NecrosaroIII
Ultimate DQ Fan
This would have been perfect as a follow up to Civil War. But as is, it's 5 years too late.
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Black Widow |OT| Theaters Bounce Back From Vormir
- Thread starter ManaByte
- Start date
nush
Gold Member
It's one to put in a recommended watch order for new fans working through the MCU.
sol_bad
Member
Does it show what happens to her in Endgame or is it possible to watch Black Widow and not be spoiled?
SidViscous
Member
Post credit scene spoils it.
The movie was alright as long as you turned off your brain while watching it. The movie just had so many issues in my opinion.
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Why only brain washing females. If it is just a chemical manipulation thing wouldn't it have been smarter to brain wash some high profile male people in power.
[*]The main bad guy brain washing his own child was just weird. If he had been that cold all along why did he go through the trouble of piecing his daughter back together again.
[*]The red guardian guy was more stupid later on in the movie. Why is a guy who supposedly has some of the strength of captain america gets stuck in a prison for 20 years? He was a spy for at least 3 years and trained to fight so why did he end up being so worthless.
[*]The mother loved the girls so why didn't she try to contact them. We know she is smart and a spy so you would think she would be able to find them.
[*]For such a paranoid bad guy who runs a super spy organization why in the world would he let natasha even be in the same room as him.
[*] I'm kind of disappointed with the whole female assassin bit. Those women were pretty much just your typical mercenaries who happened to be female.
[*]When Yelena attacked the older spy shouldn't their outfits have freaked out some people since no one was dressing like them. Shouldn't they have been in some type of disguise if they are trying to find and assassinate someone.
[*] We only had one great fight scene and that was with natasha fighting the group of women. The fight with taskmaster earlier was terrible. The fight with her sister was her getting thrown everywhere for some odd reason. Their really wasn't that much fighting in the movie. Yelena fought like 3 people and one of them was natasha.
[*]Natasha pretty much spent most of the movie getting beat down and getting hurt while escaping. LIke she fell down like a 100 feet twice and pretty much had no major problems except for some bruises.
[*]Why did the air fortress fall down. It was suppose to be a gradual descent so why did it blow up?
GeorgioCostanzaX
Gold Member
Yeah exactly watch order matters a ton with the MCU it seems now especially with the series. I loved it and got some serious Winter Soldier vibes in a good way. Taskmaster was awesome and damn Florence Pugh is my new boo.
ShadowNate
Member
It's fun but a bit boring, and most of the time it lacks the strong lead performance that SJ can offer. Or maybe it was the writing. She felt mostly going through the motions, lifeless and a bit depressed (maybe she had this direction due to losing the Avengers -- yet another family). Most of the quirky lines come from other characters.
Eh, whatever. The action is fun most of the time, the three more relevant side characters are somewhat interesting and get their humouristic and more serious moments. There's one other, where it is like "who is this guy again?" and basically that's his story.
The writing is mediocre but has its moments, the plot is not anything memorable and certainly won't hold to overthinking it.
The woke stuff are kept to a basic level -- and are barely noticeable. You know, weighing in the fact that this is also a Black Widow story. I don't know what that early superwoke review was on about -- but in retrospect it seemed like it was set up to make people hate a (medium superhero tier) movie that had none of what that review claimed.
The scope of the story does not feel as big as it would like to be. When the stakes are revealed, it has a really low impact and does not create any tension.
Taskmaster turned out to be shit.
Eh, whatever. The action is fun most of the time, the three more relevant side characters are somewhat interesting and get their humouristic and more serious moments. There's one other, where it is like "who is this guy again?" and basically that's his story.
The writing is mediocre but has its moments, the plot is not anything memorable and certainly won't hold to overthinking it.
The woke stuff are kept to a basic level -- and are barely noticeable. You know, weighing in the fact that this is also a Black Widow story. I don't know what that early superwoke review was on about -- but in retrospect it seemed like it was set up to make people hate a (medium superhero tier) movie that had none of what that review claimed.
The scope of the story does not feel as big as it would like to be. When the stakes are revealed, it has a really low impact and does not create any tension.
Taskmaster turned out to be shit.
And apparently everyone in the movie can survive huge explosions right on their face (or their car). Like multiple times too.
