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Boxing Discussion

T

Tom_Cody

Member
jimbor said:
Floyd Canelo sold gangbusters, over 2m I believe.
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Yup. I believe it was number 2 all time in terms of buys and number 1 in revenue.

x Power Pad Death Stomp x said:
Between the shitty fights and the cost (70$ Or more hd!!), and piracy, I can't believe anyone is ordering a ton of PPVs anymore.

I think Floyd/Canelo did over a million so who knows
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x Power Pad Death Stomp x said:
Wow. I guess when you have a mega fight, with a good undercard people will still pony up.
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I think the culture of PPV event parties help as well. $70 is a lot more palatable if you are splitting it between a room full of friends.
 
R

RukusProvider

Banned
Baby Milo said:
you guys remember when Pac turned down $40 Million to fight Floyd

they fucked up
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Arums ego fucked manny,

The problem for manny is that while he seems like a nice guy, like many boxers, he's just not very smart. I expect him to be broke and in dire help within a few years of retirement.
 
G

Gareth Bale

Member
El Idiota said:
There's also Barker-Sturm, which should (clearly) go to Barker, but could be interesting even though Sturm's last good fight was long ago. It's a shame how Sturm has wasted his talent (as he admitted himself that he didn't give a fuck for most of his career).
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Is Sturm good? I hardly know anyone in the middleweight division.
 
T

Tom_Cody

Member
Syphon Filter said:
Some good fights tonight. Who yall got for:

Erislandy Lara vs Austin Trout
Paul Malignaggi vs Zab Judah
Devon Alexander vs Shawn Porter
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What a packed weekend of boxing. 11 to be televised by HBO and Showtime (if you include the ShoBox card from last night). Random thoughts on the various fights:

HBO

Mathew Macklin vs. Lamar Russ: I don't care about this fight at all. Golovkin just destroyed Macklin 6 months ago. My understanding is that HBO is only carrying this fight because of promotional obligations.


James Kirkland vs. Glen Tapia: Kirkland is never in a bad fight. I don't know anything about Tapia but the boxing press seems confident that he is a willing action fighter and that this will be a slugfest. I'm looking forward to this one.

Guillermo Rigondeaux vs. Joseph Agbeko: I am a massive fan of Rigondeaux and I'm glad that he's finally back in the ring. Agbeko had a solid run in Showtime's bantamweight tournament a few years ago and, although he can be a bit awkward, he has tended to be in good fights. I'm really interested to see how this will turn out stylistically.

Showtime:

Sakio Bika vs. Anthony Dirrell: I don't really know what to make of this one. Bika is always awkward as hell and Dirrell is an 8 year prospect who has never climbed to the next level. I personally haven't seen Dirrell fight since he took 2007 off for cancer treatments.

Devon Alexander vs. Shawn Porter: Another great match-up. Alexander had a fantastic run from 2008-2010 but hasn't seemed the same since he was thoroughly beaten by Timothy Bradly at the beginning of 2011. Since then he has notched some decent wins since then but he has looked neither impressive nor exciting. Shawn Porter is guy who I have seen for years on Shobox and ESPN but he's never seemed to have a breakout moment. He is short and has a come forward style. I think this might be a pretty good match-up and this could elevate either of these guys into relevance in the division if they can look impressive.

Erislandy Lara vs. Austin Trout: I am a fan of Lara and I think he is probably number 2 at 154 after Mayweather. Unfortunately he and Trout are but counter-punching southpaws. Both guys need to win and look impressive in this fight at this moment in their careers but I don't have much faith this will look good.

Paul Malignaggi vs. Zab Judah: A few years ago I would have laughed at this match-up but I am actually pretty excited about this fight. Both guys are at somewhat similar places in their careers and the winner stands to make great money in their next fight. I have no idea who is going to win this one but my gut goes with Judah.

El Idiota said:
There's also Barker-Sturm, which should (clearly) go to Barker, but could be interesting even though Sturm's last good fight was long ago. It's a shame how Sturm has wasted his talent (as he admitted himself that he didn't give a fuck for most of his career).
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I'm not really on top of the European scene at 160. Do you think either of these guys stand a chance against Martinez or Golovkin?
 
G

Gareth Bale

Member
El Idiota said:
He used to be really good as amateur and during his early days as a professional. He also would've beaten De La Hoya in 2004 but got badly screwed by the judges. Unfortunately - and he himself admitted it - he was careless and started to not give a fuck. These days? Not really, although he seems better prepared and motivated than the past few fights, maybe because this could be the end of his career.
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Woah, I had no idea he fought De La Hoya. He must have been decent back in the day then.
 
U

UnObtainium17

Member
Baby Milo said:
you guys remember when Pac turned down $40 Million to fight Floyd

they fucked up
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I dont think so.. pac is getting shafted if he is only getting 40mil for a fight that could make $300mil easy. PBF might be a bigger name, but Pac being a part of it is also a big factor why people would buy the fight. I say $70mil for pac and PBF gets the rest could be fair(during those times, like 2-3 years ago).
 
