Seriously. DC could have made an entire universe from the ending of TDK, but instead they let it die in the most baffling way possible.
Dark Knight Rises v Man of Steel (Which one sucked more?)
- Thread starter Nintendoga
- Start date
- Status
Seriously. DC could have made an entire universe from the ending of TDK, but instead they let it die in the most baffling way possible.
There is an entire thread dedicated to trying to remember what Thor 2 is about. Even if MoS' plot isn't the best thing since sliced bread I don't see how that's worse than a plot you can't remember. You wouldn't know that judging by the backlash MoS gets here.
Not even just here. YouTube and GameFAQs have a largely negative opinion of MoS. Just weird to me considering the praise it got when I saw it in theaters. People cheered, laughed, gasped. There was a moment of shocked silence when Zod was killed. I expected MoS to have a pretty good public opinion and it doesnt. Completely threw me off.
Same happened with TDKR. My theater audience hated the movie. I remember all the laughing and bitching about the plot and the "Robin" reveal. Yet TDKR is looked at mostly in positive light. Far more than MoS.
After MoS there was one guy who I heard in the restroom bitch about the 9/11 porn but I just blew it off as not a fan of that particular thing in these movies.
AstroNut325
Member
TDKR
By a light year.
Man of Steel is excellent despite its flaws. I felt empathy towards the protagonist and the antagonist in MoS. TDKR it was just plain boredom and cringe inducing action sequences.
By a light year.
Man of Steel is excellent despite its flaws. I felt empathy towards the protagonist and the antagonist in MoS. TDKR it was just plain boredom and cringe inducing action sequences.
Extra Sauce
Member
Spoilers
Batman kills a person, and this is how they die.
There's no other explanation than Nolan saying "Fuck it, let's wrap this shit up".
Never forget.
Battersea Power Station
Member
Can you guys please expand on this point? I can't quite make out what you're implying, but I feel like you completely missed the point of TDK, and how TDKR fits in with the former's ending.
MisterHero
Super Member
They are bloated but they are still very good movies. OP needs to watch more crappy movies (or don't, and keep crap opinions about decent movies).
The ending of TDK set up the entire Batman mythology for future adventures; but TDKR revealed that they were just kidding and he was actually hiding in his mansion for years.
Or maybe Nolan was just more interested in telling his own story than seeding an entire cinematic universe?
The Dent act demolished organized crime and most of the petty shit was swept up in the years after Dark Knight. Batman was technically no longer needed other than a figure for people to blame for killing Dent, he'd more or less succeeded in what he wanted to do, having taken out the crime families and removed almost all the corruption to make Gotham peaceful, just like it was at the start of Rises.
Also... Batman has hidden away and even retired in the comics a number of times, it's the basis for Returns and the entire setup for Batman Beyond.
Dr Bass
Member
Man of Steel is a bad movie.
The Dark Knight Rises is a pretty good movie, despite some people vehemently hating it. Most of the complaints seem to stem from people either not getting the movie, or not getting the kind of movie they wanted.
The scores on Rotten Tomatoes (for the most part) generally do not lie. When a movie is in the 50s, that is pretty freakin' bad.
Man of Steel - 56%
The Dark Knight Rises - 88%
That is an extremely large disparity in reviews, and with similarly extremely good reasons.
The Dark Knight Rises is a pretty good movie, despite some people vehemently hating it. Most of the complaints seem to stem from people either not getting the movie, or not getting the kind of movie they wanted.
The scores on Rotten Tomatoes (for the most part) generally do not lie. When a movie is in the 50s, that is pretty freakin' bad.
Man of Steel - 56%
The Dark Knight Rises - 88%
That is an extremely large disparity in reviews, and with similarly extremely good reasons.
What's there to expand upon? The movie, by way of Gordon, tells you that Batman will protect Gotham and its citizens, no matter what, regardless of how the public or anyone feels about him. The ending sets up the order of things in the comic world, where Batman is actively seeked and pursued as a vigilante/criminal as much as the people he fights against. Even the Joker says "I think you and I are destined to do this forever." Nobody will ever change my mind that the magical garbage called The Dent Act is a retcon of Nola's own original ideas for this franchise.
