Because some Archangel told him to? His entire thing was "God destroyed the world via rain for 40 days, and he's called on me to destroy the world with a giant floating warship". New York was just where he started.
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Bioshock Infinite | Official Spoiler Thread |
- Thread starter BruceLeeRoy
- Start date
Because some Archangel told him to? His entire thing was "God destroyed the world via rain for 40 days, and he's called on me to destroy the world with a giant floating warship". New York was just where he started.
Yeah thanks guys, I am reading the OP and watching various theories from GiantBomb, Articles, etc.
I also wanted to ask, anyone not notice the strong nudge at Christianity, I found it rather amusing that it implied how society can be easily brainwashed, IMO. Thoughts?
Also taking opinions from people regarding my complaints do you agree or disagree? Bioshock 1 was really awesome to me, I hope they retain their roots on the next project.
I think the game should have been laid out liked Bioshock 1, where you can go back to previous areas at will, the transitions from location in Infinite were primarily from cut scenes.
I think the game would of been much better, if you used the rail system to traverse different areas and explore like that instead of the game doing it for you.
Yeah, I played it on Hard, and I barely used traps, I played it up until the very last fight on Comstocks Blimp, it got frustrating and I just wanted to finish the plot so I nudged it down to Easy to beat it, I wonder if I can pick up at a previous check point where it was still on Hard and still get the achievement,
I also wanted to ask, anyone not notice the strong nudge at Christianity, I found it rather amusing that it implied how society can be easily brainwashed, IMO. Thoughts?
Also taking opinions from people regarding my complaints do you agree or disagree? Bioshock 1 was really awesome to me, I hope they retain their roots on the next project.
I think the game should have been laid out liked Bioshock 1, where you can go back to previous areas at will, the transitions from location in Infinite were primarily from cut scenes.
I think the game would of been much better, if you used the rail system to traverse different areas and explore like that instead of the game doing it for you.
Yeah, I played it on Hard, and I barely used traps, I played it up until the very last fight on Comstocks Blimp, it got frustrating and I just wanted to finish the plot so I nudged it down to Easy to beat it, I wonder if I can pick up at a previous check point where it was still on Hard and still get the achievement,
Gully State
Member
What I posted
Gully State said:
Kinda sad that my most anticipated thing wasn't properly realized even though I thoroughly enjoyed the game...
D
Deleted member 80556
Unconfirmed Member
It did made it. When Elizabeth is looking at a painting of the Eiffel Tower, she opens a tear into Paris, where there's a cinema that shows: "La Revanche du Jedi", meaning the Revenge of the Jedi (which was the original title for The Return of the Jedi).
My theory is that in the probability space the other Elizabeths that had appeared also experienced what had happened with Dewitt and had their syphons destroyed and attained their full power as well. This is why there was a scene in with the lighthouses where you see other versions of dewitt and elizabeth crossing dimensions. All theses Dewitts and Elizabeths ultimately reach the conclusion that they must prevent the comstock timeline that is causing the paradoxes from occuring.
I may be overthinking this but I felt that the universe tends to drift back to equalibrium, therefore Elizabeth was given powers in order to prevent a universe where individuals could cross the space between worlds. Similar to Donnie Darko, Elizabeth (and by extensions the lucteces) was a means to prevent the probability space from fragmenting and influencing each other.
Finished the game a few minutes ago. Good stuff overall, although that last airship battle was a drag. At least they didn't shoehorn an additional mediocre boss fight into the end of the game as they did in Bioshock 1.
Read the OP and wow - that's a lot of research/info. Fine job there. The Songbird dying sound in Bioshock 1 was the most mindblowing part for me. Who the hell remembers/finds this shit??
Anyway, good game. A tad heavy handed in some parts and the final third of the game dragged out far too long I thought. Overall, very enjoyable though and looked terrific on the PC.
Read the OP and wow - that's a lot of research/info. Fine job there. The Songbird dying sound in Bioshock 1 was the most mindblowing part for me. Who the hell remembers/finds this shit??
