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Dark Souls III |OT+2| Why Can't We Poise the Game?

So the next patch will increase the amount of arrows/bolts you can carry!

999/999 please? My archer is standing by.
It would be nice for a bow-only run, but I haven't really missed the drop in arrows you can carry, and I've used bows as much as I usually would. I definately think they should have more in storage though, there's no reason to limit that to 99.
 

Alo0oy

Banned
Generalising the the bosses doesn't really aid your point lots of them do have speed and so on just because they're not some demonic ballerina twirling about the place doesn't diminish their abilities.

I wasn't talking about Speed, I was talking about moveset, the bosses in the previous games had an extremely limited moveset, nowhere close to the next gen games.

While I don't want to diminish their influence on the series, I think AGS saying "the enemies in DS3 suck, DS1 though with their 2 move enemies is better" is putting too many blinders on. There's no question the enemies and bosses in DS3 are more complex, it's okay to dislike their design/story...etc, but even the most simple bosses in DS3 are more complex than the most complex DS1 bosses.
 

Alo0oy

Banned
It would be nice for a bow-only run, but I haven't really missed the drop in arrows you can carry, and I've used bows as much as I usually would. I definately think they should have more in storage though, there's no reason to limit that to 99.

I never used more than 99 at once either, but it's still necessary for stocking up on higher tier arrows before going to NG+.

As an accessory, 99 is fine, it's overkill actually, but for a bow only/archer build, 99 is nothing, especially at the start of the game when you only have access to two types of arrows.
 

Ferr986

Member
The bosses are probably the best part about DS3 compared to both DS1 and 2 for me, so I'm surprised to read how they are the worst in the series.
 

Soulhouf

Member
So the next patch will increase the amount of arrows/bolts you can carry!

999/999 please? My archer is standing by.

There is no need to carry more than 99 but the storage capacity must be upgraded to 600 or 999.

The bosses are probably the best part about DS3 compared to both DS1 and 2 for me, so I'm surprised to read how they are the worst in the series.

What I don't like in DS3 bosses is the fact that they are designed to punish your dodges with delayed and other fast attacks.
I think Bloodborne did a better job in that regards without going too far.

My favorite bosses in DS3 are basically designed around a gimmick or a concept:
- Yhorm
- Wolnir
- Old Dragon
- Oceiros
Why? Because they are all very different and they have an interesting thing going on.
 

AXE

Member
The bosses are probably the best part about DS3 compared to both DS1 and 2 for me, so I'm surprised to read how they are the worst in the series.

Dunno man. I just spent some quality time with the Old Demon King, and while I don't usually whine about these things, that boss fight was pure garbage. I had constant problems with the camera and how I seemed to get stuck in almost everything. I died aplenty while not having a clear view to anything but flame and ass. The framerate on PS4 didn't exactly help the matter.

Won the fight when I accepted that the true boss here is the friggin' camera.

That worm boss before the ODK? Parked in front of it while it shot its lazors and just whacked it there without moving. I guess it was glitched or I just happened to stop in one safe spot.

While I adore the Souls games I've kinda had my fill. I appreciate the feeling when you're venturing deep without an idea where the next bonfire might be, but comparing that to the terrible distances to run to the bosses... I've decided I have better things to do with my time.

Its good that they're doing something else.
 

Mistel

Banned
I wasn't talking about Speed, I was talking about moveset, the bosses in the previous games had an extremely limited moveset, nowhere close to the next gen games.
You did with Gunydr that's pretty much all what makes him impressive in the scheme of things his moveset is no more less limited than the Asylum Demon actually champion has less moves overall it just is a faster pace. Fume Knight, Sir Alonne, and Old Ivory King for example all show similar styles of movesets and abilities to that of DS3 bosses.
 
First time posting in this community thread, but I'm a bit of a pickle and I'm looking for some insight. DS3 was the first Souls game I played to completion (basically all zones/bosses, but haven't done my NG+ yet), and I absolutely love the game. I enjoy it enough that I finally wanted to go back and tackle the earlier Souls games because I certainly want "more".

