So after a couple games (one domination, one science, won both) it seems there's no reason at all to be nice to any other civilization ever. It doesn't matter how much trade you've engaged in or how much gold you've straight given them, they're just going to sail across the ocean and build a city right next to your borders, then one turn later say the borders are causing tension and then declare war. There doesn't seem to be much nuance in the diplomacy, and compromise is non-existent. It's either they only accept 1:1 trades like my excess luxury for your excess luxury or they want all your gold, plus gold per turn, plus all your resources, plus all our cities for peace. As it is it just seems so schizo, there should be some way to build up good will. Kind of like with city-states, but it doesn't have to be a meter or something. Just make it feel consistent.
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Civilization V |OT| of Losing My Religion, And I Feel Fine...
- Thread starter XiaNaphryz
- Start date
Danne-Danger
Member
Ah. You'll have more to build than scouts in the real game. If you feel that you want to skip building stuff if you with your current tech don't see anything you need (to avoid maintnence or whatever), just shift between productions. If you throw the hammers (production) on wonders you'll get some gold relative to the production you spent when you or another civ actually finish it. And later on you can convert hammers directly to gold or science per turn.Castor Krieg said:
http://www.mediafire.com/?d35e4o57md32dxl
Baba Yetu for Civ 5
replace the file in \steamapps\common\sid meier's civilization v\Assets\Sounds\Streamed\Music\
Baba Yetu for Civ 5
replace the file in \steamapps\common\sid meier's civilization v\Assets\Sounds\Streamed\Music\
Borgnine said:
I agree and am very disappointed with the route diplomacy took. It feels like they dumbed it down to reach out to a new audience who is not gonna give a shit about the game in the first place.
One turn they message me and the text talks about how nice I am etc then the next they message me and its about how untrustworthy and evil I am. Nothing changed in interaction with each other the AI just randomly decides im a dick.
The lack of diplomatic options is really lacking too. Maybe I dont want to sail the entire world to see everything right away. Thats what trading maps is for yet now gone.
Castor Krieg said:
This reminds me of a bug I wanted to post about but forgot.
It's kind of a long story but it deals with some crappy AI decisions too. I was in the middle of my continent, with Rome on my East, the Aztecs directly to my west, and Egypt to their west.
Egypt settled a city next to my border, and clearly broke across Aztec territory. The Aztecs asked me to join them in war with Egypt which I agreed to. As I took the city on my border, the Aztecs focused their energy on a nearby city-state.
That wasn't part of our agreement, so after I razed Egypts' city I turned and came to the City-state's defense against the Aztecs. I didn't officially drop my war against Egypt, but I clearly was not focusing any energy towards them.
About halfway through my war with the Aztecs, and hundreds of years after I had attacked Egypt, Egypt offers me a truce. They offer me gold, a city, and three luxury resources.
I accepted.
Anyway, here's where the bug happened. I clicked to make the new city a puppet, since it was VERY far from my domain. I finished all my business but it kept asking me what I wanted to produce in the puppet city. It's a puppet city, so you can't assign production...
I couldn't continue. I had to go to my puppet city and annex it and choose the construction project before the game would let me end my turn.
Frustrating.
Love the game in spite of it's issues though, I hope the AI and bugs get ironed out.
edit: Diplomacy seems shallow to me too. I hope what someone else said about body language has more of an impact in the game because they sure don't say a lot. To think that it's been dumbed down even by Civ Rev standards is kinda sad. Im hoping I just don't understand the nuances yet.
Danne-Danger
Member
Speaking of music... has anyone made a mod that lets you hear all music instead of restricting it to regions? I'm already tired of the Asian ones, though the sitar track is badass.Sober said:
D
Deleted member 30609
Unconfirmed Member
just a shout out to Pacman2k for the gift via Steam, saved me a good thirty dollars. you're a legend!
