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[Freezie KO]

When this game is good, it's so good. But when it's bad, I want to rip out my innards. On the really big WMD map, I just had seven spawns in a row where I was within meters of an ongoing battle or clustered enemy position. I died in about second each spawn.

It's WMD! Just throw me into a corner somewhere the full distance across the map! I don't mind running for a minute to find someone. Especially when I'm using either the sniper rifle or the M16 on that level. Plus I was host-lagging, so I just screwed everyone and quit out. I wasn't about to wait for horrible spawn number eight.

 

[Victrix]

I've got two videos saved where I unload on a dude in a situation that looks unmissable and get 0 hitmarkers

The net code and hit detection in this game is pure shit

 

[divisionbyzorro]

I've got two videos saved where I unload on a dude in a situation that looks unmissable and get 0 hitmarkers

The net code and hit detection in this game is pure shit

Today I unloaded into a guy and died when he was looking away from me. You can guess what the killcam looked like.

I would gladly double or triple my match wait time if it meant getting matched with good hosts. Millions of people bought this game. Finding a match with 11 other dudes in my state shouldn't be that hard.

 

[Nizz]

Today I unloaded into a guy and died when he was looking away from me. You can guess what the killcam looked like.

I would gladly double or triple my match wait time if it meant getting matched with good hosts. Millions of people bought this game. Finding a match with 11 other dudes in my state shouldn't be that hard.

That's the worst. I hate, hate when I turn a corner and no sooner do I see an enemy in my view, I'm dead. It's literally see somebody and boom, dead. I'm wondering how the hell, he couldn't have seen me, go ADS and take me down within what feels like half a second.

Next thing I watch the killcam and I might as well have been Justin Hammer in Iron Man 2 dancing on stage for like two full seconds.

 

[Victrix]

I would gladly double or triple my match wait time if it meant getting matched with good hosts. Millions of people bought this game. Finding a match with 11 other dudes in my state shouldn't be that hard.

You know what really kills me about this? I've got a 25/25 fios connect. So do two of my friends. We _rarely_ end up as host, even if the host migrates. Instead it'll pick hosts where the entire rest of the fucking lobby has 3 bars.

In Reach, after a week of net testing, it'd consistently pick one of us as host, and everyone would have a smooth game I had issues with Reach, but net code and host selection wasn't one of them.

I've taken to playing Team Tactical just because it increases the chances of having a game with everyone having a good ping.

The way the game works, if ANYONE has a bad ping, it's shitty. Doesn't matter if your team is 5 bar, if theirs is 3, you're going to have some shit.

 

[Brolic Gaoler]

I'm wondering if they ever intend to fix the lag issue.

 

[cuevas. PhD.]

I'm wondering if they ever intend to fix the lag issue.

They haven't since cod4, it has to be something in the core of the IW engine.

 

[divisionbyzorro]

You know what really kills me about this? I've got a 25/25 fios connect. So do two of my friends. We _rarely_ end up as host, even if the host migrates. Instead it'll pick hosts where the entire rest of the fucking lobby has 3 bars.

In Reach, after a week of net testing, it'd consistently pick one of us as host, and everyone would have a smooth game I had issues with Reach, but net code and host selection wasn't one of them.

I've taken to playing Team Tactical just because it increases the chances of having a game with everyone having a good ping.

The way the game works, if ANYONE has a bad ping, it's shitty. Doesn't matter if your team is 5 bar, if theirs is 3, you're going to have some shit.

That's insane. Sounds like the "low-hanging fruit" here with regards to lag issues is host selection. And unless the "NAT type" issue that they're patching in the next title update magically fixes this, I expect it'll stay this way for a while.

 

[eek5]

I tested the bandwidth use by tethering off my phone and at max as a client I was sending 40kbps and downloading 40kbps so you don't need a high bandwidth account to be host. It is interesting that your 25/25 never hosts though. If you go to multiplayer options and hit "back" you get a system info screen. I would assume the game would list you as 10000Kbps and as long as your nat is open you should be hosting quite a few games. I get listed anywhere from 8000Kbps and 10000Kbps and I'm on a 10/2 connection and I host all the time ever since I forwarded ports on my router to get my NAT open.

