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[dream]

I don't think so. There are plenty of programs I don't install because they try and force third party shit on you. OpenOffice was/is atrocious about that stuff so I refuse to use it. Lots of people refuse to buy GFWL games. His stance is no different.

Yeah, but Steam is both benign and beneficial to have.

 

[Walshicus]

Yeah, but Steam is both benign and beneficial to have.

Disagree. But whatever.

 

[Zzoram]

I don't think so. There are plenty of programs I don't install because they try and force third party shit on you. OpenOffice was/is atrocious about that stuff so I refuse to use it. Lots of people refuse to buy GFWL games. His stance is no different.

No it's not. You just have to read so you check/uncheck and cancel appropriately. If you do, you won't install any 3rd party stuff, they just make it confusing for people who don't read. There is a point where even after unchecking everything, you are supposed to click cancel, not next, because it's actually switched to another installer and isn't even talking about OpenOffice but it's easy to miss if you just mash next.

 

[eznark]

No it's not. You just have to read so you check/uncheck and cancel appropriately. If you do, you won't install any 3rd party stuff, they just make it confusing for people who don't read. There is a point where even after unchecking everything, you are supposed to click cancel, not next, because it's actually switched to another installer and isn't even talking about OpenOffice but it's easy to miss if you just mash next.

Years ago that wasn't the case and they caught a lot of heat for it.

Holy shit, JayDubya! You're still around?

 

[Zeliard]

You do not get the benefit until the improvement is built... UNLESS you build a city on top of a strategic resource (in which case, you get access, but cities always have the same output regardless of tile placement).

I was wondering if you still get the benefits from the tile that you actually built the city on. Someone earlier said you should always builds cities on a shitty tile since you get nothing from that actual tile. Or is that just for bonus/luxury resources?

 

[Rapping Granny]

Disagree. But whatever.

Sir Fragula
cry moar lol
(Today, 04:18 PM)
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[SlipperySlope]

What's this about a unit limit?

 

[Human_Shield]

Holy crap, just got my cultural victory with Montezuma. Didn't think I was going to make it before 2050, but a shuffling of a tiles to production and cashing in every Great Person I had got me the victory in 2038. And a big fuck you to the king of Siam, who thought he could take my tiny three city nation with an army of elephants.

I don't think I ever say this, but I'm completely in love with this game.

 

[Walshicus]

Sir Fragula
cry moar lol
(Today, 04:18 PM)
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Why not throw in a sunset.gif and FHUTA for the hat-trick of GAF clichés?

Yeah, who wants cheap games, friends lists, the ability to reinstall your games with one button, multiplayer, and achievements anyway.

If Paradox - who have their own DD system - can offer boxed releases that just fucking work without bloatware, I don't see why 2K can't.

 

[dream]

Disagree. But whatever.

Yeah, who wants cheap games, friends lists, the ability to reinstall your games with one button, multiplayer, and achievements anyway.

 

[Zeliard]

Is it possible to play on an Earth map with all of the civilizations located where they'd actually be?

 

[eznark]

Is it possible to play on an Earth map with all of the civilizations located where they'd actually be?

I've seen a mod or two that do that.

 

[Shambles]

Yeah, who wants cheap games, friends lists, the ability to reinstall your games with one button, multiplayer, and achievements anyway.

Yeah, who wants full price games for a new release without the benefits of actually owning the game compared to a real retail release, the ability to sell/loan your games, not be limited by your internet connection or not lose access to your entire library of paid games because someone on a computer in another country decides to push a button.

See how that works? Really though you're not trying to understand, you're just trying to inflame. It doesn't take a genius to see both sides of this debate and to understand why someone would prefer one way over the other.

 

[TheFreshPrince]

When trading resources with another civ....what does the 25 turns mean? That you will have access to the resource for 25 turns, or that it will take 25 turns to 'get' to the other civ?

 

[sdornan]

If Paradox - who have their own DD system - can offer boxed releases that just fucking work without bloatware, I don't see why 2K can't.

Just because you don't like Steam and don't want to install it doesn't mean that it's "bloatware." It's essentially the PC equivalent of Xbox Live. Not to mention the installer is a grand total of 1.5MB.

EDIT: For the record, your beloved Paradox Interactive has almost their entire catalog on Steam.

