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[Minamu]

I've been mostly using the Cane for all three playthroughs, chalices, and the DLC. Only used few other weapons against some bosses, like Rom, Ebrietas, Abhorrent Beast and DLC's final boss. It's just so satisfying to swing the pimp Cane. =)

Here's a guide sheet for the chalices. I don't remember where I found the +21% non-cursed gems. You can find up to +27.2% cursed gems as well. I haven't really searched particular gems from the chalices myself either, only the Ring of Betrothal, Clawmark +30% rune, and the two Cane variants.

Nice, thanks, I'll check that out

That would be me.

Holy shit at that STR and SKL. Do they even do much after 50? Also 500k echoes per level up, damn. What NG+ are you on?

Heeey Sorry, haven't played the game since then or I'd post sooner! Yeah I'm impressed at my own stats, I've never gotten even cloae to this in the Souls games. They don't do much more damage no, I get one point of damage increase every other point so it's pretty pointless. But leveling up is still pretty easy, even at 500k+. With the proper runes, I get probably 80k per pig at Mergo's plus all the ninjas. So with all pigs, that's more than half a level per run quite easily even at my level. I'm on ng+4 or 5, I honestly don't remember anymore xD

Not sure how but maybe around level 240 or so, I sometimes got everything from 250k to almost 400k per pvp win :O So that leveled me up really fast. I even met the same guy like 5 times in combat one night and I gained like 1-2 levels inbetween each fight we had (thanks to others) so I even taunted him with the fact that each encounter with him made me stronger :lol Good times, best pvp experiences in this game across all Souls games for me.

Fake Edit: Just about every level up from maybe 230 to 256 was from pure pvp in nightmare frontier, much quicker than running through the main game.

 

[Zank Frappa]

Considering only the main quest line, how far am I into the game?

Spoiler

Today I beat Rom the Vacuous Spider, after that I beat Darkbeast Paarl, then The One Reborn and now I'm at Nightmare Frontier, about to face Amygdala. I haven't beaten the Cainhurst Castle boss yet. Should I go for him now or do him after Amygdala? Anyway, I plan on doing as much of the game as possible but I was wondering how far I'm into the game. Like halfway? A little under or over the half?

 

[GwyndolinCinder]

Considering only the main quest line, how far am I into the game?

Spoiler

Today I beat Rom the Vacuous Spider, after that I beat Darkbeast Paarl, then The One Reborn and now I'm at Nightmare Frontier, about to face Amygdala. I haven't beaten the Cainhurst Castle boss yet. Should I go for him now or do him after Amygdala? Anyway, I plan on doing as much of the game as possible but I was wondering how far I'm into the game. Like halfway? A little under or over the half?

Main quest you are almost finished, bb main is very short.

 

[Zank Frappa]

Main quest you are almost finished, bb main is very short.

Wow! Okay. What if you take in all optional bosses into account? Still almost finished?

 

[Stat!]

Hey, I put down the game many months when I got stuck in the part with the chime maiden, the thing throwing stuff at you from above, and the spiders at the Nightmare of Mensis.

Anyone willing to co-op the rest of the game with me?

I love the lore, discovery, and the environments but Im not very good and want to finish before Dark Souls 3..

 

[GwyndolinCinder]

Wow! Okay. What if you take in all optional bosses into account? Still almost finished?

Well there's probably one more secret area with bosses you don't know about, and the chalice dungeon are worth doing once for the unique bosses.if you have dlc beat that before finishing the main story.

 

[Sulik2]

Ok just figured out why I missed most of the quests. Apparently warping through a torch doesn't make npcs move to the next location in a quest line. You have to fully quit the game. I use rest mode so I never do that. Stupid, stupid design decision there.

 

[ColdPizza]

Wow. Just started this last night. Took awhile to get up to speed. My first souls game. Just beat cleric beast.

Love the stun with gun then visceral combo. So satisfying.

Edit: how does coop work?

 

[Jack Scofield]

Is it worth upgrading the Beast Cutter? I'm loving it so far but haven't done much high-level content with it. It just makes the most satisfying sound and looks like it hits HARD.

 

[Veelk]

Hm... I want to ask, what is the general consensus on the story/storytelling. I'll make my own thread discussing bloodborne where I'll post my own thoughts there, but I'm part way through Paleblood Moon and having conflicting feelings on it. What are everyone else's?

 

[RyanardoDaVinci]

Hm... I want to ask, what is the general consensus on the story/storytelling. I'll make my own thread discussing bloodborne where I'll post my own thoughts there, but I'm part way through Paleblood Moon and having conflicting feelings on it. What are everyone else's?