I rolled a islands map again. And damn if water heavy maps aren't boring as hell. There's hardly any interesting to do before medieval or even renaissance because all you get for a navy unit is a trieme which hardly helps you on conquest. Plus you don't get bonuses for circumnavigating the globe nor able to trade your maps away. And there's little you get for meeting new civs other than selling your resources away. Everything is also so far away it's a chore to do anything.
Well the key to what you did probably to have a slow buildup/conquest rather than seizing the moment utilizing your military at one immediate moment like what most people coming from Civ4 used to do. It's too easy to go too fast with the weak military AI. Ignoring happiness seems like much more fun way to play conquest.
erragal said:
Well the key to what you did probably to have a slow buildup/conquest rather than seizing the moment utilizing your military at one immediate moment like what most people coming from Civ4 used to do. It's too easy to go too fast with the weak military AI. Ignoring happiness seems like much more fun way to play conquest.
platypotamus
Member
Sblargh said:
I play culture very much like I play diplomacy... and the way I am really starting to play nearly any victory path: Defender of the little guys. Especially true for city states, but true even for the oppressed fellow players. I liberate players/city states. I conquer a city, puppet/raze it, and then sue for peace, offering the city back to the jerk if he gives me all sorts of stuff. Or I just gift it to a weaker civ for resources/money/nothing, just to keep my empire smaller. Sometimes I try to gift the city to another civ to get them involved in a war, but that has been tough going so far.
Warning: long post ahead! It's basically a recap of my whole game so feel free to skip it if that doesn't interest you. ;p
Finished my third game - English, archipelago (I know, cheating), standard, immortal, epic. Was a very fun game that taught me a lot about naval warfare (and how the AI is still pretty terrible at it) Domination victory in 1843 AD - probably could have won earlier but I was having fun building up my empire and crushing people. ^_^
Started out on this pretty nicely sized island with no one else on it, which I think definitely helped even out the playing field. The Romans came and settled on the southern part pretty early on, which pissed me off, so I started building up an army of spearmen and archers while I research iron working.... only to find them upgrading into legions as soon as I was thinking of attacking. I ended up having to settle another island just to acquire some iron, and just barely in time as the Romans declared war on me. Luckily, fighting a defensive war is a lot easier and I was able to raze their city on my island, which prompted them to offer their other nearby island-city to me in a peace treaty.
More confident now, I found that my rapidly-growing empire was eating up more happiness than I could keep up with. Since I had been scouting with two 6-movement triremes for most of the game, I decided to try and conquer some key city-states to get their luxury resources. Just as I was conquering the first one, the cowardly Iroquois sent an actual fleet over to attack me! They actually had a decent army with an escort, and were able to take over Hastings easily, but what they didn't know was that my main army was actually right next to their home island and had just finished conquering the city-state they had come for. Also, I had just researched Steel. Their Mohawk Warriors were no match for my Longswordmen, and I crushed their empire and was able to retake my city at the same time.
While I was finishing off the Iroquois, the Romans decided that it was time to have their revenge (wait didn't you attack me the first time too) and got my former allies, the Greeks, to join them in war against me. Unfortunately for them, after researching Steel, I had made a beeline for Navigation, and before they could really do anything, my ships of the line were decimating everything they tried to throw at me. Once my ships got the promotion that let them attack twice in a turn, it was pretty much game over for everyone. I could destroy two embarked units with each one, take out two land units as long as they were on flat land and not fortified, and with 9 movement I could be everywhere at once. To take over the Greek lands, which had hoplites, musketmen, or crossbowmen on almost every square, I basically just landed 3 longswordmen, a longbowmen, and a catapult, took one city in the corner, fortified around it and just let my ships blow up almost every unit they sent before they could even attack. 17 ranged attack, the 3 promotions vs land units, and 2 attacks per turn was insane.
After taking care of the Greeks, leaving them with one city, I made peace with the Romans in exchange for them giving me spices because I really needed all the luxury resources I could get. I decided to use my peacetime to build up my cities in science, production, and happiness buildings since I figured that more war was inevitable. I built a couple more cities to get the last couple of luxury resources that I needed, along with an extra coal that I really needed to build factories in almost all of my cities, and after this every city was in "We Love the King Day" every turn for the rest of the game. I spent all the money I made on buying colosseums in my newer cities just to keep level on happiness.
