TheRagnCajun
Member
Not to detract from the surge today but - a one-day rally doesn't make up for a steady decline since the brexit vote, and even before.
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British PM Theresa May Brexit Speech 17th January 2017 at 11:45AM GMT
- Thread starter SirRattleBalls
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Not to detract from the surge today but - a one-day rally doesn't make up for a steady decline since the brexit vote, and even before.
Actually EU officials only said they'd have to reapply for membership (they wouldn't become automatic members), and the Prime Minister of Spain said that he would not seek to block Scotland's membership.
If Scotland went through a legally binding referendum that was recognised by England, they wouldn't be a 'breakaway country' anyway. There's a world of difference between that and somewhere like the Basque Country or Catalonia trying to force Spain's hand on independence by seeking recognition from the EU as a separate state.
Interface_2037
Banned
Waffle,waffle,waffle...shut up Nicola, stop threatening..do.
..get out there and try and sell to the Scottish people that leaving the UK single market worth £50bn to Scotland for the EU single market, worth only £12bn, is a sensible, rational policy that will secure Scotland's future.
You'll be laughed at all the way to the ballot box and you know it.
chromatic9
Member
Scotland is a separate country that is part of a Union. I don't see how Spain can vote no if given all the facts. Scotland is not like a Basque region or Catalonia.
D
Deleted member 231381
Unconfirmed Member
There's no strict definition of country. Legally, there is at present no real distinction between Scotland's arrangement with respect to the United Kingdom and Catalunya's with respect to Spain, other than that the United Kingdom is slightly less of a dick to Scotland than Spain is to Catalunya.
I mean surely the irony of this isn't lost on her
coming from a leader who is going against the vote of a referendum and whose actions would almost certainly be economically catastrophic
If you have foreign currency to convert to £ you'll feel like a fucking millionaire
Murdoch managed to convince the English/Welsh people that leaving the EU is a sensible, rational policy that will secure the UK's future, its not that unbelievable
Funky Papa
FUNK-Y-PPA-4
It doesn't matter. The point is being a dick because political posturing is much more important than facts when it comes to Spanish politics. Catalonian nationalists have been trying to hitch their wagon to Scotland for a while, so the conservatives may be inclined to fuck with Scotland just to make a point.
Still, nothing is set in stone. It's just a possibility. But given how utterly puerile the PP is, I wouldn't count with their support.
Interface_2037
Banned
Scottish nationalists don't give a shit about hard Brexit, soft Brexit or no Brexit...it's all just a convenient smokescreen for them to try and force a 2nd referendum.
If it wasn't Brexit they'd just find another excuse for it.
It has "skyrocketed" to a level still a full cent behind the previous 31 year before Brexit low which was around $1.25
It's up for a number of reasons
1. The speech had basically been baked in, they largely knew that it was a hard Brexit but some of the tone was a bit better than expected
2. The market seems to have been taken in by the meaningless sop to parliament and the unworkable partial custom union notion (it's literally illegal under the WTO)
Eh, whatever works. The sooner they can detach from the rotting carcass that is the 'UK' the better for them, I say.
Hesemonni
Banned
Hmm...regardless, why did it react the way it reacted? You'd think it would plummet instead.
When the SNP's reason for leaving the UK is that they don't like being tied to a Westminster parliament that has minimal interest in Scottish affairs, I think that making a stink over Westminster taking huge actions while completely ignoring the interests of Scotland isn't really a 'smokescreen' so much as it is 'exactly what they're talking about'.
Jezbollah
Member
Markets like certainty - its the first indication of a structure of a plan (or government's intent). This is also partly the reason the pound plummeted the day after the vote, as a Leave vote wasn't expected.
Frankfurter
Member
Maybe because of the parliament part, i.e. hope that the parliament atleast stops the worst things.
RoadHazard
Gold Member
Fuck your "deal", fuck having your cake and eating it too. If you're out you're out, you can't just keep the parts that suit and benefit you.
I'm sorry for you guys who didn't want this, but I hope the EU doesn't budge an inch when this goes down.
I'm sorry for you guys who didn't want this, but I hope the EU doesn't budge an inch when this goes down.
Nothing whatsoever, although your money will go further than it did a year ago.
and with class. Don't go to our level.
autumnleaf
Member
If there wasn't Brexit there would not be a second referendum for a long time but in general Scotland is quite a liberal place and I wouldn't dismiss the general population not wanting to be lumped with a right-wing racist nation playing a part in a second referendum.
They will, for all the pomp and posturing by the headline grabbing idiots at the top, there are still people who make sense in Europe, pragmatic people. It's a shame they hadn't been in charge to begin with.
RoadHazard
Gold Member
Allowing the UK to leave but still retain many of the benefits of being a member would set a VERY dangerous precedent. Could be the beginning of the end for the Union.
Audioboxer
Member
The irony in people that "won't" be affected by it having such a strong feeling of having a stake in it, is that it plays its part in rustling jimmies up here. There's only so long you can be bothered listening to a big brother that constantly demands he knows what is best for you. Especially while that big bother is current swallowing the double barrels of a shotgun.