What I took away from the story, as presented and experienced during my first playthrough:

Spoiler

I got blood, I have to kill things for reasons, annoying cage-head won't shut the fuck up, I slay a nightmare(?), kill an old guy and an alien descends from the moon and I kill it and then I was a squid.

As far as I'm concerned, there is no story and the game would be better off without one; just kill shit and die a lot.

What is so obtusely presented makes hardly any sense on the surface. You shouldn't have to read a 100+ page essay to understand (vaguely) what is happening to the world and you.

 

[Nerokis]

As far as I'm concerned, there is no story and the game would be better off without one; just kill shit and die a lot.

What is so obtusely presented makes hardly any sense on the surface. You shouldn't have to read a 100+ page essay to understand (vaguely) what is happening to the world and you.

I couldn't disagree more with this. I love that Bloodborne leaves so much to the imagination. If you don't care to dive into the story and sort everything out, that's fine, but that sense of choice in the way you approach the story is also a strength of the game, in my eyes. If you do want to piece things together, and come to your own conclusions, there's lore to be found almost everywhere: item descriptions, notes, details in the environment, NPCs, even gameplay mechanics sometimes hint at the nature of things. But Bloodborne is very conducive toward interesting lore discussions, especially if you're into Lovecraftian stuff, and it makes sense that engaging with the community will usually heighten your understanding. The Paleblood Hunt is just an impressive example of that. You don't need it to come up with plausible answers of your own.

I believe in the idea that it can be okay to end a game (/book/movie/show/etc.) with an incomplete understanding of what happened, or even straight up confused. The problem is when something doesn't really reward you for trying to understand its story. That's not at all the case here.

 

[Zank Frappa]

Did we forget to use the Spoiler tag? Geez..

 

[Red Liquorice]

Hm... I want to ask, what is the general consensus on the story/storytelling. I'll make my own thread discussing bloodborne where I'll post my own thoughts there, but I'm part way through Paleblood Moon and having conflicting feelings on it. What are everyone else's?

I think it's the best story of any of the Souls games and a genuinely fascinating, layered and unique story in it's own right. The mix of gameplay and environment to tell the story beats even DS1 imo, I think it really shows Miyazaki at his best. Which is why I don't want a sequel

 

[Negrodamus]

Anyone down to help me out at Father G? Started a new build and forgot how difficult this guy could get -_-.

 

[Melchiah]

What I took away from the story, as presented and experienced during my first playthrough:

I got blood, I have to kill things for reasons,

Spoiler

annoying cage-head won't shut the fuck up, I slay a nightmare(?), kill an old guy and an alien descends from the moon and I kill it and then I was a squid.

As far as I'm concerned, there is no story and the game would be better off without one; just kill shit and die a lot.

What is so obtusely presented makes hardly any sense on the surface. You shouldn't have to read a 100+ page essay to understand (vaguely) what is happening to the world and you.

Eventhough the game was released nearly a year ago, you could have used spoiler tags as there were several posts before yours, that clearly mentioned being in the midst of the first playthrough.

You don't need to read The Paleblood Hunt essay to understand the story, after all, the person who wrote it understood it as well. You need to pay attention, and read the item descriptions though.

 

[Zank Frappa]

Spoiler

I become a freakin' squid, great. I don't mind being spoilered, but I also kind of fucking do.

 

[Veelk]

You don't need to read The Paleblood Hunt essay to understand the story, after all, the person who wrote it understood it as well. You need to pay attention, and read the item descriptions though.

That's kind of like saying "Astrophysics isn't that complicated, after all Neil Degrasse Tyson understands it just fine".

What the guy is referring to more is accessibility than difficulty. With Bloodborne, to understand it, you just need to pay careful attention to item descriptions, make inferences on all information that you are presented with at all times, and pull all that together into one cohesive whole to have even an inkling of comprehension about wtf is going on, which is only really possible after the fact of the game. That a person who clearly dedicated a lot of time and study to Bloodborne understands doesn't mean it is accessible to people in general. After all, if it were, he wouldn't need to write the Palemoon Hunt in the first place. Everyone would know what went on.

Now, whether that is a good or bad thing is up to you, but you can't really brush off accusations of inscrutability at Bloodborne, because it is a highly inscrutable game. That it can be descruitinized with time, effort, and energy doesn't change that.

 

[Melchiah]

That's kind of like saying "Astrophysics isn't that complicated, after all Neil Degrasse Tyson understands it just fine".

