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December Wrasslin |OT| Dean Ambrose, Muscleless Agent of SHIELD, Every Week :(
Nocturnowl
Member
If there was ever a time to make the unmasked Kane=Uncle Fester comparison, that gif is the one.
HarryDemeanor
Member
So when the 2000th episode of Raw happens do you think Kelly will be back to run the ropes?
Barack Lesnar
Banned
Whoops I meant 2012 Wrestlemania
Rock vs Cena
D-bry chants throughout the PPV and the Raw the night after put over D-Bry's Yes chants and basically made him a star. I'll never forget that. It's really stunning what happened... the fans had such a huge impact in helping put him over by doing the chants. Then the following Raws thereafter the crowds kept doing them. They became so popular WWE had no choice but to push the guy hard or at least give him top tier matches and segments.
Whoops.
>.<
Word? If I see you in the GAF channel I'll hit ya up for a game.
TOM f'N CRUISE
Member
I'm just glad Cody burned Miz. Hopefully Miz is gone before 2014 when they realize he's awful and doesn't improve. Maybe they can get rid of Eve for the same reasons too.
looks like the attendance of a non-major NJPW event.
looks like the attendance of a non-major NJPW event.
You want them to fire Miz & Eve?
It's probably why I see your mom in the front row.
In all seriousness, that's a pretty fucked up attitude. These are just guys out here doing what they're told, and trying to entertain you. Just because you don't like them doesn't mean you should take away their livelihood.
Most wrestlers continue to have careers outside of the WWE. So you'd be in favor of keeping Giant Gonzalez employed because he's just 'doing what he's told'? Even though he shows no signs of improvement, you'd keep him because everyone deserves a WWE job while other people are killing themselves over peanuts to try to get that kind of contract.
Professor Beef
Banned
Fire WWE Creative and Vince, not the actual wrestlers.
Miz & Eve are nowhere near Giant Gonzalez (who only stopped wrestling due to his condition, which ultimately took his life). Besides, things are different now. There is no WCW for guys to go to. Eve has also shown a ton of improvement, if you can't see that, then you need help. What I'm just seeing is something that's always disturbed me about the IWC. It's how quick people are to want someone to be fired. It's as if these guys aren't viewed as human beings, but simply as on screen characters, and their worth as employees is also judged by their on screen character, which is sad because these guys have little control over that.
Miz has shown an amazing amount of improvement since his debut on Tough Enough. Now, I may not particularly like him, but that's the truth. This forum was loving him not that long ago when he was killing Kofi, and also during his rise to the WWE title. On another note, the reason why the WWE keeps him around is because of his dedication to the company. He does each and every media appearance they ask of him, and he never complains about it. His dedication to promoting the WWE outside of the ring is what (according to Meltzer) made him a McMahon favorite, and got him the WWE title.
BTW, those guys killing themselves over peanuts will probably never get to the WWE. It's not their fault as that's just the way the WWE is. If you don't like that, then blame Vince, not the wrestlers.
Mr. Enigma
Member
Probably never. He's losing it to The Rock at the Royal Rumble, so why do it now?
I'm sorry if you think Eve's improvement in the many, MANY years she's worked there is significant, you need help. She's certainly not good enough to build a division around.
Miz can still do PR events without stepping into the ring. He can still do interviews, but he's been wrestling the same since he teamed with Nitro. Kofi's the same way, they're boring, stagnant. Maybe the writers should change their gimmicks, but you know what? They're not going to do that. The only way WWE is going to change anything is if they release people.
If they release people? That's nonsense. If they had your attitude, Rock, Austin, HBK all would have been released. All the guys I mentioned would have probably been shitted on in this thread if it were around back then. These guys have real talent, they just need to find a way to let it shine.
Miz has talent as a heel (or a non-PG face), and Eve has shown great improvement in the past year. Why she didn't show that in previous years is because her role wasn't really to be a wrestler back then, but simply to be pretty. Thus, she didn't focus on in ring training.
HarryDemeanor
Member
The Rock will. Only problem is it will be his long lost Brahma Bull belt.
Professor Beef
Banned
You're acting as if the wrestlers are the cause of the product being the way it is, when that's very incorrect.
Who is the one who comes up with the stupid gimmicks for debuting professionals? Vince.
Who yells into the announcers' ears and feeds them godawful lines? Vince.
Who told guys like MVP to dumb down their wrestling repertoire? Vince.
