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[Cannon Goose]

Welp, just found out the hard way that spiced buffs are no longer viable. 8 Bonfire Ascetics and 26 Skeptic's spices later and my Sunlight Blade barely lasts 25 seconds :/ It's a positive change for sure but I really wish I hadn't wasted all that stuff...

 

[Soulhouf]

Thanks guys, I'll see how much the pardoner asks for, I spent 133000 to be able to talk to Vangarl, I don't think I want to spend that much again.

He has some good items to sell/give you, so it's worth it no matter the price.

 

[Mistel]

Indeed, that one has more damage. But unless you use it for some quick lolz in PvP, it's going to break before you even get warmed up. It has 20 durability points which is way too little to make it practical in PvE.

I've got 3 of them I cycle between whilst wearing bracing knuckle ring. Otherwise I generally use giant club, gyrm hammer, and dragon tooth.

 

[Soulhouf]

Welp, just found out the hard way that spiced buffs are no longer viable. 8 Bonfire Ascetics and 26 Skeptic's spices later and my Sunlight Blade barely lasts 25 seconds :/ It's a positive change for sure but I really wish I hadn't wasted all that stuff...

Holy shit. That means that dark weapon is even less viable since it would require 50 fai/50 int to have max duration.
OK, that makes sense, but putting Resonant Weapon at the same level as Dark Weapon is pretty stupid.
C'mon From, we asked for balance and not make some tools obsolete.

 

[Seanspeed]

Why do all the weapons except swords suck?

I keep upgrading other types of weapons that say they should be powerful going by the stats, but it seems everything in the fucking game is weak to slashing. Hammers and spears and shit seem to do far less damage on average and are far less useful as a result.

 

[Mistel]

Why do all the weapons except swords suck?

They don't suck at all. Strike damage for instance is a major weakness for enemies.

 

[Cannon Goose]

Holy shit. That means that dark weapon is even less viable since it would require 50 fai/50 int to have max duration.
OK, that makes sense, but putting Resonant Weapon at the same level as Dark Weapon is pretty stupid.
C'mon From, we asked for balance and not make some tools obsolete.

I don't know for sure about how stats relate to buff duration, but I assumed that at the required stats for the buff you'd achieve the full 90 seconds. I really have no idea though.

In other news, I am still so glad that Nvidia added Shadowplay to desktop capture mode. I managed to jump over this guy's attack and bonk him into the ground!

http://a.pomf.se/gojypz.webm

Pay no attention to the utterly ridiculous homing/lock-on of the jump attack >.>

 

[KillerDark]

You can use the key on the

Spoiler

door to the right of the first main chamber when you enter the building that eventually leads to the boss and the spider webs. Y'know, the one where the spiders are on the ceiling, lying in ambush.

Thanks!

 

[Xeroblade]

Welp, just found out the hard way that spiced buffs are no longer viable. 8 Bonfire Ascetics and 26 Skeptic's spices later and my Sunlight Blade barely lasts 25 seconds :/ It's a positive change for sure but I really wish I hadn't wasted all that stuff...

Damn. I didnt know people actually spiced down spells this much! So before patch did it last a lot longer?

 

[Cannon Goose]

Damn. I didnt know people actually spiced down spells this much! So before patch did it last a lot longer?

Before the patch you could use Resonant Weapon with 10 INT/FTH and still get the full damage boost (50 + 50%) on top of the full 60 second buff duration.

 

[Firebrand]

Never liked the spice design much, seemed a bit silly that you could farm items to push down the reqs yet keep the full spell strength. That said... my cleric-y warrior probably doesn't fair all too well now, I think I stopped at 40-45 faith.

They don't suck at all. Strike damage for instance is a major weakness for enemies.

Yep, this. Especially early on strike is king, pick up the mace or even the morning star outside of Majula and it'll outperform a slash or thrust weapon with a couple of titanites on early bosses as well as all those armored knights.

