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COMICS! |OT| July 2016. Everyone Loves A Hero, Everyone Loves You

E

ElNarez

Banned
Ah, yes, the writer of Strange Fruit

that's who I want doing a book about contemporary activism

also, fuck you Brevoort

BREVOORT: This is the young Scott Summers pulled from the past. In my head, he’s kind of the first challenge the group faces. Which is to say that when they get together and start to do this, what they’re doing is not just putting together a superhero team, they’re more like activists. They’re making an inclusive statement that they mean to be for all members of their generation: it’s time to get together and stand up and fix the world. This is a message that goes out and people come in response to it. Cyclops shows up and goes, “Boy I love what you’re putting down, I’d like to be a part of it.” It’s kind of like Kid Hitler showing up at the door. The older Cyclops has done some stuff. He’s a hugely divisive figure in the Marvel universe, so the first question these kids have to answer for themselves is, should we let him be a part of this? Is his very presence going to taint what we’re doing? His older self became a radical and a revolutionary and did awful things, but is it the same guy? And that’s kind of why he’s there I think. He wants to go down a different road than his older self did.
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P

Ponn

Banned
ElNarez said:
Ah, yes, the writer of Strange Fruit

that's who I want doing a book about contemporary activism

also, fuck you Brevoort
Click to expand...

Why does Kid Hitler sound like a X-men codename? Someone send that to Rick and Morty twitterfeed.

edit: Oh yea,they already did Kid Apoc thats why it sounds familiar.
 
B

BrightLightLava

Unconfirmed Member
I still think it's really kind of terrible that the comics world go to voice for young characters is Mark Waid. The guy is 54. Bring in some new talent.

I like the team line up though. I like that Viv is going to be around for a little while longer.

And of course, the logo is terrible because it's a Marvel book in 2016.
 
E

ElNarez

Banned
TheFlow said:
sight just send scott back
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Yeah see, I was kinda willing to drop the whole "Marvel is just character-assasinating the X-Men because they can't do movies with 'em" angle, but Tom Brevoort actually thinks there's anything in Cyclops' recent history that makes him comparable in any way to Adolf Goddamn Hitler.

Put in the context of the whole "Steve Rogers is a nazi now" thing, it shows that a) Marvel ARE character-assasinating the X-Men and b) they don't have any fucking ideas what nazis are anymore.
 
T

TheFlow

Banned
ElNarez said:
Yeah see, I was kinda willing to drop the whole "Marvel is just character-assasinating the X-Men because they can't do movies with 'em" angle, but Tom Brevoort actually thinks there's anything in Cyclops' recent history that makes him comparable in any way to Adolf Goddamn Hitler.

Put in the context of the whole "Steve Rogers is a nazi now" thing, it shows that a) Marvel ARE character-assasinating the X-Men and b) they don't have any fucking ideas what nazis are anymore.
Click to expand...

pretty much. Cyclops is far from a nazi. more along the lines of a black panther.
 
M

mreddie

Member
BrightLightLava said:
I still think it's really kind of terrible that the comics world go to voice for young characters is Mark Waid. The guy is 54. Bring in some new talent.

I like the team line up though. I like that Viv is going to be around for a little while longer.

And of course, the logo is terrible because it's a Marvel book in 2016.
Click to expand...

Waid still gets it though, read Archie and dude has made that damn love triangle look believable.
 
B

BenjaminBirdie

Banned
ElNarez said:
Yeah see, I was kinda willing to drop the whole "Marvel is just character-assasinating the X-Men because they can't do movies with 'em" angle, but Tom Brevoort actually thinks there's anything in Cyclops' recent history that makes him comparable in any way to Adolf Goddamn Hitler.

Put in the context of the whole "Steve Rogers is a nazi now" thing, it shows that a) Marvel ARE character-assasinating the X-Men and b) they don't have any fucking ideas what nazis are anymore.
Click to expand...

tbf wouldn't this attitude preclude a movie like indiana jones and the last crusade from being any fun at all?

or the producers?

in 2016?
 
B

Boogiepop

Member
Read Nameless last night, and... that was Morrison going as far into his Morrison-y strangeness as I think I've ever seen. Like, wow, I think that's even more insane and tricky to follow than the Filth, even if it did have some crazy (but helpful) discussion of what the hell was going on at the end of the hardcover.