Anyway, good game. A tad heavy handed in some parts and the final third of the game dragged out far too long I thought. Overall, very enjoyable though and looked terrific on the PC.
Seems inefficient. If the universe wanted universe-hopping out of the picture, it would've put into motion a plan to eliminate the Luteces' discovery of Lutece Fields/Tears altogether. Otherwise it leaves some timeline where there's a possibility they get a different benefactor and make the same results, just with less baby-stealing.
Hank Scorpio
Member
Ah, yeah, you're right. He says he needs to do it himself (or sumit) before opening that lighthouse and the Elizabeth I thought was 'our' version is wearing a lace choker.
I don't think the story intended to make any large statements about Christianity itself. Like the racism and class issues it was more window dressing for the setting.
drhankmccoyphd
Member
This may have been brought up already, but I'm on my second play through. Just got to Battleship Bay. The scene where you fall into the water Songbird dives in and tries to grab you. I didn't notice at first but it looks like his right eye shatters under the water. Obviously this foreshadows the ending in Rapture, but I thought that the reason Songbird died was due to the water pressure. Assuming BB isn't that deep one would assume that Songbird has some weakness to water. Did anyone else notice this? Does mean anything to SB's origin?
Gully State
Member
Does that mean you come across different songbirds for each universe?
He died because SB was always elevated in the sky anything below can kill him.
Also another confusing thing, how many different time periods did they go through?
The first one was to save the Gunsmith, anyone know what time periods they were? Or explain that whole thing...
We only meet two. The Songbird from the original timeline and the one from the Vox timeline. I'm not sure which Songbird spots Elizabeth when she opens the tear during that one elevator segment.
By my count 5:
1) Our Booker goes to Columbia
2) Liz takes them to a world where Chen Lin is alive and kicking
3) Liz takes them to the Vox timeline where Martyr Booker died
4) Booker goes to the future Comstock house meets Old Liz (and then goes back to the Vox timeline)
5) Booker and Liz visit Rapture
Just want to say that "ooooOOOO, infinite universessss" is and always has been a totally stupid plot point. It makes everything you could say about your fiction completely irrelevant, because all of it is not only not special, but guaranteed to happen, as that is what happens with the concept of infinity.
Yes, of course Comstock is actually Booker. There's also a universe where the exact same thing happens, but the only difference for that entire world is that Comstock is wearing a red baseball cap. There's also a universe where Comstock is Booker's son, Booker is Comstock's nephew, Booker is Comstock's third-cousin from the other side of the galaxy and is actually a tentacle monster, and so on forever and ever.
It doesn't matter if I save Elizabeth, because if I didn't, she was saved in another version. Or if I did, she wasn't somewhere else. Everything you can imagine not only can happen, but does. And not only does everything happen once, it happens an infinite number of times.
That idea doesn't blow my mind; it breaks my heart. Hard to care when, in an attempt to be clever, you're essentially saying "nothing matters."
Yes, of course Comstock is actually Booker. There's also a universe where the exact same thing happens, but the only difference for that entire world is that Comstock is wearing a red baseball cap. There's also a universe where Comstock is Booker's son, Booker is Comstock's nephew, Booker is Comstock's third-cousin from the other side of the galaxy and is actually a tentacle monster, and so on forever and ever.
It doesn't matter if I save Elizabeth, because if I didn't, she was saved in another version. Or if I did, she wasn't somewhere else. Everything you can imagine not only can happen, but does. And not only does everything happen once, it happens an infinite number of times.
That idea doesn't blow my mind; it breaks my heart. Hard to care when, in an attempt to be clever, you're essentially saying "nothing matters."
drhankmccoyphd
Member
^
I can see where you're coming from. I honestly was a little disappointed whne I first beat the game but the more thought I gave it the more it seemed to work within the fiction and gameplay.