 

[Anerythristic]

Worst net code of any major online game ever?

I have been nothing but a supporter but the connections are just...wow. You never know how many bullets its going to take t drop a player (sometimes its 3 sometimes its 10), phantom or no hit markers, my knife has phased through players or had no effect, players that seem to be a full three seconds ahead in time when you look at the kill screen. I don't think they are going to fix any of this.

The game had alot of good ideas but the execution is just horid. Whats the going resale value on this? I was patient and fair but I can't play an online game that is a crap shoot everytime you get online.

 

[divisionbyzorro]

I don't think it's the "net code" per say - I think it's the host selection. I agree that it sucks. The design decisions should make this the best CoD yet, and if they ever manage to stabilize it, then it will be.

To be fair to everything, tomorrow I think I'm going to pop MW2 back in for a bit and see how it feels.

 

[tsigo]

I'm on 25/15 FiOS and never get picked as the initial host, but almost always get picked as the host after the initial host quits. Not that being host is a good thing since the host now lags for some reason in this iteration.

 

[Brolic Gaoler]

They haven't since cod4, it has to be something in the core of the IW engine.

It's worse in Black ops though.

 

[cuevas. PhD.]

It's worse in Black ops though.

Its pretty much the same, pop cod4 in and see.

 

[Brolic Gaoler]

Its pretty much the same, pop cod4 in and see.

I could pop in MW2 and see, and it's not the same. Black ops is much worse.

 

[Mr. Enigma]

Games like this that use P2P networking are going to look even worse when Gears of War 3 comes out with dedicated servers.

 

[Brolic Gaoler]

Games like this that use P2P networking are going to look even worse when Gears of War 3 comes out with dedicated servers.

That, and it's going to have a beta test.

Reach had a beta and aside from firefight on occasion it runs amazing, and it's P2P.

 

[Stantron]

Not sure. I'll message him asking what's the deal later tonight.

So I just checked, and he's got the prestige icon with the bird talon, yet the background has "XV" in it. Pretty obvious if you connect the dots.

 

[cuevas. PhD.]

I could pop in MW2 and see, and it's not the same. Black ops is much worse.

Glad to see you are not going to do either, keep stating it as fact though. :lol

Games like this that use P2P networking are going to look even worse when Gears of War 3 comes out with dedicated servers.

or you could look at most PC games.

 

[Brolic Gaoler]

Glad to see you are not going to do either, keep stating it as fact though. :lol

or you could look at most PC games.

It is fact, the issues with network code were never as bad as they are now, yes they happened from time to time, but in Black Ops they happen every other game.

 

[divisionbyzorro]

Games like this that use P2P networking are going to look even worse when Gears of War 3 comes out with dedicated servers.

Yeah, that's only because after two iterations they couldn't make a game with netcode even half as good as the game that we're all bitching about now. :lol

 

[Mr Sandman]

Games like this that use P2P networking are going to look even worse when Gears of War 3 comes out with dedicated servers.

Gears 2 was a blast (never played the first) but the lag was just unbearable to the point that it made me quit after like 3 weeks. So this intrigues me. I don't have much faith they'll get it right, but maybe it will be the start to the end of P2P for big titles (CoD, Halo).

 

[LeMaximilian]

Its pretty much the same, pop cod4 in and see.

COD4 is good, W@W is amazing, MW2 is bad, BO is awful. I've played enough of each of the franchises to know how fucked I am when the game is giving my opponents a half second or more advantage.

Played a ton of COD4/W@W prior to the BO release, and I was amazed by how good playing W@W felt online. Never this feeling of running underwater, always was crisp and I was never angry that I died from something outside my control. Running into an invisible Bouncing Betty would be my rage fuel.

Corners are the devil in BO. 80% the time, you're fucked unless your host. And if you're host, you better not be getting the 'host disadvantage', which is the game dropping to 10 fps under crowded and high action situations.

