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[Souless_PJ]

Is this GAF or Reset? DeepBreath87 is completely correct - the vaccines were sold to the public promising everything and have now been reduced to um hopefully they’ll keep you out of ICU but no guarantees. Oh and also you’ll need to take them every four months cause they kinda don’t work much after that.

And businesses and govenments around the world mandated these promising them to be the way out of the pandemic. Yet everyone still got infected and unless you have underlying health issues it didn’t matter if you’ve had zero or three shots.

The rational people have realised they’ve been duped and the governments are still not admitting they stuffed up and are not changing course.

 

[DeepBreath87]

Ottawa police would disagree.

Well, I guess I disagree with the Ottawa police. Look, I’ve watched a bunch of interviews with the actual protestors. None of them seem like revolutionaries. They seem like normal people. They pretty clearly want the government to let them do their jobs and stop trying to restrict their lives. I don’t see them committing violence or damaging property on a wide scale. I’m sure there have been incidents. But these are not rioters. It’s pretty clear what they want, and that is for the restrictions to be lifted.

 

[Kraz]

Is this GAF or Reset? DeepBreath87 is completely correct - the vaccines were sold to the public promising everything and have now been reduced to um hopefully they’ll keep you out of ICU but no guarantees. Oh and also you’ll need to take them every four months cause they kinda don’t work much after that.

And businesses and govenments around the world mandated these promising them to be the way out of the pandemic. Yet everyone still got infected and unless you have underlying health issues it didn’t matter if you’ve had zero or three shots.

The rational people have realised they’ve been duped and the governments are still not admitting they stuffed up and are not changing course.

Maybe in your region they were sold that way. Not here. So you're not speaking for everyone.

One of the considerations besides infection not even mentioned is managing resource requirements for hospitalization and recovery during waves to lessen impacts all across the board.

 

[Kraz]

Well, I guess I disagree with the Ottawa police. Look, I’ve watched a bunch of interviews with the actual protestors. None of them seem like revolutionaries. They seem like normal people. They pretty clearly want the government to let them do their jobs and stop trying to restrict their lives. I don’t see them committing violence or damaging property on a wide scale. I’m sure there have been incidents. But these are rioters. It’s pretty clear what they want, and that is for the restrictions to be lifted.

The people cheering for black market ivermectin were really normal. Along with those talking about microchips in the vaccine, globalist plots, praying the covid away...

 

[Kraz]

These people aren't oppressed.

They're just fucking whiners who can't wait the few more weeks that were already planned out and those taking advantage of the situation.

 

[DeepBreath87]

The people cheering for black market ivermectin were really normal. Along with those talking about microchips in the vaccine, globalist plots, praying the covid away...

Again, if you want to nut pick, knock yourself out. Not exactly operating in good faith. Their major complaint is the restrictions. That and for their Prime Minister to stop using rhetoric that was better suited to 1930s Germany than 2022 Canada.

 

[Kraz]

Again, if you want to nut pick, knock yourself out. Not exactly operating in good faith. Their major complaint is the restrictions. That and for their Prime Minister to stop using rhetoric that was better suited to 1930s Germany than 2022 Canada.

No the major complaint according to their representatives is the recently re-elected elected Liberal government which they specifically requested dissolved by the Governor General.

 

[DeepBreath87]

No the major complaint according to their representatives is the recently re-elected elected Liberal government which they specifically requested dissolved by the Governor General.

If my Prime Minister was talking about me like that, I’d probably want him to be removed as well.

“They take up space… Do we tolerate these people?” As opposed to what? What kind of government talks about its citizens that way?

 

[Kraz]

If my Prime Minister was talking about me like that, I’d probably want him to be removed as well.

That's what elections are for. Although this protest likely hasn't improved their chances as much as they might think.

 

[Kraz]

Their behavior is so bizarre and mechanical that my fanciful side can't help but imagine them being guided by an AI that's leading them to their doom. Oligarch AI of some sort, but the AI is working against them and giving them bad advice. This almost writes itself.

