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[cabot]

Cameron's promises were shit anyway.

Removing the EU means letting Westminster take more control.

No, thanks. Handing it more power is not what I want unless they do some serious electoral reform.

Which they won't because, you know, it might actually break the two party system.

God forbid!

 

[jelly]

Remember TATA steel in the UK and others around Europe are struggling against massive amounts of cheap state supported Chinese steel imports and the EU wanted to fight those Chinese imports with levys and funding but the one who blackballed that idea was the UK goverment.

 

[Acorn]

Remember TATA steel in the UK and others around Europe are struggling against massive amounts of cheap state supported Chinese steel imports and the EU wanted to fight those Chinese imports with levys and funding but the one who blackballed that idea was the UK goverment.

Because boy george loves blowing the Chinese.

Their state companies can run our infrastructure but god forbid the public owns our own infrastructure.

State ownership=bad unless it's the french Chinese or Indians then it's good.

 

[Juicy Bob]

No to Brexit. I vote for us to keep Ready Brek in the United Kingdom.

 

[hydrophilic attack]

Leave EU and watch the tories erode workers' rights even more. I mean the EU is currently pretty shit, but unbridled tory control would be way worse.

 

[TheOnlyOneHeEverFeared]

No to Brexit. I vote for us to keep Ready Brek in the United Kingdom.

What's wrong with good scottish porridge?

 

[Acorn]

Leave EU and watch the tories erode workers' rights even more. I mean the EU is currently pretty shit, but unbridled tory control would be way worse.

Yup. I'll move to another eu country within the 2 years period. I'm not living in an american style country.

 

[Juicy Bob]

What's wrong with good scottish porridge?

Ready Brek takes like five seconds less to microwave.

 

[Acorn]

Ready Brek takes like five seconds less to microwave.

And their chocolate flavour is the dogs bollocks.

 

[cabot]

Let's not forget the government turned down the opportunity to allow voters from age 16, and made it harder to register to vote.

Two self inflicted wounds that could make this referendum a lot closer than it probably should have been.


Great job!

 

[SporeCrawler]

I seriously hope for a brexit scenario. UK of course should not get a FTA with the EU

 

[Acorn]

Let's not forget the government turned down the opportunity to allow voters from age 16, and made it harder to register to vote.

Two self inflicted wounds that could make this referendum a lot closer than it probably should have been.


Great job!

Gerrymandering general election > eu vote to tories.

As usual Call me pig fucker self harms himself in an unrepentant attack on the oppositions voters, union support and short money. Then he realised he needs them whoops! Cunt

 

[Mr. Sam]

Thank God I'm not the only one who thinks about Ready Brek every time I hear "Brexit."

I seriously hope for a brexit scenario. UK of course should not get a FTA with the EU

I don't understand how these two sentences gel unless you want the UK to fail. If that's the case, well, whatever floats your boat, I guess.

 

[Hasney]

How about the Euro, that was a pretty bat shit insane idea that thankfully the UK was able to stay out of (not before the lovely ERM crapped all over us first, mind you).

Fair enough with the Euro, it was a sound idea in the financial climate of the time for most of the countries that did get involved, but our currency was too strong. Ready for the pound to take a nosedive if we do vote to leave though, it's already taking a pounding.

Cameron's promises were shit anyway.

Removing the EU means letting Westminster take more control.

No, thanks. Handing it more power is not what I want unless they do some serious electoral reform.

Which they won't because, you know, it might actually break the two party system.

God forbid!

Yeah, it's almost one of the main reasons I want to stay in. The EU has kept our shitty governments in check multiple times. Hell, the current government is so bad, we celebrated the house of Lords for once! Not that I'd want any of the government's in my lifetime to have had even more power.

Let's not forget the government turned down the opportunity to allow voters from age 16, and made it harder to register to vote.

Two self inflicted wounds that could make this referendum a lot closer than it probably should have been.


Great job!

Honestly, he's as bad as Gordon Brown as a prime minister, he can just talk a much better game than him.