What the guy is referring to more is accessibility than difficulty. With Bloodborne, to understand it, you just need to pay careful attention to item descriptions, make inferences on all information that you are presented with at all times, and pull all that together into one cohesive whole to have even an inkling of comprehension about wtf is going on, which is only really possible after the fact of the game. That a person who clearly dedicated a lot of time and study to Bloodborne understands doesn't mean it is accessible to people in general. After all, if it were, he wouldn't need to write the Palemoon Hunt in the first place. Everyone would know what went on.

Now, whether that is a good or bad thing is up to you, but you can't really brush off accusations of inscrutability at Bloodborne, because it is a highly inscrutable game. That it can be descruitinized with time, effort, and energy doesn't change that.

Understanding the story doesn't really demand a degree in astrophysics.

It definitely demands some effort, but to say there's no story, or that it's mandatory to read the essay to understand it, is an exaggeration. Not to mention, the idea that it would be better without a story, which is in contradiction with the aforementioned sentiment; if it already has no story, how could it be better without one?

I think it's safe to say, that many fans love the way the story is told, how it's open to interpretation, and rewards the effort put into it. It feeds the imagination, and is a welcome change from games that tend to spoon-feed the story. It's also how Miyazaki tends to approach storytelling. It's fine if you don't like it, but you should acknowledge that it's one of the reasons why many like his games.


EDIT: On a side note, this would be a fitting monster for the game. =)

 

[Veelk]

Understanding the story doesn't really demand a degree in astrophysics.

Neither does Astrophysics. A job in astrophysics requires one. But simply understanding the mechanics is another matter. All you need to do is order a textbook, or get in a library, or just look online and start reading. All the information you need is there, it's not like Astrophysicists are a cult that hide secret formulas for only those who get accepted in it's ranks. All you need to master Astrophysics in this day and age, and most endevours, including bloodborne, is time and effort. Practical experience helps too, and you can find a lab to work in I guess so you can get your hands on better equipment, I guess, but that's the only limitation you have that you can't get online. And anyway, what is a degree but a paper that states you put time and effort into studying a field(while also paying an institute handsomely for the privilege)?

It definitely demands some effort, but to say there's no story, or that it's mandatory to read the essay to understand it, is an exaggeration. Not to mention, the idea that it would be better without a story, which is in contradiction with the aforementioned sentiment; if it already has no story, how could it be better without one?

I think it's safe to say, that many fans love the way the story is told, how it's open to interpretation, and rewards the effort put into it. It feeds the imagination, and is a welcome change from games that tend to spoon-feed the story. It's also how Miyazaki tends to approach storytelling. It's fine if you don't like it, but you should acknowledge that it's one of the reasons why many like his games.

Yeah, I don't endorse his whole post. I was just rebuffing the idea that it was easy to do so long as you just 'payed attention' as if it were just a think anyone could do in an effortless manner. It goes beyond 'some' effort. First is a great deal of reading (especially if you don't have all the items on you and have to go hunting for them. It could take hours to get it). In addition to that, you have to add in any other potentially pertinent information you find while playing, without knowing whats relevant or not. To accumulate everything would require atleast 2 playthroughs. Then you have to organize all that information into a cohesive whole. Then you have to fill in the blanks with the best possible inferences. To do this requires a large amount of time dedication and study. It's more than 'some' effort. While they might be wrong about there not being a story, it's hard for me to blame a person who walks away with such an assumption. Doing it all blind would be an extreme amount of work. Which is why the Paleblood Hunt got written in the first place. So the story becomes accessible to people who don't want to or aren't able to fulfill the extreme requirements to understand the story.

I feel like some Souls fans get stuck in the hardcore mentality and forget that not every has the time or inclination to get into the game as deeply as others. I've noticed it before I played BB in other souls threads, and it comes up now and then here too. Which makes sense, it's a BB community thread, so the casual BB fans just moved on while the hardcore stick around here for the most part. I think the reasons that hardcore fans get a kick out of it is because the game rewards the hardcore mentality, which I understand. It's a kind of exclusive reward that you get for your efforts. But the Hardcore mentalty, by definition, is not the normal mentality that most people have. You can't expect them to get it.

 

[Soulhouf]

EDIT: On a side note, this would be a fitting monster for the game. =)

"Grant us eyes, grant us eyes. Plant eyes on our brains, to cleanse our beastly idiocy."

 

[Minamu]

Wow. Just started this last night. Took awhile to get up to speed. My first souls game. Just beat cleric beast.

Love the stun with gun then visceral combo. So satisfying.

Edit: how does coop work?

I don't think anyone has helped you yet.