 

[DeepBreath87]

That's what elections are for. Although this protest likely hasn't improved their chances as much as they might think.

Eh. If my Prime Minister was threatening that he wasn’t going to “tolerate” me “taking up space” anymore, I might be inclined to stand up for myself regardless of election results.

 

[DeepBreath87]

Their behavior is so bizarre and mechanical that my fanciful side can't help but imagine them being guided by an AI that's leading them to their doom. Oligarch AI of some sort, but the AI is working against them and giving them bad advice. This almost writes itself.

You are starting to sound like Alex Jones. You might want to reflect on that.

 

[Kraz]

You are starting to sound like Alex Jones. You might want to reflect on that.

I specifically said "fanciful". Was a /s necessary for you? Some get irritated by those, but you seem to be the case they're needed for.

 

[DeepBreath87]

I specifically said "fanciful". Was a /s necessary for you? Some get irritated by those, but you seem to be the case they're needed for.

I don’t know. You’re kind of unhinged sometimes.

 

[Kraz]

Eh. If my Prime Minister was threatening that he wasn’t going to “tolerate” me “taking up space” anymore, I might be inclined to stand up for myself regardless of election results.

Your prerogative to tilt at windmills in a ego satisfying hero fantasy. Sounds more likely you're trying to encourage others from a long long long long ways away.

 

[Edgelord79]

Is this GAF or Reset? DeepBreath87 is completely correct - the vaccines were sold to the public promising everything and have now been reduced to um hopefully they’ll keep you out of ICU but no guarantees. Oh and also you’ll need to take them every four months cause they kinda don’t work much after that.

And businesses and govenments around the world mandated these promising them to be the way out of the pandemic. Yet everyone still got infected and unless you have underlying health issues it didn’t matter if you’ve had zero or three shots.

The rational people have realised they’ve been duped and the governments are still not admitting they stuffed up and are not changing course.

Shouldn't you be on a convoy somewhere?

 

[DeepBreath87]

Your prerogative to tilt at windmills in a ego satisfying hero fantasy. Sounds more likely you're trying to encourage others from a long long long long ways away.

They obviously don’t need my encouragement. But I sympathize with their concerns and generally feel government intrusion into normal life needs to be checked.

 

[Kraz]

They obviously don’t need my encouragement. But I sympathize with their concerns and generally feel government intrusion into normal life needs to be checked.

You appear to have a shallow grasp of their concerns and none of the demands they've made.

You're sympathetic to your misunderstanding of the protest not the reality of it.

 

[DeepBreath87]

You appear to have a shallow grasp of their concerns and none of the demands they've made.

You're sympathetic to your misunderstanding of the protest not the reality of it.

We just don’t agree on what they are asking for. I think your opinion is clearly somewhat clouded by your disdain for these people. You probably think my sympathies do the same in the other direction. It would appear we are an impasse. I stand by the idea that if restrictions were rolled back, the protests would largely dissolve.

 

[Kraz]

We just don’t agree on what they are asking for. I think your opinion is clearly somewhat clouded by your disdain for these people. You probably think my sympathies do the same in the other direction. It would appear we are an impasse. I stand by the idea that if restrictions were rolled back, the protests would largely dissolve.

Where mandates have been rolled back to appease protestors so far hasn't improved anything.

 

[FireFly]

Is this GAF or Reset? DeepBreath87 is completely correct - the vaccines were sold to the public promising everything and have now been reduced to um hopefully they’ll keep you out of ICU but no guarantees. Oh and also you’ll need to take them every four months cause they kinda don’t work much after that.

And businesses and govenments around the world mandated these promising them to be the way out of the pandemic. Yet everyone still got infected and unless you have underlying health issues it didn’t matter if you’ve had zero or three shots.

The rational people have realised they’ve been duped and the governments are still not admitting they stuffed up and are not changing course.

That was a quick ban. Your post perfectly illustrates the danger of all or nothing thinking. Vaccines aren't perfect therefore they are useless.

