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Champions League Football (soccer) match suspended because the 4th official referred to someone as "the black guy"
- Thread starter kiiltz
- Start date
GymWolf
Member
The guy was tired and wanted to go sleep it's the only explanation for being so offended by something like that.
The referee can't remember every player's name so the 4th referee using the skin tone to indicate a guy is nothing to get mad about, maybe the name was hard to pronounce, you have multiple reasons to identify someone with the skin tone and nothing has to do with racism.
The referee can't remember every player's name so the 4th referee using the skin tone to indicate a guy is nothing to get mad about, maybe the name was hard to pronounce, you have multiple reasons to identify someone with the skin tone and nothing has to do with racism.
GymWolf
Member
So daltonism is the way to go?!
lock2k
Banned
Here in Brazil until 5 years ago Negro was the norm and Preto (Black) was an insult. Now it's the opposite. Lol
I think it's because of how black as a skin tone is used as a deregatory word and not just to describe someone. If there was more black people in there, would he still just use "the black guy"? At some point I think it's nice to see both teams respond to this kind of treatment even if the guy didn't mean to be insulting it only proves that many people are fed up with racism. I rather they stand agains't it even if it's by mistake than not taking a stand at all and allowing this to keep going.
Stiflers Mom
Banned
If you think that naming a skin colour is derogatory instead of just descriptive, maybe you are the racist fuck?
Have you thought about that?
The point is that it's certainly viable if he is the only one.
When I was in Africa people and hanging out with black people off course called me the "whitey" (the word they used is actually a lot more offensive), and I didn't give a shit.
Yeah, let's cancel someone because he just used the most appropriate standout descriptor for someone in a group.
One day here and already REEing.
Great job, little snowflake.
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SirKicksalot
Member
Kayoba
Member
I wish todays adults acted a bit more mature, I can't remember this being a problem 20-30 years ago. Now everyone is so paranoid that they perceive everything as personal attacks, from the color of their skin to their sexuality.
I'm sorry, but there are many languages and cultures out there. Some foreign words or cultural practices may not be in your taste and whining will not change that, so learn to adapt. Forcing other cultures to change in order to suit your personal needs, is in fact racist; not the other way around.
I'm sorry, but there are many languages and cultures out there. Some foreign words or cultural practices may not be in your taste and whining will not change that, so learn to adapt. Forcing other cultures to change in order to suit your personal needs, is in fact racist; not the other way around.
OneBigPuss
Member
Thirty7ven
Banned
Those of you excusing this are pathetic.
Schrödinger's cat
Banned
Ah, the moral superior who has no argument of their own that they can substantiate with logic, evidence and reason.
And an inability to read the full details or reconcile basic and accepted use of standard language as exemplified in Post #33
Just accusations and judgements. Sneering derision.
Tschumi
Member
I dunno the context.. it may be worse than the reporting makes it sound.. but for real, as someone who is against racism in a big way.... They seem to have picked a hugely low-intensity event to make this nigh on unprecedented protest gesture.. apparently it's okay for fans to monkey chant - they'll get a crowd limit the next match and the black guy who guy targeted will be told to toughen up.. but holy shit look out if a 4th official says "not that one, the black one"...
I'm just saying you pick your battles and they've picked a relative molehill to abandon a game over.
... I don't know enough context, really~
I'm just saying you pick your battles and they've picked a relative molehill to abandon a game over.
... I don't know enough context, really~
Stiflers Mom
Banned
Would you mind being adressed as that "white person" in a team with otherwise only black players?
Or the "dude" when you are on the road with a group of women?
Or the "short" or "tall" one in a group of tall or short people?
The "blonde guy" in a group of dark haired people.
The problem I have with this is that it once again you are being told to not use an extremely normal speech pattern (differentiating someone by his/her outstanding trait) just to not offend somebody in the slightest way.
This would be completely different if the "N"-word would have been said, then it would be racism and that offending person should be treated accordingly.
But you really completely lose me if you are not allowed anymore to use the most obvious differentiator in a social group situation to address someone.
This is major insanity.
Or the "dude" when you are on the road with a group of women?
Or the "short" or "tall" one in a group of tall or short people?
The "blonde guy" in a group of dark haired people.
The problem I have with this is that it once again you are being told to not use an extremely normal speech pattern (differentiating someone by his/her outstanding trait) just to not offend somebody in the slightest way.
This would be completely different if the "N"-word would have been said, then it would be racism and that offending person should be treated accordingly.
But you really completely lose me if you are not allowed anymore to use the most obvious differentiator in a social group situation to address someone.
This is major insanity.
Thirty7ven
Banned
The player made the right point, in a football game each shirt has a number, each team a different colored shirt and name, and when referring to a white player he didn’t say “the white guy” but with the black player he used “the black guy”.
If you can’t do the math here and would rather trip yourself over to find non sensical excuses, you are free to do it.
Also post #33 is written by someone with apparently 0 knowledge of history.