Oh, and hey look, you guys could buy the entirety of One Piece on sale in one shot right now. (I actually totally do love One Piece and long since caught up and have been keeping up, but that would certainly be a good chunk of cash to grab everything at once). Also yay, Geoff Johns Justice League sounds like the perfect thing to buy digitally at a discount to me, so I'm definitely on top of that one!
 
B

BrightLightLava

Unconfirmed Member
ElNarez said:
Yeah see, I was kinda willing to drop the whole "Marvel is just character-assasinating the X-Men because they can't do movies with 'em" angle, but Tom Brevoort actually thinks there's anything in Cyclops' recent history that makes him comparable in any way to Adolf Goddamn Hitler.

Put in the context of the whole "Steve Rogers is a nazi now" thing, it shows that a) Marvel ARE character-assasinating the X-Men and b) they don't have any fucking ideas what nazis are anymore.
Click to expand...

One of the things Nick Spencer tweets a lot lately is that Hydra is more Nazi-Adjacent than actually Nazi.
 
E

echoshifting

Banned
I must confess that Brevoort quote is amusing and makes little sense. How is Hitler a hugely divisive figure? He's probably one of the least divisive historical figures. Dude didn't bring his train of thought all the way into the station for that comparison.
 
B

BrightLightLava

Unconfirmed Member
mreddie said:
Waid still gets it though, read Archie and dude has made that damn love triangle look believable.
Click to expand...

I agree with you, Waid can do it and I've been enjoying Archie and most of ANAD Avengers. But why not give a book about young people figuring out their way in the world to a writer who's closer to that actual age?

Why not give Kate Leth a try, or Ryan North, or try to get Noelle Stevenson back?
 
E

ElNarez

Banned
BenjaminBirdie said:
tbf wouldn't this attitude preclude a movie like indiana jones and the last crusade from being any fun at all?

or the producers?

in 2016?
Click to expand...

I'm more referring to the way Marvel editorial and Nick Spencer have dropped the ball in a huge way in dealing with the backlash to Steve Rogers Captain America #1. I'm totally fine with fiction about nazis, but, you have to be real careful with it, and remember that you're talking about nazis, with all the weight this carries.

And saying "Hydra aren't full-on nazis, they're just nazi-adjacent" is probably the most cowardly cop-out.
 
E

ElNarez

Banned
ViewtifulJC said:
Kid Hitler is a great superhero name
Click to expand...

introducing the all-new, all-different X-Hitlers

there's Hitler, Hitler's Second Wife, Metal Hitler, Deep Sea Hitler, Jewish Hitler, Furry Hitler, Magic Lady Hitler, Asian Lady Ninja Hitler, Fireworks Hitler, Bald Hitler, Weather Hitler and Bub Hitler

they fight Frog Hitler
 
F

frye

Member
Brevoort not only doesn't know who Hitler is, he doesn't know what "revolutionary" or "radical" mean either
 
B

BrightLightLava

Unconfirmed Member
Here's a bunch of recommendations from Kieron Gillen, Kate Leth and Marjorie Liu.

Nice to see the Giant Days love:

Giant Days by John Allison, Whitney Cogar, and Lissa Treiman
There's been a lot of all-ages hotness coming out over the last few years. For my money, Giant Days is the best. Herein, college students try their hardest to learn anything, least of all life lessons. If you want to know what fills the Archie-ish niche for a 2016 crew, you're basically thinking of what John Allison and his collaborators have done here. Delightful and delightfully funny. —Gillen

Giant Days consistently has the best dialogue of any comic I read. I'm super jealous of John Allison's ability to blend the way real people talk with spot-on comedic timing. Lissa Treiman's frenetic, delightful art is the perfect complement in this story of three best friends in college dealing with love, betrayal, sexuality, smoking, plagues, and zines. —Leth
Click to expand...
 
E

echoshifting

Banned
ElNarez said:
introducing the all-new, all-different X-Hitlers

there's Hitler, Hitler's Second Wife, Metal Hitler, Deep Sea Hitler, Jewish Hitler, Furry Hitler, Magic Lady Hitler, Asian Lady Ninja Hitler, Fireworks Hitler, Bald Hitler, Weather Hitler and Bub Hitler

they fight Frog Hitler
Click to expand...

Lil' Avengers vs. Lil' Hitlers by Skottie Young

Would buy
 
B

BenjaminBirdie

Banned
ElNarez said:
I'm more referring to the way Marvel editorial and Nick Spencer have dropped the ball in a huge way in dealing with the backlash to Steve Rogers Captain America #1. I'm totally fine with fiction about nazis, but, you have to be real careful with it, and remember that you're talking about nazis, with all the weight this carries.