 

[Volotaire]

Nice OT! I assumed Tak3n's thread was the OT.

Thank God I'm not the only one who thinks about Ready Brek every time I hear "Brexit."



I don't understand how these two sentences gel unless you want the UK to fail. If that's the case, well, whatever floats your boat, I guess.

I'm glad I'm not the only one who hates the term Brexit.

Also, Ready Brek is fantastic. A great filling breakfast. I hate Quaker Oats and the other 'real' porridge brands. That may make me a heretic, but I'm willing to take the abuse.

 

[industrian]

No to Brexit. I vote for us to keep Ready Brek in the United Kingdom.

Vote yes to Brexit to stop HP Sauce from being made the Netherlands.

 

[Hasney]

Vote yes to Brexit to stop HP Sauce from being made the Netherlands.

Might still be made there, just go up in price to import it. Should have been on the leaflet that went out tbh. We demand to know the truth about what would happen with HP.

 

[SporeCrawler]

I don't understand how these two sentences gel unless you want the UK to fail. If that's the case, well, whatever floats your boat, I guess.

I do not care about the UK at all. I just care about the EU. I wish that the permanent roadblocker to a closer european union finally leaves. I sincerely believe that the problems of globalization for europe cannot be solved unless there is something like the united states of europe. UK clearly doesnt want to be a part of that.

at the same time I believe it is a mistake to allow countries like swiss to basically have the same conditions as an european state from an economical perspective by concluding FTAs (the swiss people for example voted to limit the freedom of travel unilaterally). if the UK gets an FTA that allows the UK to get the same economical conditions as if they were in the EU that means basically a big f** you to any european state that has to obey to the EU and to any european enterprise that has to follow the EU regulations (which for example limit subsidies).

 

[CharmingCharlie]

Fair enough with the Euro, it was a sound idea in the financial climate of the time for most of the countries that did get involved, but our currency was too strong. Ready for the pound to take a nosedive if we do vote to leave though, it's already taking a pounding.

I am sure the pound will take a pounding. I expect there to be a hell of a lot of pain leaving Europe. I am under no illusions that this is going to be a fairytale ride in that we are gonna leave and all will be hunky dory and we will get the FTA's all perfect (if we get any at all). I expect there to be lots of suffering, hell probably even a major depression. But the thing is it is best we get it done and over with.

There is no doubt in my mind the UK will leave Europe sooner or later. It may happen at this referendum (though I am doubtful) or it might take another 10 - 20 years. Europe's push towards some retarded United States of Europe will inevitably lead to the UK leaving and this "veto from closer integration" isn't even of any use as toilet paper.

As for those cheer leading an unelected body restraining an elected government that is pretty bad form. I don't like the Tories, infact I think it is fair to say I despise them with every fibre of my being. However they were elected in a democratic vote and they won enough votes to form a Government. That means the people of the UK wanted a Tory Government (yeah yeah only 36% of the vote blah blah).

No I don't want unelected bureaucrats meddling, restricting and interfering with an elected government even if that government is as sick, twisted and downright disgusting as the Tories. We make our bed, we lie in it and if we don't like it we should change it. We should not be going "oh save us unelected bureaucrats pretty please".

 

[Acorn]

I am sure the pound will take a pounding. I expect there to be a hell of a lot of pain leaving Europe. I am under no illusions that this is going to be a fairytale ride in that we are gonna leave and all will be hunky dory and we will get the FTA's all perfect (if we get any at all). I expect there to be lots of suffering, hell probably even a major depression. But the thing is it is best we get it done and over with.

There is no doubt in my mind the UK will leave Europe sooner or later. It may happen at this referendum (though I am doubtful) or it might take another 10 - 20 years. Europe's push towards some retarded United States of Europe will inevitably lead to the UK leaving and this "veto from closer integration" isn't even of any use as toilet paper.

As for those cheer leading an unelected body restraining an elected government that is pretty bad form. I don't like the Tories, infact I think it is fair to say I despise them with every fibre of my being. However they were elected in a democratic vote and they won enough votes to form a Government. That means the people of the UK wanted a Tory Government (yeah yeah only 36% of the vote blah blah).