Well, I started DS1 and I absolutely hate it. I don't know what it is, but while it definitely feels like an "older version" of the newest game, which I expect. For some reason, though, I just can't figure out the dodge/roll and it's like I've never played a Souls game before or something all over again. I've only gotten to the Undead Parish, so I'm a few bosses down now.

Should I stick with it or have I just been spoiled by the modern touches put on the latest game(s) in the series? Any other relevant thoughts or advice to share on the matter? Thanks all.
 

Morrigan Stark

Arrogant Smirk
Does people really think Manus was that good or is a matter of «omg sif fights with you!» thing?

The actual king of boss fights in ds1 is Artorias without doubt.
It's funny, on my first character I think I restarted Artorias more often than Manus (and Kalameet most of them but I was trying to get the tail, eventually when I gave that up I killed Kalameet like first try xD), but on my SL1, Artorias was piss-easy (2nd try, would have gotten him first try if I hadn't been sloppy) but Manus took like 50+ tries.

Manus is a damn good fight though, the dark magic phase is a real bitch even with the silver talisman. At SL1 even with upgraded crimson armour and RoFaP for extra HP, it was OHKO on me.

Damn, the Manikin Claws are a DPS machine, even more than the Blades of Mercy I feel.
Ohhh?

Teach me your ways, sempai. I just made a new character using fist weapons. I transferred claws, caestus, and manikin claws down from my first character who isn't using them. And well I'm only as far as the Foot of the High Wall right now, so super early still but I've been using the regular claws (only just raised my dex high enough to wield the Manikin claws and they aren't upgraded), they're at +2, I made them raw for now just for a slight damage boost until my stats catch up, and.... fuck me, but claws suck. :( Bleed takes too long to proc, they have no reach, and their damage output is shite. Same for the caestus except they're somehow worse since they don't bleed, though the buff from the weapon art might be OK (but doesn't last very long?).

I haven't tried the Manikin claws yet though. Right now AR-wise they're lower than the regular claws, but should I abandon the regular claws and keep upgrading the Manikin claws then? What infusion and stats work best for them? I was thinking Sharp/dex, or Refined/Quality, and using L1 combos if they don't completely suck...

tl;dr How do I make claws/fists not suck? Am I just too early in the game for that and I just need to be patient, or is there something I'm missing?
 

Ferr986

Member
There is no need to carry more than 99 but the storage capacity must be upgraded to 600 or 999.



What I don't like in DS3 bosses is the fact that they are designed to punish your dodges with delayed and other fast attacks.
I think Bloodborne did a better job in that regards without going too far.

I actually like bosses that can delay attacks, it makes them more variable, thus more fun on repeats. I still remember Sir Alonne and his mindtricks delaying or speeding up his thrusts.

Dunno man. I just spent some quality time with the Old Demon King, and while I don't usually whine about these things, that boss fight was pure garbage. I had constant problems with the camera and how I seemed to get stuck in almost everything. I died aplenty while not having a clear view to anything but flame and ass. The framerate on PS4 didn't exactly help the matter.

Won the fight when I accepted that the true boss here is the friggin' camera.

That worm boss before the ODK? Parked in front of it while it shot its lazors and just whacked it there without moving. I guess it was glitched or I just happened to stop in one safe spot.

While I adore the Souls games I've kinda had my fill. I appreciate the feeling when you're venturing deep without an idea where the next bonfire might be, but comparing that to the terrible distances to run to the bosses... I've decided I have better things to do with my time.

Its good that they're doing something else.

Even though I agree, camera has been always a problem since DS1, and it will still be a problem every time you face a big boss.

I agree than NK dragon is the worst offender yet, hated that phase. But that stuff also happened with older Souls and BB bosses (Cleric Beast and Amelia).

First time posting in this community thread, but I'm a bit of a pickle and I'm looking for some insight. DS3 was the first Souls game I played to completion (basically all zones/bosses, but haven't done my NG+ yet), and I absolutely love the game. I enjoy it enough that I finally wanted to go back and tackle the earlier Souls games because I certainly want "more".

Well, I started DS1 and I absolutely hate it. I don't know what it is, but while it definitely feels like an "older version" of the newest game, which I expect. For some reason, though, I just can't figure out the dodge/roll and it's like I've never played a Souls game before or something all over again. I've only gotten to the Undead Parish, so I'm a few bosses down now.

