Support NeoGAF

[u_neek]

... but not his hands

http://www.xboxyde.com/news_1859_en.html

I’ve been lucky enough today to go in a private demonstration of Project Gotham Racing 3 with Nick Davies of Bizarre Creations. Here are my impressions from what he said and what I’ve seen.

Nick Davies first showed us a PowerPoint presentation of what they wanted to achieve in the game, with a few screenshots too, most of them already released. Here are the main points he really wanted us to understand:
- PGR3 should feel like a real sport, with real champions
- You play how you want, anywhere you want
- All cars can at least reach 170 mph, no smaller cars like VW Golf.
- Gotham TV is a very important aspect of the experience.
- There are about 4.000 spectators you can see in each track. They all react to what’s happening on the track. They can encourage or laugh at you, and of course take a few steps back in terror if you crash near them. Every animation has been motion captured.
- Every car is composed of about 40.000 polygons for the outside, and the same number for the inside. One shot I had never seen before was a fully textured model of the inside of a car, and it looked fantastic. The leather looked really realistic.
- Almost everything in the game is unlocked right from the start. Bizarre does not want to discourage people by having them tediously unlock everything for online racing.
- There will be online tournaments and a leaderboard system.
- The matching system will be very accurate, allowing good players to play with good players, and bad drivers like me to actually have a chance to have some fun.
- The kudos system will also be much more accurate, and will be able to reward you if you do a better style of power slide for example.
- Gotham TV should feel very much like a true TV channel. They want people to be able to use it as easily as a digital TV box.
- There will be some team racing and when I mentioned cooperative game play all I got was a smile and a no comment reply.

Now for the most important part of the presentation. Nick changed the input on the very nice Samsung LCD display and there it was. PGR3, running right before my eyes!
Let me state first that this was a rather old build, running on the oldest version of the black beta kits. The game was very obviously in development, with lots of graphical bugs and a very low frame rate, something like 10 or 15 FPS.
But it already looked so incredible! This was running on the same Tokyo track as shown in the latest trailer, and except for the numerous visual bugs and the very low resolution textures of this debug build, it looked exactly the same. Only this time it was playable!
Of course I did not have the chance to play myself, but Nick managed to show us a few interesting things. First and very noticeable was the awesome motion blur. Even at this low frame rate, the sense of speed was already exciting thanks to a quite natural looking motion blur. Every fast moving object on the screen was blurred very naturally and accordingly to his speed and distance from the camera. Of course other players’ cars will be blurred too. And yes I asked and it will be used in game play as well as replays.
The car was behaving very well to each bump and small jumps of the road, but it was difficult to see if it was accurate or not because of the low frame rate. Nick also detached the camera and got it to face the spectators. They are not very detailed, but they still look very nice and move very well.
We also got the chance to see the true cockpit view running and it was also excellent. It looks like there is a freelook mode that allows you to turn your viewpoint around the car, but maybe it's just the debug build. And yes every gauge was moving in the dashboard. This build did not have any sound so I can't unfortunately comment on that aspect of the game. I do not doubt it will be as good as the visuals though.
Update: I forgot to mention that we saw a few examples of the damages on the cars. They are about the same as in PGR2, mostly because it's already really difficult to get the license as it is I guess. Also there was no HUD yet in the game.
We did not get to see more of the game than one car and one track, and even with all the bugs and low frame rate, PGR3 did not fail to impress me at all. This is definitely my most awaited Xbox 360 game

 

[Gregory]

The game was very obviously in development, with lots of graphical bugs and a very low frame rate, something like 10 or 15 FPS.

 

[IJoel]

I read this and I'M SORRY but the 10-15 FPS comment JUMPED OUT and danced for me disregarding everything else.



Seriously though, that's a very VERY low framerate. I will be severely disappointed if this doesn't run at 60 fps. I'll still buy it though. PGR2 was amazing despite the 30 fps.

IBGEK

*ducks*

 

[AB 101]

About 2 1/2 months from launch.