No I don't want unelected bureaucrats meddling, restricting and interfering with an elected government even if that government is as sick, twisted and downright disgusting as the Tories. We make our bed, we lie in it and if we don't like it we should change it. We should not be going "oh save us unelected bureaucrats pretty please".

This unelected nonsense needs to stop. We have a European parliament which we vote for.

 

[Moosichu]

This unelected nonsense needs to stop. We have a European parliament which we vote for.

Yeah. You could reasonably argue that the European parliament is more democratic than Westminster.

 

[cabot]

Westminster is democratic. Alright, then.

A truly democratic system would probably result in hung parliaments every cycle, with coalitions being the norm.

I even linked two examples of government making the process less democratic for their own gains because it affects those who vote against the Tories. They also tweaked the constituency set up to further help themselves. Acorn also brought up the comically petty union and short money policy.


The pesky undemocratic monstrosity is also looking into the completely fair and just Investigatory Powers Bill (snooper's charter)

LET ME LEAVE!

non-sarcasm summary: If Westminster sees proper reform, I'd be more willing to listen to the Leave argument. Unfortunately neither main party seems to be particularly interested in this, because they care about themselves and remaining in power over doing what's best for the country. So I'll have the EU red tape to limit their ability to go comedy evil along with the major benefits that cohesion brings over separation.

 

[Roberto Larcos]

Holland, Denmark and the UK should all quit and make our own club.

Invite Germany, France, Belgium, Luxembourg, Italy and Ireland too. We can call it the European Economic Community.

As for the vote, I'll vote in my interests. Free movement benefits me. The working time directive (that gives us 20 days off work a year and limits how long employers can force us to work) benefits me. Human rights benefit me. These are all things that leading Tories (Cameron, Boris, May) have spoken out against in the past. The EU gives the constitution we never had. That said, I do hope for a two speed Europe. I think a currency union is a fundamentally bad idea, but if some countries want to do that and share a budget, fair enough.

Look what those bastards are doing today though.

 

[industrian]

Might still be made there, just go up in price to import it. Should have been on the leaflet that went out tbh. We demand to know the truth about what would happen with HP.

They stopped making HP Sauce in the UK around 10 years ago (IIRC).

I'm really surprised that bringing back the manufacture of HP Sauce to the UK isn't a core policy of UKIP. It seems par for the course for an upstanding honourable mainstream political party such as themselves.

Yeah. You could reasonably argue that the European parliament is more democratic than Westminster.

Does the European parliament have a second house filled with 800+ unelected peers who earn £200-300 per day in order to - in the words of Lord Sewel - "do fuck all"?
Does the European parliament have an unelected head of state that costs taxpayers hundreds of millions of pounds every year?

 

[Joni]

Invite Germany, France, Belgium, Luxembourg, Italy and Ireland too. We can call it the European Economic Community.

If you want to be in club with Belgium, it is the European Union. Fuck of if you think we'd leave the thing we founded.

 

[Roberto Larcos]

If you want to be in club with Belgium, it is the European Union. Fuck of if you think we'd leave the thing we founded.

 

[tomtom94]

My leaflet just arrived! I suspect there will be a fun Twitter game with people finding creative uses for them.

 

[RedShift]

Glastonburys on that weekend. Luckily the festival organisers put a big message about getting a postal/proxy vote in the ticket confirmation along with a load of info on how to do it and when you need to do it by.

 

[mclem]

My parents are expats and my Dad needs extensive use of the French health services - treatments which weren't approved for use by the NHS.

Yeah, I think my vote's set in stone.

(And theirs, they've been out there for over a decade, but not quite long enough to lose the right to vote)

 

[danowat]

I personally think there are a number of big sticking points for many people.

1) The fact that no one really knows what is going to happen if we do leave the EU, what will happen to those who are currently here under the free movement, and likewise British ex pats, amnesty?, immediate visas?