Who undermines Creative at every opportunity and also changes scripts at literally the last minute? If you guessed Vince, then congratulations on your new carton of Muscle Milk.
billy beane
Banned
I don't wish wrestlers to lose their jobs, I just wish some of them would never appear on my TV again.
Miz and Eve Torres are not two of those people.
Miz and Eve Torres are not two of those people.
I can't speak for Rock, but the entire reason HBK made it into the main event was because he A) wrestled every night like it was Wrestlemania in the late 80s/early 90s(are you really going to tell me that the Miz does that?) and B) because he stood up to Vince and told him when he thought something was stupid.
And you realize that Stone Cold's gimmick came out only a year after he got signed to the WWF right? Miz and Kofi have both been there for over 5 years.
Stone Cold was also part of a different era and was afforded more freedom than today's PG wrestlers.
I don't want anyone to lose their job. The answer to a better product is not to just release guys. You have to keep in mind that as much as us older smarks dislike some of these characters, little Jimmies probably love an energetic and acrobatic performer like Kofi, and a sarcastic smart mouth like Miz.
The problem is no long-term vision, short-sighted booking, and piss-poor character dialogue and storytelling. That's part of it, anyway. There are many things the E could do better.
I don't want anyone to lose their job. The answer to a better product is not to just release guys. You have to keep in mind that as much as us older smarks dislike some of these characters, little Jimmies probably love an energetic and acrobatic performer like Kofi, and a sarcastic smart mouth like Miz.
The problem is no long-term vision, short-sighted booking, and piss-poor character dialogue and storytelling. That's part of it, anyway. There are many things the E could do better.
You're missing the point. All of those guys had terrible gimmicks that would have made them hated by the IWC, but instead of releasing them (like you're hoping), they were given a chance to shine, and let their natural charisma through. Now, I'm not saying that will be with the case with Miz/Eve/kofi, if given the chance, but the point is to give them the chance.
You need to stop thinking like a mark, and realize not everyone on the roster has the same role. This is a PG era, and I've hated on Kofi's character for the longest, but it's a perfect face character for the PG era.
On another note, if any of the wrestlers wrestled every night like it was WM, they would be let go tomorrow. The WWE actively discourages that type of attitude, because it shortens careers. If you don't like that, go blame Vince, not the wrestlers. I'm sure plenty of your indy darlings will be hated by you when they get to the WWE and become indoctrinated in the WWE style.
Exactly.
As much as Daniel Bryan's style has been neutered by the WWE, I think he has still done a good job of maintaining the essence of his style. I'm just happy we've gotten to see MMA kicks and elbows, and the cattle mutilation submission. Really wish that was his finisher, and I hope they let his character evolve into a serious threat in the future.
Excited to see Seth Rollins in there, too. Happy they let him keep the buckle bomb! Is he still doing God's Last Gift and/or the phoenix splash?
Excited to see Seth Rollins in there, too. Happy they let him keep the buckle bomb! Is he still doing God's Last Gift and/or the phoenix splash?
That's because Bryan is a great wrestler, but even he is slowly falling into the "5 moves of doom" rinse and repeat routine. Now, have him do that for another five years, and we'll see how people view him.
Tensai is a perfect example of this. In Japan, he was a convincing and effective monster. In the WWE, they gave him a silly gimmick, it doesn't go over, they immediately gave up on him, and less than half a year later, he's a joke.
Professor Beef
Banned
Just following DZ's orders!
Booking and character creation have a lot to do with it too. Had they let him be Albert - maybe changing his name to "King Albert" due to his Japanese success - and playing up his training and popularity overseas, his return could have gone a lot differently. The E could have had another legit monster heel.
I don't know how appropriate this gif is, but I wanted to use it.
The WWE still doesn't know how to operate in an internet era.
I didn't know there was a fellow member of the K2 Krew on here.
I still think the Albert/Tensai character could be salvaged. Have him cut a self-aware promo where he says he's sick of being a damned joke, and of letting the fans get to him. From this point on, he's going to embrace the hate and be himself. "My name is not Tensai. My name is not Bernard. My name is KING Albert, and I'm not here to be humiliated. I'm here to destroy every damned joke of a wrestler in the back. From this day forth, NO ONE will stand in my way!"
Etc.
Etc.
Come on, Soul, don't start white knighting shitty dudes like The Miz. We've come so far. We've hugged it out, we've laughed, we've cried, but now you're making me sad.