Its 2020, and if you still need someone to guide you through this then it’s because you refuse to accept change, evolution of language and social norms. And you refuse to do this out of some misguided notion that this hurts you somehow.
borborygmus
Member
Black guys are black though. If you think it's pejorative that betrays your own prejudice.
I refuse to accept "change" towards a cliff. I'm sick of these dumb slogans like "fear of change." There is no vaguer phrase, and that's exactly why manipulators use it so much. It's getting so someone can punch you in the face and say "What's the matter? You're just afraid of change aren't you."
I refuse to let manipulators like you decide what direction it's going to go. The language that you use has a lot of built-in assumptions, including that you're somehow in a position to decide what the world is going to be like. It's the same old tired "right side of history" and "settled science" rhetoric that presupposes victory. You actually have no standing whatsoever to claim that the "evolution of language" in any way supports your position.
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Thirty7ven
Banned
Listen you wanna fight for your right to differentiate football players by their skin color, go at it.
You wanna defend it by claiming it’s the end of the world if people don’t accept it? Go at it.
Fight for your right to be racist.
You wanna defend it by claiming it’s the end of the world if people don’t accept it? Go at it.
Fight for your right to be racist.
DeepBreath87
Banned
Black people refer to themselves as black all the time. Calling a black person black is not an insult. It’s a descriptor. No different than “the short one”. You are a complete moron. The shell game you play with language is amazingly stupid. “Black owned businesses” “Black lives matter” both acceptable. “The black guy”? Definitely racist.
How about “black quarterback” in the NFL? Racist too?
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borborygmus
Member
You literally think describing someone as black is an insult.
Thirty7ven
Banned
It’s different from saying “the short one”, and if this is your starting point then you have nothing.
I mean clearly you’re the moron here, but that’s neither here nor there. Morons can think too, so I expect more from you.
I think context is key, and at best you’re out of touch.
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DeepBreath87
Banned
Well your smugness makes you look like a self indulgent asshole. How about calling Lamar Jackson a “black quarterback”? Or Mike Tomlin a “black head coach”? Whose representation are we worried about in certain sports if not black people?
So it’s ok to call a person black, just not under specific circumstances, according to you? I think your lack of thinking in this topic makes it pretty obvious who the moron is.
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Thirty7ven
Banned
I think it was the ref’s lack of thinking that got him in trouble. And considering you’re acting like a dumb prick about it, I would avoid situations where your lack of thinking might be exposed. You don’t need a bigger “moron” sign than you already have plastered over your forehead.
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DeepBreath87
Banned
I love the irony of your posts. You have no self awareness do you. But you hyper aggressive stance isn’t working. You can’t explain anything because you aren’t making any sense, so you’re flailing.
What are the rules for when it’s ok to refer to a black person as black, smart guy? And make it relatively simple. You know I probably won’t be able to handle anything too complicated.
Bitmap Frogs
Mr. Community
This was unprofessional.
Not worth the noise being made, but definitely unprofessional.
Not worth the noise being made, but definitely unprofessional.
Thirty7ven
Banned
You’re the one who started by calling me a moron so this face turn of yours is pretty grating.
When is it ok to refer to a person as a black person? Oh I don’t know, try using the same criteria as you would with a white person. So in a football pitch try the name on the back of the shirt, the number. Go from there and run the list all the way down until you’re left with nothing but skin color.
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DeepBreath87
Banned
So it’s just in this specific context that calling someone black is racist? Because while I agree that a ref should use name/number, using bad form doesn’t make anyone a racist. Calling a person black is not a racist term.
Also, you are correct. I should not have called you a moron. In my defense I was half awake, but my apologies.
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Thirty7ven
Banned
I didn’t say the ref is a racist. I believe it was an honest slip and that it’s hard to control language in pressure situations, specially when you probably spent your life not having to worry about the usage of said word.
I do defend however that it shouldn’t be accepted and should be used as a learning experience so that in future situations it can be avoided. That’s all.
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Stiflers Mom
Banned
Dude, we are giving you all kinds of rational arguments for the sake of having a discussion, and all we get from you is some screeching and calling us racists and morons just because you decided we are.
You know there is a place for people like you?
ResetEra
ResetEra is the internet's premier video gaming forum destination. A savory assortment of enthusiasts, journalists, & developers. Home to breaking news and discussion about Microsoft, Sony, Nintendo, Apple, PC, PlayStation, Xbox, Switch, Google Stadia, Steam, Android, iOS, etcetera.
www.resetera.com
Have fun there screeching with the other purple hairs.
Thirty7ven
Banned
Dude, we are giving you all kinds of rational arguments for the sake of having a discussion, and all we get from you is some screeching and calling us racists and morons just because you decided we are.
You know there is a place for people like you?
