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Dark Souls |OT5| Definitely better than the sequel

J

JudgmentJay

Member
Man, what's up with the online connectivity? Started playing today at the beginning of Sen's and played through the end of Anor Londo (NG+) without quitting the game or reloading. As soon as I reached the bonfire past the archers in Anor Londo, I was getting invaded non-stop. Didn't even have to use the Dried Finger... it was one after another. I got invaded about 8 times in the span of 30 minutes. Then I got the stupid bonfire bug where I was stuck sitting, so I had to alt-f4. Came back into the game, and nothing... no invasions, no messages, no bloodstains, nothing. Frustrating... I was enjoying the PvP.
 
R

Red Liquorice

Member
AlexSA2 said:
Also disappointed that there were no big changes for NG+. Only things I noticed is that there's a caster in the sewer section (you know that area right after the giant rat and there's trap doors that drop you down?) along with a couple of rats. I discovered that the hard way when I fell through a trap door and made it the boss but the caster was there being an annoying ass. Only other thing I noticed is that the Knights of the Abyss do more damage and cannot be cheesed with a Havel build.

I hate to say it but compared to DS2 where NG+ and so on are significantly different with more enemies and an extra surprise or two. I think DS2 has the better NG+.
Click to expand...
The Channeller in the Depths is in regular NG too. This was one of the things they added and improved on in DS2, adding extra enemies to NG+.

The 4 Kings is one of my favourites fights now I dodge rather than tank, I think it makes fighting them in NG+ onwards far easier. I guess it depends on your stats, but my last playthrough I was SL60 so I couldn't afford to tank even if I wanted.
 
E

ElTopo

Banned
Red Liquorice said:
The 4 Kings is one of my favourites fights now I dodge rather than tank, I think it makes fighting them in NG+ onwards far easier. I guess it depends on your stats, but my last playthrough I was SL60 so I couldn't afford to tank even if I wanted.
Click to expand...

It's an epic fight but I don't know if I like it or not. That AOE and grab attack really takes the fun out of it and having to deal with multiple Knights who can cheap shot you...

It's one of those bosses that I really don't know whether to call bad or great.
 
E

ElTopo

Banned
Stormtrooper said:
So making rather broad statements earlier then without actually experiencing everything then?
Click to expand...

I like the challenge. I don't enjoy PVP (with delay based netcode on top of that) and see no value in summoning.

tumblr_m9wuqazpMJ1qhwf9n.gif
 
M

Mistel

Banned
AlexSA2 said:
I like the challenge. I don't enjoy PVP (with delay based netcode on top of that) and see no value in summoning.
Click to expand...
You do know that the story based invasions which provide story content are not actually over online, right? Summoning and actual pvp is fine not to enjoy or use it's not mandatory.
 
R

Red Liquorice

Member
AlexSA2 said:
It's an epic fight but I don't know if I like it or not. That AOE and grab attack really takes the fun out of it and having to deal with multiple Knights who can cheap shot you...

It's one of those bosses that I really don't know whether to call bad or great.
Click to expand...
The AoE and grab attacks can definately be the downfall of tanking in that fight. 3 fast rolls backwards will get you out and back in in time. Once you know the telltale signs of their 3 different sword attacks they're easy to dodge.

It can be unfair sometimes when a second king comes in and stabs you in the back, this only happened to me though when I rolled too far away from the current king I was attacking, if you stay close any other kings will usually just hang back. I'm not bragging when I say I just did this on NG+8 a couple of weeks back, I hit a wall with tanking them in NG+2 or 3 and if I wanted to continue (I did!) I had to learn to dodge their attacks, it took many failed attempts but I got it down and it felt amazing.

I get that feeling from all 3 Souls games, that's what a lot of us love about the series I think - overcoming those huge obstacles, finding your own method, equipment, spells, weapon etc to take down that big fucker that's been blocking your progress! :)
 
E

ElTopo

Banned
I did not tank that fight in NG+ (I don't even think it's possible to do so in NG+ and beyond) and I had a fast roll. Sometimes when I dodged 3 times away I got away and sometimes I got grabbed. It was pretty random.
 