Now that you've beaten Cleric Beast, you should have some "Insight" points (small number below your echoes, top right corner). That means that a small hidden shop has opened where you level up (at the house/doll where you woke up before). There you can buy some coop items. Long story short, you activate one of these two items when you want to coop.

If you want to join someone else and beat *their* boss, you use one of the items, a small bell. There's a scaling system in place for who you can join of course, and you can't join someone who has already beaten the boss in the area you're standing in. As a helper, your life bar will be shorter than usual but if you win against a boss without you or the host dying, you get an Insight point. There's no loss to dying, you just teleport back to your own world and you keep your echoes too. You gain a smaller amount of echoes per kill as a helper though but other than that, coop as much as you'd like

If you want help with *your* boss though, you can use a larger bell from the shop and it costs one Insight point for each helper you summon (I think two is the max plus any annoying invaders). You get the points back if no one answers your call, and possibly if you beat the boss, I'm not sure right now. Once a boss is dead, the helpers go back to their own world automatically.

If you want to play with friends, there's a password system you can use to make sure you summon the right person, and the scaling system for your levels is much more friendly too (as in, hardly active at all, if one player is too OP, he or she gets nerfed to appropriate levels). Just make sure you stand in roughly the same spot as the one you want to join etc, as the game looks at your positioning a lot to connect you properly, even within the same boss area. Around boss doors or lamps are good starting points.

You should gain plenty of Insight from bosses and items and just generally discovering new areas throughout your game so it's rarely an issue. It's also a reward in pvp wins and it costs nothing to try to invade someone either.

Oh, there's also a guild/faction system in play, where different factions may end up as hostiles even if summoned as helpers but it's more of a later game thing and it hardly ever comes into play at all, for better or worse. I think that covers it pretty well

Edit: The prices for getting the coop items may or may not be pretty steep, I think they changed the costs in a patch but I'm not sure. Maybe someone else can confirm or look at a wiki

 

[Melchiah]

Neither does Astrophysics. A job in astrophysics requires one. But simply understanding the mechanics is another matter. All you need to do is order a textbook, or get in a library, or just look online and start reading. All the information you need is there, it's not like Astrophysicists are a cult that hide secret formulas for only those who get accepted in it's ranks. All you need to master Astrophysics in this day and age, and most endevours, including bloodborne, is time and effort. Practical experience helps too, and you can find a lab to work in I guess so you can get your hands on better equipment, I guess, but that's the only limitation you have that you can't get online. And anyway, what is a degree but a paper that states you put time and effort into studying a field(while also paying an institute handsomely for the privilege)?



Yeah, I don't endorse his whole post. I was just rebuffing the idea that it was easy to do so long as you just 'payed attention' as if it were just a think anyone could do in an effortless manner. It goes beyond 'some' effort. First is a great deal of reading (especially if you don't have all the items on you and have to go hunting for them. It could take hours to get it). In addition to that, you have to add in any other potentially pertinent information you find while playing, without knowing whats relevant or not. To accumulate everything would require atleast 2 playthroughs. Then you have to organize all that information into a cohesive whole. Then you have to fill in the blanks with the best possible inferences. To do this requires a large amount of time dedication and study. It's more than 'some' effort. While they might be wrong about there not being a story, it's hard for me to blame a person who walks away with such an assumption. Doing it all blind would be an extreme amount of work. Which is why the Paleblood Hunt got written in the first place. So the story becomes accessible to people who don't want to or aren't able to fulfill the extreme requirements to understand the story.

I feel like some Souls fans get stuck in the hardcore mentality and forget that not every has the time or inclination to get into the game as deeply as others. I've noticed it before I played BB in other souls threads, and it comes up now and then here too. Which makes sense, it's a BB community thread, so the casual BB fans just moved on while the hardcore stick around here for the most part. I think the reasons that hardcore fans get a kick out of it is because the game rewards the hardcore mentality, which I understand. It's a kind of exclusive reward that you get for your efforts. But the Hardcore mentalty, by definition, is not the normal mentality that most people have. You can't expect them to get it.

That comparison exaggerates the supposed difficulty of understanding the story. All you need to do is to play the game, and spend some time to inspect what's been given to you. If you don't want to bother and skip most of it, its no wonder you might have trouble seeing what it's all about.

It doesn't require two playthroughs, as you can see and get every piece of the puzzle on a single playthrough, if you want to. Like I did, when I played it the first time following web guides regarding NPCs and optional areas. I very rarily play games through twice, so I wanted to experience everything on the first run.