2) Immigration, this a huge smokescreen, most of the people who come here from the EU, come here to work, stopping free movement will just stop this labour market, plus it doesn't stop immigration from non-EU countries, that remains the same as it is now.

3) What happens to the laws and rules (the good ones like the working time directive, maternity rules etc) that we've adopted while in the EU?, will they continue, or will they be rescinded, having a conservative government in full control of labour laws makes me twitchy, with thoughts back to the 70's and 80's

4) It's very difficult to find impartial information that isn't full of either right wing, or left wing rhetoric.

To me I think it's such a huge decision to expect the general(ly misinformed) public to make, especially with the current terror / refugee crisis.

Obviously the EU isn't perfect, and needs a lot of work, but I really don't think "we" as a country are strong enough anymore (we're aren't the empire power of 60 years ago) to stand alone.

I can see it going the way of out, and that worries me.

 

[jimbobsmells]

It amazes me when I see comments in other forums / under online articles to do with tax avoidance / evasion, the steel crisis, TTIP, or similar. Someone always uses it as an excuse to push the Brexit argument - when these issues would be arguably worse under a Tory government without the EU to consider.

The one thing that is pushing me towards voting remain is the fear of what the Tories would do once let further off the leash.

 

[Roberto Larcos]

3) What happens to the laws and rules (the good ones like the working time directive, maternity rules etc) that we've adopted while in the EU?, will they continue, or will they be rescinded, having a conservative government in full control of labour laws makes me twitchy, with thoughts back to the 70's and 80's

Laws from EU Directives would stay in force, as we needed to implement them. However they could be repealed, expressly or impliedly, the very next day. Parliamentary sovereignty, unchecked, is absolutely total.

A popular definition from A. V. Dicey: [Parliament has] "the right to make or unmake any law whatever: and, further, that no person or body is recognised by the law of England as having a right to override or set aside the legislation of Parliament."

4) It's very difficult to find impartial information that isn't full of either right wing, or left wing rhetoric.

This is a great resource.

 

[hodgy100]

It amazes me when I see comments in other forums / under online articles to do with tax avoidance / evasion, the steel crisis, TTIP, or similar. Someone always uses it as an excuse to push the Brexit argument - when these issues would be arguably worse under a Tory government without the EU to consider.

The one thing that is pushing me towards voting remain is the fear of what the Tories would do once let further off the leash.

this is basically where i am with it. we are talking about a government that tried to take benefits from the disabled that also want to to re-define our human rights on their terms, who also want to impeach our privacy with the snoopers charter. so yeah...

 

[SporeCrawler]

Invite Germany, France, Belgium, Luxembourg, Italy and Ireland too. We can call it the European Economic Community.

As for the vote, I'll vote in my interests. Free movement benefits me. The working time directive (that gives us 20 days off work a year and limits how long employers can force us to work) benefits me. Human rights benefit me. These are all things that leading Tories (Cameron, Boris, May) have spoken out against in the past. The EU gives the constitution we never had. That said, I do hope for a two speed Europe. I think a currency union is a fundamentally bad idea, but if some countries want to do that and share a budget, fair enough.

Look what those bastards are doing today though.

A monetary union can work if there is a fiscal union. A fiscal union would mean EU basically controlling money of national governments. In other words we need a USE and Britain is not going to play ball on that idea. So yeah, please go out of the EU. I am sure GB can have a splendid economic union with nonEU countries.

 

[Roberto Larcos]

A monetary union can work if there is a fiscal union. A fiscal union would mean EU basically controlling money of national governments. In other words we need a USE and Britain is not going to play ball on that idea. So yeah, please go out of the EU. I am sure GB can have a splendid economic union with nonEU countries.

The problem with the Euro is not Britain's refusal to join.

[Hint: Look closer to home, Hans.]

 

[Mac@NeoGAF]

this is basically where i am with it. we are talking about a government that tried to take benefits from the disabled that also want to to re-define our human rights on their terms, who also want to impeach our privacy with the snoopers charter. so yeah...