O

Orochinagis

Member
AlexSA2 said:
I hate to say it but compared to DS2 where NG+ and so on are significantly different with more enemies and an extra surprise or two. I think DS2 has the better NG+.
Click to expand...

Outside the new enemy type in the beginning of NG+ there is no real change like Dark Souls 2 just a bunch of red phantoms, maybe freya.
 
M

Morrigan Stark

Arrogant Smirk
Orochinagis said:
Outside the new enemy type in the beginning of NG+ there is no real change like Dark Souls 2 just a bunch of red phantoms, maybe freya.
Click to expand...
"just a bunch of red phantoms" is a significant difference, compared to the previous games. They certainly caused quite a few surprises on my end. And don't forget
the Pursuers duo
!

In fact DS2's NG+ is pretty much "surprise, motherfucker!" in a nutshell. xD
 
O

Orochinagis

Member
Morrigan Stark said:
"just a bunch of red phantoms" is a significant difference, compared to the previous games. They certainly caused quite a few surprises on my end. And don't forget
the Pursuers duo
!

In fact DS2's NG+ is pretty much "surprise, motherfucker!" in a nutshell. xD
Click to expand...

Ah dont remind me those guys with the magic resistance to the clouds.
 
B

Booshka

Member
SonicXtreme said:
Screw it I'm taking my lv 70 to meta. Currently I'm at 30 vit, 16 att, 22 end, 27 str, 9 dex, 8 int, and 30 fth. Got 50 levels to play with, what do you guys think? This char uses the butchers knife 15, sunlight blade, wotg, gmb, and great combustion, with power within in my darkmoon ring slot for the lucky first customer. Obviously 10 or 20 on vit, 40 end is a pretty easy decision, still 8 levels left then. I fell like more faith is dumb because spells run out when I defend my territory in the forest (that's all this guy is for). I could go ng + and grab more copies of the offensive spells I'm using, but they'll still run out so thats dumb too. Str seems silly since butchers knife is getting max bonus from my 2 hand isn't it? Am I best served by just pumping end?

also are there other weapons that are as dubious as the butcher knife in PVP? I haven't stopped using it since i started digging into it a week or two ago and its insane. no one knows how to fight it. all the BS fishers just get 180d and slashed when they think they're gonna get a BS. its fast enough for me to WOTG > start whaling on the tankers. light enough that with 27 str i can still grass shield parry the spammers. the 30 faith with GMB just means game over for the magic spammers. even if i get caught in a 2 on 1 i can feign 2hr2 and switch direction to the second guy who will always go in for a BS, stun him with the shocking 180 slam then i can break off a WOTG and take down his buddy who will close in for the kill every time. i've 1 on 2'd so many people with these tools. this build is nasty. just gotta figure out how to cap it off to meta because its already been so powerful since like level 50

its actually really liberating being limited with 8 int (no bellowing) and 9 dex (no go to crutches like the zwei), i definitely have more fun with characters that are more limited in choice. never would've mained the butcher without doing that.
Click to expand...

Not sure what you ended up doing with your stat allocation, but other 27 STR weapons worth trying would be, Large Club and Great Club (2H only), Man Serpent Greatsword, Demon Great Machete (2H only, make this beast Crystal), Pickaxe and Mace. All really strong weapons 2 handed with 27 STR. Large Club and Man Serpent Greatsword have solid 1 handed movesets, although Large Club is only good for the unlocked R2's and poison stack with Poison Resin. Otherwise Great Club 2 handed is stronger.

If you want, you can up your STR to 34 and Dex to 10 ( I won't tell anyone you leveled that up) to mess around with 50 STR Dragon Weapons. Can also use the Demon's Great Axe.

Cool that you are digging the Butcher Knife, I've never gotten into the moveset, and the damage has always been severely underwhelming for its weight. I do like the speed though.
 
S

Snacks the sober sea lion

Member
I'm on NG++ with the first character I beat the game with, using Murakumo this time. Rolled
Lautrec
and his cronies with just two-handed R1.

