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[UnblessedSoul]

Can someone explain to me why the bbc were getting slanted on that newsnight thing about revealing a possibly pedo suspect?, there should just be one large investigation and all those involved jailed for life, I don't find anything wrong with the bbc itself, just some of the people running it, haven't really been keeping up with the news

 

[captainnapalm]

With comments like these and people claiming David Icke's paedo claims can be taken seriously you're doing a grand job of muddying the issue yourselves.

Yet if a year ago someone made the claim that there was a large paedo ring of rich elites using the social services to procure fresh meat, you'd be happily writing that person off as a total loon, I imagine.

 

[DECK'ARD]

Yet if a year ago someone made the claim that there was a large paedo ring of rich elites using the social services to procure fresh meat, you'd be happily writing that person off as a total loon, I imagine.

Actually most of this information has been out there for years, but you had to go looking for it and then go looking for the connections of one bit to the other. Savile prompting people to go looking because of the sheer scale of what he was allowed to get away with, and what he himself was linked to.

The main missing bits of the jigsaw being the statements from the victims which were censored to remove any names, which now has made it possible to definitely connect one part to another. Of course one of those victims now having been character assassinated for doing so.

The ones who chose to stay anonymous on Channel 4 news were probably wise, I just hope this doesn't deter more from coming forward and that Messham is found ok.

 

[Brera]

Some of this doesnt make sense.

Why would the police push the victims into naming McAlister?

Now he's gone missing...

 

[PJV3]

The BBC got a briefing from Tom Watson saying that there is evidence out there that implicated a high profile Conservative politician. Newsnight ran with this without even doing the most basic of fact checking (showing a picture of the accused to the accuser, for example) and it turns out that the person they accused, Alistair McAlpine, is innocent and Mr Messham had been pushed into naming Lord McAlpine as his abuser by the police (as were others) and other statements he had made about his abuser didn't match with Lord McAlpine.

The government have currently got 2 investigations going, there are 9 in total among the many organisations implicated in wrongdoing. Many, including me, think the government should launch a wide ranging investigation into all allegations, all the coverups and basically how it got so bad and how the establishment of this country allowed so many children and teenagers to be sexually abused. I would rather it be conducted in private so that innocent people who are wrongly accused (like Lord McAlpine) are not hounded in public. Others disagree and would have it in public so there is no chance of a further cover up. It's a difficult proposition.

Tom Watson is talking about a seperate abuse ring, and he has gone to the police with that information.

 

[captainnapalm]

Actually most of this information has been out there for years, but you had to go looking for it and then go looking for the connections of one bit to the other.

The main missing bits of the jigsaw being the statements from the victims which were censored to remove any names, which now has made it possible to definitely connect one part to another. Of course one of those victims now having been character assassinated for doing so.

The ones who chose to stay anonymous on Channel 4 news were probably wise, I just hope this doesn't deter more from coming forward and that Messham is found ok.

I just read the Dailymail article on him. Damn, is there any doubt they're serving some kind of hidden agenda with that story. The commenters below the story aren't having it, though.

Even if this man does turn out to be some kind of fraud, it shoudn't invalidate a story that is obviously now much bigger than him.

 

[DECK'ARD]

I just read the Dailymail article on him. Damn, is there any doubt they're serving some kind of hidden agenda with that story. The commenters below the story aren't having it, though.

Even if this man does turn out to be some kind of fraud, it shoudn't invalidate a story that is obviously now much bigger than him.

The social worker who blew the whistle on North Wales already confirmed he is a genuine victim and spoke out against all this saying the victims are being failed as before.

Also his story on Channel 4 news of giving photos to the police was confirmed by someone involved with the Waterhouse inquiry, who said there was a court order to have the book of photos destroyed.

 

[captainnapalm]

A channel 4 news reporter has tweeted that Messham is ok.

 

[Dabanton]

Steve Messham seems to have gone missing : http://hat4uk.wordpress.com/2012/11/12/exclusive-steve-messham-missing-for-eight-hours/

Of course, it could be that he's decided to lie low but yesterday's character assassination probably isn't helping with what is likely a fragile state of mind.

hat4uk is a great blog some interesting bits and pieces from his latest entry.

What is behind this wilful desire of the UK’s media set to obfuscate Messham’s role, the McAlpine family role, and to allow the ridiculous BBC sliding-doors-on-ice-sitcom-gala to take centre stage in the context of a hideous sex scandal?

I doubt if anyone can answer that, but before more distracting shouts of “innuendo!” emanate from the Carlton Club, let’s stick to solid, recorded evidence for a while:

At the Waterhouse Tribunal:

Gerard Elias QC: “Does the name McAlpine mean anything to you.”

Steven Messham: “Yes, sir.”

Elias: “In what context?”

Messham: “I was also abused by him sexually.”