You're talking as if they can just propose anything they like, turn up at Westminster and make it law for goodness sake.

Hardly anything radical that they have come up with has actually passed into law, and if it has, Labour has been right along there with them...'snoopers charter' anyone?

 

[Uzzy]

A monetary union can work if there is a fiscal union. A fiscal union would mean EU basically controlling money of national governments. In other words we need a USE and Britain is not going to play ball on that idea. So yeah, please go out of the EU. I am sure GB can have a splendid economic union with nonEU countries.

You don't think Britain's the only opposition to that idea, do you?

 

[Juicy Bob]

If I'm someone who wants to actually do something to help out the 'Remain' campaign aside from simply posting bollocks on Facebook no one will actually read, what exactly could I do to get involved?

 

[industrian]

If I'm someone who wants to actually do something to help out the 'Remain' campaign aside from simply posting bollocks on Facebook no one will actually read, what exactly could I do to get involved?

Find your local 'Remain' group and help them out with handing out leaflets and stuff.

Alternatively, find your local 'Leave' group and do the same thing - but basically turn up the rhetoric to 11, make yourself and your cause look fanatical and crazy, and shock people into voting to remain based on how crazy you are.

 

[liquidtmd]

This unelected nonsense needs to stop. We have a European parliament which we vote for.

It does indeed semantically need to stop. However that's not to say people are unjustified in feeling that large swathes of MEPs from other countries, unelected by the electorate here, are freely allowed to collaborate and enforce policy on the us that we may not feel is in our best national interests.

 

[Roberto Larcos]

If I'm someone who wants to actually do something to help out the 'Remain' campaign aside from simply posting bollocks on Facebook no one will actually read, what exactly could I do to get involved?

• Britain Stronger in Europe (tick the 'I want to volunteer' box)
• Labour In for Britain

Alternatively, find your local 'Leave' group and do the same thing - but basically turn up the rhetoric to 11, make yourself and your cause look fanatical and crazy, and shock people into voting to remain based on how crazy you are.

If T̶h̶e̶r̶e̶s̶a̶ ̶M̶a̶y̶'̶s̶ Boris Johnson's not doing it for them...

 

[Beefy]

The EU is ok. But they pass so many weird rules (or at least try to). Then you have how they are handling the refugee crisis, which was a complete fuck up. But would I trust a UK government by themselves? I doubt it.

I just wish some one would step in and stop the Snoopers Charter.

 

[Beefy]

If Theresa May's not doing it for them...

She is pro EU though?

 

[Beefy]

You don't think Britain's the only opposition to that idea, do you?

Shh all of the EU's troubles are Britain's fault. You should know that by now.

Spoiler

/s

 

[Mac@NeoGAF]

Shh all of the EU's troubles are Britain's fault. You should know that by now.

Guess who they'll be happy to blame if things fell apart in the EU after a Brexit...

 

[Roberto Larcos]

She is pro EU though?

Wow, that was fucking amateur eh?

I guess whatever Boris says is out-ridiculoused by her.

 

[Beefy]

Wow, that was fucking amateur eh?

I guess whatever Boris says is out-ridiculoused by her.

Both sides basically have no likable people on them. So it makes it easier to not just to vote for who seems nice

 

[Succinct Verbosity]

This unelected nonsense needs to stop. We have a European parliament which we vote for.

Not to mention the uk had an unelected House of Lords.

 

[QuicheFontaine]

Alternatively, find your local 'Leave' group and do the same thing - but basically turn up the rhetoric to 11, make yourself and your cause look fanatical and crazy, and shock people into voting to remain based on how crazy you are.

Do this, and Farage would quickly eject you from the party.

Not to make Leave look more sane, but because he'd think you were eyeing up his job.

 

[oti]

No prob we cool I got this.


BRITAIN

YOU WILL NOT BE LAST IN THE UPCOMING EUROVISION, EVERYONE WILL GIVE YOU AT LEAST 1 POINT

YOU STAY IN THE EU


Deal?