So any change in pressure can kill him? I dunno if I buy that. Seems pretty weaksauce for a hulking guardian.
I can see where you're coming from. I honestly was a little disappointed whne I first beat the game but the more thought I gave it the more it seemed to work within the fiction and gameplay.
So any change in pressure can kill him? I dunno if I buy that. Seems pretty weaksauce for a hulking guardian.
If "Crisis on Two Earths" taught me anything, it's that the only choice that matters when dealing with Multiverses is to blow up the prime universe.
The only take away we should have from this game is that the very small subset of universes we're exposed to (roughly 0.0% of all universes) now don't have Comstock. Still not likely to have a happy ending though. Booker's got a gambling problem and is deep in debt. How many "good father" stories start out that way?
I think we can all agree that these should be the rules that anyone should follow before they can speak critically about the ending:
1. Beat the game twice. No exceptions.
2. Find at least 70 of the 80 voxophone recordings.
3. REALLY listen to the lyrics of the songs you hear in the game, and realize how perfect they are for the situation in Columbia.
Also, this guy's video for "Everybody Wants to Rule the World" set to footage from the game deserves more views: http://youtu.be/ox7FIznjcLs
1. Beat the game twice. No exceptions.
2. Find at least 70 of the 80 voxophone recordings.
3. REALLY listen to the lyrics of the songs you hear in the game, and realize how perfect they are for the situation in Columbia.
Also, this guy's video for "Everybody Wants to Rule the World" set to footage from the game deserves more views: http://youtu.be/ox7FIznjcLs
NullPointer
Member
That video is so amazing.
I like the fact it used the original. The whole game has the feeling of an epic adventure movie made in the '80s, so it seems appropriate.
The One Who Knocks
Member
Cross-posting from the other thread, but God damn this track from the OST...beautiful. That whole sequence was a clear nod to this scene from O' Brother Where Art Thou - one of my favorite movies. Talk about a way to get me to love your game five minutes in.
The intro of Infinite and Columbia's existence can be nailed down to this one quote.
For every moment of triumph, for every instance of beauty, many souls must be trampled.
Hunter S. Thompson
Having just finished Infinite, I think I do understand you, because I think I love it just as much.
Yup, it's amazing. I was 15 when I played Bioshock 1, and really loved it, only game where I actually spent like 30 hours in.
Also, how ironic and mindblowing is it that the cosplayer who portrayed Elizabeth in the promotion is named "Anna".
I wonder if it's intentional and Irrational changed the name in game? Foreshadowing?
I also have a hunch that the ending and main story isn't what was originally planned and was severely altered, as you can also tell by the gameplay, to make ship.
That track totally knocked me off guard. So beautiful.
bodyofanamerican
Member
So, I was watching/listening to the Bombcast spoiler-cast, and Brad suggested that maybe Anna was the product of an emotionless dalliance with someone that Booker wasn't really even that close to, and he was stuck with a child that he didn't necessarily want.
It'd be funny/interesting if the poster of that dancer they find in Emporia (Sally?) with Return to Sender (irony?) that Booker says he "knew" is actually a one night stand of Booker's that resulted in Anna, thus Anna's mother not being all that significant to the story.
It'd be funny/interesting if the poster of that dancer they find in Emporia (Sally?) with Return to Sender (irony?) that Booker says he "knew" is actually a one night stand of Booker's that resulted in Anna, thus Anna's mother not being all that significant to the story.
Dragon1893
Member
There's a chalkboard with a drawing of songbird and a note from Fink saying that the head is sensitive to high pressure, you must've missed it.
Between that and the scene you mentioned it was obvious that falling into the ocean would be its demise in the end.
On the other hand, it's a super weird sequence that doesn't fit in anything Booker and Elizabeth have ever done. It's a really well crafted sequence and it's sounds great, but it totally feels out of place and artificial.
JetBlackPanda
Member
alright what was the gear that you guys said you really need for 1999 mode?