Also, no idea what they had a bunch of grunts for security in the red room, while the Widows were all put in one room doing kata or whatever. That was a security plan set to completely fail.
Anyway, like I said no point to overthink it.
Also, no idea what they had a bunch of grunts for security in the red room, while the Widows were all put in one room doing kata or whatever. That was a security plan set to completely fail.
Anyway, like I said no point to overthink it.
Alx
Member
Yeah I was very disappointed by the movie, it's not that it's bad, it's that there's nothing good in it. Even more boring than Captain Marvel. I came in confident that there was no way they could fail at telling the usual "secret spy training origin story", but they did (or more exactly they chose anothert, less interesting story to tell).
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Hardensoul
Member
No, it’s not! I didn’t notice any woke stuff! It’s just pretty good action movie!
VenomousCoffee
Member
Watched it last night. Overall I liked it quite a bit; if I had to rank the MCU movies I'd put it in the top 1/3, for sure. Maybe top 5 or just outside it.
Pluses:
--Florence Pugh is great. She steals every scene she's in.
--David Harbour is good, too. He hams it up (in a good way).
--It looks good.
--The editing is also really good, at least for a modern movie.
--I was motivated to 'buy' it on Disney Plus when I heard people compare it to Mission Impossible. That totally holds up.
--The action sequences are definitely a step up from most MCU stuff.
--Did I mention how good Florence Pugh is?
--I usually hate the "Marvel Quips" thing, but in this movie they were all in character so they worked. Except for the post-credits scene, which did irritate me.
Minues:
--Plot holes, of course, the same as you get with every movie like this.
--ScarJo spent like 5 movies with one facial expression. Need to develop some other pitches besides the fastball, Scarlett.
--Wish we'd seen more of the actual training program the Widows went through. I'm always a sucker for that stuff.
--Same goes for seeing actual spying. LIke Winter Soldier, it's sold as a "spy movie" but it's mostly a "running down the street and kicking people" movie.
--Like most Marvel movies, it's totally asexual. I'm not calling for actual sex scenes in a Disney comic book movie, but come on guys. These are adult people, after all. The only references to sex here are met with "eww, gross" reactions from the main characters that the audience is clearly supposed to share. 24 movies, and we've had, what, 2 or 3 scenes with actual sexual chemistry between the actors (all with Cap and Peggy)?
--There are some points where the politics are really overt and clumsy. I don't need a character to state the movie's themes for me, thanks.
Edit: Just thought of another negative. There's a plot element that's basically the same as Winter Soldier and Civil War--except that in the older movies there's a ton of work put in to earn it, while here it just happens immediately, right at the beginning. I'm a big fan of the plot thing itself, but here it's badly handled because it comes too easily to the character. They don't earn it.
Overall, glad I 'bought' on Disney Plus and definitely plan to rewatch it a few times. It's not as good as Winter Soldier, but it's trying.
Pluses:
--Florence Pugh is great. She steals every scene she's in.
--David Harbour is good, too. He hams it up (in a good way).
--It looks good.
--The editing is also really good, at least for a modern movie.
--I was motivated to 'buy' it on Disney Plus when I heard people compare it to Mission Impossible. That totally holds up.
--The action sequences are definitely a step up from most MCU stuff.
--Did I mention how good Florence Pugh is?
--I usually hate the "Marvel Quips" thing, but in this movie they were all in character so they worked. Except for the post-credits scene, which did irritate me.
Minues:
--Plot holes, of course, the same as you get with every movie like this.
--ScarJo spent like 5 movies with one facial expression. Need to develop some other pitches besides the fastball, Scarlett.
--Wish we'd seen more of the actual training program the Widows went through. I'm always a sucker for that stuff.
--Same goes for seeing actual spying. LIke Winter Soldier, it's sold as a "spy movie" but it's mostly a "running down the street and kicking people" movie.
--Like most Marvel movies, it's totally asexual. I'm not calling for actual sex scenes in a Disney comic book movie, but come on guys. These are adult people, after all. The only references to sex here are met with "eww, gross" reactions from the main characters that the audience is clearly supposed to share. 24 movies, and we've had, what, 2 or 3 scenes with actual sexual chemistry between the actors (all with Cap and Peggy)?
