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Dead Space 2 |OT| The Marker Is Not A Sharpie

Half-way through Chapter 3 on my Zealot playthrough, and some further observations on difficulty and comparisons vs DS.

1. I don't think it's actually that much more difficult, but for me the change in button mappings are making me make a LOT of mistakes - mostly due to Stasis now being on Y. I think I would find DS2 MUCH easier if Stasis had been left on X, and reload left on A. I know I'm going to die so many times in Hardcore because of trying to Stasis with X. It'd be interesting to hear from a Dev why they changed it.

2. It feels much more solid and smooth, and the graphics are definitely improved.

3. It's really obvious after recent runs through DS that Audio Logs were seriously scaled back, which I think really hurts the narrative.

4. The Sprawl is definitely a more varied setting, but all the pros of more varied environment comes with a loss of the sense of claustrophobia that the Ishimura had in spades.

5. The seamless change of Chapters works really well in DS2, and really aids in the immersion. That said, it's easy to miss when you have switched, and I kind of miss the sense of achievement and the 'breather' that DS gave when using the Tram as Chapter end points.
 
Ok, I'm back at the Elevator in Chapter 7.

This is easily the most brutal part of either DS2 or DS, it it killing me on Zealot! Just died 5 times in a row, and have switched it off to take a break. I died a lot here on Survivalist as well.
 
gollumsluvslave said:
Ok, I'm back at the Elevator in Chapter 7.

This is easily the most brutal part of either DS2 or DS, it it killing me on Zealot! Just died 5 times in a row, and have switched it off to take a break. I died a lot here on Survivalist as well.

Yeah, that part is pretty awful. I usually stand next to the door with the force gun and just keep my head on a swivel.

I played through Severed last night on Zealot. It was alright. The only really interesting thing in it were the
"guys in the white coats."

Only thing I have left to do now is my Hard Core run. I have the DLC and plan on using the force gun, pulse rifle, line gun, and plasma cutter, with either the increased stasis duration or increased med pack healing suit.

I have an idea where I want to use my saves. One before that awful elevator, one before the end after the
eye machine
, and not sure where to do the third.

Waiting til Chapter 7 seems a bit much and I know Ill go insane if I get to Chapter 6 only to die.

Any tips from those who have done it so far?
 

Roscoe

Neo Member
ILOVEASIANS said:
Only thing I have left to do now is my Hard Core run. I have the DLC and plan on using the force gun, pulse rifle, line gun, and plasma cutter, with either the increased stasis duration or increased med pack healing suit.

I have an idea where I want to use my saves. One before that awful elevator, one before the end after the
eye machine
, and not sure where to do the third.

Waiting til Chapter 7 seems a bit much and I know Ill go insane if I get to Chapter 6 only to die.

Any tips from those who have done it so far?

You only need three weapons, which three is up to you but trying to carry/upgrade/buy ammo for a fourth will only stretch your resources. I recommend plasma cutter, force gun, and contact beam.

The plasma cutter for normal combat, force gun for mass attacks and crowd control, and the contact beam for alt fire stasis and to just wreck any Brute in 2-4 shots.

As for suits your instincts are dead on.

When I did it I saved in chapters 4,9 and 13. Looking back at it getting to the elevator and disc swap without saving is doable. Just proceed slowly and deliberately and you will be fine. If you can get to the swap then I would try to make it to the CEC building then save. That would put your first at chapter 8, leaving you 2 more for the harder last 7 chapters.
 
Roscoe said:
You only need three weapons, which three is up to you but trying to carry/upgrade/buy ammo for a fourth will only stretch your resources. I recommend plasma cutter, force gun, and contact beam.

The plasma cutter for normal combat, force gun for mass attacks and crowd control, and the contact beam for alt fire stasis and to just wreck any Brute in 2-4 shots.

As for suits your instincts are dead on.

When I did it I saved in chapters 4,9 and 13. Looking back at it getting to the elevator and disc swap without saving is doable. Just proceed slowly and deliberately and you will be fine. If you can get to the swap then I would try to make it to the CEC building then save. That would put your first at chapter 8, leaving you 2 more for the harder last 7 chapters.

Thanks man. The 3 weapon idea does make more sense.

Yeah, the CEC building was the other place I was thinking about for one of the saves.

What did you upgrade first?
 