 

[Jay Shadow]

When trading resources with another civ....what does the 25 turns mean? That you will have access to the resource for 25 turns, or that it will take 25 turns to 'get' to the other civ?

Access for 25 turns. Then the deal ends and you'll have to do it again.

 

[Melhisedek]

You guys using any mods?

 

[eznark]

You guys using any mods?

I'm using one that puts a clock in the UI.

 

[Zeliard]

Access for 25 turns. Then the deal ends and you'll have to do it again.

If you give temporary resource access to another Civ, do you lose that access for the time or does it just mean you both have it?

 

[Walshicus]

EDIT: For the record, your beloved Paradox Interactive has almost their entire catalog on Steam.

And isn't it great how none of their games have asked me to install it just to play?

 

[eznark]

Just because you don't like Steam and don't want to install it doesn't mean that it's "bloatware." It's essentially the PC equivalent of Xbox Live. Not to mention the installer is a grand total of 1.5MB.

EDIT: For the record, your beloved Paradox Interactive has almost their entire catalog on Steam.

Jesus Christ, Steamtologists are worse than Jehovas witnesses.

 

[f0rk]

If you give temporary resource access to another Civ, do you lose that access for the time or does it just mean you both have it?

You loose it. Generally you should be trading your surplus luxury stuff for ones you don't have.

 

[MrNyarlathotep]

Civ 5 requiring Steam was not exactly 'back of the box smallprint' months prior to release.

there were also multiple topics about it here on GAF, mostly descending into people who are fine with it, and people who have massive problems with it, which they will then reluctantly admit is nothing to do with what it is and how it does it right now, but that something bad might happen at some point in the future.

Let's do it all again!

 

[Walshicus]

Civ 5 requiring Steam was not exactly 'back of the box smallprint' months prior to release.

there were also multiple topics about it here on GAF, mostly descending into people who are fine with it, and people who have massive problems with it, which they will then reluctantly admit is nothing to do with what it is and how it does it right now, but that something bad might happen at some point in the future.

Let's do it all again!

It's on the back of my box, in VERY small print and you can hardly expect people to follow every piece of gaming news that may or may not possibly affect them. But yes, this is a lesson learned to always read the small print.

 

[ghst]

I don't want Steam installed. But yeah, my own fault for not reading the tiny text on the back. Things like this remind me why the majority of the few PC games I own are from Paradox. If I wanted a digital distribution system installed to play a game I wouldn't have bought the boxed copy.

so, software apps with a minimal footprint are out, but mandatory disk swapping is in?

i always assumed you merrickian libertarians wouldn't go within a thousand yards of as draconian as a console.

 

[MrNyarlathotep]

To be honest, I'm amazed that a regular poster on GAF would not have noticed any of the 10+ page threads about Civ 5, often with the words steamworks in the title, or that you didn't do a bit of research about the game prior to picking it up, because to certain people steamworks integration is a huge (negative) deal and it has been brought up in multiple places.

I have some sympathy I guess for having been oblivious to all of this, and for whatever reason refusing to just accept Steam is currently all good stuff, but caveat emptor I guess.

It's always worth checking what kind of copy protection / DRM PC games have.

 

[dream]

Yeah, who wants full price games for a new release without the benefits of actually owning the game compared to a real retail release, the ability to sell/loan your games, not be limited by your internet connection or not lose access to your entire library of paid games because someone on a computer in another country decides to push a button.

Those aren't legitimate issues with Steam other than your first point. And I'm not positive that's a big deal other than to the people on CF who are just miffed about not being able to burn a copy of their buddy's Civ DVD anymore.

 

[Deleted member 30609]

Jesus Christ, Steamtologists are worse than Jehovas witnesses.

the guy is being irrational. it isn't like Steam will suddenly install a million other programs automatically or force itself to load on startup. It will quietly boot in the background when he double clicks the Civ V icon. It's no skin off my nose, but it sounds to me like he'd be better served to lower his own. it's a completely arbitrary stance.

 

[Zzoram]

Those aren't legitimate issues with Steam other than your first point. And I'm not positive that's a big deal other than to the people on CF who are just miffed about not being able to burn a copy of their buddy's Civ DVD anymore.

The existance of unique serial keys has killed the used PC market, regardless of using Steam or not.

