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COMICS! |OT| July 2015. Okay for everyone, unless you're a DC or a Spider-Man.

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P

Poodlestrike

Banned
BenjaminBirdie said:
Johns' JLA Superman bears no resemblance to the current Truth iteration. Both are great books that manage to exist without erasing the other.

ShrugEmoticon.typedout
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Having not read either the DnA or Bendis series... the Superman books are contemporaries of each other; Guardians is (ostensibly) a continuation. Changes things, I guess.
 
W

WadiumArcadium

Member
I've only read the first trade of Bendis' run and it was decent enough but left no lasting impression in comparison to DnA.

And that Star Lord news is just plain stupid.
 
P

PsychBat!

Banned
echoshifting said:
lol, okay. I'm sure none of the criticism of the book is because "BENDIS." You're speaking for everyone who criticizes the book here?
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We're just gonna go back and forth on this, but you're the one who made a generalized statement in the first place.
echoshifting said:
Trashing Bendis on Guardians is so hip I have to wonder how much of it you guys have actually read.
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It's like right there, it's even in the first part of the sentence.
 
B

BenjaminBirdie

Banned
Poodlestrike said:
Having not read either the DnA or Bendis series... the Superman books are contemporaries of each other; Guardians is (ostensibly) a continuation. Changes things, I guess.
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eh probably
i just get a kneejerk reaction against those in favor of stifling new/good stories because of a deference to past ones
 
E

echoshifting

Banned
PsychBat! said:
We're just gonna go back and forth on this, but you're the one who made a generalized statement in the first place.
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That's fair, and I have no interest of going back and forth on this. I have no way of knowing who is actually reading the book. But it seems to me that, based on how this goes every time the book comes up, not everybody is criticizing the entire body of work, but rather a limited exposure to it. I guess I should have made it clearer that this was not directed at those people who are actually reading the book.
 
G

GAMEPROFF

Banned
remember the one time we all got excited because Brain wrote a Mini Alias Comic for the 75th Anniversary Issue and we thought we would get a new Streetlevel Bendis book?
 
B

BenjaminBirdie

Banned
WadiumArcadium said:
I've only read the first trade of Bendis' run and it was decent enough but left no lasting impression in comparison to DnA.

And that Star Lord news is just plain stupid.
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how?

you haven't read a panel of the new iteration of the character

it's the worst kind of blind prejudicial thinking

falcon should never be cap
x-23 should never be wolverine
gwen stacy should never be spider woman
[REDACTED] should never be thor

and cetera

terrible terrible thinking that hamstrings any kind of progress in creative media
 
C

Coriolanus

Banned
Can confirm that i shit on bendis solely because most of what i've experienced that he puts out nowadays is trash, a la Ultimate End and the final ish of Black Spider-Man. Yet to see anything that indicates that dude could manage a group book without shitting the bucket..

Old Man Logan is pretty decent, tho.
 
B

BenjaminBirdie

Banned
echoshifting said:
You mean the part where I present the open question: how much of it have you guys actually read? I got my answer, and as I said later on I have no issue with people criticizing a book they are actually reading. I just don't think that's the case for everyone.
Click to expand...

we have an instantly great example of someone clearly not reading the thing they're complaining about up thread as the thing they're complaining about doesn't yet exist
 
T

Tyrant Rave

Banned
I like Bendis on solo stuff. I love Daredevil and I liked USM.

I just think his Guardians is bland. I don't remember how many issues I read, somewhere between 7 and 12, and I don't really remember anything besides Tony and Gamora having sex. It's just a dull comic with good art IMO.
 
G

GAMEPROFF

Banned
BenjaminBirdie said:
how?

you haven't read a panel of the new iteration of the character

it's the worst kind of blind prejudicial thinking

falcon should never be cap
x-23 should never be wolverine
gwen stacy should never be spider woman
[REDACTED] should never be thor

and cetera

terrible terrible thinking that hamstrings any kind of progress in creative media
Click to expand...
All those characters have at least a history with these characters, so it makes sense, Kitty is just Peters shoehorned girlfriend because Bendis was writing X-Men and Guardians of the Banana
 
W

whatsinaname

Member
echoshifting said:
You mean the part where I present the open question: how much of it have you guys actually read? I got my answer, and as I said later on I have no issue with people criticizing a book they are actually reading. I just don't think that's the case for everyone.
Click to expand...