Raul_Atreides

Neo Member
ILOVEASIANS said:
Thanks man. The 3 weapon idea does make more sense.

Yeah, the CEC building was the other place I was thinking about for one of the saves.

What did you upgrade first?

As an alternate option, may I humbly suggest the ripper instead of the force gun? Plasma cutter and contact beam for sure, but man that ripper is my lord and personal savior. Great kills per ammo usage ratio and has a decent ranged attack in a pinch.

For upgrades, I did stasis first, then the first couple of rig hp nodes, then the "alt fire" path of the contact beam all the way to the special node(this is critical for the last couple of chapters), then the plasma cutter/ripper/force gun as desired.

Sorry to butt in, I just wanted to share as this combo was really effective for me.
 

Wowbagger

Member
Finished my HC run a couple days ago and want to chime in. :)

I used the PC exclusively for the first nine chapters. With maxed out damage, there is nothing it can't handle effectively in the first half of the game. Ammo is cheap and stacks very efficiently in inventory. Without the need to carry ammo for other weapons, you'll have plenty of space for loot and health kits. (Especially if you use one of the DLC suits -- I used the one from Severed.)

I first got two damage ups for PC (so regular necro goes down in just two shots) and the first health up. Then I got the second health up and maxed out PC damage (including SPEC node). Finally, I got the two ENG ups for Stasis. Maxing out Stasis duration is not important until late in the game.

I saved for the first time before the lift to the solar array. You can go down and fix the lift first. Before saving, I bought enough nodes to get the last two health upgrades.

I saved for the second time before the decontamination room on the Ishimura. Around this part is where the PC starts becoming less effective (too many dark skinned necros), so I pulled the nodes off the PC (then completely maxed out), bought the Javelin gun and maxed it out.

The Javelin Gun is all you need for the rest of the game. The alt-fire of a maxed out Javelin Gun will kill ANY necro in one shot, even the dark skinned Brute you face at the end of the red rooms in chapter 13. While I don't have much experience with the CB, I recommend the Über-Jav, as I like to call it, over CB for its much cheaper ammo that stacks better in inventory and lack of charge up time for primary fire. It's great for dealing with the babies during the drill ride.

Check this video to see how powerful the Javelin is: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=g-VrdtEXA_w

I saved for the last time before the red rooms. Even thou I was just gonna run through with stasis, I didn't want to risk messing up.

Also, and this is probably common knowledge, but it took me a while to realize the best way to use stasis is to never aim directly at an enemy. Instead aim at the ground in front of it and let the splash damage take care of the rest. This way you're very unlikely to waste stasis shots. The Leaper fight at the start of chapter 6 and the elevator ride in chapter 11 were much easier with this knowledge.

Oh, and I used the Patrol suit from Severed until I got the Vantage suit. Sadly, the Patrol suit just looks like the regular Security suit in the main campaign. Will the suit bugs ever get fixed? :(
 

Roscoe

Neo Member
ILOVEASIANS said:
Thanks man. The 3 weapon idea does make more sense.

Yeah, the CEC building was the other place I was thinking about for one of the saves.

What did you upgrade first?


I upgraded stasis, then HP, then split upgrades between plasma cutter and contact beam alt to the spec.

Just remembered not everyone has the 360 version, if you are on PS3 then the disc swap isn't applicable so I'd recommend saving at 7 before the elevator.

Raul_Atreides said:
As an alternate option, may I humbly suggest the ripper instead of the force gun? Plasma cutter and contact beam for sure, but man that ripper is my lord and personal savior. Great kills per ammo usage ratio and has a decent ranged attack in a pinch.

For upgrades, I did stasis first, then the first couple of rig hp nodes, then the "alt fire" path of the contact beam all the way to the special node(this is critical for the last couple of chapters), then the plasma cutter/ripper/force gun as desired.

Sorry to butt in, I just wanted to share as this combo was really effective for me.

Not butting in at all, your advice is solid.

I actually really like the ripper as well. As a crowd control weapon against smaller enemies like children it works wonders. Kills them in one hit and leaves a pile of loot in one motion.

Good luck with your HC run, it is a tough but rewarding challenge.
 