Sir Ronald Waterhouse: “Is the person you referred to alive or dead?”

Messham: “I believe he is dead.”

Right, are we all clear on this? The McAlpine Messham was referring to is dead. So then, not Lord Alastair McAlpine. So why did the BBC nail his Lordship? Why have the media ignored the deceased nature of the suspect? Why did the Mail rubbish Messham in yesterday’s two articles?

OK, here is another fact. The two authors of one of yesterday’s Mail pieces, David Rose and Bob Woffingden, were both called to give evidence to a May 2002 Home Affairs Committee report on child abuse allegations – chaired by Chris Mullin, and joined by one David Cameron.

Bob Woffingden is a member of the British False Memory Syndrome group: their evidence has been used to take children from their parents in the Secret Family Courts, and dismiss evidence against paedophile social workers.

David Rose is a former member of MI5.

So then….not just objective MoS hacks.

They appeared in their 2002 evidence to be claiming that the paedophile perpetrators in question had suffered a gross miscarriage of justice. The Dept Of Health Bryn Estyn report (only 2 years later) shamed both their testimonies. Perhaps they’re still feeling sore. Or perhaps they have another agenda? I think we should be told.

Right then detractors, is this non-innuendo enough for you? No?

Fine, what about this:

The Waterhouse report contains Steven Messham’s statement to the police. In it, Steven testified that his abuser “had several cars and a chauffeur.”
The abusers would wait for Steven Messham at the bottom of a lane near Bryn Estyn children’s home when Steven had a late pass from the home. Messham was then abused in the car in a lay-by, and at the Crest Hotel in Wrexham.

Local Welsh councillor Keith Gregory has tesified that boys from Bryn Estyn would be taken to the homes of two McAlpine family members in the area – Gerwyn Hall and Marchwiel Hall, both a few miles from Wrexham town centre. Gerwyn Hall was occupied by Jimmie McAlpine, who died in 1991. Marchwiel Hall was the home of Jimmie’s sister. Their son, John Bell, lived at Marchwiel Hall at the time. He now lives in Thailand.

Jimmie McAlpine’s ID fits to the letter with his chauffeurs, his massive car collection, the house where he lived, the hotel he frequented, and the golf club membership he shared at the time with the two leaders at Bryn Estyn….both of whom went to jail on multiple charges of buggery.

Here’s my take on this last part: it is NOT innuendo, it is very powerful and consistent circumstantial evidence. At the time it should have been more than enough to put Jimmie McAlpine into a police HQ for questioning. But that didn’t happen.

There is an overpowering smell of rotting flesh in all this, but as the huge injustice done by the depraved of our nation goes out of focus, the main media of our Septic Isle are concerned with….revolving doors at the BBC.

Give me strength.

 

[DECK'ARD]

Time we heard more from the media about ole Jimmie really isn't it.

Then ask who was alive with enough influence to stop it all coming out, and stop Jimmie being charged when he was alive.

 

[DECK'ARD]

Indeed, and since it is impossible to libel the dead one hopes the investigations are starting.

Yep, there's two who are dead who need going over, if they can do it for Savile so effectively they should have no problem here.

 

[CyclopsRock]

You really think that's the only reason the BBC's taking brickbats right now? Seriously?

Yes, the BBC fucked up. That doesn't merit the disproportionate treatment they're getting now. Compare this case to the allegations across the print media last year over Chris Jefferies, and tell me with a straight face that they received the same reaction.

That's not the only reason, nope. But it isn't like people are making a mountain out of a mole hill here. These are already some big mountains. They're being held responsible for their actions and their mistakes which, were it not for ITV, would never have come out.

 

[Wes]

So it seems the biggest thing people are up in arms about between the Noon and 6 news block is the £450,000 goign to Entwhistle?

Well I imagine he'll turn it down, as do all people who were in position of power who are offered such sums of money to the derision of the general public (like the banking bosses of the past few years).

 

[Joel Was Right]

Shut down the BBC for this? Reminds me of Fox viewers wanting to impeach Obama for Benghazi

 

[DECK'ARD]

Sad to see the line 'it could never happen now' being used so much.

Hardly anyone knows about Rochdale, if the media or the Internet don't do a better job of pulling all this together this will get buried. A few old celebs offered up as a symptom of their time.

With the questions about how they got away with it, what else, and especially who else, they were linked to conveniently dodged.

 

[DECK'ARD]

Gateshead now:

http://www.journallive.co.uk/north-...ateshead-s-axwell-park-school-61634-32212869/

Abuse investigation team urged to look at Gateshead's Axwell Park School

THE team investigating the North Wales abuse scandal has been urged to look at a North East school where a shamed teacher began his career.

Missed signs of abuse must now be probed, warned Labour MP Dave Anderson as it emerged the paedophile at the centre of the North Wales outrage had been in charge of vulnerable children.