Here in the UK all restrictions are ending this month, thanks to vaccination, and there are no plans to offer a fourth or fifth or sixth booster, or however many we are being told to fear. So I guess conspiracy theorists will have to find a new target for now.

 

[DeepBreath87]

That was a quick ban. Your post perfectly illustrates the danger of all or nothing thinking. Vaccines aren't perfect therefore they are useless.

Here in the UK all restrictions are ending this month, thanks to vaccination, and there are no plans to offer a fourth or fifth or sixth booster, or however many we are being told to fear. So I guess conspiracy theorists will have to find a new target for now.

I do think it’s a mistake to discount the vaccines entirely. They’re effective as personal, individual protection. My experience where I work is that only unvaccinated people under the age of 50 really ended up needing to be intubated. That was still pretty rare, but when we got a really sick 38 year old, typically they were overweight and unvaccinated.

Now we did see a sizable number of vaccinated people in there late 60s or older who ended up not doing well. But the vaccinations undoubtedly helped a lot of people. I’m pro vaccine. I just don’t believe in the mandates are worth it. I didn’t before it was obvious that the vaccines weren’t good at preventing transmission and I continue to think their cost to society is greater than their worth.

 

[poppabk]

I do think it’s a mistake to discount the vaccines entirely. They’re effective as personal, individual protection. My experience where I work is that only unvaccinated people under the age of 50 really ended up needing to be intubated. That was still pretty rare, but when we got a really sick 38 year old, typically they were overweight and unvaccinated.

Now we did see a sizable number of vaccinated people in there late 60s or older who ended up not doing well. But the vaccinations undoubtedly helped a lot of people. I’m pro vaccine. I just don’t believe in the mandates are worth it. I didn’t before it was obvious that the vaccines weren’t good at preventing transmission and I continue to think their cost to society is greater than their worth.

So you would have rather had longer more extensive lockdowns and increased mask mandates rather than the vaccines?

 

[Vicetrailia]

So you would have rather had longer more extensive lockdowns and increased mask mandates rather than the vaccines?

He would rather have as many people die and/or get sick from Covid, and cause as much destruction to society as possible. He’s pro death but for Covid. He’s apparently the mutated human form of the Covid virus.

 

[DeepBreath87]

He would rather have as many people die and/or get sick from Covid, and cause as much destruction to society as possible. He’s pro death but for Covid. He’s apparently the mutated human form of the Covid virus.

Wow. That’s a pretty despicable thing to say. Calling other human beings viruses. I’m almost surprised you stooped to that level. Pretty disgusting. Do better.

So you would have rather had longer more extensive lockdowns and increased mask mandates rather than the vaccines?

That’s a false choice, my friend. Plenty of places have gotten along fine without either of those things.

 

[poppabk]

That’s a false choice, my friend. Plenty of places have gotten along fine without either of those things.

Which places? And please don't say fucking Sweden for the hundredth time.

 

[laynelane]

You appear to have a shallow grasp of their concerns and none of the demands they've made.

You're sympathetic to your misunderstanding of the protest not the reality of it.

I can't even call it a protest anymore. It's an occupation. I'm right in the heart of it, with all the fumes, noise, and Fuck Trudeau signs everywhere. That a group calling for the removal of the lawfully elected Prime Minister in a democratic nation and the dissolution of the government has been allowed to carry on for this long is something I never thought I'd see.

 

[DeepBreath87]

Which places? And please don't say fucking Sweden for the hundredth time.

How about Florida? They haven’t had restrictions of any significance in over a year. Their outcomes don’t vary significantly from states that have been mandating masks and vaccines. You would expect that a place like that, with such a large number of elderly people and such lax restrictions would see a massive death toll that demonstrated that the measures in other states were effective.

How about Mexico? Very little to no restrictions. Not exactly the highest levels of healthcare either. Somehow they haven’t experience societal collapse or death on such a wide scale that they stand out.