Just finished my HC run today as well :)

Primary guns for me were Plasma Cutter, Ripper (chose this instead of the Force Gun), worked great, it's alt is nice for hitting things at a distance as well, but when you have a lot of enemies running at you hold out a blade and watch the pile of limbs stack up :p.
Used it vs the Darker skinned enemies as well one blade easily kills them.
Also used the
Detonator, setting up traps
worked wonders especially vs the
Stalkers, just block all your paths with mines and watch them explode in one hit as they run toward you.
, helped to ease the nerves as well knowing all your surroundings are pretty much covered.
The final level and final Store, bought the
Javelin Gun, and maxed out it's Alt, the Special added effect node for this weapon is a must, for the final boss I just stood in the one spot fired it at Nicole, use the ALT fire on her that's all you need to open up the heart/repeat.

Was a great ride, sad it's over now, at least until I give the DLC a shot.
 

Replicant

Member
gollumsluvslave said:
This is easily the most brutal part of either DS2 or DS, it it killing me on Zealot! Just died 5 times in a row, and have switched it off to take a break. I died a lot here on Survivalist as well.

No way. That one is a piece of cake in comparison to the Barrack in DS1 or the 2nd to last battle in DS2 or those annoying asteroids part or the tentacle crap in DS1 as well. As long as you're fast with the Force Gun, you can double-shot most of them quickly and stay away from their claws. Just make sure you bring enough health items.

ILOVEASIANS said:
Waiting til Chapter 7 seems a bit much and I know Ill go insane if I get to Chapter 6 only to die.

If you can stay alive until the end of Tormentor, it's likely that you won't be in too much trouble between that to the beginning of Chapter 7 (before the Elevator fight). I do recommend that you save before the Elevator fight though because even though it's relatively easy, you can also easily fucked up if you're not careful.
 
Raul_Atreides said:
As an alternate option, may I humbly suggest the ripper instead of the force gun? Plasma cutter and contact beam for sure, but man that ripper is my lord and personal savior. Great kills per ammo usage ratio and has a decent ranged attack in a pinch.

For upgrades, I did stasis first, then the first couple of rig hp nodes, then the "alt fire" path of the contact beam all the way to the special node(this is critical for the last couple of chapters), then the plasma cutter/ripper/force gun as desired.

Sorry to butt in, I just wanted to share as this combo was really effective for me.


I haven't really used the Ripper that much in either DS1 or this, but based on the positive reviews here I probably should give it a shot. I'll just carry the force gun when needed, like on the Chapter 7 elevator sequence and the end.

I think I'm going to shoot for the elevator as my first save. If it gets to be too much of a pain in the ass I'll have to re-think my strat.

Thanks again for the tips guys!
 
I don't understand the difficulty people are having with the elevator in chapter 7. You're all talking about the solar array elevator with the tripods, right?

All I did with that chapter on Hardcore was stand in the middle of the elevator and spin around and shoot every tripod arm I saw once with the plasma cutter. Every time they're hit once they move to another window, so I'd just make them keep moving around and never really killed more than a couple of them.

On other difficulties the detonator makes that part ridiculously easy

Or you're all talking about something else and I'm just crazy
 
Replicant said:
No way. That one is a piece of cake in comparison to the Barrack in DS1 or the 2nd to last battle in DS2 or those annoying asteroids part or the tentacle crap in DS1 as well. As long as you're fast with the Force Gun, you can double-shot most of them quickly and stay away from their claws. Just make sure you bring enough health items.

For me personally it's MUCH worse than the Barracks, simply based on number of times I'm getting killed - usually to standing in the wrong place and getting skewered!.

Of course, I should mention that I'm trying to get Elevator Action this time round, and I have managed to get past the Elevator, but no achievement as yet.


At least in the Barrack, the waves had patterns, and if you time it right it wasn't too bad. I also had TONS of stasis packs. With the Elevator, the Tripod's seem to have a completely random pattern; statis lasts a VERY short time (to be next to useless), and I keep hetting one-hit killed.

For me personally it's the hardest part of both games, and by a stretch. Of course it could be that I've not got the right strategy yet, and I need to respec or something (Force Gun isn't fully maxed).
 