War came again when the other major power, Germany, finished securing his largest-on-the-archipelago-map island and decided that the Romans would make a good next target. I agreed to help him in 10 turns, then promptly declared war on the Romans 4 turns later once all my troops were in place to make sure that I would get the Roman island. It had spices so I wouldn't have to trade for any luxury resources anymore! The island fell quickly, but for some reason Caesar would not give me all his money for peace, so I even headed up to the arctic to raze his puny settlements up there and finish him for good.
After this I figured that it was time for peace again and started building up my cities again, and finally got the piety policy to decrease unhappiness, when out of nowhere Bismarck decides to attack me! His only problem was that he decided that my weak point was Tyre, a former city state which was on an island that was... two whole squares. (I didn't want to take it over but it was right in the middle of my naval pathing and refused to go back to peace with me because I'd attacked too many city-states (2!)) Anyway, his units just had no idea what to do - they landed on nearby islands but obviously couldn't attack the city they wanted, so they just milled around. I picked them off with my destroyers (costly upgrades but definitely worth it). Around this time I got a Great Engineer, so I decided to rush the Taj Mahal for the free golden age, and boy was this worth it. Lasted 18 turns, which I made count by building up my military with the extra production and gold. I had just teched up to Infantry around when he declared war, and my level 7 and 8 destroyers combined with the infantry just demolished him.
After I took half of the German empire, I decided that it was time to win and took 15 turns or so to go blow up Persia (only had riflemen, not a challenge) and China (I felt bad, she was the only nice leader to me throughout the whole game and she only had pikemen and chu-ko-nu (which somehow managed to kill 1 infantry unit, wtf)).
Overall, it really felt like the AI didn't know what to do with its navy except a couple of specific things. It was able to put together fleets to invade my lands twice, but when Germany declared war on me it had probably 20 or so caravels and they just continued to wander around the map doing nothing useful. They destroyed some fishing boats and captured one embarked unit, but it only seemed to do those things if they were already in the area for some other reason. It also did nothing to guard the waters around its home area or the way to the place they were attacking. On the flip side, I was able to see what a really well built-up navy can do. Once you get frigates you can really go crazy on support for your invasions if they are near a coast.
One thing I hate is that razing cities takes forever sometimes. I was trying to raze Pasargadae and Susa there at the end, but it was taking 8 turns because they were 16s when I captured them. That's 8 turns of a -lot- of unhappiness, since they count as non-puppet conquered states during that time...
I wrote it as much for myself as everyone else anyway
Finished my third game - English, archipelago (I know, cheating), standard, immortal, epic. Was a very fun game that taught me a lot about naval warfare (and how the AI is still pretty terrible at it) Domination victory in 1843 AD - probably could have won earlier but I was having fun building up my empire and crushing people. ^_^
Started out on this pretty nicely sized island with no one else on it, which I think definitely helped even out the playing field. The Romans came and settled on the southern part pretty early on, which pissed me off, so I started building up an army of spearmen and archers while I research iron working.... only to find them upgrading into legions as soon as I was thinking of attacking. I ended up having to settle another island just to acquire some iron, and just barely in time as the Romans declared war on me. Luckily, fighting a defensive war is a lot easier and I was able to raze their city on my island, which prompted them to offer their other nearby island-city to me in a peace treaty.
More confident now, I found that my rapidly-growing empire was eating up more happiness than I could keep up with. Since I had been scouting with two 6-movement triremes for most of the game, I decided to try and conquer some key city-states to get their luxury resources. Just as I was conquering the first one, the cowardly Iroquois sent an actual fleet over to attack me! They actually had a decent army with an escort, and were able to take over Hastings easily, but what they didn't know was that my main army was actually right next to their home island and had just finished conquering the city-state they had come for. Also, I had just researched Steel. Their Mohawk Warriors were no match for my Longswordmen, and I crushed their empire and was able to retake my city at the same time.