Peter Howarth taught at Gateshead’s Axwell Park School from 1966 to 1973 before going on to be jailed for horrific crimes against children in his next post in Wales. Now it is claimed he was part of a paedophile ring with Jimmy Savile and others.

It was during his early career at the Home Office-run school for troubled youngsters in Blaydon his predatory actions first began.

However, no action was taken and the pervert was then appointed deputy head of Bryn Estyn in North Wales, where he committed the crimes that saw him jailed in 1994. He later died in prison.

Now calls have been made for Keith Bristow, the National Crime Agency chief tasked with running the new inquiry, to extend his remit to look at how Howarth’s pattern of behaviour began on Tyneside.

Mr Anderson, MP for Blaydon, said: “I am clear there should be absolutely no no-go areas in getting all the facts of this horrendous abuse exposed.


“I would urge anyone with information to come forward, particularly anyone who may have been abused while in care. If there is any suggestion of wrong-doing at Axwell Park the authorities must do all in their power to get to the truth.”

At least one of them could have been stopped before the abuse in North Wales.

 

[DECK'ARD]

DECK'ARD

Switch to C4 News now.

Cheers, C4 have been good on this so far.

 

[DECK'ARD]

That guy gave a pretty good explanation of what the two government inquiries are doing.

Caught the end, will swap to +1 after.

 

[DECK'ARD]

Howarth, referred to in that Gateshead article, and Savile were directly linked:

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/ukn...inked-to-North-Wales-child-abuse-scandal.html

Boys were reportedly molested to entertain Savile at Bryn Estyn care home in Wrexham, North Wales.

One victim said he was raped repeatedly by deputy head of the home Peter Howarth.
He said that he and other boys would also have their pyjama bottoms pulled down by Howarth for Savile's entertainment.

The boy, known as "Ben" said that Savile would regularly visit the care home with his brother in a chauffeured limousine.

Boys would be taken to visit him at Howarth's flat if they behaved well.

Howarth one of the very few to be convicted after a social worker finally blew the whistle because of no one taking any action, yet nothing else came out about Savile or anyone else? And he could have been stopped before North Wales even happened but was promoted there instead?

This really couldn't stink any more.

 

[Wes]

Interesting when Newsnight has to criticise itself.

 

[DECK'ARD]

Interesting when Newsnight has to criticise itself.

While the BBC are screwing it up, seems ITV are going to ramp it up about Savile at least:

http://www.mirror.co.uk/news/uk-news/jimmy-savile-child-abuse-probe-1430294

There's going to be a second Exposure programme, and a few of his mates have fled the country.

 

[MJLord]

I should probably have been keeping up with this. Can anyone give me the skinny ?

 

[DECK'ARD]

I should probably have been keeping up with this. Can anyone give me the skinny ?

In the OP + the last few pages.

At the rate it's going Savile will have more connections than Kevin Bacon soon.

 

[DECK'ARD]

The Church now:

Former UK bishop held in child sex abuse inquiry

LONDON (Reuters) - A former Church of England bishop was arrested on Tuesday on suspicion of sexually assaulting boys as young as 12, police said, the latest public figure to be accused after weeks of child abuse claims that have engulfed the BBC and celebrities.

Separate police investigations into the late television presenter Jimmy Savile have fuelled a national abuse scandal that has dominated public debate and provoked a bout of national soul searching.

Police said Peter Ball, 80, was held in western England on suspicion of sex offences against eight boys and young men, aged from 12 to their early 20s, in the late 1980s and early 1990s. He was a bishop in Lewes, southern England, and Gloucester, in the southwest. A woman who answered the telephone at his house in Somerset, southwest England, declined to comment on the arrest.

Ball was arrested at his home after the Church of England passed information from internal reviews to detectives investigating historic sexual offences. A second man, a retired Anglican priest aged 67, was detained in Sussex, southern England, on suspicion of separate offences against two teenage boys in 1981 and 1983, police said.

Detective Chief Inspector Carwyn Hughes, of Sussex Police, said it was a "very complex inquiry". "Allegations of historic offences are treated just as seriously as any more recent offences," he said.

The church has tightened measures to prevent child abuse after criticism that for years it was slow to respond to allegations and even covered up offences or moved suspected pedophiles to protect its reputation.

"The Church of England takes any allegations of abuse very seriously and is committed to being a safe place for all," said the Right Reverend Paul Butler, Bishop of Southwell and Nottingham, chairman of a church group set up to protect children.

Another MP has been named in the Commons as well but trying to find a better source.