And I've been trying to get good screenshots of Ash Lake. Need to run away quicker so I can get the whole thing in the picture.
Spoiler
That thing is actually pretty intimidating even though I've killed it at least 3 times. Really sucks that Dark Souls 2 has no hidden lore area like Ash Lake or anything nearly the scale of the hydra
 
E

ElTopo

Banned
Forgot to mention this: when I was fighting Seek in NG+ I ran past a few of the clam monsters and there was no fog door. So when I fought Seek they just walked right in and I couldn't see them because they were right behind him and I was murdered. The next time I made sure to kill all of them but I did notice a fog door that time.
 
S

SonicXtreme

Member
AlexSA2 said:
Forgot to mention this: when I was fighting Seek in NG+ I ran past a few of the clam monsters and there was no fog door. So when I fought Seek they just walked right in and I couldn't see them because they were right behind him and I was murdered. The next time I made sure to kill all of them but I did notice a fog door that time.
Click to expand...
The fog doesn't show up on your first encounter with him in the caves.
 
R

Red Liquorice

Member
Yeah I always do a run down to Seath to put up the fog gate and bone out, maybe not on NG, but NG+ onwards at low level it's one hit kill from anything he does.
 
E

ElTopo

Banned
On NG++ now. I think after this I'm going to put it down until the final patch is out.

I will list another negative comparison to DS2 in that I think DS1 is far more linear especially on NG+. You still can't go to the Catacombs, I mean you can kill the boss there but you still have to find your way out because you can't fight Gravelord yet. You can't go to Londo Ruins. You can't access the Artorias DLC yet. You can probably skip Moonlight Butterfly and the Hydra if you're ballsy. But that's about it.

On the plus side you can fight Sif really early on and get that going.
 
Tarkus

Tarkus

Member
AlexSA2 said:
On NG++ now. I think after this I'm going to put it down until the final patch is out.

I will list another negative comparison to DS2 in that I think DS1 is far more linear especially on NG+. You still can't go to the Catacombs, I mean you can kill the boss there but you still have to find your way out because you can't fight Gravelord yet. You can't go to Londo Ruins. You can't access the Artorias DLC yet. You can probably skip Moonlight Butterfly and the Hydra if you're ballsy. But that's about it.

On the plus side you can fight Sif really early on and get that going.
Click to expand...
You can complete New Londo Ruins up to the point of the Four Kings. Now that you've killed Sif, you can comeplete NLR.

Skipping Moonlight and Hydra is easy...don't kill them. Nothing ballsy about that. Neither impede your path and there are no consequences for skipping.
 
E

ElTopo

Banned
SourShoes said:
You can complete New Londo Ruins up to the point of the Four Kings. Now that you've killed Sif, you can comeplete NLR.
Click to expand...

I thought as much. Still, avoiding the Hydra to get to the Artorias DLC is still risky because of those fireballs. I killed the Hydra just to make it easier.
 
R

RedSwirl

Junior Member
So I finally started NG+ and am realizing my Black Knight Halberd +5 was overpowered for Taurus Demon and the Gargoyles. Enemies dish out a lot more damage but most early-game dudes go down almost effortlessly. I think I'm gonna try to skip through New Londo Ruins and Valley of the Drakes to see if I'm gangsta enough for Blighttown and Quaelag. At what point in NG+ should I start being worried (at soul level 104)?
 
Tarkus

Tarkus

Member
AlexSA2 said:
I thought as much. Still, avoiding the Hydra to get to the Artorias DLC is still risky because of those fireballs. I killed the Hydra just to make it easier.
Click to expand...
To save you some trouble, make sure you have placed the Lordvessel and have gotten the pendant when you save Dusk. NG++ AotA is going to be tough.

RedSwirl said:
So I finally started NG+ and am realizing my Black Knight Halberd +5 was overpowered for Taurus Demon and the Gargoyles. Enemies dish out a lot more damage but most early-game dudes go down almost effortlessly. I think I'm gonna try to skip through New Londo Ruins and Valley of the Drakes to see if I'm gangsta enough for Blighttown and Quaelag. At what point in NG+ should I start being worried (at soul level 104)?
Click to expand...
Quelaag might give you some trouble soloing her at your soul level. It's a bit low for NG+, but if you're "gangsta" enough, then you shouldn't have much trouble until Anor Londo. Everything hits harder, so pump your Vitality if you haven't done so. Maybe pump up Endurance so you can fast roll with heavier armor.
 
