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Canadian PoliGAF - 42nd Parliament: Sunny Ways in Trudeaupia

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Morrigan Stark

Arrogant Smirk
You mean sorry NDP voters.... Liberal voters voted Liberal because Liberals are the natural governing party of Canada
Mate, piss off

don't worry about them Simon, these are the same people who laughed my off these boards when I predicted a Trudeau majority.

they were all wearing Mulcair beards with a bad standing posture when laughing at me
Say, weren't you supposed to get perm-banned for predicting a Hillary win?

oh so NOW you like us huh
/s
Hehe

I'm truly sorry, but arch-capitalists are really scary.

Kevin O'Leary says 3.5 billion people living in poverty is 'fantastic news'

This guy has lost the plot. He'd be really bad for the economy and prestige. He'd be unelectable in any other English-speaking country besides the US, and he's certainly unelectable in Quebec, thankfully.
Jeeeeeeeeeeeesus that's the worst thing I heard today, and I've been hearing about Trump admin goofs

Somehow Leitch is possibly worse? Ugh.
 
You know, if it was difficult to undo all of the crap necessary to make election reform possible, it'd be better if that is just simply what he said.

"We can do it, but it will cause a lot of problems. Let us know!" Instead, he's going by some odd private research to find out if the interest was still there.

That's not transparent at all, and hoping Trudeau has some decent answers to this in his next townhall.

That being said though, that wasn't one of the reasons why I voted for him so the news doesn't miff me too much (I was chasing after someone that wasn't conservative).

And he better expect this to be used by O'Leary at some point ugh. Just the fact that he's interested scares me as I review Trump's daily damage in the U.S.
 

Mailbox

Member
Say, weren't you supposed to get perm-banned for predicting a Hillary win?
.

Iirc that was a temp ban and he already served it.
I think... I do remember Gutter being banned after the election for a short while.

Somehow Leitch is possibly worse? Ugh.

Yeah, its kinda scary that 2 of the frontrunners are Mr.Increased_Wealth_inequality_is_amazing and Mrs.Trump_wannabe. I seriously hope Chong gets in. We could use someone like him to at least slightly moderate a frazzled conservative constituency (Mind, I still don't agree with his policy stance on things, but at least he believes climate change is real and calls out against racism).

Tie Leitch and O'Leary together and throw them into a lake.

This is preferable, but alas.
(I don't really advocate for the death or hurt of these people, just that they really fucking need to get out of the spotlight. Canada doesn't need a far-right uprising now.)
 

Apathy

Member
Mate, piss off


Say, weren't you supposed to get perm-banned for predicting a Hillary win?


Hehe


Jeeeeeeeeeeeesus that's the worst thing I heard today, and I've been hearing about Trump admin goofs

Somehow Leitch is possibly worse? Ugh.

Leitch's campaign manage uses "cuck" when he disagrees with someone. Shes human garbage.

Also, I'm surprised you had not seen O'Leary say that yet, that's quite old and the day he announced his intention to run it was run on tv a lot.

Shit like:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uEVSpunPBs4

&

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Egs_NYEdSWo

another dragon talks against this idiot:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EtWX7ZYl-pQ


and for as much as this dude thinks hes amazing at business, go as Mattel what they think of his business acumen. Cause Mattels purchase of the company that O'Leary ran, and the subsequent nosedive of their stock will tell you that O'Leary is nothing short of a charlatan
 

Sibylus

Banned
Iirc that was a temp ban and he already served it.
I think... I do remember Gutter being banned after the election for a short while.



Yeah, its kinda scary that 2 of the frontrunners are Mr.Increased_Wealth_inequality_is_amazing and Mrs.Trump_wannabe. I seriously hope Chong gets in. We could use someone like him to at least slightly moderate a frazzled conservative constituency (Mind, I still don't agree with his policy stance on things, but at least he believes climate change is real and calls out against racism).



This is preferable, but alas.
(I don't really advocate for the death or hurt of these people, just that they really fucking need to get out of the spotlight. Canada doesn't need a far-right uprising now.)