Edit:

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/ukn...th-sexually-abused-boys-MP-tells-Commons.html

Sir Cyril Smith 'sexually abused boys', MP tells Commons

Sir Cyril Smith, the former Liberal Democrat MP, sexually abused boys and "reduced them to quivering wrecks", an MP has claimed during a Commons debate. Simon Danczuk, the Labour MP for Smith's former constituency in Rochdale, described him as a "29 stone bully" who "imposed himself" on his victims whom he "humiliated and terrified".

The allegations were investigated by Lancashire Police in the 1960s but no action was taken. Mr Danczuk said some alleged victims had only now come forward in the wake of the Jimmy Savile scandal and it was time to find out "why was this allowed to happen".

Smith's brother, Norman, said he was "staggered" the MP was blackening the name of Sir Cyril, who died in 2010, adding that the police found at the time that there was no case to answer. Barry Fitton, a former resident of the Cambridge House hostel in Rochdale, told the website politicshome.com that when he was 15 Smith would make him strip, smacked his bare bottom and then stroked his buttocks.

On another occasion, Smith subjected him to a "medical" that involved him stroking his thighs and testicles.
Another former resident, Eddie Shorrock, who was 17, said Smith, who founded the hostel and had keys to its premises, also gave him a "medical" whenever he took time off work. Mr Danczuk said a third victim, who wished to remain anonymous, had contacted him today to describe the "abuse meted out by Sir Cyril".

Rumours about child abuse dogged Smith for much of his life, and appeared in a local magazine and in Private Eye in 1979.
Mr Danczuk, referring to the recent Rochdale grooming scandal, said: "Attempts to suppress the truth are not new in Rochdale.
"Sir Cyril Smith was a political giant in Rochdale but his career was continually dogged by allegations that he had abused boys...these allegations must be properly investigated and the seriousness of the victims' complaints must be acknowleged. "Young boys were humiliated, terrified and reduced to quivering wrecks by this 29-stone bully imposing himself on them."

Mr Danczuk made the comments during a debate on child sexual exploitation. He said it had been suggested that the file on the case which was prepared by Lancashire Police was sent to the Director of Public Prosecutions at the time.

It has also been claimed that when the Coalition government was formed in 1974, when Smith could have been made a minister, Special Branch asked for a copy of the report from Lancashire Police. Smith, who never married, was reportedly questioned by police but was later told there was insufficient evidence for a prosecution.

A spokesman for Lancashire Police said: "We believe there was an investigation in the late 1960s but as no records are now held it cannot be ascertained whether a file was passed to the Director of Public Prosecutions. "While we take matters such as this extremely seriously we have not received any further allegations and at this time there is no ongoing investigation in relation to this matter."

 

[Nicktendo86]

The Church now

Well that's a surprise :/

Spoiler

not

Edit: so another case where the police found no case to answer? This fucking stinks to high heaven.

 

[Cosmonaut X]

Cyril Smith was named and exposed *years* ago by Private Eye for his rather dubious approach to "discipline". Worth Googling.

EDIT:

Ah - missed the brief mention above. Still worth looking for. This stuff has been in plain sight for ages, but as with Savile, it wasn't followed up thoroughly.

 

[DECK'ARD]

Well that's a surprise :/

Spoiler

not

Good friend of Prince Charles as well apparently, we are nearly right at the top.

 

[Chinner]

just checking a few of them big name paper websites and theres basically no coverage of this anymore lol.

 

[DECK'ARD]

just checking a few of them big name paper websites and theres basically no coverage of this anymore lol.

Amazing isn't it.

The Sun of all things has run the most with the latest bits with a headline from Brass Eye as well (!)

http://www.thesun.co.uk/sol/homepag...ramatically-unmasked-as-paedo-in-Commons.html

 

[Nicktendo86]

Good friend of Prince Charles as well apparently, we are nearly right at the top.

Another one of Charlie's 'friends' huh? Surprise surprise

Edit: I had the 'pleasure' of reading the sun yesterday, had a couple of pages and an editorial dedicated to the 'crisis' at the BBC. They really have been served up as a sacrificial lamb havent they.

 

[DECK'ARD]

Another one of Charlie's 'friends' huh? Surprise surprise

Edit: I had the 'pleasure' of reading the sun yesterday, had a couple of pages and an editorial dedicated to the 'crisis' at the BBC. They really have been served up as a sacrificial lamb havent they.

It's thoroughly depressing how the BBC has been used to completely bury all this.

Where is the coverage pulling all this together you could fill a whole paper with it.

 

[EdwardTivrusky]

I'm hoping that this is just the calm during the investigations... but i really have to repeat it like a mantra to make myself believe it's true.

I hope this scandal doesn't just fade away which i'm sure the monied scum involved would like to happen and a re probably paying to happen as we type.

 

[watershed]

The wide spread sexual abuse is disgusting but the cover up is what truly makes me lose faith in the whole system.

 

[Dabanton]

I think we'll have a short lull then another big explosion of stories just like the phone hacking stuff.