While I was finishing off the Iroquois, the Romans decided that it was time to have their revenge (wait didn't you attack me the first time too) and got my former allies, the Greeks, to join them in war against me. Unfortunately for them, after researching Steel, I had made a beeline for Navigation, and before they could really do anything, my ships of the line were decimating everything they tried to throw at me. Once my ships got the promotion that let them attack twice in a turn, it was pretty much game over for everyone. I could destroy two embarked units with each one, take out two land units as long as they were on flat land and not fortified, and with 9 movement I could be everywhere at once. To take over the Greek lands, which had hoplites, musketmen, or crossbowmen on almost every square, I basically just landed 3 longswordmen, a longbowmen, and a catapult, took one city in the corner, fortified around it and just let my ships blow up almost every unit they sent before they could even attack. 17 ranged attack, the 3 promotions vs land units, and 2 attacks per turn was insane.
After taking care of the Greeks, leaving them with one city, I made peace with the Romans in exchange for them giving me spices because I really needed all the luxury resources I could get. I decided to use my peacetime to build up my cities in science, production, and happiness buildings since I figured that more war was inevitable. I built a couple more cities to get the last couple of luxury resources that I needed, along with an extra coal that I really needed to build factories in almost all of my cities, and after this every city was in "We Love the King Day" every turn for the rest of the game. I spent all the money I made on buying colosseums in my newer cities just to keep level on happiness.
War came again when the other major power, Germany, finished securing his largest-on-the-archipelago-map island and decided that the Romans would make a good next target. I agreed to help him in 10 turns, then promptly declared war on the Romans 4 turns later once all my troops were in place to make sure that I would get the Roman island. It had spices so I wouldn't have to trade for any luxury resources anymore! The island fell quickly, but for some reason Caesar would not give me all his money for peace, so I even headed up to the arctic to raze his puny settlements up there and finish him for good.
After this I figured that it was time for peace again and started building up my cities again, and finally got the piety policy to decrease unhappiness, when out of nowhere Bismarck decides to attack me! His only problem was that he decided that my weak point was Tyre, a former city state which was on an island that was... two whole squares. (I didn't want to take it over but it was right in the middle of my naval pathing and refused to go back to peace with me because I'd attacked too many city-states (2!)) Anyway, his units just had no idea what to do - they landed on nearby islands but obviously couldn't attack the city they wanted, so they just milled around. I picked them off with my destroyers (costly upgrades but definitely worth it). Around this time I got a Great Engineer, so I decided to rush the Taj Mahal for the free golden age, and boy was this worth it. Lasted 18 turns, which I made count by building up my military with the extra production and gold. I had just teched up to Infantry around when he declared war, and my level 7 and 8 destroyers combined with the infantry just demolished him.
After I took half of the German empire, I decided that it was time to win and took 15 turns or so to go blow up Persia (only had riflemen, not a challenge) and China (I felt bad, she was the only nice leader to me throughout the whole game and she only had pikemen and chu-ko-nu (which somehow managed to kill 1 infantry unit, wtf)).
Overall, it really felt like the AI didn't know what to do with its navy except a couple of specific things. It was able to put together fleets to invade my lands twice, but when Germany declared war on me it had probably 20 or so caravels and they just continued to wander around the map doing nothing useful. They destroyed some fishing boats and captured one embarked unit, but it only seemed to do those things if they were already in the area for some other reason. It also did nothing to guard the waters around its home area or the way to the place they were attacking. On the flip side, I was able to see what a really well built-up navy can do. Once you get frigates you can really go crazy on support for your invasions if they are near a coast.
One thing I hate is that razing cities takes forever sometimes. I was trying to raze Pasargadae and Susa there at the end, but it was taking 8 turns because they were 16s when I captured them. That's 8 turns of a -lot- of unhappiness, since they count as non-puppet conquered states during that time...