This is not good.

 

[Borys]

The game was very obviously in development, with lots of graphical bugs and a very low frame rate, something like 10 or 15 FPS.

Why did you repeat that?

 

[Gregory]

So what was with that trailer running at 60fps ?

 

[Gregory]

Why did you repeat that?

That was the most interesting part. Just couldn`t be bothered to quote it.

 

[Geek]

The game was very obviously in development, with lots of graphical bugs and a very low frame rate, something like 10 or 15 FPS.

Let me state first that this was a rather old build, running on the oldest version of the black beta kits.

Also, is this guaranteed on launch day? It might be in the "launch window" which could mean its still another 5 months out. Don't everyone get your panties in a bunch.

 

[Stinkles]

Don't be ridiculous. If they weren't confident they were going to get the frame rate up, they wouldn't show it.


Anyway, I happen to know for a fact PGR is going to ship with a lovely frame rate SO STOP THIS SHIT NOW. Seriously. Stop it.

 

[Gregory]

Don't be ridiculous. If they weren't confident they were going to get the frame rate up, they wouldn't show it.


Anyway, I happen to know for a fact PGR is going to ship with a lovely frame rate SO STOP THIS SHIT NOW. Seriously. Stop it.

60fps lovely ? 30 isn`t lovely.

 

[Pseudo judo]

I read this and I'M SORRY but the 10-15 FPS comment JUMPED OUT and danced for me disregarding everything else.



Seriously though, that's a very VERY low framerate. I will be severely disappointed if this doesn't run at 60 fps. I'll still buy it though. PGR2 was amazing despite the 30 fps.

IBGEK

*ducks*

Why do people in this forum only read what suites their agendas and nothing else. GD drama queens.

Let me state first that this was a rather old build, running on the oldest version of the black beta kits. The game was very obviously in development, with lots of graphical bugs and a very low frame rate, something like 10 or 15 FPS.

 

[FiRez]

PGR2 was amazing despite the 30 fps.

I agree, why is that a problem?

 

[Borys]

Don't be ridiculous. If they weren't confident they were going to get the frame rate up, they wouldn't show it.


Anyway, I happen to know for a fact PGR is going to ship with a lovely frame rate SO STOP THIS SHIT NOW. Seriously. Stop it.

As you probably know there are two ways to achieve higher framerate:

a) optimize, optimize, optimize
b) scale back graphics
EDIT: c) run on final hardware (tip from Geek ;p) (well, duh!)

Which will be true for PGR3?

 

[Razoric]

Why do people in this forum only read what suites their agendas and nothing else. GD drama queens.

so every version MS is showing is some old "beta kit" version. :lol

I cant wait for TeamXbox reviews: Now this game is made using an old beta kit but its still very good and gives you a good idea what the sequel will be like. awesome stuff 4.9/5

 

[Die Squirrel Die]

Where's this Tokyo trailer they talk about, I'd like to see it?

 

[Geek]

What about "c) Run on final hardware"?

 

[IJoel]

Why do people in this forum only read what suites their agendas and nothing else. GD drama queens.

Likewise. If you bother to read my past posts you'll realize that I've always defended PGR3 and hell, even PGR2 and its 30 FPS fantastic gameplay. It's just that 10-15 fps 3 months away from launch sounds quite troubling.

As I said, I'll be getting this on launch date. It is, along with Oblivion, my Xbox 360 sellers, but I can't cover the sun with my hand. I still hope and trust they'll be able to release this at 60 FPS.

 

[quin]

Likewise. If you bother to read my past posts you'll realize that I've always defended PGR3 and hell, even PGR2 and its 30 FPS fantastic gameplay. It's just that 10-15 fps 3 months away from launch sounds quite troubling.

As I said, I'll be getting this on launch date. It is, along with Oblivion, my Xbox 360 sellers, but I can't cover the sun with my hand. I still hope and trust they'll be able to release this at 60 FPS.

did you miss the part where Blim says its an old build running on the oldest beta kit?