Not sure if the same applies to PvP, difference in strike/slash protection doesn't seem to be huge in the armor stats.

 

[maomaoIYP]

Welp, just found out the hard way that spiced buffs are no longer viable. 8 Bonfire Ascetics and 26 Skeptic's spices later and my Sunlight Blade barely lasts 25 seconds :/ It's a positive change for sure but I really wish I hadn't wasted all that stuff...

Wow, that is fucking amazing the number of things that they fixed.

Spoiler

I don't have a single spiced down character among my 9 LOLOLOLOLOLOL

 

[J-Roderton]

Geez. This Undead Crypt boss is like Smelter 2.0. What's he weak against?

 

[KittenMaster]

Why do all the weapons except swords suck?

I keep upgrading other types of weapons that say they should be powerful going by the stats, but it seems everything in the fucking game is weak to slashing. Hammers and spears and shit seem to do far less damage on average and are far less useful as a result.

In my experience swords, especially dex based ones aren't very good in this game. Speedruns are able to take a blunt weapon two handed at 25 strength, Aromatic Ooze buff it, and do more damage to lategame bosses at relatively low levels compared to my overleveled character who both infused and Aromatic Ooze buff'd the fast sword weapon.

I'm pretty sure that an unbuffed Falchion was doing more damage in Dark Souls 1 than every attempt to boost the damage of a Warped Sword in Dark Souls 2.

 

[Red Liquorice]

I've still never used spices, it just seems cheap. All the benefits without the stat investment? Just more of the BS that From put in the game for reasons unknown.

Spoiler

casul

 

[Jackben]

Warped Sword +5 is OK but you really notice how limited it is when you switch it up. The move set is probably the most interesting aspect as you can catch a lot of people off guard by chaining attacks in PVP.

Strength weapons are the true king in Dark Souls 2, not sure it's intended as there are a lot of really badly implemented scaling stats that make 0 sense for Dexterity weapons in Dark Souls 2. But it is what is is.

Also consider the number of humanoid sized and armored enemies you encounter in the game: blunt/crushing damage type weapons do much better damage to armored enemies than slashing or piercing weapons, and smaller enemies are more easily stunned/overwhelmed with this type as well.

Your success of course is still determined by your play style. You can make dexterity work by staying mobile, getting lots of hits in while you can and dodging appropriately.

I have found that my favorite bread & butter build for survival is to go for long swords since you get a nice, varied move set that does decent damage. Sunlight sword for example gets decent scaling with strength, and the 2H R2 thrust is useful for narrow entryways and corridors.

But I prefer to either rock a Greatsword on my strength build or katanas for dex when I want to look cool and have fun and am not worried/pressured by the area.

 

[Soulhouf]

I've still never used spices, it just seems cheap. All the benefits without the stat investment? Just more of the BS that From put in the game for reasons unknown.

Spoiler

casul

That's why they nerfed the Flame Weapon (no stat requirement) and made duration increase with stat I guess.
It's pretty good IMO.

The change that made no sense is the Resonant Weapon nerf though. Making it have exactly the same effect as Dark Weapon albeit with much higher costs is absurd.

 

[Jackben]

I've still never used spices, it just seems cheap. All the benefits without the stat investment? Just more of the BS that From put in the game for reasons unknown.

Spoiler

casul

Well before the patch it was used to get access to buffs like already described (sunlight blade, flame weapon) but now I don't really see a major use when it comes to scaling offensive or defensive spells. I thought maybe it could be used for stuff like that 62 Faith lightning spell before I found out it sucks.

I guess it could be kinda useful for a non-magic build to get Chameleon & Repair down to 10 Int?

 

[Orochinagis]

just equip it, you'll get a prompt when you're near.

Welp I killed her shortly so I think I wont invade her, I hate priest.

 

[Morrigan Stark]

Why do all the weapons except swords suck?