 

[DECK'ARD]

Belfast:

http://www.u.tv/News/Order-not-cooperating-in-abuse-inquiry/307dcb47-4404-4082-b5df-c2dd0f11cc63

Order 'not cooperating' in abuse inquiry

A Belfast man has accused a Catholic religious order of failing to cooperate with a police investigation into claims he was abused by one of their members.

He hit out after being told that the priest has left the jurisdiction for a year.

The man, known as 'Declan', said he was abused at Rubane House near Kircubbin, which opened in 1950 and closed in 1985 - with its reputation by then in tatters. He told UTV: "From 1964 for just over five years I was physically and sexually abused by the brothers."

The Kincora sex scandal led there in 1980 as did the Fr Brenda Smyth inquiry in 1994. He was a frequent visiting abuser. This is Declan's third attempt to secure criminal convictions against his abusers although he got a £35,000 civil settlement in 2006.

"Which I duly gave away because it was dirty money," he explained. "I didn't want money...I wanted justice."

But he was angry when the police currently investigating the De la Salle order again telephoned him with information about the brother in question. "They informed me that a brother I was abused by is no longer in the jurisdiction," said Declan. "He has left the country and they said he has left for a year."

De la Salle Brother Pius McCarthy, the superior at the Order's Dublin headquarters, said the brother was America on a course and would be back in a few months. He denied the PSNI had been in touch with allegations against the brother.

Sex abuse campaigner Margaret McGuckin said she is concerned about the impact on the historical abuse inquiry. "I was quite shocked when this gentleman phoned me," she told UTV. Also astonished was 'Padraig' who has been told that another de La Salle brother he says abused him is currently beyond reach in Dublin. H says it will impact on the historical abuse inquiry.

"Actually it leaves the inquiry that it's not a proper inquiry," said Padraig. "It leaves the inquiry it is an absolute sham."

Last month De la Salle brother Francis Manning gave an assurance at Stormont. Manning said: "As an order we welcome this inquiry. "And we trust that it will be comprehensive and provide a source of comfort and closure for all concerned." The police will only say they are involved in an ongoing investigation into the De la Salle order.

The Kincora child abuse scandal:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kincora_Boys'_Home

The scandal first came to public attention in January 1980 after a news report in the Irish Independent. On 3 April 1980 three members of staff at the home, William McGrath, Raymond Semple and Joseph Mains, were charged with a number of offences relating to the systematic abuse of children in their care over a number of years. All three were later convicted and jailed. Mains, the former warden, received a term of six years, Semple, a former assistant warden, five years and McGrath four years.

McGrath was also the leader of an obscure loyalist paramilitary group, called Tara.

Allegations were later made that the Royal Ulster Constabulary had been informed of the abuse at the home for years previously, but had not moved to prevent it. In his 1999 book The Dirty War, Martin Dillon claims that McGrath may have been employed by MI5 since the 1960s.[1] The tabloid press then linked the home with a whole series of establishment figures without any evidence being provided.

Ian Paisley, leader of the Democratic Unionist Party and moderator of the Free Presbyterian Church which he founded in 1951, was accused of failing to report the fact of McGrath's homosexuality to the relevant authorities although he initially denied ever being advised by his informant, a church member, Miss Valerie Shaw, that McGrath worked in a boys' home. McGrath was himself married with children. Paisley later gave more versions acknowledging learning from Miss Shaw about McGrath's homosexuality[citation needed].

During this time, it is alleged by satirical magazine Private Eye, high-ranking members of the Whitehall Civil Service and senior officers of the UK military were involved in the sexual abuse of boys in Kincora.[citation needed].

A "private inquiry" was set up in 1982 by James Prior, the Northern Ireland Secretary of State under the Commissioner of Complaints, Stephen McGonagle, to deal with these allegations, but it collapsed after three of its members resigned. Debates on Kincora in the Northern Ireland Assembly were held on 22 March and 9 November 1983. Another inquiry, under Judge William Hughes, was then announced in January 1984.

In December 1985, Judge Hughes reported after his lengthy public inquiry. The view that there was a more extensive 'ring' operating at the home was not accepted.[3]

 

[Cosmonaut X]

I think we'll have a short lull then another big explosion of stories just like the phone hacking stuff.

The difference there was there was a bit more interest from the broadsheets - eager to hammer the right-wing tabloids - and a bit more organisation from celebrities and people like Tom Watson, who seemed to be careful to time any announcements or new revelations for maximum damage.

 

[captainnapalm]

just checking a few of them big name paper websites and theres basically no coverage of this anymore lol.

I find this amazing as well. I've been checking British papers to hear the latest, finding almost nothing.

 

[Oxx]

Well, the latest Private Eye just arrived. Hopefully they have been working overtime on this mess.

