PirateKing
Junior Member
I just hit her and yeah what's up with that? Anyone has a theory?
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Bloodborne Story and Lore Discussion Thread [Unmarked Spoilers]
- Thread starter GorillaJu
- Start date
I just hit her and yeah what's up with that? Anyone has a theory?
The "Sunrise ending"? It is happier but nothing is resolved. Another hunter will go through the exact same journey as you only to help the Moon Presence in its quest to kill the newborn. You don't ever get rid of the beast curse that plagues the lands. It's basically the same ending that Djura and Eileen have endured. They don't seem any better off tbh.
PirateKing
Junior Member
But their blood is red? I've seen that picture and it's really weird but doesn't answer the white blood. Now that I think about it, anything else with white blood in this game?
Master Willem
I don't think they are related at all. It's more about a Nightmare entity using the image of the ones who helps you the most.
Savantcore
Unconfirmed Member
Just dropped into this thread (and r/Bloodborne) and I just have no idea what anyone is talking about! I'm such a BB casual.
crimzonflame
Member
True, but it feels like nothing gets resolved in the other endings too.
1) You replace Gherman and the cycle starts again.
2) You turn into a a slug..ok. We dont know whats going to happen.
At least with sunrise, the character can just leave Yharnam and never look back again. Thats what I think at least.
Doesn't the newborn dies when you defeat Mergo's Wet Nurse?
What exactly is the thing that you do that ends the curse?
PirateKing
Junior Member
Thanks. Wonder if there are others as well.
The third ending is the true ending. If the Moon Presence is the master mind behind all of it then killing it ends most what is wrong with the world, and by you becoming the infant Great One, you could lead the humanity into the right path by becoming a Great One or rule them in the most darkest way possible.
You become the next Moon Presence?
Stopping the Ritual of Mensis.
crimzonflame
Member
I dont even know what that means.
I thought of it more like you become the first human to be reborn as a complete great one, taking humanity to it's next step in evolution or something like that
I thought of it more like you become the first human to be reborn as a complete great one, taking humanity to it's next step in evolution or something like that
Yeah this
at least that's what i thought
I just want to make master willem proud :,(
KittenMaster
Member
I feel like the "sunrise" ending is also one where your character could potentially share what he learned with people that would be able to make a difference.
PirateKing
Junior Member
Djura is an ex-hunter who accepted the death at the tree. Basically he woke up after the night of the hunt. It's hardly a good ending.
There's a good theory here about different colors of blood. The author have some good points about different blood colors. Red for Great Ones, white for Kin.
PirateKing
Junior Member
I'm actually reading that at the moment
I'm on Chapter 4 but it's basically most of what I already know nicely put together. Only thing I didn't know where the blood colours. How I missed that in my playthroughs, I don't even know.
KittenMaster
Member
Djura chose to use what he knew to protect the beasts that were once people, which I felt was somewhat noble.
crimzonflame
Member
Plus I thought he was originally from Yharnam.
Clear
CliffyB's Cock Holster
Its just Eldritch Gods doing Eldritch God shit!
I get the feeling its basically Moon Presence vs Kos/Oedon for rulership of our dimension. MP is basically all about preventing all the other deities from bringing forth a child of their own, hence the hunt.
Mensis is trying to deal with the being they call Kos and call forth his avatar via the nightmare. The Choir is trying to talk to them via the celestial emissary having concluded that Oedon is formless and possibly because he/she/it seems to be most interested in the hated Cainhurst Bloodline... obviously a major party foul in their view. Which is why Oedon is trying to sneak in via a child of his/her/its own during the bloodmoon.
PirateKing
Junior Member
His actions feel the most "human" unlike the character you control. It was a massive surprise when I spoke to him and asked me to spare them in my second playthrough.
PirateKing
Junior Member
Speaking of Kos, I have a feeling the DLC might teleport us to space and make us fight it. I want this to happen haha
Gherman said that you will forget everything if you choose that path.
Do you remember that dialogue when you kill micolash? he said something like "no.. i'll wake up now, i'll forget everything!"
KittenMaster
Member
Oh, that is true.
Disregard what I said then.
I still feel that it's not necessarily a bad ending though, neutral at worst.