I am at the section right before the arcade where I can reset the checkpoint and spawn 2 random gear.
I am at the section right before the arcade where I can reset the checkpoint and spawn 2 random gear.
JetBlackPanda
Member
I think being abandoned by Booker and them torturing her / making it painful to open tears just broke her.
bodyofanamerican
Member
Shawn, one of the game devs, posted on here the following gear that really helps with Lady Comstock: Electric Punch, Blood to Salts, Vampires Embrace, and Last Man Standing then use Charge.
Dragon1893
Member
Old Liz explains that time eventually broke her. You should watch that part again.
JetBlackPanda
Member
thanks, just grabbed vampires embrace. I will keep that one.
So, in 62 pages it's probably already posted, but I already knew Booker and Comstock were the same guy, because somewhere in the beginning when Comstock does his speech, Booker speaks a few words in sync with it. I thought that was a pretty nice hint if a bit too telling perhaps.
It took me a while to understand that Booker rejected the baptism and Comstock accepted it though. That's still a bit, hmm. I mean, if Elizabeth could bring them to some kind of singularity where all Bookers and all priests underwent the baptism, wouldn't it been easier to have just killed the priest?
It took me a while to understand that Booker rejected the baptism and Comstock accepted it though. That's still a bit, hmm. I mean, if Elizabeth could bring them to some kind of singularity where all Bookers and all priests underwent the baptism, wouldn't it been easier to have just killed the priest?
So they all become gambling addicts who're willing to sell children? Quite the utopia you have cooking.
Screaming Meat
Unconfirmed Member
I like the lateral thinking, but if Comstock!Booker were determined to get a baptism, he would get it elsewhere and still come to fruition. I mean, he had a floating city built, finding another priest wouldn't really be a problem.
EDIT: Beats
I get the impression that Lady Comstock from Booker's dimension is her mother. She mentions something along the lines of "Can I save him in another world"? When you defeat her.
Eh, Rapture looked good. I don't even like Bioshock that much but still found thing very cool.
Disappointed there wasn't a nod at System Shock. Maybe they didn't want to make any unfavorable comparisons again.
The One Who Knocks
Member
I hope I wasn't too long but Wintershield is what I would consider the 'essential' one. Spare the Rod, Deadly Lunger, Vampire's Embrace, Overkill, Blood to Salt, Brittle-Skinned, Executioner, Burning Halo are all very helpful (I've bold what was my 'final' end of game set-up; both Blood to Salt and Wintershield are highlighted since the latter is situational). Others may have other recommendations but if you get two of them, or the bolded ones, I'd probably stick with it.
EDIT: Also, I've just seen that you can allegedly get infinite gear after the Hall of Heroes before you ride the gondola. Supposedly if you collect the gear in the toy shop, return to the Hall of Heroes' lobby and go back to the toy shop it resets but I can't speak to the validity of this. I'll look for a video.
EDIT: What? It actually works? Unless there's some editting going on or something. Can anybody confirm this http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bNS3x2DaQB8?
Couple more things, were the Vox already in the airship when you boarded before Liz smacks you?
And, what significance does the first baptism server for Booker.
We are assuming since he's going to Colombia he hasn't been baptized at Wounded Knee, but he does prior to going into Colombia so shouldn't that change him to Comstock?
And, what significance does the first baptism server for Booker.
We are assuming since he's going to Colombia he hasn't been baptized at Wounded Knee, but he does prior to going into Colombia so shouldn't that change him to Comstock?
Isn't there a scene right after she smacks you that shows them attacking the airship and boarding it?
No to the second question. It's not just a Baptism that turns him into Comstock. It's essentially taking the "easy" way out in absolving himself of all the terrible things he had done. Him getting a Baptism 20 years later really isn't the same thing.
I wonder about what happens now to Booker and Elizabeth/Anna. So Booker doesn't try and absolve himself, he still marries, has Anna... wife still dies and presumably he still goes into a very low point in his life.