Regarding "hardcore Souls fans", I don't really fit the label, as BB is the only Miyazaki game I've ever completed. I've admired the audiovisual side of his games for years, but Demon's Souls was too frustrating for me at the time. Eventhough I was a Souls virgin, understanding the story and the gameplay mechanics in BB wasn't that hard for me. I just inspected the areas, and read what's been given to me, like I do with all games. Of course I still missed some things, and that's where the essay, and ENB's and Vaati's videos, come handy, as they might shed some light on little details you missed, but it's not like they're mandatory for understanding the whole. I think they're more directed to those, who can't get enough of the game even after completing it.

I get a kick out of storytelling, that's open to interpretation, and involves some mystery. Something that gives a sense of wonder when you connect the dots, like Silent Hill 2 did back then with its symbolism. It doesn't have to spell out or display everything, and in that regard BB is faithful to Lovecraft's novels.

 

[ColdPizza]

Wow. Beat Papa G on my 5th try. Got a very timely visceral attack in while in beast mode and then just finished him off with a Molotov cocktail. The game...it just clicked for me.

 

[Screaming Meat]

Wow. Beat Papa G on my 5th try. Got a very timely visceral attack in while in beast mode and then just finished him off with a Molotov cocktail. The game...it just clicked for me.

Yeeeeeeeea booooiiiiii!

That's kind of like saying "Astrophysics isn't that complicated, after all Neil Degrasse Tyson understands it just fine".

I'm sorry but that's an absolutely terrible analogy, man.

 

[RyanardoDaVinci]

I don't care for the story and don't care if there is one because to me, this game (Soulsborne in general) is Kill Crazy Monsters: The Game. The story is completely superfluous, it serves no purpose other than its basic foundation of "stuff happened, investigate why."

I take it at face value, i.e. what is shown to me in the cutscenes is the story. A hundred sentence-long item descriptions mean nothing to me. It's great that people love what the Soulsborne series does with story, if they enjoy analyzing every tiny bit of text and lore to get a deeper/clearer understanding of each game... more power to them, I respect and understand that drive. I used to do that to every game when I was younger; spending hours upon hours scouring the internet for every bit of information and discussion on X game/series. I'm tired of doing that, I play games now to escape the shit of life. I don't want to do any extra work.

I don't knock the game any points for having an obtuse story, it's just that at the end of it all, I watch the credits roll like this:

Did we forget to use the Spoiler tag? Geez..

Yes, we did.

Sorry, man. It was late and I was on mobile, I always forget that on mobile.

 

[JadedWriter]

I too look at Souls games as "Slay crazy distorted beasts" the game. I know there's lore but I don't exactly care enough to dive into it, that's what ENB is for or Silver Mont or whomever.

 

[ColdPizza]

I don't think anyone has helped you yet.

Now that you've beaten Cleric Beast, you should have some "Insight" points (small number below your echoes, top right corner). That means that a small hidden shop has opened where you level up (at the house/doll where you woke up before). There you can buy some coop items. Long story short, you activate one of these two items when you want to coop.

If you want to join someone else and beat *their* boss, you use one of the items, a small bell. There's a scaling system in place for who you can join of course, and you can't join someone who has already beaten the boss in the area you're standing in. As a helper, your life bar will be shorter than usual but if you win against a boss without you or the host dying, you get an Insight point. There's no loss to dying, you just teleport back to your own world and you keep your echoes too. You gain a smaller amount of echoes per kill as a helper though but other than that, coop as much as you'd like

If you want help with *your* boss though, you can use a larger bell from the shop and it costs one Insight point for each helper you summon (I think two is the max plus any annoying invaders). You get the points back if no one answers your call, and possibly if you beat the boss, I'm not sure right now. Once a boss is dead, the helpers go back to their own world automatically.

If you want to play with friends, there's a password system you can use to make sure you summon the right person, and the scaling system for your levels is much more friendly too (as in, hardly active at all, if one player is too OP, he or she gets nerfed to appropriate levels). Just make sure you stand in roughly the same spot as the one you want to join etc, as the game looks at your positioning a lot to connect you properly, even within the same boss area. Around boss doors or lamps are good starting points.

You should gain plenty of Insight from bosses and items and just generally discovering new areas throughout your game so it's rarely an issue. It's also a reward in pvp wins and it costs nothing to try to invade someone either.

Oh, there's also a guild/faction system in play, where different factions may end up as hostiles even if summoned as helpers but it's more of a later game thing and it hardly ever comes into play at all, for better or worse. I think that covers it pretty well

Edit: The prices for getting the coop items may or may not be pretty steep, I think they changed the costs in a patch but I'm not sure. Maybe someone else can confirm or look at a wiki

Awesome, thanks for this.

 

[Veelk]

I'm sorry but that's an absolutely terrible analogy, man.