They're welcome to govern the lake jointly.
 
single issue voters ready to divide between Greens, NDP and Bloc to spite the Liberals would only benefit the Conservatives.

I will leave it at that and let you dwell on this is issue of "electoral reform"
 
Are there any political podcasts folks in here would recommend? I keep up with the US through a couple of their NPR shows but I've found CBC's shows to be kind of dry. Granted I haven't given them a shot in a while.
CANADALAND is quite good and I know you said CBC is kind of dry but The House is great.
 

BeesEight

Member
single issue voters ready to divide between Greens, NDP and Bloc to spite the Liberals would only benefit the Conservatives.

I will leave it at that and let you dwell on this is issue of "electoral reform"

The Liberal Party has as much right to govern Canada as the Communist Party of Canada. Maybe Liberals should try keeping campaign promises they make to the electorate if they don't want voters supporting parties that don't brazenly lie and belittle them.

But, I mean, your comments on this issue are disingenuous at best. You happily admit that you'd support the removal of democracy from Canada if it meant that the Liberal Party governed in perpetuity so you leaving the discussion on electoral reform is probably wise.
 
The Liberal Party has as much right to govern Canada as the Communist Party of Canada. Maybe Liberals should try keeping campaign promises they make to the electorate if they don't want voters supporting parties that don't brazenly lie and belittle them.

But, I mean, your comments on this issue are disingenuous at best. You happily admit that you'd support the removal of democracy from Canada if it meant that the Liberal Party governed in perpetuity so you leaving the discussion on electoral reform is probably wise.

no party in history of politics has ever met their campaign promises
 

Apathy

Member
Bigger than snubbing the first French debate?

Well his options are going to be don't show up, show up and answer everything with the most jank barely understandable French possible or show up and answer everything in English. Not sure which Quebecers will find worse.
 

BeesEight

Member
no party in history of politics has ever met their campaign promises

This short rebuttal is about as substantive as it is tired.

Most politicians actually attempt to deliver on their campaign promises. The Liberals propping this up as a major component of their platform ("Last election under First Past the Post!") only to turn around and immediately kill it out the gate ("Math is too difficult for the Canadian people") is about as insulting as a politician can get. It was made quite clear that this promise was made solely to earn votes with a whopping 0 intention of delivering.

It is justifiably a large mark of concern for any citizen going forward in their support of the Liberal Party. They will categorically lie and mislead you to try and curry your favour. This is different than other candidates who intend to deliver and run into difficulties that make executing promises unfeasible.

If any other party were to pull a similar stunt I would be shocked if the Liberals and their supporters weren't the first to rush out and hold it against them. But, alas, they can do no wrong in your eyes so your defence of them is unpersuasive. No doubt the Liberal Party's game plan here on out is to attempt to hold leftist voters hostage by hoping the Conservatives field entirely repugnant candidates that the left has to continue banding together for eternity in order to keep them out. It is, after all, what you insinuate with your dismissive attitude for NDP, Green and Bloc supporters.

That you lack the wherefore-all to see how successful a strategy that was down south also says enough.
 
Electoral reform was not a "major component of their platform." It was -- and remains -- something a very tiny subset of the population cares about. The number of people who vote solely on that one issue is negligible at best, and those voters were never in the Liberal camp to begin with. Besides that, considering that no NDP government has ever even made a nod towards electoral reform, it shows how seriously we should take the moral spluttering from their supporters today and going forward.

Well his options are going to be don't show up, show up and answer everything with the most jank barely understandable French possible or show up and answer everything in English. Not sure which Quebecers will find worse.

He's not winning over Quebecois voters regardless of what he does, so I have to guess that he's going to answer everything in English and give the most outrageous answers possible so that everything focuses on him. It'll piss off all the other candidates, and probably kill his shot at being anyone's second choice, but considering everything we know about him, I can't imagine him doing anything else. It'll be interesting to see how Leitch compensates for that; she'll probably try and take things even further than she's already gone.