I’m not saying restrictions were never justifiable. They had their time. But clearly mask mandates are minimally effective. And I’ve made my feelings on the benefits of vaccine mandates vs their societal consequences quite clear already. Plenty of places are doing fine without forcing the unvaccinated out of their jobs. Even the places that did vaccinate are seeing massive spikes because the virus is spreading essentially uninhibited.

At this point vaccine mandates serve no purpose. The people who want the vaccine have gotten it. And everyone has gotten Omicron or will soon enough. At this point, the pandemic is over. The vaccines helped keep a lot of people from dying. Omicron’s more mild nature helped as well. Now the we are acknowledging natural, recovered immunity is a thing, broad swathes of society have some form of immunity from severe illness. The necessity of mandates is no longer even a question.

 

[BadBurger]

Well, I guess I disagree with the Ottawa police. Look, I’ve watched a bunch of interviews with the actual protestors. None of them seem like revolutionaries. They seem like normal people. They pretty clearly want the government to let them do their jobs and stop trying to restrict their lives. I don’t see them committing violence or damaging property on a wide scale. I’m sure there have been incidents. But these are not rioters. It’s pretty clear what they want, and that is for the restrictions to be lifted.

This began over unvaccinated truckers not being allowed to cross the border for gigs. Two things, however: the vast majority of truckers are already vaccinated, and Canadian trucking companies were already simply using vaccinated drivers to replace unvaccinated drivers for those specific gigs - no big deal.

If you really want to see what they're all about, which is honestly completely predictable, you simply need visit their official social media page on Gab (since they were booted from Facebook). Look at who they are responding to, the media they're sharing, the accounts that support them. And there are watchdog groups monitoring their communications on apps such as Zello - it ain't pretty.

 

[poppabk]

How about Florida? They haven’t had restrictions of any significance in over a year. Their outcomes don’t vary significantly from states that have been mandating masks and vaccines. You would expect that a place like that, with such a large number of elderly people and such lax restrictions would see a massive death toll that demonstrated that the measures in other states were effective.

How about Mexico? Very little to no restrictions. Not exactly the highest levels of healthcare either. Somehow they haven’t experience societal collapse or death on such a wide scale that they stand out.

I’m not saying restrictions were never justifiable. They had their time. But clearly mask mandates are minimally effective. And I’ve made my feelings on the benefits of vaccine mandates vs their societal consequences quite clear already. Plenty of places are doing fine without forcing the unvaccinated out of their jobs. Even the places that did vaccinate are seeing massive spikes because the virus is spreading essentially uninhibited.

At this point vaccine mandates serve no purpose. The people who want the vaccine have gotten it. And everyone has gotten Omicron or will soon enough. At this point, the pandemic is over. The vaccines helped keep a lot of people from dying. Omicron’s more mild nature helped as well. Now the we are acknowledging natural, recovered immunity is a thing, broad swathes of society have some form of immunity from severe illness. The necessity of mandates is no longer even a question.

Florida has a 50% higher death rate than my state of VA and we haven't had any particular restrictions in over a year either other than kids in school wearing masks. Our economy has recovered as well as, if not better than Florida.
Mexico had similar restrictions to anywhere else except for entry into the country.
I agree that vaccine mandates have limited purpose at this stage that's why there aren't many places introducing mandates.

 

[Boodler81]

I think people keep missing the point that just because someone got vaccinated, it doesn't mean they support the mandates.

 

[funkygunther]

How about Mexico? Very little to no restrictions. Not exactly the highest levels of healthcare either. Somehow they haven’t experience societal collapse or death on such a wide scale that they stand out.

discrepencies between Mexico’s reported deaths and their excess deaths have been found unfortunately

https://www.nature.com/articles/d41586-022-00104-8

 

[Rentahamster]

How about Florida? They haven’t had restrictions of any significance in over a year. Their outcomes don’t vary significantly from states that have been mandating masks and vaccines.

Nope.

You would expect that a place like that, with such a large number of elderly people and such lax restrictions would see a massive death toll that demonstrated that the measures in other states were effective.