--There are some points where the politics are really overt and clumsy. I don't need a character to state the movie's themes for me, thanks.
Edit: Just thought of another negative. There's a plot element that's basically the same as Winter Soldier and Civil War--except that in the older movies there's a ton of work put in to earn it, while here it just happens immediately, right at the beginning. I'm a big fan of the plot thing itself, but here it's badly handled because it comes too easily to the character. They don't earn it.
Overall, glad I 'bought' on Disney Plus and definitely plan to rewatch it a few times. It's not as good as Winter Soldier, but it's trying.
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Fbh
Member
Wait, so you're saying YouTube grifters were lying about the movie for monetized views?
Lol, Well I guess, haven't really looked into what they've said. But some people on youtube (and around here) loose their shit as soon as women are involved.
To me it was fine. The cast is mostly female but the movie doesn't bend over backwards to focus on the fact that they are women.
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NecrosaroIII
Ultimate DQ Fan
Who was the sister? She's a cutie
SkylineRKR
Member
Taskmaster was kinda underused. For the rest I liked the film. David Harbour knocked it out of the park.
Florence Pugh. I didn't know her either but she was good.
Florence Pugh. I didn't know her either but she was good.
ManaByte
Member
The "went toilet in my hands" line was hilarious.
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doubtful that is going to happen. This movie was pretty much filmed like right after end game so it is the last of the typical mcu movies but you can still see a tidbit of the woke stuff in it.I also have to say it was way less "woke feminist" than I expected.
Hopefully moving forward they stick to this style and less cringe shit like:
NotMyProblemAnymoreCunt
Biggest Trails Stan
Yes it is
ManaByte
Member
The people in this thread who actually watched it (as opposed to watching a Youtube video about it) don't think it is.
SkylineRKR
Member
No, its not a super feminist movie. Captain Marvel could be classified as one and even Endgame based on a few scenes, but BW keeps it at the low.
Right now listening to Malia J. Usually i'm not to big on cover songs but this one is pretty good.
Right now listening to Malia J. Usually i'm not to big on cover songs but this one is pretty good.
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ManaByte
Member
The beginning is basically The Americans but set in the MCU and the rest of the movie is basically following up with the disfunctional family after their spy mission in the US ended.
NotMyProblemAnymoreCunt
Biggest Trails Stan
I watched it
ManaByte
Member
Then explain how it's some super feminist propaganda, because the people in this thread who actually did watch it aren't seeing that.
SafeOrAlone
Banned
The next version of Taskmaster will be one of Moon Knight’s split personalities. That’s how he gets the cloak.
ManaByte
Member
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SkylineRKR
Member
I don't see how Black Widow is feminist? Its a female superhero sure. And its about brainwashed female kid soldiers who are being controlled. They're mostly beating up females, but males are also on the receiving end. I found David Harbour to be the highlight of the movie though. Winstone was rather menacing.
Captain Marvel who's clearly being molded into a lesbian and the awful no doubt track during a fight scene is feminist. But Black Widow? I think its about as feminist as Atomic Blonde, Ava and Tomb Raider. Its just a movie with a female who kicks ass. Not everything with females is feminist.
Captain Marvel who's clearly being molded into a lesbian and the awful no doubt track during a fight scene is feminist. But Black Widow? I think its about as feminist as Atomic Blonde, Ava and Tomb Raider. Its just a movie with a female who kicks ass. Not everything with females is feminist.
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ManaByte
Member
Box Office: ‘Black Widow’ Snares Huge $39.5M Friday
Marvel's Scarlett Johansson superhero pic is showing signs of doing pre-pandemic level business and could approach $90 million in its domestic debut.
www.hollywoodreporter.com
Not sure about that since they kind of hinted at the Carol/Rhodey thing from the comics during the hologram bit at the beginning of Endgame.
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NotMyProblemAnymoreCunt
Biggest Trails Stan
Oh really
You telling me that the cartoonish villian of The Red Room wasn't a obvious jab at men?
Or the fact that they changed Taskmaster gender? Because let's face it if Taskmaster was male they wouldn't want to show him as the victim of the brainwashing. In the end when Natasha freed Taskmaster of her brainwashing, do you think if Taskmaster was a male that Natasha would have just killed him?