The online play/lag/netcode is easily Black Ops biggest fault, and it's something that could of been easily investigated prior to the game going gold if there was an open beta. People would of been complaining out the friggin wazoo regarding the spawning and how the game feels like total crap if the host isn't them, or lives in the same state.

 

[ch0mp]

Gears 2 was a blast (never played the first) but the lag was just unbearable to the point that it made me quit after like 3 weeks. So this intrigues me. I don't have much faith they'll get it right, but maybe it will be the start to the end of P2P for big titles (CoD, Halo).

Yes please. Localised dedicated servers would actually make me have some interest in console MP.

 

[eek5]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TmoFrpvT6yk

Can't wait for the knife nerf. This thing is so overpowered! :lol

 

[cuevas. PhD.]

COD4 is good, W@W is amazing, MW2 is bad, BO is awful. I've played enough of each of the franchises to know how fucked I am when the game is giving my opponents a half second or more advantage.

Played a ton of COD4/W@W prior to the BO release, and I was amazed by how good playing W@W felt online. Never this feeling of running underwater, always was crisp and I was never angry that I died from something outside my control. Running into an invisible Bouncing Betty would be my rage fuel.

Corners are the devil in BO. 80% the time, you're fucked unless your host. And if you're host, you better not be getting the 'host disadvantage', which is the game dropping to 10 fps under crowded and high action situations.

The online play/lag/netcode is easily Black Ops biggest fault, and it's something that could of been easily investigated prior to the game going gold if there was an open beta. People would of been complaining out the friggin wazoo regarding the spawning and how the game feels like total crap if the host isn't them, or lives in the same state.

Corners have always been bad and all my I have always felt my killstreaks end with some BS. You guys are making the netcode to be way worse than it is. Is it the best? No but is it gamebreaking? Absolutely not. I just rage when I get killed around a corner when im 52-1 like .5 seconds before my teammate gets the last kill. I rage and go around calling the game the worst ever but I know I could have done something better.

The thing I will give you is the on-host lag, napalm gets me every single time.

 

[eek5]

The host framerate drop is really bad. On some maps I can't even go in certain areas of the map (I have to basically stay underground on radiation or I'm playing at 15fps)

Hopefully they address it but I doubt they will :/ The corner stuff was in COD4 and W@W for sure. Sounds like rose-tinted glasses to me because I remember the corner stuff being pretty bad in W@W. I would get smoked before I even approached a corner and their kill cam would show me turning it already :lol

Really? Are you on PS3?

360

 

[cuevas. PhD.]

The host framerate drop is really bad. On some maps I can't even go in certain areas of the map (I have to basically stay underground on radiation or I'm playing at 15fps)

Hopefully they address it but I doubt they will :/

Really? Are you on PS3?

I don't know what to tell you, I get host a few times a day and I only lag when napalm comes down. I have never gotten FPS drop on my 360 when walking around.

But hey us console owners should be glad we can at least play out game! lolpc

Just re-read my post and my phone made some fucked up assumptions of what I wanted to type

 

[eek5]

:lol :lol

 

[TurboLibre]

I had the same thing happen to me earlier today. I got ~25 kills with only a couple of deaths while the rest of my team didn't even break 10 (even had a 0-20). I don't really get angry at that stuff though, I played a good match there wasn't anything I could do. When the respawn system causes me to die 5 times in a row because it was right in front of an enemy/kill streak, that's when the swearing starts.

 

[eek5]

Nah that one was my fault. I needed to get 36 kills but I fell short

It is crazy that me and my friend combined for 61 kills and we still lost though :lol

I don't really get angry at that stuff though, I played a good match there wasn't anything I could do. .

Yeah it doesn't really bother me at all. I get matched against people who do awful all the time so sometimes you win and sometimes you lose.

 

[VaLiancY]

Any late night Gafers on at the moment? GT - Valvodka

 

[user_nat]

lol.

Just won a game 75-7 on Jungle.

I got 21 kills in a single chopper gunner. I also died 3/7 times.

 

[VALKYRAY]

:lol :lol

lol @ em n00bs.
wings of redemption would ragequitted if he was on your team.