And saying "Hydra aren't full-on nazis, they're just nazi-adjacent" is probably the most cowardly cop-out.
Click to expand...

Indiana Jones pratfalls into Adolf Hitler, THE Adolf Hitler, and THE Adolf Hitler signs a very important artifact that could secure a very powerful relic for the nazis, presumably to help them exterminate more types of people they don't like, and the guy buffonishly signs it with his autograph and hands it back.

Now, Spielberg has since denounced this type of depiction of Nazis, but, I mean, we're not even talking about Nazis here. We're talking about dudes in green and yellow outfits, who inspire comics like Hank Johnson, Agent of Hydra and supporting characs like Bob, Agent of Hydra. Cartoons.

But let's follow this logic. If Hydra are more than "Nazi-adjacent" because of the Red Skull, is everyone else who teamed up with Red Skull during like Acts of Vengeance similarly Nazified?

There are plenty of actual things to be angry with mainstream comics about. Creator diversity, colorist credit, shitty logos, digital discrimination, garbage printing techniques, increasing prices, terrible inkers, no inkers, terrible artists, rushed comics, shitty logos, did I mention shitty logos?

Hydra has been a cartoon villain brand for forty years. Red Skull has erased Steve Rogers from the world as recently as Brube's run. This is nothing new. This is comics.

Cassandra Nova murdered millions of mutants and then, through the power of comic book storytelling, joined the X-Men as Ernst.

This whole argument makes no sense to me when there are actual meaningful fights to be fought.
 
B

Brianimaniac

Banned
Breaking it down to 23¢ a page might be the wake-up call I need. What the fuck am I doing with my money?

I generally read events like these more because I want to be informed on things that will directly influence other books I'm enjoying, but I really need to break the habit and rely more on recap pages.
 
B

BenjaminBirdie

Banned
Riskington said:
Breaking it down to 23¢ a page might be the wake-up call I need. What the fuck am I doing with my money?

I generally read events like these more because I want to be informed on things that will directly influence other books I'm enjoying, but I really need to break the habit and rely more on recap pages.
Click to expand...

The problem is that the direct market audience is so small and so middle class and so drenched in disposable income, they will continue to be milked at +$1 a year for the rest of their lives.
 
H

hipsterpants

Member
Is there an in-universe explanation as to how Kamala can possibly keep her secret identity/have a high school life while also being an avenger/"champion" or does Marvel just not care?
 
E

echoshifting

Banned
Riskington said:
Breaking it down to 23¢ a page might be the wake-up call I need. What the fuck am I doing with my money?

I generally read events like these more because I want to be informed on things that will directly influence other books I'm enjoying, but I really need to break the habit and rely more on recap pages.
Click to expand...

Yeah. I read the events because I generally end up enjoying the ride, but for someone who is just reading them effectively as a news bulletin I don't know how you look at those numbers and continue buying the book.
 
B

Brianimaniac

Banned
hipsterpants said:
Is there an in-universe explanation as to how Kamala can possibly keep her secret identity/have a high school life while also being an avenger/"champion" or does Marvel just not care?
Click to expand...
Attempts to explain these kinds of things that aren't very tongue-in-cheek have resulted in some of the worst superhero comics ever written.
 
E

echoshifting

Banned
hipsterpants said:
Is there an in-universe explanation as to how Kamala can possibly keep her secret identity/have a high school life while also being an avenger/"champion" or does Marvel just not care?
Click to expand...

Why single out Kamala? The suspension of disbelief Marvel is asking for here goes all the way back to the '60s.
 
B

BenjaminBirdie

Banned
echoshifting said:
Why single out Kamala? The suspension of disbelief Marvel is asking for here goes all the way back to the '60s.
Click to expand...

it's also a bad choice for singling out considering how Wilson handles the people around her and their handling of her secret identity

The end of the Last Days storyline with her mom OF COURSE knowing she was Ms. Marvel was gorgeous and amazing
 
E

echoshifting

Banned
BenjaminBirdie said:
it's also a bad choice for singling out considering how Wilson handles the people around her and their handling of her secret identity

The end of the Last Days storyline with her mom OF COURSE knowing she was Ms. Marvel was gorgeous and amazing
Click to expand...

Yeah. I mean it comes up all the time in that book. In Nova and Spider-Man too. It's not like they pretend it would be easy.
 
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