I keep upgrading other types of weapons that say they should be powerful going by the stats, but it seems everything in the fucking game is weak to slashing. Hammers and spears and shit seem to do far less damage on average and are far less useful as a result.

...What? It's the other way around, most enemies are weak to blunt, hammers are OP and slashing/dex is weaker.

 

[Mistel]

Geez. This Undead Crypt boss is like Smelter 2.0. What's he weak against?

Lightning.

Welp I killed her shortly so I think I wont invade her, I hate priest.

Undercover Patches...

 

[Alo81]

Why do all the weapons except swords suck?

I keep upgrading other types of weapons that say they should be powerful going by the stats, but it seems everything in the fucking game is weak to slashing. Hammers and spears and shit seem to do far less damage on average and are far less useful as a result.

This is basically the exact opposite of the truth.

 

[Booshka]

Wow, that is fucking amazing the number of things that they fixed.

Spoiler

I don't have a single spiced down character among my 9 LOLOLOLOLOLOL

You have some overleveled characters. Try out casting Sacred Oath, then Numbness, then Greater Magic Barrier. Not sure the exact order to get the proper broken buff stacking. But if you do it right you become unkillable for about 2 minutes depending on how long your buffs last.

Apparently From thought that buff stacking wasn't already broken enough, so they took it to another level, I was watching Oroboro's stream yesterday and he was testing it with a friend. It's unbelievably broken, pair that with the good ol Powerstance HelixMastodon combo and you become an unkillable poking machine of death.

 

[Orochinagis]

I will start selling humanities and priest gear shortly

 

[Soulhouf]

You have some overleveled characters. Try out casting Sacred Oath, then Numbness, then Greater Magic Barrier. Not sure the exact order to get the proper broken buff stacking. But if you do it right you become unkillable for about 2 minutes depending on how long your buffs last.

Apparently From thought that buff stacking wasn't already broken enough, so they took it to another level, I was watching Oroboro's stream yesterday and he was testing it with a friend. It's unbelievably broken, pair that with the good ol Powerstance HelixMastodon combo and you become an unkillable poking machine of death.

I don't know how it works exactly but it sounds more hassle than anything.
They spend 10 sec stacking buffs and if you don't interrupt them, you can run until the effect wears off.

 

[maomaoIYP]

You have some overleveled characters. Try out casting Sacred Oath, then Numbness, then Greater Magic Barrier. Not sure the exact order to get the proper broken buff stacking. But if you do it right you become unkillable for about 2 minutes depending on how long your buffs last.

Apparently From thought that buff stacking wasn't already broken enough, so they took it to another level, I was watching Oroboro's stream yesterday and he was testing it with a friend. It's unbelievably broken, pair that with the good ol Powerstance HelixMastodon combo and you become an unkillable poking machine of death.

Hmm.... but numbness only works for 20 seconds according to the wiki?
I've fought many characters pre-patch who cast GMB and sacred oath, I don't recall getting demolished. I've never seen someone cast numbness though.

 

[Mistel]

I will start selling humanities and priest gear shortly

Both imperious and insolent sets along with the mace of the insolent?

 

[Soulhouf]

Hmm.... but numbness only works for 20 seconds according to the wiki?
I've fought many characters pre-patch who cast GMB and sacred oath, I don't recall getting demolished. I've never seen someone cast numbness though.

It always makes me laugh when I see a Havel monster casts GMB and Profound Still at the begining of a fight because I don't use magic or infuse anything.
Pure physical damage FTW.

 

[Newboi]

I finally decided to start actively playing some PvP by going to Iron keep and summoning red phantoms. I've been using the Sunsword +10. It's not the strongest weapon, but it has a pretty fun moveset and the hits do stack up. I should probably start using shadowplay myself because there have been some absolutely hilarious moments in PvP.

 

[Sullichin]

Why not use an arced sword instead of a murakumo to get some strength scaling?