M

Mistel

Banned
AlexSA2 said:
I thought as much. Still, avoiding the Hydra to get to the Artorias DLC is still risky because of those fireballs. I killed the Hydra just to make it easier.
Click to expand...
You can't access the dlc without killing the hydra as it then makes the golden golem spawn.
 
O

Orochinagis

Member
AlexSA2 said:
On NG++ now. I think after this I'm going to put it down until the final patch is out.

I will list another negative comparison to DS2 in that I think DS1 is far more linear especially on NG+. You still can't go to the Catacombs, I mean you can kill the boss there but you still have to find your way out because you can't fight Gravelord yet. You can't go to Londo Ruins. You can't access the Artorias DLC yet. You can probably skip Moonlight Butterfly and the Hydra if you're ballsy. But that's about it.
Click to expand...

What
 
M

Morrigan Stark

Arrogant Smirk
You can backtrack out of the Tomb of the Giants on foot, so it's untrue that you can't go to the Catacombs. In fact I often do that to get the Rite of Kindling early. And you can clear all of New Londo except the boss, which only needs Sif. With the master key (which you should definitely have for NG+), you can skip Taurus, Capra, Gaping Demon, and most of Blighttown very easily.


So yeah, I don't know what AlexSA2 is talking about either.
 
E

ElTopo

Banned
Not liking the DS1 community as much as DS2. DS1 guys seem very anal retentive.

Anywho, beat Knights of the Abyss on my first try on NG++. So there's that.
 
M

Mistel

Banned
AlexSA2 said:
Not liking the DS1 community as much as DS2. DS1 guys seem very anal retentive.
Click to expand...
In this case nobody is being anally retentive at all, you just made an incorrect statement which was then corrected about the linear nature of NG+. That if anything is a far greater criticism of the second game.
 
E

ElTopo

Banned
SourShoes said:
You beat Artorias on your first try?
Click to expand...

I clearly said Knights of the Abyss. But for the record I did beat Artorias on my first try on my 1st play through in my slow ass tank build. I beat him a 2nd time with my lighter build on my 2nd play through. He's really easy.
 
M

Morrigan Stark

Arrogant Smirk
AlexSA2 said:
I clearly said Knights of the Abyss.
Click to expand...
Well, SourShoes was being facetious, but really, the only boss that can be called a "knight of the Abyss" is Artorias. You probably meant the Four Kings, but I'm sure you'll think the correction is "being pedantic" again (even though that's what they're called and all)...
 
M

Mistel

Banned
Morrigan Stark said:
I don't really see how, but whatever.
Click to expand...
All it is unlike with how you mentioned previously with what you can do with the master key in NG+ and effectively only be stopped by all three orange gates before reaching the lordvessel and placing it. Same applies to a first playthrough if you really want it to. In 2 you have far less choice as you cannot access as large a variety of the games base areas without getting a yore branch to get to the shaded woods this is the same for every playthrough. Unlike the first where you could effectively go right to demon ruins if you really wanted to with 2 you are limited to always head to shaded woods if you want to continue due to the lack of interconnectivity between the world itself with the four branches that really go nowhere.

There's also the much more linear endgame without even touching on the mechanisms for shrine winter. Granted there is some variety with what you can do with post kings ring such as the twins before either of the other two king doors, but you still have to go through all the steps to get the giants kingship for the final story boss which makes the progression very linear as there is really only one way to go. In the first although it shares a similar structure it still has more variety for what you can do and access and what order you complete it in.

That is why I personally see 2 as more linear as 1 with terms with progression.
 
Tarkus

Tarkus

Member
AlexSA2 said:
I clearly said Knights of the Abyss. But for the record I did beat Artorias on my first try on my 1st play through in my slow ass tank build. I beat him a 2nd time with my lighter build on my 2nd play through. He's really easy.
Click to expand...
No one in the Abyss is a knight except Artorias.