 

[LCfiner]

The existance of unique serial keys has killed the used PC market, regardless of using Steam or not.

Exactly. I'd like to see anyone try to sell a recent PC game used. The concept is pretty much laughable at this point. And the other "points" about having to be online to play or your ability to play a game hinging on someone hovering their finger over a kill switch button are just total bullshit.

 

[dream]

Exactly. I'd like to see anyone try to sell a recent PC game used. The concept is pretty much laughable at this point. And the other "points" about having to be online to play or your ability to play a game hinging on someone hovering their finger over a kill switch button are just total bullshit.

Seriously. I expect this see this stuff on CF where the only PC game they've played in the past 5 years is Civ 4 but...on GAF?

 

[TheExodu5]

So I have to have Steam installed to play?...

Back to the shop it goes.

Waaaah waaaah my hardrive can't take the 1.5MB waaaah waaaaaah

Cry moar lol

 

[Helmholtz]

PC gamers complaining about Steam? Really? Really?

 

[Ysiadmihi]

I'm not gonna install Steam, I don't wanna be part of the machine maaaan!

Really, I can understand not wanting to be forced to install something but it's Steam for christ sake.

 

[Macattk15]

It's on the back of my box, in VERY small print and you can hardly expect people to follow every piece of gaming news that may or may not possibly affect them. But yes, this is a lesson learned to always read the small print.

Lol. What in the hell do you have against Steam?

 

[mavs]

I'm not gonna install Steam, I don't wanna be part of the machine maaaan!

Really, I can understand not wanting to be forced to install something but it's Steam for christ sake.

I can't understand arguing with people who won't install Steam. You know what they're going to say, tell them what they want to know and leave them alone.

 

[TheQueen'sOwn]

I've had Steam on my computer since somewhere around 2003. Then, it was something to complain about. Not now.

EDIT: Apparently I had it in 2002.

Anyway, just picked up the full game. Can't wait to play !

 

[Totakeke]

You're missing spices actually.

Puppet states do eventually start increasing social policy costs, but it's after a certain number. I have three in my Persia game and they haven't increased costs at all, but in my Aztec game I ended up with 11/12 and they started increasing with each one.

The map didn't have spices, or at least I never remember seeing them. There was also only one incense for the whole map, but the stupid city state never linked the resource and I had to conquer them to get it.


I barely had any puppet cities, maybe 5 at most, and I already saw the social policy costs increasing for each one I conquer. If what you're saying is true, then there must be another factor into determining the social policy costs rather than just purely puppet/annex.

What is the best civilization to go with if you want a science victory?

The deluxe edition exclusive Civ, Babylonians :lol. They get a free great scientist when you research writing and has a faster great scientist generation rate I believe.

Tried to do another culture/science win and ran out of time. If I had another 50ish turns it would have been good.

Any tips? I was playing as Egypt and played on the lowest game settings trying to make it easier :lol Do I have to set it to marathon?

Were you trying to do a cultural or a space victory? If you didn't know what you're going to do and played the game without a specific focus, then you'll have those issues. Otherwise it's pretty obvious what you need to do. For cultural, you need to get the cultural wonders and build a lot of cultural buildings. For science, you want high population cities, science buildings, and you can also make a lot of research agreements with other civs. You should also build your cities with their purpose in mind.

 

[Carm]

It's on the back of my box, in VERY small print and you can hardly expect people to follow every piece of gaming news that may or may not possibly affect them. But yes, this is a lesson learned to always read the small print.

I'm sorry, but that is a bullshit excuse that you and everyone else that uses it, knows it is. It's fine that some people don't like Steam for whatever reason, albeit most are stupid reasons, most major PC game releases are gonna have some form of DRM. So either don't buy any major PC releases or find DRM that is tolerable. As for people bringing up not being able to sell/trade/buy used PC games, where the hell have you been the past 10 years?

Takes less than a minute to see that it requires Steam. Simply using Google, which my mother can even use, and she barely knows how to use a mouse.

Besides typing the names in the address/search box it's no more than 5 clicks to the page showing it requires Steam.



But please, keep complaining about the bloatware that is Steam. Prior to release I spent a whole evening just reading the Steam Rant thread on the civfanatics forums for the entertainment value and boy it was a fun read.

 

[DEO3]

You guys using any mods?

