.
 
They could have booted his ass out week 4 if they wanted. They can't blame him for them not booting him out. If they do, they are they stupidest, bitterest jury off all time.

Only thing Josh and Christmas did was be the Paul minions that he didn't betray. But only because he views them as the weakest ones.
 
JettDash said:
They could have booted his ass out week 4 if they wanted. They can't blame him for them not booting him out. If they do, they are they stupidest, bitterest jury off all time.

Only thing Josh and Christmas did was be the Paul minions that he didn't betray. But only because he views them as the weakest ones.
Click to expand...

And he found Raven annoying.
 
He was immune for 4 evictions. By the time he could be booted, he had built the relationships he needed to stay. It's a pointless discussion because we will never know how he would have fared with a level playing field.
 
lenovox1 said:
As discussed above, the only way he loses if if Josh wins HoH and takes him out.
Click to expand...

but the slims of this happening seem slim imo. although they gave josh an edit a week or two ago of him in the DR saying he was thinking of a chance to take paul out
 
Daria said:
but the slims of this happening seem slim imo. although they gave josh an edit a week or two ago of him in the DR saying he was thinking of a chance to take paul out
Click to expand...

It does seem as though Paul has convinced Josh to take him to F2. If that does happen, it will be Paul's most impressive achievement.
 
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