Also on O'Leary, he's declining to commit to move back to Canada if he wins. I'd say that you'd think most people would be sensitive to the Ignatieff example, except O'Leary probably wasn't even in Canada when that happened.
 

Tiktaalik

Member
single issue voters ready to divide between Greens, NDP and Bloc to spite the Liberals would only benefit the Conservatives.

I will leave it at that and let you dwell on this is issue of "electoral reform"

If you like two party systems so much please just spare us your terrible opinions and head over to the US politics thread.
 

Apathy

Member
He's not winning over Quebecois voters regardless of what he does, so I have to guess that he's going to answer everything in English and give the most outrageous answers possible so that everything focuses on him. It'll piss off all the other candidates, and probably kill his shot at being anyone's second choice, but considering everything we know about him, I can't imagine him doing anything else. It'll be interesting to see how Leitch compensates for that; she'll probably try and take things even further than she's already gone.

Also on O'Leary, he's declining to commit to move back to Canada if he wins. I'd say that you'd think most people would be sensitive to the Ignatieff example, except O'Leary probably wasn't even in Canada when that happened.

When moderates like chong get no traction but extremist like leitch do, I have no idea what the conservative base is thinking, so O'Leary not being able to win Quebec doesn't seem to factor in to their picking process.
 

maharg

idspispopd
Electoral reform was not a "major component of their platform." It was -- and remains -- something a very tiny subset of the population cares about.

This is conflating two things: How many people care about something and how significant a plank it was in the platform. For much of the campaign, Trudeau was using the slogan "The last election under first past the post" as a major component of his stump. To say it was an incidental part of his campaign is, frankly, bullshit revisionism. It was absolutely a significant part of their campaign and platform and was a significant draw to voters who would have otherwise voted NDP but found their messaging anemic.

It was part of advocating for "Real Change."

And of course, this argument can always be used for *absolutely anything* a party campaigns on. It's basically arguing that campaigns are meaningless and parties should just do whatever the fuck they want. It is as cynical an argument as you can make about what elections mean, and it reveals something about you every time you make it. It's the root of power-brokerage politics.
 

Tiktaalik

Member
I don't understand how people are trying to spin that Electoral Reform wasn't a cornerstone promise of the Real Change™ campaign.

Trudeau ditches electoral reform – and some of his new-politics appeal

...

Electoral reform had been part of Mr. Trudeau’s new-politics appeal that struck a chord with young voters in 2015. As opposition leader, he spent many days speaking to young voters about political cynicism, telling them, as he did at a stop at the University of Waterloo in 2014, that disaffection with politics among young people “is much more a reflection on what politics is doing wrong than on you yourselves.”

He told those students that Canada needs electoral reform. “It’s just not right that we have a prime minister with a majority who is, you know, disliked or disapproved of by 60 per cent of the population,” he said then. But now it’s 2017.

Trudeau rallied young people and new voters around electoral reform and marijuana legalization, Real Change™, and he won a big majority based on increased turnout. We'll never know if it was literally electoral reform single issue voters that pushed him over the finish line, but bold ideas like electoral reform were part of the Real Change™ package that separated him from Liberal leaders of old and made him appealing to a new generation of voters.
 

BeesEight

Member
Electoral reform was not a "major component of their platform." It was -- and remains -- something a very tiny subset of the population cares about. The number of people who vote solely on that one issue is negligible at best, and those voters were never in the Liberal camp to begin with. Besides that, considering that no NDP government has ever even made a nod towards electoral reform, it shows how seriously we should take the moral spluttering from their supporters today and going forward.

Considering his reassurances for replacing First Past the Post, I'd hardly call it a "niche" promise either.

How about we classify it as prominent then?

It does not change the fact that it is a broken promise and an egregious one at that considering how the issue was handled since they took office. That a subset of the population "cares" is a weak defence for their misleading the issue as well. We shouldn't have to wait for the majority of the population to care about issues which need addressing. This is how environmental issues get kicked down the line until it becomes too late to properly address them.