That's a bit of an odd stance. Why would someone continue to spend time on something they are not enjoying? I stopped reading at #18. I might catch up someday, I might not. Does my criticism become invalid because I am not currently reading it?
 
E

E the Shaggy

Junior Member
GAMEPROFF said:
All those characters have at least a history with these characters, so it makes sense, Kitty is just Peters shoehorned girlfriend because Bendis was writing X-Men and Guardians of the Banana
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They're married now. After three weeks of long distance dating.

whatsinaname said:
That's a bit of an odd stance. Why would someone continue to spend time on something they are not enjoying? I stopped reading at #18. I might catch up someday, I might not. Does my criticism become invalid because I am not currently reading it?
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It's really a damned if you do, damned if you don't scenario:

"You can't criticize something you haven't read!!"
"Well why are you reading something you hate then??"
 
B

BenjaminBirdie

Banned
GAMEPROFF said:
All those characters have at least a history with these characters, so it makes sense, Kitty is just Peters shoehorned girlfriend because Bendis was writing X-Men and Guardians of the Banana
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Kristen is equally DD's "shoehorned" girlfriend by this logic. Both are relationships that make sense in the context of those books.
 
W

WadiumArcadium

Member
BenjaminBirdie said:
how?

you haven't read a panel of the new iteration of the character

it's the worst kind of blind prejudicial thinking

falcon should never be cap
x-23 should never be wolverine
gwen stacy should never be spider woman
[REDACTED] should never be thor

and cetera

terrible terrible thinking that hamstrings any kind of progress in creative media
Click to expand...

I wouldn't really call it creative. More of a forced gimmick trying to pull in new readers. Call me cynical if you will but everyone doesn't have to like EVERY idea.
 
E

E the Shaggy

Junior Member
WadiumArcadium said:
Call me cynical if you will but everyone doesn't have to like EVERY idea.
Click to expand...

Seriously. If I don't like the way something looks, I can still think that before actually reading it, and if I'm proven wrong, GREAT! I get a good book to read.

You know how dumb "Bucky is alive again as a half cyborg Russian sleeper agent" sounded on paper back when Brubaker was pitching the idea? He ended up turning that into gold though.
 
E

echoshifting

Banned
whatsinaname said:
That's a bit of an odd stance. Why would someone continue to spend time on something they are not enjoying? I stopped reading at #18. I might catch up someday, I might not. Does my criticism become invalid because I am not currently reading it?
Click to expand...

It depends on what you're complaining about. I don't think it's cool to trash the book's current or upcoming status quo when you don't really know that much about it. Right now we have a lot of people complaining about the identity of the new Star-Lord, but if you'd read up through Black Vortex it's a perfectly natural transition, imho.

There's a difference between basing your criticism on what you've read vs. criticizing a future character development based on the first 18 issues of the series, or whatever. I don't think it's that odd to ask the drive-by comments on this if they can back up their criticism with some knowledge of the book as it stands today, and that's effectively what I was trying to do.
 
A

arkon

Member
echoshifting said:
I read the DnA saga and I am a huge fan.

Hey, at least you're reading the book you're criticizing....I have no issue with anyone for whom that is the case. It just seems like every time the book comes up a bunch of people pile onto Bendis who obviously aren't reading the book.
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There's probably a reason those people are no longer reading the book. I'm not going to carry on reading something I'm not enjoying but am more than willing to jump in with some criticism if somebody asks for opinions on it.

If those criticisms are misinformed then it would seem to me to be the perfect place for current readers to jump in and say "Actually, no, you're wrong here. This is what's happening in the book and this is probably why they setup things like this in those issues you read." Or words to that effect.

edit: beaten
 
C

Coriolanus

Banned
echoshifting said:
It depends on what you're complaining about. I don't think it's cool to trash the book's current or upcoming status quo when you don't really know that much about it. Right now we have a lot of people complaining about the identity of the new Star-Lord, but if you'd read up through Black Vortex it's a perfectly natural transition, imho.