Minamu

Member
Guess what? :D Dead Space 2 arrived today :O What a shocker! First copy sent on like feb 24th. Never showed up, got a refund. Second copy sent on march 9th and arrived perfectly fine (from a different store). I'm my way to a party, but when I get home, the real party begins :D I wonder if DS2 and too much booze is a good combo? :)
 
Okay died two more times in the last two dies and my hardcore run. Yesterday I died durring the solar array flight sequence. I was so worried about this part because instant death + small dodging time = much time wasted. I dodged all the debris and was totally relieved. Then Issac just crashes into the side of the building. WTF I thought him going through the window was automatic I didn't know you could die. Fuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuu......

Then today

Replicant said:
* In chapter 9, there are 2 ways of dealing with the decompression window. The first is to run to the left hand area (the one without the power node box) and stand way way back and shoot the window yourself. Then when you get sucked, shoot the safety. Warning: sometimes the location of your pointer is not obvious by doing it this way but you have more time to shoot the safety button. The other way is to shoot the window while you're inside the lift. It's far more dangerous because you're closer to the window but your weapon's pointer for some reason is far closer to the safety latch so it's your choice.

Okay this one pissed me off today. Hmm decomp window. I know I'll just stand back in the previous room and shoot it from safety like the last one. BAM! I get sucked in at such an awkward angle that I could not react in time. I scream No No No No NO NO NO NO! NOOOO! It was futile, I just watching Issac get his arms chopped off, just standing there. My grief set in. Why does it not suck me in, in another room then the same situation later it's different. Arrrgg.

My first save was mid way through Ch5 and I died at the end of Chapter 9. Although I admit as much as I am restarting, I am almost having as much fun as my first play-through.
 
Minamu said:
Guess what? :D Dead Space 2 arrived today :O What a shocker! First copy sent on like feb 24th. Never showed up, got a refund. Second copy sent on march 9th and arrived perfectly fine (from a different store). I'm my way to a party, but when I get home, the real party begins :D I wonder if DS2 and too much booze is a good combo? :)

Awesome! It's not a bad combo.

But nevertheless, awesome.
 

Wowbagger

Member
XxSlasherMcGirkxX said:
Okay this one pissed me off today. Hmm decomp window. I know I'll just stand back in the previous room and shoot it from safety like the last one. BAM! I get sucked in at such an awkward angle that I could not react in time. I scream No No No No NO NO NO NO! NOOOO! It was futile, I just watching Issac get his arms chopped off, just standing there. My grief set in. Why does it not suck me in, in another room then the same situation later it's different. Arrrgg.

Third way to deal with that room: run towards the power node box and stasis the dark skinned necro that drops down (just aim at the ground). Then stasis the exploder and take it out with carefully placed shots, making sure not to hit the glass. Re-stasis as necessary.

Bottom line: stasis is your friend. Abuse the hell out of it and you'll have all the time in the world to deal with tricky enemy attacks.
 

Wiggum2007

Junior Member
Stupid Tiedemann and his goons, they'd have had a much easier time with that pesky Isaac if they'd just used Stasis on him before they started shooting.
 
Am I missing something with the Force Gun? Having just completed a fresh Zealot run (Forged PC/Force Gun/Heavy Duty Contact), it didn't do shit for me. Even with 3 damage upgrades it still took over 3 shots to kill most Necros. For crowd control, the Contact Beam's alt fire seemed superior with the stasis upgrade. Everyone and their mother preaches about the Force Gun but I'm just not seeing it. Thoughts?
 

_Isaac

Member
Wiggum2007 said:
Stupid Tiedemann and his goons, they'd have had a much easier time with that pesky Isaac if they'd just used Stasis on him before they started shooting.

I found it so funny that all those trained super soldiers were so easily killed off in a matter of seconds during that one scene near the end yet an engineer like Isaac can get through it.
 

Nirolak

Mrgrgr
_Isaac said:
I found it so funny that all those trained super soldiers were so easily killed off in a matter of seconds during that one scene near the end yet an engineer like Isaac can get through it.
It reminds me of that scene in the first game when
a single necromorph in an escape pod takes over and destroys an elite military ship in a matter of minutes
.

Edit:

I actually really liked the last chapters in the game, but then again I had a mouse, so it was way easier to respond to eighteen necromorphs at once.
 
XxSlasherMcGirkxX said:
My first save was mid way through Ch5 and I died at the end of Chapter 9. Although I admit as much as I am restarting, I am almost having as much fun as my first play-through.