And as I'll say, regardless of whether the majority of Canadians wanted it or not, it's a very easy criticism to leverage against the Liberal Party that they now simply have to own. They killed this promise and very clearly had no intention of implementing it despite their rhetoric on the campaign trail.

As for the "moral sputtering" comment, I would normally ignore it for the obvious fallacy that it is but for the sake of political discourse, I have never once voted for the NDP. I appreciate the Canadian political system because it affords a plurality of views and parties. My support of electoral reform was to see that plurality supported and maintained. I was also not a "PR or nothing" supporter. Hell, I'd have been happy if Trudeau pushed through ranked ballet or single transferable vote even if the NDP think it's the worst thing to have graced the earth. Instead, the Liberals are simply kicking the issue down the road - yet again - instead of dealing with a problem that will only continue to rear its head in the future.
 

Tiktaalik

Member
Trudeau's broken promise on electoral reform betrays the public interest
Ed Broadbent is chairman of the Broadbent Institute and a long-time advocate of electoral reform.

Through my many decades of involvement in politics and public life, I've lived through a number of disappointments and broken promises.

Prime Minister Justin Trudeau's decision to abandon his commitment to make the 2015 election the last held under the broken first-past-the-post electoral system is one of the most cynical I've seen.

He made a progressive promise to lure voters in the campaign. He won his election. Then he broke his promise.

The decision shows utter contempt for Parliament's electoral reform consultations and the special committee's recommendations to the government. His decision trades recklessly on the trust citizens put in his government to pursue any of its promises in good faith.

Recall that Mr. Trudeau pledged real change, and to do politics differently. He won election on a platform that included an explicit reform promise, and he himself was outspoken about our broken system and repeatedly stood by his (ostensible) belief in ”making every vote count."

As someone who testified at the electoral reform committee, I believed Mr. Trudeau. On Wednesday he not only broke his promise, but also denied the truth – namely that there was a consensus on electoral reform.

The consensus reached by all opposition parties in the committee's majority report was quite precise. They recommended the adoption of a proportional voting system with strong local representation, to be decided by national referendum.

This was a clear mandate for the kind of consensus-building reform the Liberals had said they would be open to.

Consensus on these recommendations did not emerge out of thin air; rather, it emerged from the kind of ”evidence-based policy-making" and collaborative spirit of Parliament the Liberals had claimed to support.

The committee heard from an impressive group of electoral-reform experts from civil society and academia both in Canada and internationally, not to mention former politicians, civil servants and thousands of Canadian citizens. According to an analysis, undertaken by Fair Vote Canada, 88 per cent of expert witnesses to the committee, and the vast majority of people who spoke at the committee's open mic sessions, were in favour of proportional representation. This included a majority in the Prime Minister's own riding of Papineau, Que.

That the testimony was overwhelmingly supportive of replacing a system the government itself has called ”archaic" seems not to have mattered to Mr. Trudeau. The Liberals' supplemental report to the committee ignored the evidence in support of proportional representation, and thus damaged the overall integrity of the committee's work.

Under our current first-past-the-post system, successive governments by Stephen Harper and Justin Trudeau obtained a majority of seats with the support of fewer than four in 10 voters. The reform proposed by the committee, based on local representation and proportionality, would have ended false majorities, promoted cross-party collaboration and put more power back in the hands of voters, where it belongs.

We would have had an electoral system like most of the world's advanced democracies.

Mr. Trudeau had an opportunity to inspire and deliver real change for a generation. Instead, he has chosen to abandon reform, break his promise and contribute to political cynicism.


”A clear preference for a new electoral system, let alone a consensus, has not emerged."

This statement from Trudeau is such bullshit that it's offensive to hear. 88% of witnesses agreeing on one thing is apparently not enough for this government. They better not ever say "evidence based decision making" ever again.
 
Former NDP leader Ed Broadbent is unhappy? Conveniently glosses over the opposition parties being 'united' only because the Conservatives specifically want a referendum to go out and die.
 