Went ahead and did this. Arced Sword+5 has the same exact attack rating as Murakumo +10 with 40STR/DEX/Ring of Blades+2 (533). They do the same damage on a Heide Knight. They're the exact same weapon except the Arced Sword weighs 2 more

Without Ring of Blades, Arced gets +123 bonus damage and Murakumo +103, but Arced's base rating is 20 points lower so they're the same.

 

[Firebrand]

Thoughts on dualwielding A/B-scaling STR weapons? I pumped up my STR to 45 to dualwield two Lion Greataxes for funsies, but eh, compared to just two-handing one it's +~40% damage at 100% extra stamina cost, not to mention the weight. I'll probably drop the STR down to 40 again and have a shield or something with range as a backup-weapon.

Also thinking about going a bit faith, even though spicing might not be as viable now. Lightning-infusing heavy weapons on a 40 STR build not a terribly great idea now perhaps, even?

just equip it, you'll get a prompt when you're near.

You don't even need to have it equipped to get the prompt, I think. Just has to be in your inventory.

 

[Mistel]

Went ahead and did this. Arced Sword+5 has the same exact attack rating as Murakumo +10 with 40STR/DEX. They do the same damage on a Heide Knight. They're the exact same weapon except the Arced Sword weighs 2 more

So a maxed Murakumo which has 380 with E/A scaling does the exact same damage as a Arced sword +5 with 360 with C/A. How? A 20 base damage difference shouldn't account for that.

Thoughts on dualwielding A/B-scaling STR weapons? I pumped up my STR to 45 to dualwield two Lion Greataxes for funsies, but eh, compared to just two-handing one it's +~40% damage at 100% extra stamina cost, not to mention the weight. I'll probably drop the STR down to 40 again and have a shield or something with range as a backup-weapon.

I use dual gyrm axes instead they've got lower requirments but are heavy but so worth it. Very fun to use weapon.

 

[AlexBasch]

Bought the game yesterday.

Fuuuuuck I'm getting my ass kicked by regular baddies yet I blazed through DaS a few days ago even with the unpatched Xbox version.

So, I know Souls games are better going in blind and shit, but how many levels should I invest in adaptability? I have noticed that despite rolling away I still get hit, is there a link between those things?

 

[Sullichin]

Thoughts on dualwielding A/B-scaling STR weapons? I pumped up my STR to 45 to dualwield two Lion Greataxes for funsies, but eh, compared to just two-handing one it's +~40% damage at 100% extra stamina cost, not to mention the weight. I'll probably drop the STR down to 40 again and have a shield or something with range as a backup-weapon.

Also thinking about going a bit faith, even though spicing might not be as viable now. Lightning-infusing heavy weapons on a 40 STR build not a terribly great idea now perhaps, even?

You don't even need to have it equipped to get the prompt, I think. Just has to be in your inventory.

I can't deal with the stamina cost. Lion Greataxe (singular) is one of my favorite PVP weapons though. Estoc is a pretty good backup weapon.

So a maxed Murakumo which has 380 with E/A scaling does the exact same damage as a Arced sword +5 with 360 with C/A. How? A 20 base damage difference shouldn't account for that.


I use dual gyrm axes instead they've got lower requirments but are heavy but so worth it. Very fun to use weapon.

Yep, Arced gets exactly 20 more points of scaling damage than the Murakumo with 40/40.

 

[Mistel]

Yep, Arced gets exactly 20 more points of scaling damage than the Murakumo with 40/40.

Well that's sucky. Scaling is borked really.

So, I know Souls games are better going in blind and shit, but how many levels should I invest in adaptability? I have noticed that despite rolling away I still get hit, is there a link between those things?

There is a link between them it is good idea to invest points in adaptability.

 

[Xeroblade]

Bought the game yesterday.

Fuuuuuck I'm getting my ass kicked by regular baddies yet I blazed through DaS a few days ago even with the unpatched Xbox version.