Should I stick with it or have I just been spoiled by the modern touches put on the latest game(s) in the series? Any other relevant thoughts or advice to share on the matter? Thanks all.

Totally normal that you have problems to adapt to DS1 roll. DS1 has 4way roll while locking on instead of 8 like DS2 oor 3, so rolling is more sluggish.

DS1 excels on level design though. It's just in another league compared to the rest of the series. It's truly more Castlevania like, with more areas interconnected between them.

I would say give it another chance, but I could understand that you feel the game too dated now gameplay-wise.
 

Soulhouf

Member
tl;dr How do I make claws/fists not suck? Am I just too early in the game for that and I just need to be patient, or is there something I'm missing?

I only tried Caestus and by dual wielding them you can chain 15 attacks in a row or so which will stagger and destroy any humanoid enemy. I remember the Lothric red eye knights being a joke in NG+2 with a raw Caestus.
 

Screaming Meat

Unconfirmed Member
tl;dr How do I make claws/fists not suck? Am I just too early in the game for that and I just need to be patient, or is there something I'm missing?

Claws have slow wind-ups on all their opening moves which can be tricky to get used to. Shields are troublesome too - they stagger you - so wait for openings before going full Wolverine! I find Manikin the best due to QS. The roll and running attacks are really good; the former has a double roll before the strike which can be directed. The claws work really well with Luck/Bleed builds and Carthus Rouge, as well as the Pontiff rings and Carthus Beacon stacking. Get some formidable damage that way. Sharp and Hollow infusions worked well for me at different stages.

I haven't got the hang of them in PvP quite yet.
 
About the Falcon Shield - I wanted to farm a raw gem from the hollows in HWoL, the shield was the only item discovery related equipment I have at present. From the first bonfire I killed the archer, the two non-hostile hollows and the axe one that walked up the stairs and got two raw gems. Not conclusive, but I choose to believe it saved me time farming!
 
With the existence of the Refined Gem, what is the point of doing a pure STR or DEX build? It seems like a quality 40/40 build lets you wield pretty much any weapon, and make it viable with a Refined Gem. So why would you do a pure build? Am I missing something here?
 

Amirnol

Member
Want to try a Cleric/Paladin STR/FTH build, giant hammers/axes/swords and miracles for support. Any advice or suggestions?
 

Morrigan Stark

Arrogant Smirk
Claws have slow wind-ups on all their opening moves which can be tricky to get used to. Shields are troublesome too - they stagger you - so wait for openings before going full Wolverine! I find Manikin the best due to QS. The roll and running attacks are really good; the former has a double roll before the strike which can be directed. The claws work really well with Luck/Bleed builds and Carthus Rouge, as well as the Pontiff rings and Carthus Beacon stacking. Get some formidable damage that way. Sharp and Hollow infusions worked well for me at different stages.

I haven't got the hang of them in PvP quite yet.
Good stuff, thanks. As I suspected it might take some time to get going, as Carthus Rouge and those rings are not immediately available.
What is QS (re: Manikin claw) btw?

I'll probably go Quality on this build since I want to use both Caestus and claws (maybe Demon's Fists eventually, they any good?) for... roleplay reasons. ^^

How to use caestus:

1) Press L2 before receiving an attack

2) ATATATATATATA

3) ?????

4) Profit
So far this has been underwhelming though since damage output is so low. Guess I need to be patient... or get my friend to transfer some Carthus Rouge but you can only carry 5 at a time alas...
 

Ferr986

Member
With the existence of the Refined Gem, what is the point of doing a pure STR or DEX build? It seems like a quality 40/40 build lets you wield pretty much any weapon, and make it viable with a Refined Gem. So why would you do a pure build? Am I missing something here?

Only if you want to use a higher than 40 weapon. Like the FUGS and... dunno what more now.

Otherwise no point, yeah.
 
I just noticed the warcry de-buffs your weapon, at least with Magic Weapon :/


With the existence of the Refined Gem, what is the point of doing a pure STR or DEX build? It seems like a quality 40/40 build lets you wield pretty much any weapon, and make it viable with a Refined Gem. So why would you do a pure build? Am I missing something here?
Scaling is probably better for high-end STR or DEX builds, rather than making the same weapon quality.
 