In what way? I've seen a lot of people remark at apologies being bad because of feature differences when the purpose of an analogy is functional similarities, which I think are on point in the context of the conversation.

That comparison exaggerates the supposed difficulty of understanding the story. All you need to do is to play the game, and spend some time to inspect what's been given to you. If you don't want to bother and skip most of it, its no wonder you might have trouble seeing what it's all about.

It doesn't require two playthroughs, as you can see and get every piece of the puzzle on a single playthrough, if you want to. Like I did, when I played it the first time following web guides regarding NPCs and optional areas. I very rarily play games through twice, so I wanted to experience everything on the first run.

Regarding "hardcore Souls fans", I don't really fit the label, as BB is the only Miyazaki game I've ever completed. I've admired the audiovisual side of his games for years, but Demon's Souls was too frustrating for me at the time. Eventhough I was a Souls virgin, understanding the story and the gameplay mechanics in BB wasn't that hard for me. I just inspected the areas, and read what's been given to me, like I do with all games. Of course I still missed some things, and that's where the essay, and ENB's and Vaati's videos, come handy, as they might shed some light on little details you missed, but it's not like they're mandatory for understanding the whole. I think they're more directed to those, who can't get enough of the game even after completing it.

I get a kick out of storytelling, that's open to interpretation, and involves some mystery. Something that gives a sense of wonder when you connect the dots, like Silent Hill 2 did back then with its symbolism. It doesn't have to spell out or display everything, and in that regard BB is faithful to Lovecraft's novels.

I guess I can't honestly tell you how much of the story I'd have gotten on my own. Since I got spoiled in a hundred small ways just looking up limited information like where weapons are, I decided "fuck it" and read lore videos for everything I defeated. So how much I would have gotten by the end of it in my own is only my own estimation. Having read most of the descriptions and stuff though, I feel. I wouldn't have much of an idea though.

Anyway, I'm not arguing that it's good or bad. That's a discussion for another day. It's just, without a doubt, difficult.

 

[Dahbomb]

That Astrophysics analogy IS terrible.

Bloodborne's story isn't complex or highly intricate... it's just obtusely presented. Where as astrophysics is presented as clear as day but it's insanely complex and intricate. You need a great deal of fundamental knowledge to understand astrophysics at the top level... you don't need to have mastered English literature to understand BB's story. What you need is time invested to understand it.

And you should know that stuff like the Paleblood and Vaatidya videos do have a good deal of theoretical stuff in them. There is nothing wrong with that of course, you can make a good story where the interpretation is open to the reader/viewer but just know that it applies to various aspects of BB too.

 

[Orochinagis]

Yes, the history is made up to be ambiguos as much as it can for the purpose of feed the comunity as much as the history goes, the DLC make the things worse if you think about the nature of the nightmares.

 

[Veelk]

What you need is time invested to understand it.

And that is precisely the functionality of the argument I was referring to, and while the difficulty is a featural aspect. That all you need is time and effort to study both. There is nothing preventing you from studying astrophysics to a master level like NDT. Of course, the challenges between the two will be different, but the way in which to solve them, time and effort, is the same. You sit your ass down and study the material.

There was a good thread explaining it better than I am right now by a mod or former mod that pointed out how people often mistakenly object to analogies by focusing on apparently feature differences when the focus should be on the relevant similarity defined by the context. I've been looking for it for a while, but I haven't been able to find it. Another example I've read in logic books is people pointing out the an analogy between baseballs and oranges is invalid because tastes, colors, or insides even when the statement was "you can throw thr orange like a baseball", making the size and roundness the relevant features rather than the other stuff.

 

[Soulhouf]

The thing I like the most in Bloodborne, and I think it managed to do it better than Demon's and Dark Souls, is how the world the story and the gameplay make a coherent whole.
The story is like a gigantic and incomplete puzzle, which even if the player manages to assemble, there are still missing pieces. There are multiple layers here. Assembling all the pieces is an achievement on its own let alone filling in the blanks. The story itself is like a game because the player is no longer a simple spectator but contributes in its development.
As with the gameplay, assimilating the story of Bloodborne requires a lot of investment. You need to pay close attention to everything, be creative and make connections between the clues you find.
Of course you don't need to do all that since there are people who did it before you. So if you can't invest the necessary time you can read and watch what others discovered but I'm not like that because I think the discovery is so important in these games. That's why I always go blind.

There are a reason why I spent more than 1000 hours in this game already, because it's a very rich game. I love discovering new things to do, make connections.
The Souls formula involving a certain amount of challenge, the intense battle system. The vague but concrete story which brilliantly contributes to attracting player's morbid curiosity. The fantastic art direction and the excellent adaptation of Lovecraft's cosmic horror. That's why Bloodborne is so fascinating to me.