I didn't watch any of those YouTube videos and I was looking forward to this but this movie was beyond disappointing.
I did like the action sequences but I had lot of problems with the movie that doesn't just include the feminist stuff
Or the fact that they changed Taskmaster gender? Because let's face it if Taskmaster was male they wouldn't want to show him as the victim of the brainwashing. In the end when Natasha freed Taskmaster of her brainwashing, do you think if Taskmaster was a male that Natasha would have just killed him?
I didn't watch any of those YouTube videos and I was looking forward to this but this movie was beyond disappointing.
I did like the action sequences but I had lot of problems with the movie that doesn't just include the feminist stuff
We will see if this movie is still doing good at the box office in a week or two
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ManaByte
Member
Did you ever see The Avengers from nine years ago? Both this villain and Taskmaster connect to that.
I hate what they did with Taskmaster, but what they did makes sense with how they set up Black Widow's origin back in 2012.
NotMyProblemAnymoreCunt
Biggest Trails Stan
Yes I did lol and I remember that speech
Why not make Dreykov daughter into a son? That would have been much better lol
ManaByte
Member
Showing two characters who were first mentioned nine years ago and the context of how they affected Black Widow's origin as it was mentioned nine years ago doesn't make it a feminist movie. And the fact that you'd want them to change a character who was established as a girl in the movies already into a guy in this movie just shows that you're coming at it with some kind of sad agenda and are seeing feminist propaganda where there isn't any.
Not only that, but the whole Red Room setup in this is basically Black Widow's origin from the comics. In the MCU Dreykov is just the replacement for Grigor Pchelintsov in the comics. Making Dreykov the one in charge of the Red Room, because he was mentioned in The Avengers, makes a ton more sense than introducing someone people never heard of like Pchelintsov.
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ShadowNate
Member
So.... I'm not sure if it's a running joke in the MCU, or something that started with End Game (where I first noticed), but I have to ask
What is going on with Hawkeye's hair(cuts)? It's like it's changing in every second scene he's in.
ManaByte
Member
The photo at the end is setting up the Hawkeye series, which is set more than a year after Endgame. The return of the snapped people Endgame was around the middle or so of 2023 and Hawkeye is set during Christmas 2024.
SkylineRKR
Member
Can't help to think Loki was so fucking flawless back then. I like the new series, but hes such a weak prankster there thats way too likeable. Hiddleston killed it in 2012.
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Liljagare
Member
There is always one ..
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The ancient one was pretty bad. The taskmaster was predictable for this day and age.
It could work if he had a new kid with his wife. Have the street smart kid , the smart but paranoid wife, and the idiot hero husband.
ManaByte
Member
Predictable? They whitewashed him. If anyone other than Disney/Marvel did that to a traditionally black character the Twitter mob would never stop raging until they had blood.
I am middle of the road on this, watched it via the magic of Disney ploos.
Only watched it once, but Pugh is great.
Loved the prison scene, wish there was more Red Guardian.
Didn't think it was woke or feminist.
Glad to see it doing well at the cinema.
Ties itself nicely back into the future movies / shows.
Do you think if it does really well, there is a "Bucharest" movie in the future? I know more information is given.
Only watched it once, but Pugh is great.
Loved the prison scene, wish there was more Red Guardian.
Didn't think it was woke or feminist.
Glad to see it doing well at the cinema.
Ties itself nicely back into the future movies / shows.
Do you think if it does really well, there is a "Bucharest" movie in the future? I know more information is given.
ManaByte
Member
Nah but there could be a sequel with Pugh as Black Widow after all the Thunderbolts/Dark Avengers stuff is over.
sol_bad
Member
Endgame a super feminist movie based on a 30 second shot? Are you kidding me. That shot wasn't even for feminist reasons, it was purely for fan service.
ManaByte
Member
But it had GIRLS.
The predictable portion was predicting that the taskmaster was female. At first I thought it would be the mother but after hearing about the daughter getting killed in the explosion I knew it was her. For the whitewashing I'm only vaguely aware of the character and not enough to know his race. I honestly just thought the guy was white under the mask.
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ManaByte
Member
The problem I was having with his race was that I kept googling and would get pictures of him as white. So I wasn't sure what was going on.