Not until I'm done getting most of the achievements (enabling mods disables achievements) - though there are a few I know I'll never get (build a 1,000 temples!? chop down a 1,000 forests!? Shit is crazy).

 

[dream]

Not until I'm done getting most of the achievements (enabling mods disables achievements) - though there are a few I know I'll never get (build a 1,000 temples!? chop down a 1,000 forests!? Shit is crazy).

Achievements are only disabled when you start a new game using a mod. You can still unlock them otherwise.

 

[MrNyarlathotep]

Achievements are only disabled when you start a new game using a mod. You can still unlock them otherwise.

Which is pretty crappy if you just want a real-life clock in your UI so you have some awareness of just how late it's getting as you play.

...although steamworks to the rescue with that and its built in overlay with a clock in I guess

 

[Sober]

I was wondering if you still get the benefits from the tile that you actually built the city on. Someone earlier said you should always builds cities on a shitty tile since you get nothing from that actual tile. Or is that just for bonus/luxury resources?

I came to the same conclusion, but this post on the strat section at CF is more detailed: http://forums.civfanatics.com/showthread.php?t=382196 (the section marked: City Tile Yields)

Basically, find the crappiest tile, but still in 3-hex length of any resources you want from the area so they can be worked, so you aren't 'wasting' (in the min/max sense) a good tile when you could put an improvement on it that would help you more since the game only takes the tile yield(s) if it is greater than what the city would normally give.

Achievements are only disabled when you start a new game using a mod. You can still unlock them otherwise.

I think it's just starting a game from the mod menu right? Because I changed my menu music, but I've been picking up achievements regardless in my games using the regular SP menu options.

 

[Darklord]

PC gamers complaining about Steam? Really? Really?

There is a weird group of people who are anti-steam to the death. It's pretty idiotic. Hell, I hate GFWL but I'll still use it if I have too.

 

[scoobs]

There is a weird group of people who are anti-steam to the death. It's pretty idiotic. Hell, I hate GFWL but I'll still use it if I have too.

fight the machiiiine man! :lol I dont understand people that will deprive themselves of great games just because its on a single console or in this case service. I just dont get it.

 

[Chris R]

What is the best civilization to go with if you want a science victory?

This! And also what is the best setup? Obviously hope for jungle tiles because you get +2 Science per worked jungle tile from the university building. I'm guessing go for something that expands fast and focus on expansion/science traits as well as micromanaging your specialists? What about research agreements?

Like I said in a few posts before this one I went for a science or culture victory and just didn't have enough turns :|

 

[eznark]

fight the machiiiine man! :lol I dont understand people that will deprive themselves of great games just because its on a single console or in this case service. I just dont get it.

I love Steam, but he makes more sense to me than the people who get militantly indignant when you deign denigrate the service.

Of course it's the money-gated civilization who is best for what I want. Why wouldn't it be? :lol

 

[platypotamus]

What is the best civilization to go with if you want a science victory?

If you got the deluxe edition: Babylon by a good country mile.

Otherwise... not sure? I'd be tempted to try Greece with the patronage science perk.

Holy crap, just got my cultural victory with Montezuma. Didn't think I was going to make it before 2050, but a shuffling of a tiles to production and cashing in every Great Person I had got me the victory in 2038. And a big fuck you to the king of Siam, who thought he could take my tiny three city nation with an army of elephants.

I don't think I ever say this, but I'm completely in love with this game.

What's his culture bonus for defeated units like? How much culture/unit? Does it scale based on the unit's strength? Is it negligible? The info in civilpedia is unclear, and I was thinking about trying a culture game with him.

I've seen a mod or two that do that.

I grabbed one and it didn't seem to work :\ Might have been user error though.

 

[Totakeke]

If you got the deluxe edition: Babylon by a good country mile.

Otherwise... not sure? I'd be tempted to try Greece with the patronage science perk.

I'd say Gandhi for an alternative, but then Gandhi is an all around powerhouse.

 

[DEO3]

I grabbed one and it didn't seem to work :\ Might have been user error though.

Make sure when you play/load the game, you're doing it through the "Mods" section of the main menu. That is, open the game and when you're at the main menu click on "Mods", then in the sub-menu choose "Single Player", from there you can either setup a new game or load a previous save with any of the mods you've installed and enabled in the Mod Browser.