Yes, you would expect that because that's what happened.

COVID Data Tracker

CDC’s home for COVID-19 data. Visualizations, graphs, and data in one easy-to-use website.

covid.cdc.gov

Florida, Maine, Vermont, West Virginia, Delaware, and Montana are the top 5 states with the most old people in them. Florida (66% fully vaccinated) and West Virginia, another woefully undervaccinated state (56% fully vaccinated) lead the pack in cumulative deaths per capita. Hey look, Maine (78% fully vaccinated) and Vermont (80% fully vaccinated), two states with some of the highest vaccination levels, are relatively low on the death count (not completely apples to apples comparison since the population sizes and densities are different).

What if we check by size and compare Florida with the other states that are closest to it in size?

We see, of course, that the lower vaccinated states of Florida (66% fully vaccinated) and Pennsylvania (66% fully vaccinated) lead the way in deaths per capita, while the higher vaccinated states of California and New York who also took the pandemic relatively more seriously, has kept the most people alive in that time.

I’m not saying restrictions were never justifiable. They had their time. But clearly mask mandates are minimally effective.

The mandates themselves are only as effective as the population is compliant. In places with a noncompliant populace, they will be less effective. Compare that to a place like Japan where masking is very effective without a mandate because everyone does it on their own volition because they know it works.

See my earlier post which compiles lots of data from observational and controlled studies about how masking and mandates was probably effective.

https://www.neogaf.com/threads/covid-19-thread-no-bitching-about-masks-of-fauci-edition.1608887/post-265539210

Even the places that did vaccinate are seeing massive spikes because the virus is spreading essentially uninhibited.

Regardless of massive spikes in cases, less people overall are getting sick and dying, which means it's working.

 

[prinz_valium]

The only good death (and excess death) tracking
https://www.euromomo.eu/graphs-and-maps/
Sadly it doesn't exists for shit hole countries, tho

If you start tracking that kind of data when something happend, it's going to be bad data. You already have to do it.

 

[StreetsofBeige]

The mandates themselves are only as effective as the population is compliant. In places with a noncompliant populace, they will be less effective. Compare that to a place like Japan where masking is very effective without a mandate because everyone does it on their own volition because they know it works.

It may or not have to do with knowing it works or not, but more about people (or a culture) that will listen to authority and direction. And it's not even country specific, but can be region specific.

In places like redneck states (including redneck provinces like Alberta and Saskatchewan), there's always some kind of defiance against government no matter what they say. Aliens can be invading Earth and zapping people like War of the Worlds. Government says stay inside and lock your doors. But I'd bet any money you'd get more people standing outside there taking on all comers like it's Red Dawn.

But to be fair, people in those small town or rural areas live a more sedated life, and can do more of their own shit vs. a condo urbanite whose biggest worry in life is being fast enough to book a patio for an after work pow wow. So to less urban people, government is a babysitter they dont want micromanaging their lives.

 

[DeepBreath87]

Nope.



Yes, you would expect that because that's what happened.

COVID Data Tracker

CDC’s home for COVID-19 data. Visualizations, graphs, and data in one easy-to-use website.

covid.cdc.gov

Florida, Maine, Vermont, West Virginia, Delaware, and Montana are the top 5 states with the most old people in them. Florida (66% fully vaccinated) and West Virginia, another woefully undervaccinated state (56% fully vaccinated) lead the pack in cumulative deaths per capita. Hey look, Maine (78% fully vaccinated) and Vermont (80% fully vaccinated), two states with some of the highest vaccination levels, are relatively low on the death count (not completely apples to apples comparison since the population sizes and densities are different).

What if we check by size and compare Florida with the other states that are closest to it in size?

We see, of course, that the lower vaccinated states of Florida (66% fully vaccinated) and Pennsylvania (66% fully vaccinated) lead the way in deaths per capita, while the higher vaccinated states of California and New York who also took the pandemic relatively more seriously, has kept the most people alive in that time.