 

[DECK'ARD]

Well, the latest Private Eye just arrived. Hopefully they have been working overtime on this mess.

Private Eye seems to be the recurring theme here in trying to expose it all.

 

[Cosmonaut X]

Private Eye seems to be the recurring theme here in trying to expose it all.

They always are - PE are almost always first on these things, they keep on and on at them - often over decades - and rarely get any credit for long-term investigative journalism when a story finally breaks in the mass media.

 

[DECK'ARD]

Can't stink any more? It can:

http://m.politics.co.uk/news/2012/11/14/peers-want-probe-into-child-abuse-inquiry-dropped

McAlpine aftermath: Peers demand child abuse investigation is dropped

The inquiry announced by Theresa May last week into Ronald Waterhouse's original investigation of child abuse in north Wales care homes should be dropped, peers have said.

Ministers announced the probe into whether the Waterhouse inquiry last week, after victim Steve Messham alleged a senor Tory was among the paedophiles involved.

The original inquiry was criticised in some quarters for not looking at allegations of child abuse outside the care homes. Messham has subsequently apologised for the case of a mistaken identity, triggering the resignation of George Entwistle as BBC director-general.

Now peers are calling for the inquiry into Waterhouse's work to be withdrawn or amended.

Crossbench peer Lord Lloyd of Berwick, a retired judge, suggested that "there is no longer any need for another high court judge to go over the word done by Sir Ronald Waterhouse and that on the contrary we should all be grateful for the impeccable nature of his inquiry and the thoroughness of his report".

Lord Mackay of Clashfern, an advocate and Tory peer, said he viewed Waterhouse as a "very distinguished, conscientious judge" whose work was being unfairly impugned. "I was in touch with him when he was doing his inquiry and I know the terrific effect it had on him from the harrowing nature of his work," he told the Lords. "I feel very strongly it is utterly wrong to cast aspersions on his work, unless there is a basis on doing so on which one can rely upon."

Baroness Butler-Sloss, a retired English judge, said the government had "cast aspersions" upon Waterhouse's report by inferring he "didn't do a good enough job". She suggested that the terms of reference for Mrs Justice Macur's inquiry into Waterhouse's work of the late 1990s be amended.

"If the terms of reference are changed, to say any allegations not made to Sir Ronald Waterhouse should be investigated, I suspect the House would be a great deal happier," she added.

Justice minister Lord McNally said the government would not abandon the Macur inquiry.

"The situation that we faced was not just a single individual coming forward, but a large amount of accusations being bandying around and a great deal of public concern," he told peers. "I do not think anything the prime minister or the government does calls into question the integrity of the Waterhouse inquiry.

"The review… will look at whether any specific allegations of child abuse were not investigated. The serious allegations that have been made do merit a further thorough investigation."

Labour frontbencher Baroness Smith of Basildon repeated her party's call for an overarching inquiry into allegations of historic child abuse, following claims relating to BBC presenter Jimmy Savile.

Lord McNally said the government was not planning on changing its approach, adding: "I really do not accept that [Mrs Justice Macur's inquiry] impugns either the integrity or the processes of the original report.

"We are indebted to the senior judiciary for so often being willing to take on these very difficult tasks on behalf of society as a whole."

 

[Chinner]

depressing, shame the media are diverting attention. suppose the only last thing is for the public to do something itself.

 

[DECK'ARD]

depressing, shame the media are diverting attention. suppose the only last thing is for the public to do something itself.

I will update the summary later, with Rochdale and everything that's come to light since the first summary. Although the amount that has to be added in just a few days is scary.

There must be mountains we don't know about yet.

 

[Nicktendo86]

Fucking cunts, those lords don't want this investigated because the house is a sanctuary for washed up former MPs and I bet anything it is full of lords who have done dodgy shit or knew something dodgy was happening and ignored/covered up.

The media are doing a fantastic job of ignoring all of this/diverting attention. It really is breathtaking.

 

[DECK'ARD]

Fucking cunts, those lords don't want this investigated because the house is a sanctuary for washed up former MPs and I bet anything it is full of lords who have done dodgy shit or knew something dodgy was happening and ignored/covered up.

The media are doing a fantastic job of ignoring all of this/diverting attention. It really is breathtaking.

The bigger the story has got, the more the media has shied away from it. When it was just Savile it was a free-for-all, now it's a case of having to join the dots. With the BBC served up as the establishment shield.

I like how we have another 'victim' now in Sir Ronald Waterhouse as well, to join Lord McAlpine. If this is the attitude that exists to those in power versus the REAL victims in all this then no wonder things got so bad.

I've never been less proud of our country than I am at the moment. We just can't afford to ignore this, no matter how big it is or who it involves. It's because of how big it is and who it involves that makes it so serious.

 

[EdwardTivrusky]

I've said in another forum that we need Tim Minchin to update his Pope Song to reflect the sickos involved in covering up these scandals.