Apparently there's a bug related to saving/loading that causes your save size to bloat from 1mb to even 32mb or higher. This supposedly is the reason why later on loading especially takes forever and can even crash the game. I haven't tried this yet, but supposedly [only] autosaving every turn and loading only after launching the game works around the issue.
Jasconius said:
Played a similar map on Emperor, standard speed as Germans. I don't think the AI has any clue how to play water heavy maps at all. I didn't even need to conquer anything to be on par and near the top for score. Greece never expanded at all and only had his capital all game. The AI civs that started on bigger islands did the best while the ones that were on small islands were pretty much doomed from the start.
Could've finished the AIs much earlier, but played it longer and ended here.
That's the maximum amount of happiness you can get from resources, so there's pretty much a hard cap. After that, every city you build/capture will have to have its unhappiness covered by happiness buildings. I pretty much sold more than half of the cities I captured and went to just conquer their capitals when I got bored of it to win the game, which is very very easy to do on water maps.
Deku said:
This is untrue btw. Puppets also increases the social policy costs, there's no change when you convert them to an annexed city. However the number of unhappiness do increase.
Castor Krieg said:
I haven't got the full game, but I have tried the demo on Steam.
No tutorial. This is a really great idea. For someone who's never played a Civ game, this is basically completely unfathomable. Sounds like the full game isn't much better. Shame, after all the hype I quite fancied trying this.
Rapping Granny
Banned
Guys I need help. First Civ game and I am loving the hell out of it.
I have a question about work boats, how can I get them to start fishing in my hex? I just took over a city and they had some fishing boats, I moved my work boat beside the fishing water and the boat wasn't doing crap.
I have a question about work boats, how can I get them to start fishing in my hex? I just took over a city and they had some fishing boats, I moved my work boat beside the fishing water and the boat wasn't doing crap.
Do you guys really need a tutorial to play Civ? Half of the fun is learning how the game works, you're not competing for a high score or anything unless you want to.
In your city screen, on the top right corner, click the citizens tab. It will tell you what tiles your citizens are working on. Note that you do not need fishing boats to work on a water tile. Fishing boats are basically improvements similar to what workers can build except they are one time use only, that's it. They increase the yield of the tile and then they disappear, you don't need to build them to have your citizens working on that tile.
Rapping Granny said:
In your city screen, on the top right corner, click the citizens tab. It will tell you what tiles your citizens are working on. Note that you do not need fishing boats to work on a water tile. Fishing boats are basically improvements similar to what workers can build except they are one time use only, that's it. They increase the yield of the tile and then they disappear, you don't need to build them to have your citizens working on that tile.
My two city empire just got destroyed by Askia, conquerer of worlds. Was going for a cultural victory but there doesn't seem like I could've done anything to prevent him from attacking me and even if I had made a sizeable army, I then wouldn't have been on track for culture. I wish the diplomacy was more real-world like, less game like. When someone attacks me, they should say why, even if its a bullshit reason.
Zzoram said:
Thanks. I think I downloaded a PDF from there that was supposed to be a beginners guide. It was over my head.
Example: I wanted to go to war with China. Had all my armies in place, but couldn't figure out how to initiate dialog with their leader (or just attach without saying hi first). After asking a friend on another forum, turns out I have to do a SHIFT + L Click to talk to the guy. Now, I don't think I missed this during any in-game instructions.
I just want a Sim City on a bigger scale. Thought Civ might be what I wanted. Tropico 3 is close, but not quite what I'm craving.
DodgerSan said:
The 'tutorial' is terrible, and it was quite shocking to me after the fantastic tutorial that Civ IV had. I was very disappointed in the tut because honestly I was looking forward to another virtual Sid.
That said, the lack of a good tutorial shouldn't keep anyone from trying the game. There are a lot of things going on but nothing that will keep you from understanding the basics on a lower difficulty level. The game really isn't that punishing until you reach higher difficulties.