Nothing about TDK tells you he's going to give up and go skulk in an attic for eight years. Absolutely nothing.
Batman wasn't the victim of organized crime. It's not like he'd let muggers and rapists do what they want because they aren't associated with anyone.
It's contrived and isn't at all faithful to Batman as a character, but if it made for a better story I'd be more ok with it. However, in the context of the plot of TDKR, I have no idea what Batman sitting on his ass for 8 years done to enhance it.
Furious 7 is a fun movie. Can you tell me why it doesn't deserve an 81%?
I hate when people bring up RT like that's a good metric of quality. Even the user scores paint a totally different picture with MoS at 78% and TDKR at 90%. The disparity goes from 32 to 12.
Man of Steel is worse than The Dark Knight Rises.
What I liked:
What I didn't like:
What I liked:
- It brings in the often neglected alien angle and puts it front and center.
- The action is for the most part well directed.
- The film features good casting choices and good performances all around, especially by Michael Shannon and Russell Crowe.
- Zod's character was somewhat interesting. They didn't just make him another megalomaniac archetype bent on ruling the world.
- It contains some very memorable and beautifully shot scenes, like the moment where Superman learns to fly.
What I didn't like:
- Irrespective of what we think about the death of Zod, having the climax of a Superman film be a moment of gut-wrenching anxiety and despair just doesn't fit.
- Just because the muted color palette works for Batman, doesn't mean that it works for Superman. To me, the strength of these characters lie partly in their differences. These differences should be reflected in the atmosphere surrounding them.
- Superman was often talked about as being an ideal and a symbol of hope, but we never really got to see it through his actions or people's reactions.
- The general intellectual defensiveness evidenced by the film (e.g., not having anyone call him Superman unless someone is also there to roll their eyes).
- The editing and pacing was sometimes a bit strange and jarring (e.g., going immediately from intense action scenes to somber childhood memories).
- Superman kissing Lois amidst the ruins of Metropolis, presumably surrounded by the corpses of tens of thousands of innocent people, was among the most obscene things I've ever witnessed in a film of this kind.
- Although Zod's character was somewhat interesting and original, his motivation didn't always make sense. If he wanted Superman to cooperate with him, why did he give him visions of drowning in a sea of human skulls? Why didn't he just decide to settle on Mars instead? If he did, then he could just ask Superman for the codex and convince him to help them build a new civilization there. I guess him being programmed to be a great military leader means that he can still be a diplomatic retard.
Bobby Roberts
Banned
The Iron Giant isn't a Superman movie
Superman: The Movie is still the best Superman movie.
Man of Steel is probably the second best (Superman II has a lot of the same problems as Man of Steel, actually, with a Superman who is actually more self-centered, and actually ENJOYS hurting/killing people. And the Donner Cut doesn't really make anything better, either.)
Transformers are also "fun" movies.
They also have shit dialogue, shit characters, and shit acting.
But who cares, because YAY EXPLOSIONS, amirite?
SlowRevolution
Member
TDKR's a lot better. Neither sucked.
All that really does is make the opinions here seem like outliers.
Furious 7 received much better reviews than Transformers. Why do you think that is?
But he was a victim of organized crime. Remember Rachel showing him how bad Gotham was and it was thanks to the powerful crime families corrupting the highest institutions and making life hard for the average man that created so many people like Joe Chill?
flaxknuckles
Member
A DC movie universe spawned from the no-supernatural-allowed NolanBat movies sounds awful as fuck. Especially with Bale and his cheesy ass Bat voice.
Aaronology
Member
Dude, I've been asking myself that exact same question for the past 5 years now...
Anyone who likes decent cinema and has grown up on legitimately good action flicks will not like Furious 7. Others will I suppose which is why this turd is sitting at 81%. Maybe if the director shook that camera even more during the mind numbingly boring action sequences it would cross 90%.