As for the "moral sputtering" comment, I would normally ignore it for the obvious fallacy that it is but for the sake of political discourse, I have never once voted for the NDP. I appreciate the Canadian political system because it affords a plurality of views and parties. My support of electoral reform was to see that plurality supported and maintained. I was also not a "PR or nothing" supporter. Hell, I'd have been happy if Trudeau pushed through ranked ballet or single transferable vote even if the NDP think it's the worst thing to have graced the earth. Instead, the Liberals are simply kicking the issue down the road - yet again - instead of dealing with a problem that will only continue to rear its head in the future.

How is it a fallacy? As far as I can tell the people complaining loudest about it are Greens and NDPers. The Greens have some kind of high ground, I guess, though it's not as if they're being vocal about it for purely altruistic reasons: the only way they'll be getting elected is by changing the rules to get them elected, and even then there's no guarantee.

As for the NDP: if they had no problem pointing to provincial successes during the last election as evidence of what they can do, then it's 100% fair to point out that they never seemed to think the electoral system was an issue when they were in government in Ontario, Saskatchewan, BC, Nova Scotia, or the Yukon, and I don't hear anyone clamouring for it right now in Alberta.

And all of this is predicated on the assumption that there even *is* a problem! That, more than anything else, is why electoral reform continues to fail. Its proponents take it as a given that everyone will see the self-evident nature of why FPTP is apparently bad, so they don't bother showing their work as to why it's bad.

This statement from Trudeau is such bullshit that it's offensive to hear. 88% of witnesses agreeing on one thing is apparently not enough for this government. They better not ever say "evidence based decision making" ever again.

Their survey had 360,000 responses, which I assume is more than the number of people who bothered to go out to consultations by several orders of magnitude. You can deride mydemocracy.ca all you want, but the fact is it was still used for gathering opinions, and it's clear that, based on those findings, there wasn't anything like the consensus that you're pretending exists.
 

maharg

idspispopd
How is it a fallacy? As far as I can tell the people complaining loudest about it are Greens and NDPers. The Greens have some kind of high ground, I guess, though it's not as if they're being vocal about it for purely altruistic reasons: the only way they'll be getting elected is by changing the rules to get them elected, and even then there's no guarantee.

God forbid they fight for their voters to get representation in the legislature.

As for the NDP: if they had no problem pointing to provincial successes during the last election as evidence of what they can do, then it's 100% fair to point out that they never seemed to think the electoral system was an issue when they were in government in Ontario, Saskatchewan, BC, Nova Scotia, or the Yukon, and I don't hear anyone clamouring for it right now in Alberta.

And this is also bad. And?
 

Tiktaalik

Member
88 per cent of expert witnesses to the committee
88 per cent of expert witnesses to the committee
88 per cent of expert witnesses to the committee
88 per cent of expert witnesses to the committee

"no consensus"

Evidence Based Decision Making in practice everybody!
 

SRG01

Member
I'm not even a Trudeau supporter and I find this argument to be perplexing.

Qualifying what is "Change" from an incoming government is a slippery slope, because nearly all governments will maintain some sort of status quo from one to the next. Not all policies (read: only a select few) will be adopted for a myriad of reasons, the strongest of which being the realpolitik of the day. Even Harper's government campaigned on "change" and even then had very few major policy changes through his ten year term.

The only administration that can truly, absolutely be qualified as real Change with a capital C is the Trump administration south of the border.

88 per cent of expert witnesses to the committee
88 per cent of expert witnesses to the committee
88 per cent of expert witnesses to the committee
88 per cent of expert witnesses to the committee

"no consensus"

Evidence Based Decision Making in practice everybody!

Tik, please re-read that statement. Expert Witnesses should not be conflated with actual popular support.
 

Tiktaalik

Member
Tik, please re-read that statement. Expert Witnesses should not be conflated with actual popular support.

It's not up to the public to somehow by itself achieve a consensus on this issue.