(I still didn't read the Pale Blood Hunt if you're wondering because I think I'm not ready yet to do it).

 

[Orochinagis]

The thing I like the most in Bloodborne, and I think it managed to do it better than Demon's and Dark Souls, is how the world the story and the gameplay make a coherent whole.
The story is like a gigantic and incomplete puzzle, which even if the player manages to assemble, there are still missing pieces. There are multiple layers here. Assembling all the pieces is an achievement on its own let alone filling in the blanks. The story itself is like a game because the player is no longer a simple spectator but contributes in its development.
As with the gameplay, assimilating the story of Bloodborne requires a lot of investment. You need to pay close attention to everything, be creative and make connections between the clues you find.
Of course you don't need to do all that since there are people who did it before you. So if you can't invest the necessary time you can read and watch what others discovered but I'm not like that because I think the discovery is so important in these games. That's why I always go blind.

There are a reason why I spent more than 1000 hours in this game already, because it's a very rich game. I love discovering new things to do, make connections.
The Souls formula involving a certain amount of challenge, the intense battle system. The vague but concrete story which brilliantly contributes to attracting player's morbid curiosity. The fantastic art direction and the excellent adaptation of Lovecraft's cosmic horror. That's why Bloodborne is so fascinating to me.

(I still didn't read the Pale Blood Hunt if you're wondering because I think I'm not ready yet to do it).

You better not read it, since his writing is not a fact but his ideas plastered after playing BB , later he fixed his writing because some ideas were so wrong.

He is the only one who went that deep in that matter to write an essay

 

[Veelk]

I'm reading it now and he separates chapters between fact and his interpretations. Should I just read the former?

 

[Raptor]

Defiled Dungeon is kicking my ass, particularly that Fire Dog goddamn.

The half life bar is kinda to much I think.

Im also using my +10 Pizza Cutter because using the claw build in this is insta death on any strike I get.

 

[Orochinagis]

Defiled Dungeon is kicking my ass, particularly that Fire Dog goddamn.

The half life bar is kinda to much I think.

Im also using my +10 Pizza Cutter because using the claw build in this is insta death on any strike I get.

You just have to worry about on of his attacks, the rest of his pattern is predictable to evade. I dont think you can stun him that much and have room to evade with the pizza cutter

 

[OniBaka]

I laughed a lot to this.

https://gfycat.com/DefensivePoisedAmericanwarmblood

 

[Weltall Zero]

Nice, thanks, I'll check that out

Heeey Sorry, haven't played the game since then or I'd post sooner! Yeah I'm impressed at my own stats, I've never gotten even cloae to this in the Souls games. They don't do much more damage no, I get one point of damage increase every other point so it's pretty pointless. But leveling up is still pretty easy, even at 500k+. With the proper runes, I get probably 80k per pig at Mergo's plus all the ninjas. So with all pigs, that's more than half a level per run quite easily even at my level. I'm on ng+4 or 5, I honestly don't remember anymore xD

Not sure how but maybe around level 240 or so, I sometimes got everything from 250k to almost 400k per pvp win :O So that leveled me up really fast. I even met the same guy like 5 times in combat one night and I gained like 1-2 levels inbetween each fight we had (thanks to others) so I even taunted him with the fact that each encounter with him made me stronger :lol Good times, best pvp experiences in this game across all Souls games for me.

Fake Edit: Just about every level up from maybe 230 to 256 was from pure pvp in nightmare frontier, much quicker than running through the main game.

Fascinating. So this whole "stay in the 100-120 range for PvP" thing often repeated seems to be pretty much an urban legend, which I was already suspecting. I haven't PvP'ed much (probably should, considering how much fun I've had the few times I've been invaded) but your post at least makes me not to worry about overleveling for it. Thanks!

 

[grmlin]

I laughed a lot to this.

https://gfycat.com/DefensivePoisedAmericanwarmblood

haha, ragdoll FTW

 

[Veelk]

I laughed a lot to this.

https://gfycat.com/DefensivePoisedAmericanwarmblood

lmao, i'm crying

 

[JadedWriter]

I laughed a lot to this.

https://gfycat.com/DefensivePoisedAmericanwarmblood

He is succumbing to his beastly urges.