Micolash is probably going to die at that point. Remember that his physical form is the mummy you found in the small buildings after the Advent Plaza.
PirateKing
Junior Member
If that's the case then how does Djura and Elieen know of the Hunter's Dream? Elieen especially points at the doll.
Something kinda interesting: Outside of Alfred (who's not a proper Hunter), all the Hunters named in-game are elderly. Gehrman, Eileen, Djura, Gascoigne, Henryk, all very old. Makes you wonder.
I think people are forgetting this when they get confused about the whole contradiction of hunters remembering the Hunter's Dream and Gehrman saying you'd forget; the Hunter's Dream is literally your character dreaming. And when you die in a normal dream, you wake up.
Remember, you are waking up from a dream. Generally, when you wake up after dreaming, you remember bits and pieces but not the whole thing. If asked to recall it, you might have highlights, but you won't be able to piece together a decent narrative. That is probably what happened with Djura and Eileen.
I think people are forgetting this when they get confused about the whole contradiction of hunters remembering the Hunter's Dream and Gehrman saying you'd forget; the Hunter's Dream is literally your character dreaming. And when you die in a normal dream, you wake up.
Can you even leave Yharnam? You yourself aren't cured of the plague. You are just able to control yourself from turning into a beast (which may be lost with no guidance from Gehrman/Moon Presence).
I think the true ending implies that you become the Great One and can choose whatever you want to do. It seems like you are the first human to become it and therefore can protect humanity from the other Great Ones.
This ritual goes on every night of the hunt. The newborn is always born but it seems like Moon Presence doesn't want this to happen as it wants to prevent the lineage of other Great Ones from continuing. Therefore, it has created the hunter's dream to find a suitable hunter to kill the newborn.
You don't do anything to end the scourge of the beast. Maybe that's another thing started by the Moon Presence in order to find the strongest hunters. But it seems like becoming a Great One yourself means you have the power to stand up to other Great Ones and to protect the rest of the human race from them.
Gehrman states you'll forget the dream, I assume you also forget what you learned. I take the Yharnam Sunrise ending as the "ignorance is bliss" ending. You give up on eldritch knowledge that could potentially leave you insane (or much, much worse) and go back to a life where werewolves were as bad as it got. Fits the cosmic horror theme of eldritch knowledge driving one mad.
It's my favorite ending for that reason.
ok, sorry @_@
KittenMaster
Member
I did acknowledge I was wrong about that.
PirateKing
Junior Member
Makes sense. I think what they forget are the Insights rather than all the memories. Perhaps, in hopes of not going mad.
ISee
Member
But will your hunter turn into a mindless beast down the road? As so many have before you...
Von Krukru
Banned
Just noticed Wilhelm has those tentacles growing out his back. I missed that detail during my 2 first playtrough, do they become visible when you have enough insight?
One of the most interesting things from the Miyazaki interview in the guide is that in the world of Bloodborne, the more advanced a being is, the more difficult it is to have children. (the idea being based on the way birth rates are lower in more advanced countries) So the great ones are so advanced that their birth rate is zero - thus they long for surrogates.
Something else I've been wondering, is that ENB mentioned more than once when answering people that he finds the Ebrietas fight very cool lore wise, because you're fighitng a real great one, a legit great one or whatever. It's obvious why Ebrietas would be considered "a real Great One" compared to Rom or Celestial Emissary, but that got me very confused about Amygdala and the Wet Nurse. What is it that makes Ebrietas more of a Great One than those two?
That depends on what she decides to do next, I guess. If we're assuming she'll do what I would do in her place, I'd get the fuck out of Yharnam and never come back.
But it's my favorite not because it leaves my character in a better state, I just think it fits the cosmic horror theme really well. It's as close to being driven to madness by eldritch knowledge as we could possibly have as an ending without it going completely against the rest of the game.
That depends on what she decides to do next, I guess. If we're assuming she'll do what I would do in her place, I'd get the fuck out of Yharnam and never come back.
But it's my favorite not because it leaves my character in a better state, I just think it fits the cosmic horror theme really well. It's as close to being driven to madness by eldritch knowledge as we could possibly have as an ending without it going completely against the rest of the game.
I think there's no evidence that the Great Ones want to harm humanity. Scourge of the Beast is a human fault, too much use of Blood Healing was the cause of that.