IMDB rating is the most pointless voted by a bunch of marvel and dc fanboys who give perfect scores to these movies because they have horrible taste.
Because it's a well made, fun action flick.
LastGamer84
Member
One completely fails to understand it source material, the other is just a sub-par comic movie with terrible plot holes.
TDKR also has a better critic rating than any other superhero movie aside from The Dark Knight and Spider-Man 2. I think it's pretty safe to say the general consensus is positive. The ones who don't like the movie tend to be the outliers.
Man, I can only imagine the seething disdain you have for the ignorant masses and even more clueless critics who overwhelmingly enjoy Furious 7 and TDKR.
Keep preaching brother. Some day the truth will be known.
Thornton Reed
Member
Zack Snyder is one of the worst directors out there. His best moments aren't even close to nolans worst.
Snyder makes tacky flashy bullshit
Snyder makes tacky flashy bullshit
And that's one of the things that made no sense in regards to the main plot. So everything is all fine and dandy in Gotham and the people are all happy and content, then Bane comes along and tells everyone that he's here to help because everything is so corrupt and the people are like "oh yeah sure whatever"?.
Seriously, what the hell?
I'm guessing TDKR is as high as it is because of residual goodwill people held from Heath Ledger's death.
RustyNails
Member
This is simply well put.
TDKR is actually a really good Batman movie, but not quite the best Baleman movie. Here are some of the amazing scenes and plot points regarding TDKR, starting with BANE:
Then the Wall St Heist
To the best Batman introduction of any Batman movie, ever
I can go on. Other scenes that come to mind that were really memorable,
Scarecrow's court
Batman's re-introduction (again, the best reintroduction of any Batman movie)
Tell me you didn't feel goosebumps when you heard Batman's theme playing in the background and then Batman shows up. And who can forget, the absolute pivotal battle in the movie
People immediately think of Talia and how she shat up the movie and think the entire movie sucked. This is not the case. Bane is a worthy followup to Joker. But I agree that Talia was really the worst part of the movie. There were of course some silly cuts in the movie mostly regarding the action sequences. I hope we get a fan cut of the movie that completely removes her from the film (something which Nolan should have done in the first place) and we only get Batman versus Bane for the fight of Gotham's soul.
In other words,
I just remembered that TDKR spawned this:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IkMPZ7WeDck
Its existence is justified.
Watchmen is one of the better comic book movies out there.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IkMPZ7WeDck
Its existence is justified.
Watchmen is one of the better comic book movies out there.
roflwaffles
Member
TDKR is a great movie when you're watching it - it only falls apart once you start to pick it apart afterwards. The actual experience of watching it was very worthwhile. It's easy to see why it gets some hate though.
MoS has a great concept but is poorly executed and has abysmal pacing with too much seemingly random scenes and sequences that drag on just a bit too long.
I still much prefer these to Batman 89 and Superman Returns.
MoS has a great concept but is poorly executed and has abysmal pacing with too much seemingly random scenes and sequences that drag on just a bit too long.
I still much prefer these to Batman 89 and Superman Returns.
Discotheque
Banned
There's like 4 great scenes in tdkr (which are like better than a numerous amount of films in the genre alone) but the film itself is a disappointing slog
Oh I will give my opinion on movies. I did not need your permission nor do I need to look at Rotten Tomatoes to form opinions about movies I see.
Which was entirely to do with the strength of the story and nothing to do with Snyder. Not even his shitting over-editing and constant slowmo-normal speed bullshit could sink such a thought-provoking story.
roflwaffles
Member
For that last jumping punch that Bane does to Bats, it never looked right to me. It always looked like his fist never connected with Batman's face and he was just punching air instead, with Bale falling down afterwards.
We need more brave heroes like you.Oh I will give my opinion on movies. I did not need your permission nor do I need to look at Rotten Tomatoes to form opinions about movies I see.
Sure, the director of the movie had nothing to do with how good that movie was.
Something like Watchmen could've easily turned to shit.
- Status