I'm with you on this. I started mine last night and made it to the solar array elevator before I made my first save. The whole time I was on edge hoping I wouldn't choke. It made for a much more intense play through so far.

It really hasn't been as bad as I was expecting. Not looking forward to the section
on top of the mine cart
. Going to use another save there and one towards the end sequence.
 
Man I fucking hate Pukers!

Especially the Enhanced variety - nearly every time I've been killed on Zealot since completing Chapter 8 has been down to one of those fuckers, either directly or indirectly.

Zealot is harder than Impossible in DS definitely, it's so frugal on ammo, I'm getting killed far more than I did on impossible.

Fuck those Pukers!
 

Roscoe

Neo Member
gollumsluvslave said:
Fuck those Pukers!

And those scorpions, but pukers are the worst. You can't always hear them in the background (and I'm wearing headphones), and they are tough sons of bitches. My zealot run I ended up using a maxed javelin gun whenever I saw one, literally shoot the bastard 3-4 times and hit the alt fire.
 

Kazzy

Member
The Xtortionist said:
Am I missing something with the Force Gun? Having just completed a fresh Zealot run (Forged PC/Force Gun/Heavy Duty Contact), it didn't do shit for me. Even with 3 damage upgrades it still took over 3 shots to kill most Necros. For crowd control, the Contact Beam's alt fire seemed superior with the stasis upgrade. Everyone and their mother preaches about the Force Gun but I'm just not seeing it. Thoughts?

Most of the strategies for Hardcore seemed to revolve around the Force Gun, to me it's just to buy you extra time in a large fight, even upgraded I think it lacks a punch.

I got through Zealot entirely with the Plasma Cutter alone, same for Hardcore bar the final fight which I bought the Plama Rifle for as well.

The Force Gun is too indirect a weapon for my style.
 

Minamu

Member
NotTheGuyYouKill said:
Awesome! It's not a bad combo.

But nevertheless, awesome.
Made it to chapter 5 in one sitting tonight (didn't play last night :( ). Pretty good stuff, I'd say :D Would've played more but I had to stop myself from ODing on it :)
 
Finished my Zealot run last night, a few more observations:-

Like Replicant has already advised, Contact Beam ALT makes the last few chapters MUCH easier, and when I tackle Hardcore, I will get th Contact Beam ALT path upgraded as priority, I think it will make Hardcore much more doable.

Got killed a few times, mostly due to Pukers at range slowing me down for the Ubermorph to do his worst.

Leapers are much harder in DS2 due to being able to jump much further, annoying little bastards.

Story held together better on 2nd play through, as I picked up stuff I missed 1st time around, but it's still a bit ropey in places.
 
Wowbagger said:
Third way to deal with that room: run towards the power node box and stasis the dark skinned necro that drops down (just aim at the ground). Then stasis the exploder and take it out with carefully placed shots, making sure not to hit the glass. Re-stasis as necessary.

Bottom line: stasis is your friend. Abuse the hell out of it and you'll have all the time in the world to deal with tricky enemy attacks.


I biffed it here last night on my hard core run. I tried getting fancy and missed the shot to close the window. Luckily I only had to replay two chapters. Used this strat the second time through and it worked like a charm.

I'm in Chapter 12 with one save left. Probably end up finishing it tonight at some point.
 

JackEtc

Member
I HATE scary movies and games, and am a total pussy when it comes to scary stuff, especially jump scares. I decided to start live streaming me playing through Dead Space 2 (blind) 4 Play Podcast style for some friends.

First 3 chapters:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=z9EPeNfWiY0

It ended up being pretty funny at parts (especially at the jump scares), and I was pretty scared the entire time (constantly cursing and calling things "dude"). If you wanna just see me get scared, and skip everything else, there's time links in the description.

So, I'm being shameless, but if you want to watch, there it is. Quality isn't the best (streaming in 720p from now on), and I know it's long (gonna start splitting them up), but I'd appreciate any feedback.
 
YES! Hardcore complete. One fine platinum trophy for me. What a challange, good fun all around. The Finger gun is pretty funny. I really hope we get some more single player DLC.

But for now we celebrate and rest.
 
JackEtc said:
I HATE scary movies and games, and am a total pussy when it comes to scary stuff, especially jump scares. I decided to start live streaming me playing through Dead Space 2 (blind) 4 Play Podcast style for some friends.