Speaking in terms of averages, at least if it is Scot debating Scot you can draw out reasons for yes and no. Half the time it is someone from the rUK it ends up being "I like the flag and I like Britain being as it is". Aka, I don't think some from the rUK actually see any benefit to Scotland staying other than that. A strong feeling of passion for the UK. As I said above though we are veering way past the point of feelings like that taking center stage. Anyone who subscribes to you're getting dragged along because I am is also shooting themselves in the foot.
TatteredHat
Member
There might be a "deal" but it won't contain any concessions on movement of people. Then again the UK already gave up on single market access, so perhaps that's not even on the table anymore.
UK can get a fast-track to a WTO deal as far as I'm concerned, that's about it.
UK can get a fast-track to a WTO deal as far as I'm concerned, that's about it.
its been Britain since end of World War II, poor and in decline.
Huw_Dawson
Member
There's no fast-track to a WTO deal - we crash out to WTO rules if no deal is made with the EU.
This will be an enjoyable hill to watch the modern Conservative Party torch their reputation for economic competence on, at least.
Well not being from the UK it makes sense if you want to keep the EU's current shaky union intact. If the UK gets off easy it will make referendums in other countries more palatable. Basically to stop the snowball from going down hill.
No one in here wants the UK to suffer especially posters like me who actually live here and are worried about where this going is going. Tell the other countries in the EU that we are going to hold a gun to their heads to get what we want won't work. It will end up like neville chamberlain. And this crap about we will get what we want and stop being pessimistic is a joke. London not Rome is burning and there having a sing song
fabricated backlash
Member
Meh, after 30 years of the UK uphill breaking and raisins picking, I can understand the frustration.
Honestly, I don't support close ties with the UK after Brexit. The UK chose xenophobia and nostalgia over common sense. The decision was made by people who think they'd hurt the EU with it, so they get no sympathy from me.
There is a difference in wanting the UK to get a ok deal then wanting to see it burn. Like a few posts on various threads have basically said. This is peoples lives people are talking about, not just a government that it won't effect
I believe it's an expression of the pent-up desire to see the UK's decades of political hubris be revenged. All the exceptions, all the blame for domestic troubles levied against the EU and so on.
I voted remain and as it is I live way below the poverty line. Not every poor person voted to leave.
They'll move on to the next scapegoat offered to them. Just as they did when the Caribbean/Indian/Pakistani/Irish communities were imminent threats to normal (read: White English) people's way of life.
Good speech.
One thing that stuck out to me was her point that "no deal for Britain is better than a bad deal for Britain." Unless we can claim backsies on the whole Article 50 thing and retain our EU membership I'm not sure what she is getting at.
Also, she desperately wants to shed the Brexit moniker. Time to deploy the Number 10 brand experts.
One thing that stuck out to me was her point that "no deal for Britain is better than a bad deal for Britain." Unless we can claim backsies on the whole Article 50 thing and retain our EU membership I'm not sure what she is getting at.
Also, she desperately wants to shed the Brexit moniker. Time to deploy the Number 10 brand experts.
Nobody is saying that the EU should piss in our cornflakes. I don't expect the EU to be anything but firm and fair because why should they be anything else. They've accommodated the UK for years, best EU terms. The EU isn't going to screw the UK over, they'll manage that themselves. The EU will look out for itself as they should and are standing on firm ground, you don't budge from that. The UK Government only has themselves to blame for the fallout.
You want to leave the best thing you ever had, fine but don't expect us to give you the best thing you ever had for nothing. Simple as that.
Benefits will have to go both ways, there will need to be concessions on both sides, some of that is alluded to in todays statement of course.
I can see the EU project significantly shrinking or radically changing - I think it has to, it's been imposed on people across a whole continent, a vanity project which took no account of their opinions and places no value whatsoever on their individual cultures and circumstances. If it doesn't change, more will leave.
Shes laying the ground work for the fact her entire speech was a lot of nonsense, and won't get us anywhere with Europe. Then we are forced to go to WTO level tariffs on goods because we're so fucking stupid she can say it was better to walk away than take a bad deal.
You have to say they have successfully manipulated this, leaking all the substance of the speech so the pound would fall the day before and bounce back by the time the speech takes place.
Are you kidding me. Did you not follow the Canada EU trade deal. A little tiny place put a spanner in the works there.
Wallonia, a staunchly socialist region of 3.6 million people, had been leading objections, demanding stronger safeguards on labour, environmental and consumer standards. It also wanted more protection for Walloon farmers, who would face new competition from Canadian imports.
Out of 500 million people.
Herr Schwarz
Banned
Take a shot whenever she says the word global.
I like her grandiose rhetoric at the motivations of Brexit.
Also, global.
I like her grandiose rhetoric at the motivations of Brexit.
Also, global.
and that is the problem, too many people get a say, and Poland seem the most keen to fuck us, even though we have half their country here and support them, which is ironic
European here, so I got all them Euro's to spent.
Ffs
Not all of us want to leave that is the point and not all of us able to leave the UK if it gets fucked over. I accept we are leaving and hope we get a ok deal, I am not expecting or wanting a great one. It just gets annoying when some posters want ro see the UK be fucked over. Totally forgetting there are actual lives at stake.
-Plasma Reus-
Service guarantees member status
wtf?
D
Deleted member 284
Unconfirmed Member
This fucking post is greatness 💀
all in good fun
This is disgusting
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