 

[TurboLibre]

Damn. On the subject, I just went 43-9. The second best player on my team got 7.

7.

We still won though.

 

[Fugu]

After careful consideration, I have concluded that the M14 is pretty much just the best gun ever. Removing stopping power has basically made it ridiculous; it's one of the few guns that kills on two connected bullets almost all the time without coming with an entirely gimped aiming mechanism (sniping).

 

[eek5]

Damn. On the subject, I just went 43-9. The second best player on my team got 7.

7.

We still won though.

To be fair it is extremely difficult to get a lot of kills when someone on your team gets 43 :lol

 

[LeMaximilian]

After careful consideration, I have concluded that the M14 is pretty much just the best gun ever. Removing stopping power has basically made it ridiculous; it's one of the few guns that kills on two connected bullets almost all the time without coming with an entirely gimped aiming mechanism (sniping).

Just wait till you get the FAL.

 

[Myomoto]

After careful consideration, I have concluded that the M14 is pretty much just the best gun ever. Removing stopping power has basically made it ridiculous; it's one of the few guns that kills on two connected bullets almost all the time without coming with an entirely gimped aiming mechanism (sniping).

It does 50 base damage, with very little drop-off on range, so yeah shooting a dude twice in the leg should kill him.

 

[molekiller]

After careful consideration, I have concluded that the M14 is pretty much just the best gun ever. Removing stopping power has basically made it ridiculous; it's one of the few guns that kills on two connected bullets almost all the time without coming with an entirely gimped aiming mechanism (sniping).

I prefer the FAL, it has far less recoil.

 

[aku:jiki]

I'm not going to argue with most of your post, but you do realize that YouTube uploading only works about 25% of the time even on 360, right?

I've been doing this silly little "ritual" when uploading clips that has made me feel like an idiot for doing it, but hell, maybe my technique is actually working and I should share it? My videos do show up every time.

It's pretty simple, just do this: Make clip, copy clip from file share, go directly to rendering without playing the clip, view the clip (on your console) and rate it directly after rendering, have your YT account linked and wait 10 minutes, then the video should show up. Never try to queue multiple videos as that just ends up in shit, nothing ever shows up or you'll see like the 5th video you uploaded show up 4 days later.

And unless the "NAT type" issue that they're patching in the next title update magically fixes this, I expect it'll stay this way for a while.

Wait, wait, what? There's a problem with that? I just bought a Linksys to replace the previous, horrendous Sitecom my housemates had and after setting it up perfectly BO is still saying I have shitty NAT and I'm like wut.

Corners have always been bad and all my I have always felt my killstreaks end with some BS. You guys are making the netcode to be way worse than it is. Is it the best? No but is it gamebreaking? Absolutely not. I just rage when I get killed around a corner when im 52-1 like .5 seconds before my teammate gets the last kill. I rage and go around calling the game the worst ever but I know I could have done something better.

The thing I will give you is the on-host lag, napalm gets me every single time.

Why are you on some kind of quest to silence those of us who are having major issues with Black Ops? I mean, we spent $60 just like you did, are we not entitled to try to have the flaws in the product we purchased fixed?

Posters like myself, Maximilian and that kid with numbers in his name and a grey avatar aren't fucking around, making idiot posts just to hate on the game. We have no interest in doing that at all. We're expressing our concerns and offering suggestions for solutions, so again, why are you trying to shut us up, man? We just want to be able to enjoy the game more!

 

[divisionbyzorro]

I've been doing this silly little "ritual" when uploading clips that has made me feel like an idiot for doing it, but hell, maybe my technique is actually working and I should share it? My videos do show up every time.

It's pretty simple, just do this: Make clip, copy clip from file share, go directly to rendering without playing the clip, view the clip (on your console) and rate it directly after rendering, have your YT account linked and wait 10 minutes, then the video should show up. Never try to queue multiple videos as that just ends up in shit, nothing ever shows up or you'll see like the 5th video you uploaded show up 4 days later.

I'll try this and see if I can get it to work.