It isn't a shitty attitude to want someone who is terrible like The Miz off TV or somewhere else. Some guys are not good. While you can blame part of that on the writers, it is up to the wrestlers to make it work. And the guys who are good can make even the terrible writing work. Examples, everything D-Bryne and Kane related this year. Seriously, hugging it out? Goat faces? Anger management? But you know what, not only did those two made it work, they became the best thing in wrestling this year because they aren't shitty at their jobs. The hallmark of good talent is over coming bad booking and bad writing. Miz can't do that. Because he sucks. His mic and in ring skills have actually decreased in the past year. He's basically back to the amazingly terrible levels he was right after Tough Enough when he was hosting Smackdown.
He's awful. He's annoying in the worst possible way. He's not clever, his writing isn't clever, he can't adlib for shit, he stumbles over his words, he's dull, and he's probably the most average wrestler in the company. People give Kofi a lot of shit, but he's dramatically better than Miz in pretty much all categories. Sometimes guys suck. He had a miracle run last year. But that wore off and we're left with the most annoying and shitty guy to be on WWE TV probably since the 90s.
The only enjoyable thing about the Miz and Miz TV is when someone makes him look like a clueless putz.
It isn't a shitty attitude to want someone who is terrible like The Miz off TV or somewhere else. Some guys are not good. While you can blame part of that on the writers, it is up to the wrestlers to make it work. And the guys who are good can make even the terrible writing work. Examples, everything D-Bryne and Kane related this year. Seriously, hugging it out? Goat faces? Anger management? But you know what, not only did those two made it work, they became the best thing in wrestling this year because they aren't shitty at their jobs. The hallmark of good talent is over coming bad booking and bad writing. Miz can't do that. Because he sucks. His mic and in ring skills have actually decreased in the past year. He's basically back to the amazingly terrible levels he was right after Tough Enough when he was hosting Smackdown.
He's awful. He's annoying in the worst possible way. He's not clever, his writing isn't clever, he can't adlib for shit, he stumbles over his words, he's dull, and he's probably the most average wrestler in the company. People give Kofi a lot of shit, but he's dramatically better than Miz in pretty much all categories. Sometimes guys suck. He had a miracle run last year. But that wore off and we're left with the most annoying and shitty guy to be on WWE TV probably since the 90s.
The only enjoyable thing about the Miz and Miz TV is when someone makes him look like a clueless putz.
Late reply but yeah, import. Wait for the Wii U version. Old Wii version is now obsolete. S&P should work.
-Pyromaniac-
Member
we can only hope
My issue here, though, is that Miz has essentially only had one character since his debut, and not much else. More so than that, my issue with what DZ said wasn't his hatred of Miz, but his general attitude that "a lot of people should be fired". Guys like Bryan and Kane were given multiple chances with multiple characters, and they had the benefit of honing their craft for years before they got to this level, something Miz (or most guys the WWE gets now) haven't had.
Guys should be given multiple chances to find themselves and what works. In an era where WWE debuts guys when they're green, they should be given a chance to develop. These are issues inherent to the WWE, but not the fault of the wrestlers. It's how the business is constructed now.
funkystudent
Member
So I bought a Vita.
#ultimateunderdog
#ultimateunderdog
Soulplaya's got a point about putting totally green guys in the spotlight. Bryan worked because of his years in the indies building up his persona as "the best in the world." Miz came in as...some reality show guy with no in-ring work.
I don't think Miz is terrible, but I agree that he needs to tweak quite a bit to make this face character actually watchable. Miz TV is a very good concept, but it has been poorly executed.
I don't think Miz is terrible, but I agree that he needs to tweak quite a bit to make this face character actually watchable. Miz TV is a very good concept, but it has been poorly executed.
Oh yeah? I bought The Last Story Limited Edition for the Wii off Ebay, along with Final Fantasy: Dawn of Souls for the original GBA.
#Nintendo4lyfe
IC_Champion
Member
Que nWo music
Another one!
Miz started wrestling in 2003. He's almost 10 years in. It's not like he just started a few years ago. He's a decade in. He showed steady improvement and was rewarded for it, but now has completely dropped off on the mic and in the ring back to what he was when he was on Tough Enough. Yet, he's being rewarded for it. It's like he completely stopped giving a shit once he got his title run and WM main event.
Professor Beef
Banned
Is that when he started in ECW, or when he went to wrestling school? Because there's a big difference.
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