The mandates themselves are only as effective as the population is compliant. In places with a noncompliant populace, they will be less effective. Compare that to a place like Japan where masking is very effective without a mandate because everyone does it on their own volition because they know it works.

See my earlier post which compiles lots of data from observational and controlled studies about how masking and mandates was probably effective.

https://www.neogaf.com/threads/covid-19-thread-no-bitching-about-masks-of-fauci-edition.1608887/post-265539210

Regardless of massive spikes in cases, less people overall are getting sick and dying, which means it's working.

So just to boil that down, you skewed your data by removing the first 100k deaths which were largely concentrated in New York. You say so right at the top of the charts you made. If you didn’t do that, you would see that per capita, Florida is actually 18th in overall death rate while New York is 6th.

United States COVID - Coronavirus Statistics - Worldometer

United States Coronavirus update with statistics and graphs: total and new cases, deaths per day, mortality and recovery rates, current active cases, recoveries, trends and timeline.

www.worldometers.info

By removing the first 100k deaths, you removed almost 30k deaths from New York. Comparatively, you removed about 2000 from Florida. Not exactly fair to remove New York’s largest spike in death but include everyone else’s. You didn’t count 40% of New York’s overall deaths. Shady stuff.

Essentially you had to change the starting point to make the data say what you wanted because the reality is that overall, Florida actually has had fewer deaths per capita than New York despite and overall older population and far less restrictions.

 

[Coolwhhip]

Kinda off topic:

So we're finally in the clear ish with covid and returning to normal, then Putin decides "nope". EviLore maybe allow a thread on Ukraine even when it's politics? It might be as important as covid (or worse) if things go south.

 

[prinz_valium]

Kinda off topic:

So we're finally in the clear ish with covid and returning to normal, then Putin decides "nope". EviLore maybe allow a thread on Ukraine even when it's politics? It might be as important as covid (or worse) if things go south.

No.
Don't want and don't need war in Europe.

 

[12Goblins]

Kinda off topic:

So we're finally in the clear ish with covid and returning to normal, then Putin decides "nope". EviLore maybe allow a thread on Ukraine even when it's politics? It might be as important as covid (or worse) if things go south.

maybe once people start acting like well adjusted adults and stop chery picking facts and misrepresenting perceived inconsistencies in order to confirm their worldviews, then we can start to discuss adult topics in a responsible manner

 

[DeepBreath87]

maybe once people start acting like well adjusted adults and stop chery picking facts and misrepresenting perceived inconsistencies in order to confirm their worldviews, then we can start to discuss adult topics in a responsible manner

Yeah. It’s never good to alter data to get the answer we want.

 

[Kraz]

Yeah. It’s never good to alter data to get the answer we want.

Or leave some out to make strongly worded broad based political claims off assumptions and anecdotes.

 

[DeepBreath87]

Or leave some out to make strongly worded broad based political claims off assumptions and anecdotes.

Oh? Did I shave off 40% of the deaths from a state to try and claim it had a better outcome than it actually did?

 

[Kraz]

Oh? Did I shave off 40% of the deaths from a state to try and claim it had a better outcome than it actually did?

Was referring to our conversation yesterday and specifically thinking of when you mentioned watching a youtube video of a protestor in a truck which somehow summarized the entire protest for you.

 

[poppabk]

So just to boil that down, you skewed your data by removing the first 100k deaths which were largely concentrated in New York. You say so right at the top of the charts you made. If you didn’t do that, you would see that per capita, Florida is actually 18th in overall death rate while New York is 6th.

United States COVID - Coronavirus Statistics - Worldometer

United States Coronavirus update with statistics and graphs: total and new cases, deaths per day, mortality and recovery rates, current active cases, recoveries, trends and timeline.

www.worldometers.info

By removing the first 100k deaths, you removed almost 30k deaths from New York. Comparatively, you removed about 2000 from Florida. Not exactly fair to remove New York’s largest spike in death but include everyone else’s. You didn’t count 40% of New York’s overall deaths. Shady stuff.