May cause offence. Not safe for work, has swearing. Much Swearing.
YouTube - Tim Minchin - Pope Song

 

[DECK'ARD]

Updated summary:

Jimmy Savile

- ITV airs investigation revealing victims of abuse by Jimmy Savile, former DJ and television presenter at the BBC plus notable charity worker
- Police start investigation and hear from hundreds of victims over 40 years
- BBC revealed to have pulled an earlier investigation which made similar claims
- Videos of his BBC shows have Gary Glittler as a guest boasting of the girls they have
- A video shows Savile trying to molest one on air, she went to floor managers about it but they laughed it off
- Savile revealed to have abused patients through his charity work at Stoke Mandeville hospital, the youngest being 8
- Savile had been given keys to Broadmoor high-security psychiatric hospital with unrestricted access
- Savile boasted in his autobiography that he slept with an underage girl but nothing came of it because he would 'take down half the station with him'
- Savile held a 'Friday Club' with members of the police both serving and retired every week for 20 years
- Savile was basically 'untouchable'
- Freddie Starr arrested over similar allegations, others being investigated
- Several close friends of Savile said to have fled the country
- ITV preparing second programme detailing his early life

North Wales child abuse scandal (1974-1990)

The fact Savile was untouchable, and this all went on in plain sight for decades, reopened questions about the abuse in care homes which Savile visited regularly in North Wales.

- Between 1974 and 1990, up to 650 children from 40 children's homes such as Bryn Estyn were sexually, physically and emotionally abused
- Only 9 people were charged, 7 convicted, and no one outside the care homes
- Persistent allegations were that the homes were visited by prominent people in the public eye and politicians at unexplained times, and also to collect boys and abuse them in local hotels and residences in London
- Jillings in his inquiry regretted he did not have the mandate to investigate these allegations further
- Jillings was also concerned there was a widespread paedophile ring in North Wales and the North West, of which there had been warnings 4 years earlier, and went to the Chief Constable about it
- The Jillings report was instead however ordered not to be published as not being in the public interest, having been warned by insurers of the cost of compensation to all the victims
- Parts of the unpublished Jillings report were leaked by a whistleblower which led to the Waterhouse inquiry
- The Waterhouse inquiry forbid any naming or investigation of those not already convicted
- Up to 60 names were removed from one victim's statement alone
- 16 victims of the abuse are now dead, 3 from suicide

Gateshead child abuse (1966-1973) / Peter Howarth

- Peter Howarth taught at Gateshead's Axwell Park, a Home Office run school for troubled youngers where he abused children
- No charges or action was taken and he was then appointed deputy head at Bryn Estyn children's home where he continued to abuse the children in its care
- A victim of the abuse there says children were regularly abused for the 'entertainment' of Savile at the home in the presence of Peter Howarth
- Children were taken to Savile in Howarth's flat
- When the social worker blew the whistle on the abuse in North Wales after police and council refused to take any action, Howarth was one of only 7 who were convicted.
- No charges were made against Savile or anyone else outside the care homes
- Nothing about Savile's involvement, or anyone else, came out at all

Islington child abuse scandal (1970-80's)

This also happened in Islington where each of the 24 care homes was found to be abusing children.

- The abuse spanned the 1970's and 80's, it is still unclear the number of victims and no one was charged
- It wasn't revealed until 1992 when a social worker blew the whistle after the police and council refused to take any action
- Although there were then as many as 13 inquiries, proving the abuse took place, none of them looked at the perpetrators
- The original whistleblower said when the story broke 'everyone just left the council'
- Some are still running councils elsewhere
- Perpetrators escaped conviction and went on to abuse elsewhere, some had links to those at other care homes
- One was arrested in Thailand in 2006 for abusing as many as 300 children

The head of Islington council at the time, Margaret Hodge, was later appointed Minister For Children in Tony Blair's government.

Rochdale child abuse scandal (2007-2012)

- 9 Asian men were jailed for grooming young white girls for sex over 5 years
- Children and their parents went repeatedly to police and social services for help but were ignored
- Victims were said to be 'making their own choices', some were as young as 12
- A report in Rotherham found agencies there were aware of similar abuse but did nothing, and no one was prosecuted

Lord McAlpine

Lord McAlpine was named by one of the victims in North Wales, leading to a statement denying it from Lord McAlpine and the resignation of the BBC's Director General. This followed a warning from Cameron on ITV about a witch hunt. However there is more to the story.