Honestly, even with the great tutorial I would think Civ IV a much harder game to get into from a noob perspective. In Civ V a lot of the more complex processes happen more in the background, and things like overall happiness and limited units add strategy as well as make more sense to a newcomer.
There are plenty of people in this thread that will answer any questions you might have. And there are several Civ-based forums that discuss strategies in great depths with various civs.
moojito
Member
Yarr, I was complaining as well about no tutorial when I got the demo. I started a game and I found that you get these pop ups from your advisors that explain what's happening really well. At any time you can click on the advisor button for a pointer on what to do.
Anyhoo, a question: what is it that influences how long it takes for a city to build something? I've started a new game, but I remember last time round some cities would take like half the time another city would to build something.
Anyhoo, a question: what is it that influences how long it takes for a city to build something? I've started a new game, but I remember last time round some cities would take like half the time another city would to build something.
moojito said:
It's dependant on how much Production, aka Hammers the city is getting from tiles, improvements, buildings etc. So a city built near lots of hills all improved with mines will easily outproduce other cities, but then of course it will grow slower and such. If you mouse over any tile the tooltip just above the minimap will show how much Food, Production and Gold that tile is giving. You can also build things like a Workshop to speed up production. You also need to see what tiles the citizens of a city are actually working, you can see this when you click on a city, swapping citizens to more production heavy tiles whilst working on big things like wonders can really speed it along.
moojito
Member
A very nice explanation, there. Cheers for that!
If you don't intend to play it right now, you can uninstall it and steam. Then when you want to get round to playing it you can reinstall steam and it'll log back into your account, where you can select civ and reinstall it again from there.
You should embrace the steam, though. It's lovely!
Sir Fragula said:
If you don't intend to play it right now, you can uninstall it and steam. Then when you want to get round to playing it you can reinstall steam and it'll log back into your account, where you can select civ and reinstall it again from there.
You should embrace the steam, though. It's lovely!
I don't want Steam installed. But yeah, my own fault for not reading the tiny text on the back. Things like this remind me why the majority of the few PC games I own are from Paradox. If I wanted a digital distribution system installed to play a game I wouldn't have bought the boxed copy.scoobs said:
There's now some indication that the long AI turn times late game are, indeed, due to the save file bug, so it's better never to load a save except right after launching the game. Yes, if you've to reload you'll have to exit the game, though it's possible just going back to main menu might suffice.
Totakeke said:
You're missing spices actually.
Puppet states do eventually start increasing social policy costs, but it's after a certain number. I have three in my Persia game and they haven't increased costs at all, but in my Aztec game I ended up with 11/12 and they started increasing with each one.
dream
Member
moojito said:
Colkate's explanation is dead-on but it might help if you had some screens to show you how production works. I'll fire some off from the current game I'm working on.
So that's my shitty Siam capital. The tiles with the little green heads on them are the tiles my citizens are working -- all the resources on them are going towards my city. The little orange dots are hammers. They're the resources that determine how quick your city builds something. So in this case I have citizens pulling in a total of 10 hammers from the tiles they're working, right? Since this is my capital, I have a palace automatically built in the city -- that gives me another 2 hammers for a total of 12 hammers per turn.
If you look at the buildings list on the left, building a barracks would require 80 hammers. That's why it will take 7 turns to build: 80 / 12.
This is why it's a good idea to specialize your cities. Founding a new city in an area with a ton of mines means I'll have a production powerhouse in my empire, especially once I start setting up buildings that give production bonuses.
Rapping Granny
Banned
Sir Fragula said:
Why the fuck don't you want Steam installed?
What's wrong with Steam? you install the program, have the game installed and play the damn game and stop being a little baby about it.
If you are going to force yourself to not enjoy a game because of a little thing like installing a computer program then damn son, you need some help.
PS I just took over North America and now on to South. Fuck YEah.
sublime085
Member
What a silly and arbitrary reason not to play a game.Sir Fragula said:
Your loss dude.