So, I know Souls games are better going in blind and shit, but how many levels should I invest in adaptability? I have noticed that despite rolling away I still get hit, is there a link between those things?

Adp you should try to get up to at least 20. so you have close to 90 AGI. but then again the only difference i noticed was that i could drink estus faster, my rolls were the same to me.

 

[Firebrand]

So a maxed Murakumo which has 380 with E/A scaling does the exact same damage as a Arced sword +5 with 360 with C/A. How? A 20 base damage difference shouldn't account for that.


I use dual gyrm axes instead they've got lower requirments but are heavy but so worth it. Very fun to use weapon.

But... Gyrm axes only have single blades... can't deal with it.
I wonder if they mixed up the Gyrm Axe vs Greataxe stat. Greataxe requires 50 STR, weighs 20.0 yet it does less damage than the regular Axe and has D (!) scaling at level 0.

 

[Mistel]

But... Gyrm axes only have single blades... can't deal with it.
I wonder if they mixed up the Gyrm Axe vs Greataxe stat. Greataxe requires 50 STR, weighs 20.0 yet it does less damage than the regular Axe and has D (!) scaling at level 0.

Don't think about touching my Gyrm axes. It is a great weapon I'll be gutted if they alter it an axe with the greataxe move set and that scaling. Sogood.gif

 

[AlexBasch]

Well that's sucky. Scaling is borked really.

There is a link between them it is good idea to invest points in adaptability.

Adp you should try to get up to at least 20. so you have close to 90 AGI. but then again the only difference i noticed was that i could drink estus faster, my rolls were the same to me.

Thank you both, ADP will be my priority then.

I'll go for another DEX character here, but I'm surprised that a Halberd requires so many STR points. It was my favourite weapon in DaS but I'm not sure if I should get STR to 20.

 

[Mistel]

I'll go for another DEX character here, but I'm surprised that a Halberd requires so many STR points. It was my favourite weapon in DaS but I'm not sure if I should get STR to 20.

You should the halberd has a great moveset even better than in dark souls I think. I'd aim for between 95-110 agility myself.

 

[Firebrand]

Thank you both, ADP will be my priority then.

I'll go for another DEX character here, but I'm surprised that a Halberd requires so many STR points. It was my favourite weapon in DaS but I'm not sure if I should get STR to 20.

If the adaptability is really low like the bandit's starting value of 3, yeah, rolling is going to be hard. Not a fan really that you don't _see_ much of a difference.

As for STR, might as well go to 20 and try some weapons, you'll get a few opportunities to respec using

Spoiler

Soul Vessels

.

Important note about the halberd in DS2: You need to actually hit things with the blade. Hugging someone and just hitting R1 will result in you hitting them with the shaft and you'll do really poor damage.

 

[Booshka]

Thank you both, ADP will be my priority then.

I'll go for another DEX character here, but I'm surprised that a Halberd requires so many STR points. It was my favourite weapon in DaS but I'm not sure if I should get STR to 20.

Halberd is a STR scaling weapon in Dark Souls 2, along with the Estoc. So pick up the Halberd and buy the Estoc, upgrade both and level your STR.

There is also a very large STR scaling Halberd later in the game that does some serious damage.

 

[King Gilga]

I'm so SICK to DEATH of farming twinkling titanite for all my fashion souls needs.

Why did they go backwards and not make them buyable from a BS this time?

I've never been more tempted to use a trainer/save editor in my life.

 

[AlexBasch]

Oh, they changed it to be a STR scaling weapon? Well, time to change priorities then. I'm still adapting to the new combat; parries, watching my stamina more carefully and the like.

Just got out of Forest of Fallen Giants.

Spoiler

Man, Last Giant was easy but I kept fucking up in the last part of the battle. Like, going perfect and then one shotted by his damn foot, reminded me a lot of Tower Knight.

 

[-MD-]

So, I know Souls games are better going in blind and shit, but how many levels should I invest in adaptability? I have noticed that despite rolling away I still get hit, is there a link between those things?