 

[Soulhouf]

I laughed a lot to this.

https://gfycat.com/DefensivePoisedAmericanwarmblood

/dead

 

[Melchiah]

I laughed a lot to this.

https://gfycat.com/DefensivePoisedAmericanwarmblood

Here's some more BB fun... giving the pig a hand: http://i.imgur.com/Pw6HPYz.gifv

 

[Raptor]

Abhorrent Beast is now the only boss I think is harder than the damn Giant Sharks to me lol, he just doesnt stop and the only way I could kill him was me solo no NPC with me and always doing a dodge to his right and a strike, dodge/strike/dodge, pretty much the entire fight.

no room to rest or compose, you want to heal he will come and mess you up whiel you are healing.

Amazing fight and also frustating.

 

[JadedWriter]

Abhorrent Beast is now the only boss I think is harder than the damn Giant Sharks to me lol, he just doesnt stop and the only way I could kill him was me solo no NPC with me and always doing a dodge to his right and a strike, dodge/strike/dodge, pretty much the entire fight.

no room to rest or compose, you want to heal he will come and mess you up whiel you are healing.

Amazing fight and also frustating.

One of my favorite boss fights, just so pulse pounding.

 

[Minamu]

Fascinating. So this whole "stay in the 100-120 range for PvP" thing often repeated seems to be pretty much an urban legend, which I was already suspecting. I haven't PvP'ed much (probably should, considering how much fun I've had the few times I've been invaded) but your post at least makes me not to worry about overleveling for it. Thanks!

I think that's mostly a community-based number for optimizing and balancing stats for builds. The number hasn't really changed much at all since Demon's Souls so it is rather arbitrary compared to how the levelling systems have changed over the games. I think Bloodbourne is the easiest to level up in by far. It's strange how the meta-level doesn't reflect that. On the other hand, the point is probably related to a certain of stat increases. But that goes out the window a bit due to how match-ups are calculated, level differences considered. Not to mention the unfair advantage the host always have due to 25%+ more health. I don't think the game is really balanced for modern pvp at all because of this. But it's still hella fun

 

[Deleted member 752119]

Finally bought and played through The Old Hunters the past few days. I'd been reluctant as my only save was NG+ just past Father G.

Ludwig was a pain in the ass, and Orphan Kos was major bastard, but it's done. Laurence and the shark giants in the well I decided not to fuck with after giving each 10 or so tries as I don't have patience for dealing with that optional shit.

The other bosses I thought were easy. I beat Maria on my third or fourth attempt and the living failures on my first try.

Very good DLC, just wish I'd kept an end of regular game save instead of having to suffer through it on NG+. Lesson learned for Dark Souls 3--no NG+ as I don't really care to replay it so I need to just keep a nice overleveled end game save to be ready for DLC.

I probably won't get DS3 for a while though as I need to finish Twilight Princess HD and then will prioritize Quantum Break and Uncharted 4 before even thinking about DS3.

 

[Raptor]

Invaders well some that have invade me got scare of the pizza cutter, I was minding my own bussiness on Mergo's Loft farming and I got invaded, so Im suing my beast claw build exclusively but I got angry when I was losing to him, I take out my piizza cutter and the dude just ran away lol, didnt wanted to engage or get close, killed him good.

The other time was when I was fighting the Hunter NPC on Mergo's Loft after Shelob, he wanted to take advantage of me being busy with teh hunter, took out t he cutter and slayed them both lol.

Thing is insane that pizza cutter.

 

[Screaming Meat]

In what way? I've seen a lot of people remark at apologies being bad because of feature differences when the purpose of an analogy is functional similarities, which I think are on point in the context of the conversation.

I don't think they're functionally the same.

Astrophysics is much more complicated than Bloodborne and your analogy kind of belittles the effort required to "master" such a heavy subject. You don't just read a few articles on the web for a few years and suddenly become a professor in Astrophysics. The writer of the Paleblood essay neither went through a Masters programme or a Professorship. He has not spent years building a foundation of ancillary subjects to even begin to understand Bloodborne (calculus-based physics, high level mathematics, Data analysis, some computer science, HTML coding, a grounding in some kind of programming language like C++ etc.). He has not had to do years and years of research or write essays every weekend for four or five or even six years. He has not had to go through rigorous academic reviews and exams to prove his understanding of Bloodborne to his peers so that he may be taken seriously.

The Paleblood writer played a game, paid attention, and was inclined enough to write his thoughts down in both an ordered and engaging manner (which is his actual skill).

The barriers for entry for collating the information presented in Bloodborne and a professorship in Astrophysics are so completely at odds that there are no functional similarities between the two. Anyone with a PS4 and the ability to read/listen/write can do the former. The latter requires much more.

Or summink.

Spoiler

Just in case: that's not meant to come across nearly as aggressive as they might read!