There's a difference between basing your criticism on what you've read vs. criticizing a future character development based on the first 18 issues of the series, or whatever. I don't think it's that odd to ask the drive-by comments on this if they can back up their criticism with some knowledge of the book as it stands today, and that's effectively what I was trying to do.
Click to expand...

Fair point.
*types marvel black vortex review on google*
first hit
To borrow from Honest Trailers’ The Hobbit: The Battle of Five Armies, the final third of The Black Vortex is the best installment of the event “because it finally, finally means it’s over.” Seriously, the Guardians of the Galaxy only got to spend one issue on Venom’s home planet, but their squabble with the X-Men over a vaguely powerful mirror stretched out into a 13-issue “event?” Truly, there is no justice.

After a strong start and a mediocre middle, the conclusion of the Black Vortex is just so… blah. The evil McGuffin is wrestled from the hands of the Slaughter Lords, as we knew it would be, and Mr. Knife is left encased in amber. Nothing is learned or gained from this that required such a long arc. Last summer, Kelly Sue DeConnick lectured at the Ultimate Comics Writer’s Workshop and offered tips on quality comic book writing (which she was nice enough to post on Tumblr). One reoccurring theme in her lecture was the need to use the plot to further character development. The Black Vortex utterly fails at this (though it’s worth noting that, of the final four issues, DeConnick’s Captain Marvel #14 is easily the best). It’s quite a feat of incompetence that so many characters can undergo a cosmic transformation that unlocks their potential, yet never reveals anything new or valuable about their personalities.
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I just don’t understand how professional writers could botch up an arc this badly.
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Second hit.. Kinder, but not much in the way of praise either.

"hey man, it woulda made sense if you'd soldiered through a terrible event" isn't exactly what i would call a good defense, but to each his own.

GAMEPROFF said:
Why has this not happened yet?
Click to expand...

Because she's too hard to kill, prolly.
 
G

GAMEPROFF

Banned
Hey, just to tell the truth, I am basing my strict rejection of Bendis Guardians mostly om stuff you told me, the banana Hooked on a feeling scene, the Original Sin stuff, Rychard Ryder, stupid shorehorned characters for the team, the laughable planet of the symbiots stuff were suddenly every symbiote had a spider on the body... Far enough to be sure that I will never ever touch a Guardians of the Galaxy story that has Bendis name written on it.
 
E

E the Shaggy

Junior Member
GAMEPROFF said:
Hey, just to tell the truth, I am basing my strict rejection of Bendis Guardians mostly om stuff you told me, the banana Hooked on a feeling scene, the Original Sin stuff, Rychard Ryder, stupid shorehorned characters for the team, the laughable planet of the symbiots stuff were suddenly every symbiote had a spider on the body... Far enough to be sure that I will never ever touch a Guardians of the Galaxy story that has Bendis name written on it.
Click to expand...

The banana stuff actually wasn't Bendis, that was Hopeless in the Starlord solo book.

The symbiotes thing is something that EVERY writer has done. I can still remember the old "Planet of the Symbiotes" where all the symbiotes have, and have always had, the Spider-Man eyes for some reason.
 
G

GAMEPROFF

Banned
E the Shaggy said:
The banana stuff actually wasn't Bendis, that was Hopeless in the Starlord solo book.

The symbiotes thing is something that EVERY writer has done. I can still remember the old "Planet of the Symbiotes" where all the symbiotes have, and have always had, the Spider-Man eyes for some reason.
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The eyes are ok, I have no problem with them, but a spider is a far wider reach.

And ok - when everyone says the banana stuff is from Bendis them I assume as a non-read that its from Bendis. I wont buy books just to verify this.
 
Z

Zombine

Banned
GrandHarrier said:
Kitty rode a magic space bullet. I don't think you can get more space than that.
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1238944593638.png
 
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