ResetEra
ResetEra is the internet's premier video gaming forum destination. A savory assortment of enthusiasts, journalists, & developers. Home to breaking news and discussion about Microsoft, Sony, Nintendo, Apple, PC, PlayStation, Xbox, Switch, Google Stadia, Steam, Android, iOS, etcetera.
Have fun there screeching with the other purple hairs.
You’re not giving good arguments for why the usage of the word in this context is ok. You’re just fighting for your right to use the word whenever you want.
I was a called a moron first. And I’m not the one using out of context scenarios to justify why it’s ok in this specific context. And if nobody ever taught you that context is everything, then now you know.
And if you don’t like Neogaf and how it’s a place for a wide range of opinions, you can kindly fuck off to your echo chamber of choice. I’m going nowhere.
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DeepBreath87
Banned
He’s being called a racist though. It’s not “hey after the game I’m going to go to this guy and let him know to be careful with his language.” It’s “stop the game, I won’t play if this guy is reffing”. That seems like a wild overreaction to what appears to be at worst a lack of decorum.
Slings and Arrows
Banned
So what? What's the problem?
Anyway,
I wonder how much money all those players got paid for that match, only to abandon it? I wish i could walk off the job, still get paid £10,000's just for showing up for 20 minutes because some little foreign fella said "that black guy"
Edit:
And who are you to dictate to people what they can and can't say?
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Lord Thunderbear
Member
The referee wasn't referring to a player, but to a member of the staff - thus no number or names on the shirt.
You don't even know what you're talking about and you're still here complaining for the sake of it.
Seems fitting.
Stiflers Mom
Banned
You are not even disputing our arguments.
Just screeching "RACISTS" around.
Yeah, I will continue to use the word "black" as a descriptor of a skin color, like every sane person does.
The context is that the only black person around was called "the black person".
How is that racist?
You didn't give an answer yet.
I don't mind your opinion, it's just not furthering your cause if you call people racists here without any evidence why and not engaging in sincere discussion.
tl/dr:
If you think "black" is something bad, maybe you are the racist fuck. Context or not.
Stiflers Mom
Banned
Thirty7ven
Banned
Well then he should’ve said the team’s assistant coach. He’s the assistant manager by the way, and there’s only one of those, he’s the manager’s right hand man and it’s the ref’s job to know who he is. In fact he should know him by name, and it’s a lack of professionalism that he didn’t.
You’re the one screeching, evidently. Must be really loud inside your head. Saying it over and over won’t make me the one losing composure.
Just like you, I don’t own social norms or dictate language terms and how they should be used. But I listen, because as a matter of fact, language is something we learn, we aren’t born with it.
You can say what you want, but you don’t decide how society at large decides to evolve language and terms. This has happened throughout history, as etymology is an ongoing process.
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Stiflers Mom
Banned
Thirty7ven
Banned
Stiflers Mom
Banned
Shouldn't you be somewhere drinking beer and laughing with your Klan brothers for being successful in denormalizing the usage of the word "black"?
Slings and Arrows
Banned
No it's not. Etymology is the study of the origin of words. Once you find the origin, it stops.
Thirty7ven
Banned
Origin is one part, history is another. History doesn't stop.
Slings and Arrows
Banned
Doubling down? Nice.
History does stop. That's why it's history. And if you're willing to use the history argument, read up on it.
Etymology can be used to distinguish the point in history where invaders came to native lands. The invaders force their choice of language and words upon the population while adopting passive words used for trade and bartering.
Every invading group always dictates language, every time, all throughout history.
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Thirty7ven
Banned
I'm sorry what? That doesn't make any sense. Time doesn't stop.
Can't believe you actually went there. I thought you would because it was funny in my mind, but you actually did.
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notseqi
Member
I'd like to know how this came about, I imagine it being 'Get the assistant coach off the field.' 'Which one?' 'The black one.'.
There is more than one assistant coach around and he is the only black guy with the turkish team. Why not make it easy as there is no reason for the fourth official to know the assistant coaches name.
There is more than one assistant coach around and he is the only black guy with the turkish team. Why not make it easy as there is no reason for the fourth official to know the assistant coaches name.
Quik maffs. So proud.
I know many italians that have no qualms on going with the hard-R option but it's not unusual to distinguish people in such a way, 'ragazzo nero' was often heard and not taken as offensive.
ManofOne
Plus Member
I found the origin of bullshit
Thirty7ven
Banned
Assistant manager, each team only has one.
Yes this is true. But tradition doesn’t make it right. Clearly people are fighting to change that. It doesn’t make someone a racist for saying it, but is increasingly more and more a lack of tact.
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notseqi
Member
Still fine as the name is not expected to be known by the fourth assistant.
It was only an imagined scenario anyway, the 'Which one?' part is the important one.
Stiflers Mom
Banned
Imagine some black dude that you might know living in your neighborhood helps your grandma that collapsed, and you want to thank him when you meet him next time but she is not allowed to tell you he was a black dude along other descriptors because then she would be a racist according to that dumb fuck reeing in this thread.
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