 

[jet1911]

Where's this Tokyo trailer they talk about, I'd like to see it?

http://www.xboxyde.com/news_1784_en.html

 

[Izzy]

The game was very obviously in development, with lots of graphical bugs and a very low frame rate, something like 10 or 15 FPS.

How unfortunate. Hopefully, they'll up it to 20-30 fps.

First and very noticeable was the awesome motion blur. Even at this low frame rate, the sense of speed was already exciting thanks to a quite natural looking motion blur. Every fast moving object on the screen was blurred very naturally and accordingly to his speed and distance from the camera. Of course other players’ cars will be blurred too. And yes I asked and it will be used in game play as well as replays.

Excellent.

 

[dark10x]

I agree, why is that a problem?

Why is 30 fps a problem? You're not serious, right?

 

[u_neek]

Bizarre menitioned several times that they're aiming for 60 fps!

 

[Razoric]

did you miss the part where Blim says its an old build running on the oldest beta kit?

cling to that till the very end. :lol

 

[quin]

cling to that till the very end. :lol

cling to the fact that bizarre is going to to ship this in that condition then....

 

[FiRez]

Why is 30 fps a problem? You're not serious, right?

eh....that was my point, 30 fps isn't a problem at all in PGR2

 

[IJoel]

did you miss the part where Blim says its an old build running on the oldest beta kit?

Think about it. It's a BETA kit. No more 30% of the power (isn't it 80% or so supposedly?) They are 3 months away from launch, which leaves them with 2.5 months for development. They game runs at 10-15 FPS. I don't doubt they'll make a locked 30 FPS. But a jump from 15 FPS to 60 FPS is quite significant.

Anyway... we got this out of the way.

Now, I want videos Bizarre!

 

[Blimblim]

Nick would not state anything about 60 fps, but he seemed very confident they'd manage to do it.
And like I think I said, this was an old build (more than one month) running on the first version of the beta hardware. Nick told us they were already using a new version of the kits.

 

[dark10x]

eh....that was my point, 30 fps isn't a problem at all in PGR2

Speak for yourself. In a racer, 30 fps is a major problem. I can still enjoy a 30 fps racer, but it becomes a much better experience at 60. I think PGR1 looks and plays better as a result (I couldn't get into PGR2 at all, actually).

I firmly believe that PGR3 will be 60 fps, though. If, for some reason, it is not 60 fps, though, I will not buy it. Plain and simple. I'm not a big enough fan of the series to bother with it unless it is 60 fps. If this were a part of a favorite series of mine, I could deal with it, but I'd still be very disappointed.

 

[fiddlestick]

why would they show the game on old kits when the console is ready? :lol

something fishy is going on..

 

[Gregory]

Bizarre menitioned several times that they're aiming for 60 fps!

Which they also did with PGR2.

DICE for example said outright that RSC2 was gonna ship at 60fps. Which it did. They took out some graphical effects here and there in some races, mostly car shadows which nobody really noticed. They delivered.

 

[newsguy]

Damn you GAF. You guys are focusing on an old build and complaining about a low framerate. With all of this complaining no one mentioned that THERE'S A TRUE IN-GAME COCKPIT VIEW!!!! This wasn't confirmed and Blim confirmed it (complete with moving gauges!)

 

[Blimblim]

why would they show the game on old kits when the console is ready? :lol

something fishy is going on..

Because Bizarre did not have any spare new kit available, so they took an older one. This presentation was AFAIK a very last minute decision from MS. Ho, and who said the console was 100% done?
Newsguy: Actually this was confirmed before.

 

[Spider_Jerusalem]

About 2 1/2 months from launch.

This is not good.

Let me state first that this was a rather old build, running on the oldest version of the black beta kits

However, the part about realtime blur is really interesting. I already had non problems with PGR2 running at 30fps, so I think that PGR3 at 30fps + realtime blur will be great for me

 

[PhatSaqs]

People just love to be negative.