You beat Manus on your first playthrough in NG++?? You da man! And you even had to ask for help in this thread about where the Very Large Ember was just the other day so you could ascend your weapon. And you cleared the DLC in <2 hrs on NG++? LEGEND! You need to record an SL 1 run and show us how it's done. We must bask in your incredible skills. "Londo Ruins" and "Knights of the Abyss" with being "ballsy" and skipping Moonlight and Hydra as part of DS1's stupid linear progression compared to DS2's. GOAT
 
S

SeventhSon

Member
RedSwirl said:
So I finally started NG+ and am realizing my Black Knight Halberd +5 was overpowered for Taurus Demon and the Gargoyles. Enemies dish out a lot more damage but most early-game dudes go down almost effortlessly. I think I'm gonna try to skip through New Londo Ruins and Valley of the Drakes to see if I'm gangsta enough for Blighttown and Quaelag. At what point in NG+ should I start being worried (at soul level 104)?
Click to expand...

You're the perfect level for all of NG+.
 
E

ElTopo

Banned
SourShoes said:
No one in the Abyss is a knight except Artorias.

You beat Manus on your first playthrough in NG++?? You da man! And you even had to ask for help in this thread about where the Very Large Ember was just the other day so you could ascend your weapon. And you cleared the DLC in <2 hrs on NG++? LEGEND! You need to record an SL 1 run and show us how it's done. We must bask in your incredible skills. "Londo Ruins" and "Knights of the Abyss" with being "ballsy" and skipping Moonlight and Hydra as part of DS1's stupid linear progression compared to DS2's. GOAT
Click to expand...

You forgot this:

3zzX0ru.png
 
Soleil rouge

Soleil rouge

Member
Are there cheaters/hackers in this game?

I was invaded twice in the Depths. The first guy took 98% of my life in one strike, but he did hit me cleanly; don't think he was cheating. The second guy, however, was pulling off the backstab move with ease, even when he was in front of me. If he got within 3 feet, it was an automatic backstab. So annoying.
 
F

Fotheringay

Member
Soleil rouge said:
Are there cheaters/hackers in this game?

I was invaded twice in the Depths. The first guy took 98% of my life in one strike, but he did hit me cleanly; don't think he was cheating. The second guy, however, was pulling off the backstab move with ease, even when he was in front of me. If he got within 3 feet, it was an automatic backstab. So annoying.
Click to expand...

There's always been hacking, and incredibly poor netcode at times, but now with the migration off of GFWL it's incredibly easy to just download a save editor and fuck with everything.
 
O

Orochinagis

Member
Soleil rouge said:
Are there cheaters/hackers in this game?

I was invaded twice in the Depths. The first guy took 98% of my life in one strike, but he did hit me cleanly; don't think he was cheating. The second guy, however, was pulling off the backstab move with ease, even when he was in front of me. If he got within 3 feet, it was an automatic backstab. So annoying.
Click to expand...

You forgot to tell us in what platform you are playing but maybe you were invaded by an overgeared player
 
Soleil rouge

Soleil rouge

Member
Orochinagis said:
You forgot to tell us in what platform you are playing but maybe you were invaded by an overgeared player
Click to expand...

Yeah, forgot about that. I'm on PC.

So it's possible to pull off a backstab while being in front of your opponent? I've just started playing and I love the game. Just a little salty about being invaded, lol.
 
O

Orochinagis

Member
Soleil rouge said:
Yeah, forgot about that. I'm on PC.

So it's possible to pull off a backstab while being in front of your opponent? I've just started playing and I love the game. Just a little salty about being invaded, lol.
Click to expand...

Yes, they can parry you and do a frontal backstab, you can do it to with the secondary attack on your left hand weapon or using a weapon with both hands with Tab I think.
 
Soleil rouge

Soleil rouge

Member
Orochinagis said:
Yes, they can parry you and do a frontal backstab, you can do it to with the secondary attack on your left hand weapon or using a weapon with both hands with Tab I think.
Click to expand...

I know about the parry, but I swear this guy was teleporting. He'd just suddenly appear behind my character, then backstab. I don't mind being beaten in a fair fight, but this was infuriating.
0IgCrbV.gif
.

I'm using a 360 controller, btw.
 
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