It's funny, on my first character I think I restarted Artorias more often than Manus (and Kalameet most of them but I was trying to get the tail, eventually when I gave that up I killed Kalameet like first try xD), but on my SL1, Artorias was piss-easy (2nd try, would have gotten him first try if I hadn't been sloppy) but Manus took like 50+ tries.

Manus is a damn good fight though, the dark magic phase is a real bitch even with the silver talisman. At SL1 even with upgraded crimson armour and RoFaP for extra HP, it was OHKO on me.
I have yet to beat Artorias, Manus, Kalameet, and Gwyn on my SL 1. I could probably kill Gwyn, but it goes into NG+ right away which sucks. But before DaS 3 came out I decided to play DaS 1...I one shot Kalameet, Artorias, and Manus. Either I got significantly better, or they got nerfed to hell :/.
 
Good stuff, thanks. As I suspected it might take some time to get going, as Carthus Rouge and those rings are not immediately available.
What is QS (re: Manikin claw) btw?

I'll probably go Quality on this build since I want to use both Caestus and claws (maybe Demon's Fists eventually, they any good?) for... roleplay reasons. ^^


So far this has been underwhelming though since damage output is so low. Guess I need to be patient... or get my friend to transfer some Carthus Rouge but you can only carry 5 at a time alas...

I recommend, going very low on equipment load and using Flynn's Ring, the damage boost you get helps a lot early in the game. I'm doing a cestus only character and it gets better over time, obviously you absolutly suck on PvP lol.

Want to try a Cleric/Paladin STR/FTH build, giant hammers/axes/swords and miracles for support. Any advice or suggestions?

Morne's Greathammer was made for this.
 

Tarkus

Member
About the Falcon Shield - I wanted to farm a raw gem from the hollows in HWoL, the shield was the only item discovery related equipment I have at present. From the first bonfire I killed the archer, the two non-hostile hollows and the axe one that walked up the stairs and got two raw gems. Not conclusive, but I choose to believe it saved me time farming!
BELIEVE
 
About the Falcon Shield - I wanted to farm a raw gem from the hollows in HWoL, the shield was the only item discovery related equipment I have at present. From the first bonfire I killed the archer, the two non-hostile hollows and the axe one that walked up the stairs and got two raw gems. Not conclusive, but I choose to believe it saved me time farming!

Go fourth Falcon, continue your majestic journey!
 

Morrigan Stark

Arrogant Smirk
I recommend, going very low on equipment load and using Flynn's Ring, the damage boost you get helps a lot early in the game. I'm doing a cestus only character and it gets better over time, obviously you absolutly suck on PvP lol.
Yeah I thought of that since my character wears little armour (again for RP/character accuracy reasons) so I'm definitely trying that ring once I get it.

This is a co-op run with a friend and we plan on having the dried finger active at all times (for invasions, not additional phantoms) so it's too bad it sucks at PvP but we should manage.

My friend will use the partizan and Avelyn. Anyone care to guess our characters? :)

Morne's Greathammer was made for this.
Too bad it has 0 scaling with faith despite the hefty requirements... :(
 
Yeah I thought of that since my character wears little armour (again for RP/character accuracy reasons) so I'm definitely trying that ring once I get it.

This is a co-op run with a friend and we plan on having the dried finger active at all times (for invasions, not additional phantoms) so it's too bad it sucks at PvP but we should manage.

My friend will use the partizan and Avelyn. Anyone care to guess our characters? :)


Too bad it has 0 scaling with faith despite the hefty requirements... :(

The problem with caestus, early, is that is damage is quite low, and won't reach maximum potential until full upgrade + scaling. So you'll need a tons of hits to get a kill, is quite fun though. L2 is your best tool, with some ingenious use, you can get several hits on enemies, is basically hyperarmor on demand.

Regarding Morne's, well it dosn't scale with FTH, but I'll say the weapon is powerful enough, and dat battle art is godly.
 