- Boys were regularly taken to do work at 2 homes of the McAlpine family according to a local councillor
- Jimmie McAlpine was identified by one of the victims in North Wales, he died before the Waterhouse inquiry
- Photographic evidence handed into police by one of the victims was ordered to be destroyed
- Police said to have had extensive reasons to link Jimmie McAlpine to the abuse in the care homes, no action was taken
- All names were removed from the Waterhouse report
- The inquiry itself was halted on one occasion when a particular name came up
- Steve Messham, who named Lord McAlpine and confirmed as a genuine victim by the social worker who blew the whistle about North Wales, attacked in widely criticised article by the Sunday Mail which referred to him as a 'weirdo'
- Integrity and motives of Mail journalist are questioned
- Media focus shifts completely to the 'crisis' at the BBC

Sir Peter Morrison

Sir Peter Morrison, Parliamentary Private Secretary to Margaret Thatcher, was identified on Channel 4 news by eye witness as one of the abusers and names that was not revealed at the time nor charged.

- Edwina Currie's diaries published in 2002 named him as a 'noted pedarest' with a 'liking for young boys' and expressed concern at him being appointed PPS to Thatcher for fear of the press revealing it
- Currie was also responsible for appointing Savile to his role at Broadmoor
- Margaret Thatcher was said to either not be aware or 'taking a gamble'
- Norman Tebbit, Chairman of the Conservative party, was aware of it
- Teresa Gorman MP said his agent had been offered money to keep quiet about his activities

Sir Cyril Smith

- Sir Cyril Smith, MP for Rochdale, named in House Of Commons as a repeated abuser of young boys and urged victims to come forward
- He was investigated by Lancashire police in the 1960's but no action was taken
- Persistent allegations had been made over the years but still no action was taken
- MP said there had been a long-standing culture in Rochdale of 'hiding the truth'

The Church Of England

- Peter Ball, former Church Of England Bishop, arrested on suspicion of sexually assaulting boys as young as 12
- The arrest came as part of the investigation into Savile
- Ball, like Savile, was a close friend of Prince Charles
- A second unnamed man, a retired Anglican priest, has also been arrested

Current inquiries

There are currently at least 9 separate inquiries investigating the BBC, police, social services, and the previous inquiries. Demands are being made by the opposition and those involved with exposing the previous cases of abuse for a single overarching public inquiry into all the allegations and confirmed cases of child abuse.

No attempt at all has been made at any point to try and get a complete picture of the child abuse that was happening throughout the country, because of the limited mandates of each inquiry, nor identify and investigate all the perpetrators of it and bring them to justice. The unpublished Jillings report said victims were sacrificed to protect those in professional positions at every stage.

Peers in the House Of Lords have demanded the inquiry into the Waterhouse inquiry be dropped or amended. The opposition have repeated their demand for a wider public inquiry but the Government has said it will not be changing its position.

Links

Original whistleblower in North Wales warns of the shift of focus and attempts to discredit victims of child abuse:

http://news.sky.com/story/1010077/concerns-over-treatment-of-child-abuse-victims

Eye witness describes what went on at the care homes in North Wales:

http://www.channel4.com/news/exclusive-eyewitness-saw-thatcher-aide-take-boys-to-abuse

McAlpine aftermath: Peers demand child abuse investigation is dropped:

http://m.politics.co.uk/news/2012/11/14/peers-want-probe-into-child-abuse-inquiry-dropped

The North Wales child abuse scandal: A damaged generation waits for justice 30 years on:

http://www.independent.co.uk/news/u...on-waits-for-justice-30-years-on-8303901.html

(links to all articles used for this summary are posted in the thread, I will add more to this section later)

 

[Little Old Man]

The false accusations have ultimately ruined everything. The BBC is now in crisis- managers and editors under the news department will be on lock down, watching their subordinates like a hawk, and demanding to be personally notified of any stories or investigations relating to the abuse. This will knock on the head any speculation in stories relating to the matter, and indeed any investigations, reports, etc.

Other news channels will have watched the events at the BBC closely, and will obviously not want the chance of journalist or programme potentially doing the same on their own doorstep. That's those outlets out of the spotlight.

You'll get the same old trash from the tabloids.
Maybe some fresh reports and investigations from broadsheets, but unless it is something truly big and substantial (causing TV to pick up on it), nothing much will come of it.

So sadly we're left with only a minor number of publications doing much work in the area (seemingly the likes of Private Eye). Expect nothing until the ridiculous number of investigations present their findings when the press doesn't have to do the work, and can't be attacked for repeating that which was said in a report. Meanwhile those involved and those aware of the cover up can sit tight and sweep any lose ends under the rug. Pretty shameful shit.

 

[Clay Davis]

DECK'ARD, you're doing a amazing job with the summaries and updating the thread. I don't have nearly enough time to the same, so I think it prudent to create a new thread where you are able to keep the opening post as updated as it needs to be.

 

[EdwardTivrusky]

I need to find the thread with lovely pictures of cute animals frolicking in fields because i'm so disappointed and cynical about my country at the moment.

Point me in the direction of the kitten pictures.