Wait, wait, what? There's a problem with that? I just bought a Linksys to replace the previous, horrendous Sitecom my housemates had and after setting it up
perfectly BO is still saying I have shitty NAT and I'm like wut.

From the 360 update thread:

Updated handling for UPnP-enabled routers to improve matchmaking conditions where users had strict or moderate NAT types. Also added in-game communications so that all players are aware of their NAT type in the Player Match party lobby.

 

[GeekyDad]

"From the 360 update thread:

'Originally Posted by Treyarch:
Updated handling for UPnP-enabled routers to improve matchmaking conditions where users had strict or moderate NAT types. Also added in-game communications so that all players are aware of their NAT type in the Player Match party lobby.'"

Yeah, that exact listing is also stated in the PS3 forums' patch thread. So, I'd guess it's an issue inherent in the game itself, not exclusive to one system or the other.

 

[RSTEIN]

I'm the first guy to stand up and say "hey, your game blows for the following reasons:____." As much as I love Gears, I did my fare share of complaining.

But I honestly don't know what you all are talking about. I'm never chosen as the host in any game (Gears, Halo, MW2, BO) so I've dealt with my fare share of lag rage in a lot of games. But with BO I haven't encountered any systematic lag whatsoever. Sure, a game or two will have serious lag that requires me to back out. But I'd say 90% of the time it's smooth sailing. I'm not the best at this game by any stretch (I have a 1.80 k/d, far from 2.0+ or something), I know if I get killed it's my own damn fault for being in the wrong place at the wrong time or not aiming fast or quick enough. I feel that the majority of the time when I die it's because during that specific encounter the opponent was better than me. This was not the case in Gears at all--comparing this game to pre-patch Gears 2 is insane.

By the way, we have it pretty sweet today even with these P2P networks. Obviously none of you played Quake TF back in the day on 56k against kids on university networks (aka LPBs - Low Ping Bastards). Try sniping someone against the map with that kind of lag handicap!

 

[divisionbyzorro]

"From the 360 update thread:

'Originally Posted by Treyarch:
Updated handling for UPnP-enabled routers to improve matchmaking conditions where users had strict or moderate NAT types. Also added in-game communications so that all players are aware of their NAT type in the Player Match party lobby.'"

Yeah, that exact listing is also stated in the PS3 forums' patch thread. So, I'd guess it's an issue inherent in the game itself, not exclusive to one system or the other.

I'm

Spoiler

unreasonably

hopeful that this will help improve the host selection process. When the game has a good host, it feels wonderful. When the game has even a slightly below-average host, it's almost unplayable.

 

[PalaceBrother]

Gameplay Tuning:
* • Limit the ability to re-roll supply drops using Hardline Pro to Care Packages only, no other killstreak drops.

I played this morning and was still able to re-roll SAM Turrets.

 

[divisionbyzorro]

I played this morning and was still able to re-roll SAM Turrets.

It'll be built into the next title update, which is currently in cert on 360 and PS3.

 

[aku:jiki]

From the 360 update thread:

Ah, nice. That will help me out, but it doesn't tell me why the game is saying I have moderate NAT when I did set up my router correctly.

Actually, anyone on GAF know how to get rid of moderate NAT? (I already have opened the ports, given my 360 a static IP and the usual stuff. Referred to portforward.com when I couldn't figure it out and they're not saying to do anything I haven't done...)

 

[divisionbyzorro]

Ah, nice. That will help me out, but it doesn't tell me why the game is saying I have moderate NAT when I did set up my router correctly.

Actually, anyone on GAF know how to get rid of moderate NAT? (I already have opened the ports, given my 360 a static IP and the usual stuff. Referred to portforward.com when I couldn't figure it out and they're not saying to do anything I haven't done...)

I usually just go with the nuclear option and put the 360 on the router's DMZ. Seems to work fine for me.

 

[regs]

has there been a patch that came out that made this game worse or something? I suppose it's just how the community evolved but i stopped playing for a week and now it's not that I am getting my ass kicked but I am just getting cheaply killed left and right as soon as I spawn like mw2

edit: right after i posted this my game started, walked outside after i spawned and was sniped :lol