Mist

Banned
Anyone knows any fun Dex/Faith PvP build (or any other kind of build for that matter)? Going around as Artorias is kind of getting boring now.
 

Alo0oy

Banned
Ohhh?

Teach me your ways, sempai. I just made a new character using fist weapons. I transferred claws, caestus, and manikin claws down from my first character who isn't using them. And well I'm only as far as the Foot of the High Wall right now, so super early still but I've been using the regular claws (only just raised my dex high enough to wield the Manikin claws and they aren't upgraded), they're at +2, I made them raw for now just for a slight damage boost until my stats catch up, and.... fuck me, but claws suck. :( Bleed takes too long to proc, they have no reach, and their damage output is shite. Same for the caestus except they're somehow worse since they don't bleed, though the buff from the weapon art might be OK (but doesn't last very long?).

I haven't tried the Manikin claws yet though. Right now AR-wise they're lower than the regular claws, but should I abandon the regular claws and keep upgrading the Manikin claws then? What infusion and stats work best for them? I was thinking Sharp/dex, or Refined/Quality, and using L1 combos if they don't completely suck...

tl;dr How do I make claws/fists not suck? Am I just too early in the game for that and I just need to be patient, or is there something I'm missing?

The best build for Manikin Claws is a luck/dex build (40/40 ideally), they proc bleed extremely fast, I was procing Gundyr every 5-6 hits or so, and considering how fast they are, you'd see the health bar emptying very fast.

They're also great with resin because resin adds flat 80 AR, which is great for fast weapons like the Manikin Claws, I used gold resin on Soul of Cinder and his health bar was melting, you need to practice quickstep with it to make best use of it, it has very long iframes and consumes no stamina, be very aggressive, keep QSing and attacking at all times, for some reason they stunlock black knights better than other lighter weapons.

Carry a spear with you as a back up weapon, and infuse both with Hollow gems to get the extra 10 luck.

They're very OP when you're cooping, if the other player can draw the boss's aggro, you can keep doing L1 combos and QSing towards the boss everytime he moves, and watch as his health bar completely evaporates. Avoid getting hit though because almost all attacks after quicksteps count as counter attacks so they do extra damage.
 

Alo0oy

Banned
Anyone knows any fun Dex/Faith PvP build (or any other kind of build for that matter)? Going around as Artorias is kind of getting boring now.

Dragonslayer Swordspear, 40/40 DEX/FTH. Does better damage than all other spears, and you have access to miracles to boot.
 
Totally normal that you have problems to adapt to DS1 roll. DS1 has 4way roll while locking on instead of 8 like DS2 oor 3, so rolling is more sluggish.

DS1 excels on level design though. It's just in another league compared to the rest of the series. It's truly more Castlevania like, with more areas interconnected between them.

I would say give it another chance, but I could understand that you feel the game too dated now gameplay-wise.

Ok...that makes me feel a bit better. I sure want to get into this game, as I've read/heard so many things about DS1 being the best of the bunch. Thanks for the reply, and I'll definitely give it another go. I figure this will be similar to DS3 for me, in that once I break through the proverbial "wall", it'll open up the game and pull me in.
 

Alo0oy

Banned
Damn, too bad I chose the Storm Curved Sword already. How would the normal Dragonslayer Spear do?

It's very good, but it's better suited for a quality build because the faith scaling is bad.

The swordspear has equal dex and faith scaling.

EDIT: or you can use Sunlight Blade with sharp Gotthard Twinswords, AR should be 500+.
 

Screaming Meat

Unconfirmed Member
Good stuff, thanks. As I suspected it might take some time to get going, as Carthus Rouge and those rings are not immediately available.
What is QS (re: Manikin claw) btw?

I'll probably go Quality on this build since I want to use both Caestus and claws (maybe Demon's Fists eventually, they any good?) for... roleplay reasons. ^^

QS = Quick Step :)

Yeah, it took time but I think I got pretty much everything bar Hollow infusion in place by the time I reached Irithyll (without completing Cathedral of the Deep).
 

Kieli

Member
Ok...that makes me feel a bit better. I sure want to get into this game, as I've read/heard so many things about DS1 being the best of the bunch. Thanks for the reply, and I'll definitely give it another go. I figure this will be similar to DS3 for me, in that once I break through the proverbial "wall", it'll open up the game and pull me in.