It's the job of our elected representatives to study the issue, consult with the public, consult with experts, achieve a consensus on how to proceed and then either continue to consult with the public further or debate the issue in parliament. The first part was achieved by the committee. Trudeau is being totally disingenuous by suggesting that electoral reform consensus was apparently supposed to be achieved in some other fashion.
 

maharg

idspispopd
It's not up to the public to somehow by itself achieve a consensus on this issue.

It's the job of our elected representatives to study the issue, consult with the public, consult with experts, achieve a consensus on how to proceed and then either continue to consult with the public further or debate the issue in parliament. The first part was achieved by the committee. Trudeau is being totally disingenuous by suggesting that electoral reform consensus was apparently supposed to be achieved in some other fashion.

Yep. Also, isn't it such a shock that the majority is luke-warm on something that will dilute their franchise somewhat, giving a piece of it to voices that are currently unrepresented? I mean, how could this happen!
 
88 per cent of expert witnesses to the committee
88 per cent of expert witnesses to the committee
88 per cent of expert witnesses to the committee
88 per cent of expert witnesses to the committee

"no consensus"

380,000 respondents to their survey
380,000 respondents to their survey
380,000 respondents to their survey
380,000 respondents to their survey

No consensus.
 

maharg

idspispopd
Are we pretending the survey wasn't deliberately designed to produce a lack of consensus whether there was one or not? It was absolute trash.

It's obvious as hell that they've done everything they could to tank this promise (though they still botched doing it in a way that wouldn't hurt them). The level of wilful blindness you're exhibiting is approaching gutter_trash levels here.
 
I'm saying that the survey was designed to find out whether there was popular appetite for massive changes to how we select our government. Considering that successive referenda have showed either indifference or hostility to the idea, I don't think it's insane to think that the survey found that nothing has changed in that regard.
 

Apathy

Member
If O'Leary loses, it's a guarantee he won't run in the 2019 election. He just won't admit it to avoid further comparisons to Trump.

Oh it will be a massive blow to his ego. Might shut him up for a long time and keep him out of the public eye
 
Are we pretending the survey wasn't deliberately designed to produce a lack of consensus whether there was one or not? It was absolute trash.

It's obvious as hell that they've done everything they could to tank this promise (though they still botched doing it in a way that wouldn't hurt them). The level of wilful blindness you're exhibiting is approaching gutter_trash levels here.

I agree... the survey was high school level incompetent, and anyone with an IQ larger than their shoe size could see it... Questions about how we feel about...? I've been a devout Liberal supporter since the days of Stephen Harper's first minority, and I have devoted time and money to the cause... My MP is getting a bloody earful on this one, and I'm not letting it go... This was important; just because they think they can sweep it under the rug doesn't mean they should. The fact that they are trying to do so basically betrays everything Trudeau said about political cynicism and a new way of doing politics prior to getting elected...
 

Tiktaalik

Member
The survey was clearly designed to be useless and to just muddle the issue but even still the survey showed dissatisfaction with the status quo.

...

In the Liberals' online experiment, just over 60 per cent strongly agreed or somewhat agreed ”it is better for several parties to have to govern together than for one party to make all the decisions in government," and almost 70 per cent strongly agreed or somewhat agreed ”a party that wins the most seats in an election should still have to compromise with other parties, even if it means reconsidering some of its policies."

...

http://news.nationalpost.com/news/c...want-proportional-representation-some-mps-say

There's a clear interest in a system that is different from "party that gets 39% of the vote gains 100% of the power and is able to do whatever it wants."

The stupid survey didn't ask people their opinions on their preferred electoral system and then Trudeau turns around and states "A clear preference for a new electoral system, let alone a consensus, has not emerged" No shit! How could a consensus emerge if people weren't even asked?

Anyway my point is not about the useless survey, but about the committee process. The committee did what it was supposed to do, talked with the experts, and did find consensus. Trudeau is not stating the facts by suggesting that this didn't happen.
 