 

[newsguy]

Newsguy: Actually this was confirmed before.

Really, then it's new to me. Up until now I didn't know if those screens were replay angles only or in-game.

 

[Trustus Jones]

why would they show the game on old kits when the console is ready? :lol

something fishy is going on..

Perhaps because they wanted to actually concentrate on finishing the game rather than wasting time diverting resources to get the code running on a retail xbox360 that is only gonna be shown behind closed doors anyway.

Please lets not go down this 60fps route again as it`s already been discussed to death.

 

[DCX]

Big deal...10-15fps and it's not done...wait until the retail copy comes out then we'll talk or should i say, debate.

DCX

 

[Gregory]

Damn you GAF. You guys are focusing on an old build and complaining about a low framerate. With all of this complaining no one mentioned that THERE'S A TRUE IN-GAME COCKPIT VIEW!!!! This wasn't confirmed and Blim confirmed it (complete with moving gauges!)

Cockpit view is pointless and a waste of recources. Research show less than 10% use this viewpoint anyway.

 

[Funky Papa]

People just love to be negative.

Nah, just some of them. Make a post search of those who are being negative.

Oh, teh surprises!!!1!

 

[Pimpwerx]

eh....that was my point, 30 fps isn't a problem at all in PGR2

Racers *prefer* 60fps. It's simply smoother. You can play the game at 30fps. A lot of racers are at that framerate. But when you play it at 60fps, it's hard to go back. Hopefully PGR3 hits that target. It looks phenomenal oterwise. PEACE.

 

[SolidSnakex]

Cockpit view is pointless and a waste of recources. Research show less than 10% use this viewpoint anyway.

Probably because less than 5% of racers have a real cockpit view.

 

[newsguy]

Cockpit view is pointless and a waste of recources. Research show less than 10% use this viewpoint anyway.

With individually modeled interiors for every car, it will suck to be out of that 10%

 

[Gattsu25]

with a decent motion blur, they can get the game running at (barely) below 30FPS speeds and still not loose their sense of speed

 

[Stinkles]

Cockpit view is pointless and a waste of recources. Research show less than 10% use this viewpoint anyway.

Jesus. Gek, come back, all is forgiven.

 

[truffleshuffle83]

i think with motion blur and the engine sounds they have, the feel of speed should be no problem

 

[Kabuki Waq]

as long as its a constant 10fps ill be happy.

 

[Gregory]

Probably because less than 5% of racers have a real cockpit view.

Perhaps, but DICE for example said they included the cockpit view because of the fans` request but found out less than 10% used it during gameplay.

I wouldn`t spent my resources at it. But hey, Bizarre did. That`s ok, as long as it doesn`t drop to 30fps because of it.

 

[op_ivy]

bah, i have no worries. bizarre sounds quite confident the game wil be 60fps, they just cant say 100% yet (and wont be able to till the game ships).

 

[Blimblim]

Perhaps, but DICE for example said they included the cockpit view because of the fans` request but found out less than 10% used it during gameplay.

I wouldn`t spent my resources at it. But hey, Bizarre did. That`s ok, as long as it doesn`t drop to 30fps because of it.

Rallisport is simply (IMHO) unplayable with the cockpit view. You simply can't drive when everything is going that fast and you have to slide your way through a narrow corner. It's much simpler if you know exactly where each 4 corners of the car are.
In PGR2 I play only in cockpit mode, it's simpler with this view to really know where the apex of the corner is.

 

[Gregory]

Rallisport is simply (IMHO) unplayable with the cockpit view. You simply can't drive when everything is going that fast and you have to slide your way through a narrow corner. It's much simpler if you know exactly where each 4 corners of the car are.
In PGR2 I play only in cockpit mode, it's simpler with this view to really know where the apex of the corner is.

Is there even a cockpit view in PGR2 ? RSC2 has the best cockpit view I`ve seen so far actually, together with World Racing and Toca 2.