If you came from BB and DSIII, it may take some time to get used to. In some ways, DS will feel antiquated due to lacking some of the QoL features such as 8-way roll, stat respec, multi-item use (like popping 10 souls at once), and heat-up mechanic.

It's how I felt going from DS to DeS; I felt DeS was a little raw and DS a bit more refined.
 

Alo0oy

Banned
QS = Quick Step :)

Yeah, it took time but I think I got pretty much everything bar Hollow infusion in place by the time I reached Irithyll (without completing Cathedral of the Deep).

Yeah, I think hollow is the best infusion for fist weapons because you get 10 free stat points as well as extra damage from strength investment, you don't need more than 30 endurance, so raising strength to ~25 helps when combined with 40/40 dex/luck.
 

Screaming Meat

Unconfirmed Member
Yeah, I think hollow is the best infusion for fist weapons because you get 10 free stat points as well as extra damage from strength investment, you don't need more than 30 endurance, so raising strength to ~25 helps when combined with 40/40 dex/luck.

Definitely. The extra Luck works well (albeit only a little) with the bleed metre shenanigans too. The Pontiff/Beacon stack is beastly once you get it going and that works really well with fast weapon/bleed builds.

It's the PvP side of things I haven't got the hang of with Manikin. I think I've won only a handful of fights, where Warden TB's usually net me some good streaks. I'll workout out eventually.

How's your katana build (that was you, right)?
 
So finally about to jump into DS3 after preordering it. Plan on going with a standard one hand / shield build with a touch of magic for ranged. In DS1 & DS2 I just went with pyromancy and ignored all other types of magic pretty much.

Would that be the safest way to go here as well? Any tips for stat leveling? Was planning on just dumping points into VIT & END until I have a weapon or two I like. Also note I play PvE exclusively and pretty much never summon for help if that makes a difference.

Any broad tips would be greatly appreciated, thanks.
 

Alo0oy

Banned
Definitely. The extra Luck works well (albeit only a little) with the bleed metre shenanigans too. The Pontiff/Beacon stack is beastly once you get it going and that works really well with fast weapon/bleed builds.

It's the PvP side of things I haven't got the hang of with Manikin. I think I've won only a handful of fights, where Warden TB's usually net me some good streaks. I'll workout out eventually.

How's your katana build (that was you, right)?

Didn't work out, Darkdrift does no damage and the black blade has shitty range, so I abandoned the build.

I hope Darkdrift gets a buff because the current situation is unacceptable

Sec and Thanks.

It's up (Jesus)

GG, that was a good fight.
 

laxu

Member
So finally about to jump into DS3 after preordering it. Plan on going with a standard one hand / shield build with a touch of magic for ranged. In DS1 & DS2 I just went with pyromancy and ignored all other types of magic pretty much.

Would that be the safest way to go here as well? Any tips for stat leveling? Was planning on just dumping points into VIT & END until I have a weapon or two I like. Also note I play PvE exclusively and pretty much never summon for help if that makes a difference.

Any broad tips would be greatly appreciated, thanks.

I use pyromancy on both of my characters. One started as a pyromancer and the other as an assassin. The assassin is a really good starter as you get good starting stats and gear.

I'd dump some points into STR and DEX as well as the game has plenty of fairly resilient enemies right from the start.

You should use at least NPC summons as they can give you gestures upon summoning. If you don't want to use them against a boss you can just summon them and kill yourself after you receive their gestures although there are a few summons that yield items if they survive a boss fight.

The online mode is actually lots of fun so don't knock it till you try it.
 

laxu

Member
Is it possible to kill
Lord of Cinder
and not link the flame but just return to firelink shrine? I'm still deciding what ending I want and if I should cure my hollowing since who knows what we will get in the DLC (Londor for example).
 

SDR-UK

Member
Is it possible to kill
Lord of Cinder
and not link the flame but just return to firelink shrine? I'm still deciding what ending I want and if I should cure my hollowing since who knows what we will get in the DLC (Londor for example).

Entirely possible. Just walk out afterwards.
 
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