Essentially you had to change the starting point to make the data say what you wanted because the reality is that overall, Florida actually has had fewer deaths per capita than New York despite and overall older population and far less restrictions.

You have to judge the effects of restrictions from when they could be feasibly effective and specifically when they started to diverge. Florida didn't deviate from the norm in terms of lockdowns for the first wave, they had stay at home orders, they closed schools etc. Including data from that period won't give you a picture of what effect restrictions had because both states were locked down.

 

[DeepBreath87]

You have to judge the effects of restrictions from when they could be feasibly effective and specifically when they started to diverge. Florida didn't deviate from the norm in terms of lockdowns for the first wave, they had stay at home orders, they closed schools etc. Including data from that period won't give you a picture of what effect restrictions had because both states were locked down.

No. You have to judge the states in their totality. New York had a large number of their vulnerable population die in the first wave. To exclude that is to skew the stats in favor of a particular conclusion. If Florida ultimately ends up with a lower rate of death from
Covid despite the lack of restrictions and mandates, that’s just the reality.

You are trying to parse the data fit a narrative. The fact is that skimming 40%(!) of a state’s total deaths is skewing the data. That’s not even up for debate. There is no way to do that that isn’t dishonest unless you acknowledge it up front.

 

[DeepBreath87]

Was referring to our conversation yesterday and specifically thinking of when you mentioned watching a youtube video of a protestor in a truck which somehow summarized the entire protest for you.

We don’t need to rehash the conversation. I tend to listen to what people are saying rather than have my opinions formed through the lens of other people’s opinions. So when I see people at the protest talking about what their upset about, I figure they are actually saying what they are upset about. I tend not to make it any more complicated than that.

Like I told you, I believe your obvious disdain for those people is clouding your ability to evaluate them rationally.

 

[chromhound]

If you own shares...

 

[Kraz]

We don’t need to rehash the conversation. I tend to listen to what people are saying rather than have my opinions formed through the lens of other people’s opinions. So when I see people at the protest talking about what their upset about, I figure they are actually saying what they are upset about. I tend not to make it any more complicated than that.

Like I told you, I believe your obvious disdain for those people is clouding your ability to evaluate them rationally.

Your rose coloured blinders and lack of knowledge about the situation's keeps you from forming any proper opinions on the matter.

Many have disdain and stronger feelings for those protestors who want to impose themselves on the nation by threatening its citizens.

An example:

Ottawa tow-truck operator receives hundreds of threats from both sides of the convoy

Randy May describes himself as a patriotic Canadian who supports the "Freedom Convoy," calling it a “do-or-die” situation for truckers.

ottawacitizen.com

https://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/ottawa/ottawa-convoy-protest-shack-towed-reaction-1.6342357

 

[Kraz]

Oh and then there's this product of rhetoric about the matter in the US

Bomb threat to the wrong Ottawa by U.S. man opposed to Canada's mask mandate

The suspect searched for 'Ottawa Police Department' and phoned the force in Ottawa, Ohio

nationalpost.com

So bomb threats and money coming from US sources to terrorize.

 

[DeepBreath87]

Your rose coloured blinders and lack of knowledge about the situation's keeps you from forming any proper opinions on the matter.

Many have disdain and stronger feelings for those protestors who want to impose themselves on the nation by threatening its citizens.

An example:

Ottawa tow-truck operator receives hundreds of threats from both sides of the convoy

Randy May describes himself as a patriotic Canadian who supports the "Freedom Convoy," calling it a “do-or-die” situation for truckers.

ottawacitizen.com

https://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/ottawa/ottawa-convoy-protest-shack-towed-reaction-1.6342357

“Additionally, he says, the haters have come from both sides of the issue, with convoy supporters ganging up first when they thought he was moving the structure as part of a police effort, followed by the anti-convoy contingent when it became clear he supported the protest.”

“Anti-protestors, he says, have called to say they hope he and his children get COVID, or have intimidated him by reciting his home address over the phone.”

Sounds like that guy is caught in the middle actually.