I'm no expert but going from 8 to 20 adaptability I noticed a massive difference in being able to dodge attacks.

I think I'm at 22 now and will probably stay there.

 

[Krasnoya Ronin]

So, I know Souls games are better going in blind and shit, but how many levels should I invest in adaptability? I have noticed that despite rolling away I still get hit, is there a link between those things?

Yo, Adaptability isn't the main thing you should be looking at. Check how much it raises Agility (it's also affected by Attunement slightly).

For "Fast-Roll" (under 70% burden), these are the breakpoints:

85 AGL = 8 i-frames.
90 AGL = 9 i-frames.
95 AGL = 10 i-frames.
100 AGL = 12 i-frames.
105 AGL = 13 i-frames.
110 AGL = 13 i-frames.
115 AGL = 15 i-frames.
120 AGL = 16 i-frames.

Remember that rolling distance is not affected by agility, though. It's affected by your equipment burden and seems to scale pretty fluidly with it (i.e. no breakpoints, just a steady ratio). Less equipment burden = More distance covered per roll.

Source: http://darksouls2.wikidot.com/agility (though don't browse around here unless you want to get spoiled).

EDIT: Note that you get 2 i-frames between 95 and 100 AGL, but you don't go over 13 until 115 AGL. This is sort of a point of diminishing returns. Also, in order to get max AGL you need to max out both Adaptability and Attunement, so you'd probably get better benefits elsewhere by leveling other stuff (more attack or spell damage, for example).

 

[Xeroblade]

I'm no expert but going from 8 to 20 adaptability I noticed a massive difference in being able to dodge attacks.

I think I'm at 22 now and will probably stay there.

I think it really all comes down to personal taste. I just know when to roll and have gotten use to having base adp. on 4 of my 5 builds i have 5 or 6 adp. I dodge things left and right. on my other build i have it at 20 and notice only the estus chug is somewhat faster. To me its all on a personal level. Just go with what you are comfortable with.

 

[PranooY]

I just got Santier's spear, broke it. What path is better? Raw or mundane. I heard that mundance scales of the lowest attribute and my lowest is 5 for faith. If so, mundane would suck..

 

[Jackben]

I just got Santier's spear, broke it. What path is better? Raw or mundane. I heard that mundance scales of the lowest attribute and my lowest is 5 for faith. If so, mundane would suck..

Raw unless your lowest stat is at least 20

 

[AlexBasch]

Yo, Adaptability isn't the main thing you should be looking at. Check how much it raises Agility (it's also affected by Attunement slightly).

For "Fast-Roll" (under 70% burden), these are the breakpoints:

85 AGL = 8 i-frames.
90 AGL = 9 i-frames.
95 AGL = 10 i-frames.
100 AGL = 12 i-frames.
105 AGL = 13 i-frames.
110 AGL = 13 i-frames.
115 AGL = 15 i-frames.
120 AGL = 16 i-frames.

Remember that rolling distance is not affected by agility, though. It's affected by your equipment burden and seems to scale pretty fluidly with it (i.e. no breakpoints, just a steady ratio). Less equipment burden = More distance covered per roll.

Source: http://darksouls2.wikidot.com/agility (though don't browse around here unless you want to get spoiled).

EDIT: Note that you get 2 i-frames between 95 and 100 AGL, but you don't go over 13 until 115 AGL. This is sort of a point of diminishing returns. Also, in order to get max AGL you need to max out both Adaptability and Attunement, so you'd probably get better benefits elsewhere by leveling other stuff (more attack or spell damage, for example).

I liked your explanation a lot. I like to mid-fast roll instead of the fastest one myself, but I was weirded out to see that the attacks did damage no matter if I dodged. I just leveled it to 20 and maybe Endurance needs a couple of points now.

Only thing bugging me is that the Halberd and Spear now seem to need more STR than before, so let's see where this takes me.