A

abuC

Member
Just got home and caught the Tapia/Kirkland fight from the 2nd round on, and that was tough to watch with the Abdusalamov fight fresh in my memory. Tapia needs to go to the hospital immediately, he took an unreal amount of punishment.
 
jchap

jchap

Member
abuC said:
Yeah he's definitely not TV friendly for the crowds that want a lot of action.
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The only way its TV friendly is to get him in there with a hard punching head hunter and see if he can survive all 12 rounds kind of like the Donaire fight. Donaire caught him only once and it wasn't enough to finish him. Plus when someone is very aggressive he punches back out of necessity.
 
T

Tom_Cody

Member
I feel like I'm hung over from boxing right now. I was sick as a dog this weekend and I watched all 11 fights on US TV. Random thoughts:

The ShoBox card on Friday night was fun. Four fights, knockouts. J'Leon Love and Badou Jack both scored impressive KOs and that's good for the dry 168 pound division. Ward (and eventually Golovkin) are going to need people to fight. Bey and Pearson looked good as well but they were up against nothing opponents.

I watched the entire showtime card before I put on the HBO card:
Showtime:

Sakio Bika vs. Anthony Dirrell: Actually better than I expected but a very unsatisfying outcome. I thought Dirrell clearly won by landing harder shots throughout. I have very little interest in seeing Bika fight at this point; I know what he has to offer. Oh well. In general it's nice to see Dirrell back in the ring following his health issues and it looks like his physical talents are intact.

Devon Alexander vs. Shawn Porter: Ugh, what a clinch fest. I have seen ~5 of his fights and I really don't ever remember seeing this much clinching. I'm happy for Porter but I did not enjoy watching this ugly fight at all. That Porter won makes for an interesting twist at 147.

Erislandy Lara vs. Austin Trout: Lara again showed his class. I'm not sure where Trout goes from here though. I still contend that Lara would beat Cotto or Alvarez if given the opportunity but it seems impossible that he ever will be. I have no idea who he fights next.

Paul Malignaggi vs. Zab Judah: What a disapointing non-performance from Judah. I don't even know what to say about this fight. Malignaggi clearly won but I wasn't at all impressed. Again, I have no idea who he fights next.

As for the HBO fights:

Mathew Macklin vs. Lamar Russ: Not even worth discussing. Maybe this will earn Macklin an opportunity to fight in Europe. I can't say I really care. Decent fight though.

James Kirkland vs. Glen Tapia: Kirkland's savage display felt like the second coming of Gerald McClellan. I can't wait to see him in with the other top guys at 154. AFAIK he does not carry a promotional affiliation so we might actually see him in the Canelo or Cotto. I would additionally love to see him grind on Mayweather for 12 rounds. Regarding the stoppage, I agree that it was late but I think there has been a lot criticism made with the added perspective of hindsight. Tapia hit and hurt Kirland as late as the beginning of the 5th which, in my mind, earned him the right to finish that round (at least from the prospective of the ref). I think maybe his corner should have stopped it at that point but even that's a tough call. Kirkland was super open for the entire fight and he has been knocked out before. Oh well. I agree that the stoppage looked bad. I hope Tapia goes on to fight another day. And I hope he alters his style. No boxer should view Gatti as a role model.

Guillermo Rigondeaux vs. Joseph Agbeko: I am as big a fan of Rigondeaux as you'll find but that fight was just awful. Agbeko brought in a great resume but he was content to survive and stink the place out. To his credit Rigondeaux actually forward quite a bit in this fight but Agbeko did his best to make sure that no boxing could take place. This was kind of the worst outcome that possibly have occurred for Rigondeaux at this point in his career. He is the man at 122 without question but this won't really matter if no one wants to fight him and networks aren't willing to pay to make the good fights happen. I'm not really sure what he can do besides maybe move up to 126. Otherwise he'll just have to accept very short money for fights on small cards.
 
T

TuXx

Member
Tom_Cody said:
This was kind of the worst outcome that possibly have occurred for Rigondeaux at this point in his career. He is the man at 122 without question but this won't really matter if no one wants to fight him and networks aren't willing to pay to make the good fights happen. I'm not really sure what he can do besides maybe move up to 126. Otherwise he'll just have to accept very short money for fights on small cards.
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Promoters need to do a better job promoting Cuban fighters. I understand their style is hard to sell, but at least put them to fight in Miami, so they can be in front of other Cubans who'll cheer them instead of having a dead atmosphere. Promoters worry too much over the finish product to how a fight will look like. none of that matters as long as you have a good promotion and a good venue. Floyd Mayweather is a prime example to all that. Sure there will be Casuals who will be upset and not pay for another card, but that market never really has any real intentions of getting into the sport.
 