PirateKing
Junior Member
They just want a kid. If that means harming anyone in the way, they'll do it.
The Wet Nurse has to be a Great One. Mergo could well be Kos' child and so is being protected by one of Kos' strongest Great Ones. All speculation of course.
I think the Plain Doll is the only character that bleeds pure white. Blood Starved Beast, Master Willem, Rom, Celestial Emissary and Ebrietas bleed a sort of clear brownish fluid. Darkbeast Paarl and Mergo's Wetnurse just sort of emit dust when you hit them. Everyone else appears to bleed red, notably Amygdala, Brain of Mensis and Moon Presence.
Kai Dracon
Writing a dinosaur space opera symphony
Going with lovecraftian themes, I'd say the idea is Great Ones are so far beyond human concerns they can't intentionally desire to hurt humans just to be evil. They can even cooperate with them in their own way.
But because they're so alien and far beyond, they're inadvertently destructive. Humans are a fragile shop full of china, and Great Ones (even their blood) are the bulls.
But because they're so alien and far beyond, they're inadvertently destructive. Humans are a fragile shop full of china, and Great Ones (even their blood) are the bulls.
Oh my, a written lore guide, 90 pages at that?
I couldn't be more happy. I have been waiting for this since GameFAQs rather excellent Demon's Souls Lore Guide.
Isn't it already wide accepted that the Doll was made by Gerhman and he try to breathe a live into it by using the Third Umblical Cord? It's only then instead of bringing it to live, he met Moon Presence, make deal to make the Doll alive in exchange of his own and become the Steward of the dream
Well, the Amygdalas around Yarhnam/Yagarhul attacks you for no reason. And we know how Moon Presence is a dick and uses hunters like tools.
And also they use our woman to have their children. IMO A lot of Great Ones probably sees us as inferior beings that can use for whatever they want.
Djura and Eileen renounced their hunter's vows,did gherman kill them? did they just stop hunting and their link with hunter´s dream simply dissapeared?
This is only my interpretation,but i think that ignoring their duties as hunters forced them to be cast out from the dream,i mean if you were Gherman would you free those hunters that are neglecting their duties? Finding hunters is very hard and let them go that easy sounds like a waste.
Wanna be free from this cursed dream? work you ass off and end the nightmare.
PirateKing
Junior Member
One of them sends you to the one that you fight before getting the chalice. I don't understand the Amygdalas. Why don't the lesser ones do anything apart from being dicks?
We know for a fact there have been many Hunters before you but you simply can't sever your link with the Dream. One has to "die" in the dream to wake up, as been seen the game's ending and many graves in the Hunter's Dream.
Try to temper your expectations. It's from a guy that wrote a 1700-word essay on Reddit about who Lawrence is and he turned out to be flat wrong. (Even before Miyazaki's comments contradicted him, it was obvious he was wrong, IMO) He tends to get carried away. Not to mention being too verbose for his own good. Learn to edit, man!
Just noticed Wilhelm has those tentacles growing out his back. I missed that detail during my 2 first playtrough, do they become visible when you have enough insight?
Woah. I missed this too. Are those growths the same as the type on the altar of despair?
You also kill great ones before becoming one yourself
Yeah, I agree, I can't see any evidence that makes it so the Amygdala is a lesser being either. Maybe Ebrietas is more important than those two, but I don't see how that makes them any less of great ones. Amygdala even drops a chalice too, doesn't it?
Some people take the "open to interpretation" thing too literally and get carried away, they come up with random theories with no evidence whatsoever and treat it as truth.
Like the very weak link between the Cleric Beast and Ludwig. If that's enough evidence, than Gascoigne is the doll, the Small Hair Ornament can be given to the doll and it says it looks good on gray hair. omg cracked the case.
Veritigo_X
Member
Those "amygdalas" aren't actually Great Ones. According to the guide they are called False Gods. The only Great One Amygdala is the one you fight.
PirateKing
Junior Member
What I really want to know is what The Great Ones really are. Are they ruled by a supreme being? A one above all called Kos? Or are they all rivals? Why is there so many Amygdalas? Are they the lowest ranked members of the Great Ones?
Huh. Does that mean they were made by other means in the image of the real one? If so, by whom?