First 3 chapters:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=z9EPeNfWiY0

Awesome stuff, watched the first chapter it's great watching people freak out like this :p, Will certainly watch the rest later tonight.
 

Massa

Member
_Isaac said:
I found it so funny that all those trained super soldiers were so easily killed off in a matter of seconds during that one scene near the end yet an engineer like Isaac can get through it.

They didn't shoot for the limbs. :p
 

dimb

Bjergsen is the greatest midlane in the world
Nirolak said:
It reminds me of that scene in the first game when
a single necromorph in an escape pod takes over and destroys an elite military ship in a matter of minutes
.

Edit:

I actually really liked the last chapters in the game, but then again I had a mouse, so it was way easier to respond to eighteen necromorphs at once.
I didn't think the last section was as hard as it was tedious, even with a mouse.

It was especially apparent after the restraint the game showed just a few chapters earlier.

There's also at least two sections where the game just encloses you in a very boring small square space and throws necromorphs at you for a few minutes. Really lazily done if you ask me.
 

SamuraiX-

Member
Just wanted to drop by and tell Visceral to go fuck themselves.

The Leapers went from being decently challenging in groups to just down right game breaking.

Yeah, so now let's make them be able to leap from 50 feet away and pummel Isaac with a combo attack without any cool down in between!

Not like that kills you in 2 hits or anything.

Edit: Oh, and let's make them move twice as fast as in the first game!
 

tsigo

Member
They took an enemy that wasn't even remotely dangerous and made it extremely dangerous. Nothing wrong with that. Stasis that shit.
 

SamuraiX-

Member
tsigo said:
They took an enemy that wasn't even remotely dangerous and made it extremely dangerous. Nothing wrong with that. Stasis that shit.

There's a difference between making them more challenging to deal with and just making them cheap.

They move so fast sometimes that my stasis shot misses and then I'm fucked. If it's just one or two, I can deal. But when they throw six of them at you, in pairs, that's just bull shit.

Edit: And on that note, is the Seeker Rifle or Detonator useful at all? Both sound like really cool weapons, but are they effective at any point in the game? Please don't be too specific as I would like to try and figure out how, where, and when I can best utilize them on my own.
 
SamuraiX- said:
There's a difference between making them more challenging to deal with and just making them cheap.

They move so fast sometimes that my stasis shot misses and then I'm fucked. If it's just one or two, I can deal. But when they throw six of them at you, in pairs, that's just bull shit.

Edit: And on that note, is the Seeker Rifle or Detonator useful at all? Both sound like really cool weapons, but are they effective at any point in the game? Please don't be too specific as I would like to try and figure out how, where, and when I can best utilize them on my own.

I found no use for the Seeker Rifle on my first playthrough... but after Severed and on my third one, I used it a bit. It's ok when it's fully upgraded.

Haven't used detonators yet.
 

JackEtc

Member
CadaveriaIX said:
Awesome stuff, watched the first chapter it's great watching people freak out like this :p, Will certainly watch the rest later tonight.
Yay, glad you guys are liking it!

Anyone else who watches it, I'd appreciate any feedback.
 
this might be the first game i get all the achievements for in a long time.

these are all i have left to do.

Vacuum Cleaner
Decompress 20 Necromorphs without getting sucked out yourself

...And Stay Down
Kill 25 crawling enemies with Stomp (single player only)

Think Fast
Kill 30 Necromorphs with Kinesis objects

My Boom Stick
Kill 6 enemies at once with Line Gun's Alt-Fire (single player only)

Shock Therapy
Impale an enemy with the Javelin Gun and use its Alt-Fire to shock 3 others (single player only)

It's a Trap!
Kill 20 enemies with Detonator Mines in a deployed state

C-Section
Knock down an enemy with Contact Beam Alt-Fire then kill it with Primary Fire before it stands up

Secret Achievement
Continue playing to unlock this secret achievement.

The Veteran
Severed: Complete on Zealot difficulty

Remember the Alamo
Severed: Kill 16 or more enemies in the final last stand combat sequence

King of the Hill
Severed: Defend the quarry platform until the door unlocks

Grind House
Severed: In the grinder room, cause an enemy to die in the grinders


i'm hoping visceral releases a patch to help fix audio issues that many have been having but i am not holding my breath
 
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