T

Tom_Cody

Member
TuXx said:
Promoters need to do a better job promoting Cuban fighters. I understand their style is hard to sell, but at least put them to fight in Miami, so they can be in front of other Cubans who'll cheer them instead of having a dead atmosphere. Promoters worry too much over the finish product to how a fight will look like. none of that matters as long as you have a good promotion and a good venue. Floyd Mayweather is a prime example to all that. Sure there will be Casuals who will be upset and not pay for another card, but that market never really has any real intentions of getting into the sport.
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I don't think you're wrong regarding the Miami idea but I think the bigger problem is that the big promotional people just don't have faith in Cuban fighters as a marketable product. I've been following the sport for almost ten years and in that time I've seen a bunch of cuban standouts appear but none of them have been able to really establish themselves.

The 'boring' style is only one factor. The biggest single reason seems to be that there just isn't a large enough base of cuban fans in the US. Back in the day there was a promotional company called Team Freedom that came about for this exact reason but it ended up being a completely failed venture. The audience just wasn't there.

More and more fighters are becoming aware of how their fighting styles impact their earnings. It is simply a fact that Rigondeaux could earn more money if he spent more time in his fights moving forward and setting up offense. If he doesn't want to do that, all he can really do is stand tall and take on all comers until someone beats him.
 
T

Tom_Cody

Member
Fun interview/feature with Ann Wolfe discussing the Kirkland-Tapia fight. She doesn't disappoint:
http://www.maxboxing.com/news/max-boxing-news/ann-wolfe-boxings-most-underrated-trainer

A big part of preparation includes Wolfe giving Kirkland pep talks from hell.

“I told him, ’Listen, we are going to go to battle. [Tapia] is going to be boxing. We’re going to go fight. We’re going to kill this motherf*cker. I want you to try to go kill his ass soon as the bell rings,” said Wolfe. “People say, ’Do you really mean kill him?’ Yes. Do I want him to die? No. But you have to have that mindset. I tell James, ’I want to see some skin on the gloves when you come back over here.' Because guess what? If he doesn’t, that’s Kirkland going to the hospital. That’s him telling his mom he lost. This is a savage, savage, murderous sport and people trying to make it tennis. We are punching each other in the damn head. If you ain’t trying to kill somebody, why the hell are you punching people in the head until you render them unconscious?”
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L

Leunam

Member
Yesterday, on my way home from work, I registered at a boxing gym.

It's a small place, and a lot of their gloves and pads are pretty worn, but the bags looked like they were in good shape, they've got room for shadow boxing and other exercises, it's on my commute and the people I spoke to were pretty enthusiastic. Looks like a lot of the people there are teens and there was only one guy who was older than me(I'm 26). As I was filling out the forms another couple came in with their middle-school daughter who was looking to train.

I'm really excited about this and tonight I'm going to go out and buy some equipment. I got some Mexican wraps yesterday at the gym but I plan on picking up some of the other style (cotton?) to see which one I prefer. I'm thinking I need a jump rope and training gloves as well. Anyone have any suggestions on what I might need?
 
T

Tom_Cody

Member
Syphon Filter said:
who yall got for the broner/marcos fight?
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I think Broner will win.

RukusProvider said:
Broner should take it. I'm sure he'll be chin tested atleast a couple of times though. Let's see if he's got one.
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I don't think Broner will get hit too much. I just don't see it stylistically playing out that way.

Look back at his fights from 2011 to present, starting with the Ponce De Leon fight:
http://boxrec.com/list_bouts.php?cat=boxer&human_id=455859

None of those guys hit Broner. It's not like they hit him and just couldn't hurt him, they didn't hit him. He's very slick even when he's on offense. In a way his style reminds me of James Toney in his lighter years. He can stand in front of you and land punches without being hit in return. Malignaggi was able to diffuse his style to some extent by using angles and footwork but Maidana is no Malignaggi when it comes to footwork.

Yes, Maidana punches harder than those 130-135 pound fighters but he doesn't have better technical skills. And he is slower. I see Broner hitting Maidana all night while effectively nullifying Maidana's offense.

The major question I see regarding Broner at 147 is not his chin, it is his power. How much will he hurt Maidana when he hits him.
 
S

studyguy

Member
Holy shit! We have a Boxing GAF!

Tom_Cody said:
I think Broner will win.

I don't think Broner will get hit too much. I just don't see it stylistically playing out that way.

Yes, Maidana punches harder than those 130-135 pound fighters but he doesn't have better technical skills. And he is slower. I see Broner hitting Maidana all night while effectively nullifying Maidana's offense.
Click to expand...

Also this pretty much sums up my opinion of the fight. I'm genuinely curious to see how Broner takes Maidana's hits assuming he can land them, but that guy's a straight bruiser for his weight. Still hoping he knocks Broner down a peg since that guy needs an ego check.

Will be fun.
 
T

Tom_Cody

Member
The numbers are in from the weigh-in:

Broner 144.4, Maidana 146.2

Both look to be in good shape.

Y64waG2.jpg


Dug55sW.jpg



studyguy said:
Holy shit! We have a Boxing GAF!
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Glad to have you.
 
P

perineumlick

Member
Damn, Karass and Thurman are landing bombs.

Thurman is boxing well, but Karass is putting in dat body work. I thought he hurt Thurman to the body in the third.
 
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