Kevin O'Leary goofed today.
http://ottawacitizen.com/news/polit...ng-funeral-for-quebec-mosque-shooting-victims

http://www.cbc.ca/news/politics/oleary-gun-range-shooting-thursday-1.3963724
he tweeted on the day of the funeral of 3 of the slain Quebec City victims a link to his shooting range video:
tweetoleary.png
he then deleted his tweet

(video of gun shooting range:)
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=if406irf6WI

then realized his gaf and retweeted:
https://twitter.com/kevinolearytv/status/827246103330451461?ref_src=twsrc^tfw
Out of respect for today's service I have taken down my last post.


the guy doesn't even pay attention to local news from his birth province....

O'Leary... just visiting
 

CazTGG

Member
Kevin O'Leary goofed today.
http://ottawacitizen.com/news/polit...ng-funeral-for-quebec-mosque-shooting-victims

http://www.cbc.ca/news/politics/oleary-gun-range-shooting-thursday-1.3963724
he tweeted on the day of the funeral of 3 of the slain Quebec City victims a link to his shooting range video:

he then deleted his tweet

(video of gun shooting range:)
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=if406irf6WI

then realized his gaf and retweeted:
https://twitter.com/kevinolearytv/status/827246103330451461?ref_src=twsrc^tfw



the guy doesn't even pay attention to local news from his birth province....

O'Leary... just visiting

I'm finding it more and more difficult to see any candidate worse than him aside from Kellie Leitch. I sincerely hope other CPC hopefuls call him out on this because this should be given far more attention than it appears to be receiving at the moment.
 
Nick Kouvalis just resigned as Leitch's campaign manager! On mobile so I can't link, but he just tweeted it.


And in terms of awfulness...I don't know. O'Leary is bad, but so are most of them. Brad Trost is a homophobic, anti-choice bigot. Andrew Scheer and Pierre Lemieux are also pretty hardcore social conservatives. Maxime Bernier wants to end the social safety net, and he has some pretty iffy beliefs on civil rights issues thanks to his dedication to libertarianism. Nearly all of them are climate science deniers. Even Chong, who's supposedly the "good" Conservative, has some pretty scary beliefs on privatization and government services. Yes, O'Leary is louder, but that doesn't mean the rest of the field is much better.
 

diaspora

Member
Nick Kouvalis just resigned as Leitch's campaign manager! On mobile so I can't link, but he just tweeted it.


And in terms of awfulness...I don't know. O'Leary is bad, but so are most of them. Brad Trost is a homophobic, anti-choice bigot. Andrew Scheer and Pierre Lemieux are also pretty hardcore social conservatives. Maxime Bernier wants to end the social safety net, and he has some pretty iffy beliefs on civil rights issues thanks to his dedication to libertarianism. Nearly all of them are climate science deniers. Even Chong, who's supposedly the "good" Conservative, has some pretty scary beliefs on privatization and government services. Yes, O'Leary is louder, but that doesn't mean the rest of the field is much better.
Was going to say the same.

https://twitter.com/NickKouvalis/status/827304952016019456
 

Apathy

Member
O'Leary doesn't give a shit about the Muslims that were murdered. Someone on the team must have realized how stupid the tweet was. As for Kouvalis, good riddance to a garbage human. Glad that he provably hurt get campaign enough with his last attack that they had to do something about it.
 

Pancake Mix

Copied someone else's pancake recipe
I'm finding it more and more difficult to see any candidate worse than him aside from Kellie Leitch. I sincerely hope other CPC hopefuls call him out on this because this should be given far more attention than it appears to be receiving at the moment.

He's much worse. He has zero tact in how little he cares about working-class Canadians (zero), he doesn't even spend his time in this country (he's a US resident), and he's a serious, hardcore neoliberal of the most extreme kind, far beyond how any Canadian Prime Minister has ever governed. He also has no respect for either the indigenous peoples or the founding nations of Canada, and his lack of tact and propensity to run his mouth would show with the indigenous peoples, I'm sure. He doesn't remotely care about anyone other than himself. He has no understanding of what it means to be an MP, let alone a party leader, let alone leader of the opposition, let alone a PM. The less the media here focuses on his loud mouth, the better.

He would turn us into a loud, obnoxious joke on the world stage.
 
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