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[darkistheway]

I think the main problem with PVP is Bungie's inability to find a good balance with the guns combined with the maps' overemphasis on close quarters.

For the most part, you need to focus on the meta with the fastest TTK. Stay at range to avoid shotguns - that means pulse rifles and snipers. Or close the distance and utilize the poor lines of sight with a shotgun.

That ends up allowing only two styles of play.

You can't handcannon up close because of the accuracy nerf.

You can't scout rifle out far because of the slower TTK.

Auto rifles are still just not good enough.

Obviously, there are players that will succeed with a scout/sidearm combo but the meta is what is because the majority of players are finding the most success with it.

They need to focus on balancing every weapon's TTK so they are really close at the stated range goal.

A pulse rifle should not be able to beat a scout at range. Ever. Right now, a pulse rifle can beat a sniper. It's ridiculous.

 

[xplicitone]

So when I got my Warlock deleted (RIP first char, you will always be my first!) and bought the game on Xb1 a few months ago, I had to make new characters. 4 of them.

With each character, I played PvP as soon as I was able to. I basically just had a single jump and a grenade (Pre TTK, you didn't unlock the super ability or any of the first few nodes like you do now, or maybe that's just for the 3rd subclass). Regardless, you start off basically without power. As you progress and play, you unlock more abilities. From having no super to a super, to different jumps, nades, super abilities, etc. It felt like I was regaining my powers back. In the other sense when you haven't played that character class at all, it was like becoming a superhero. You also started off with fairly crappy guns (What's up Khovostov).

The whole thing with becoming more powerful and earning more powerful guns, combined with fighting harder and more powerful enemies while exploring new places and lore was fantastic.

This then brings up when you're finally ready for Vault of Glass, such an epic place and raid with so much mystery. Earning your powerful Found Verdict, Vision of Confluence, etc. felt so right. It's the ultimate climax of leveling up your character and abilities.



Fast forward to today...

We can become more powerful... by getting crappy gear/weapons that we can infuse our current stuff with (or use it until we have good stuff to infuse)! But we have to rely SUPER heavily on DOUBLE luck of both obtaining something and it being high enough light. That's our new end-game. No more chasing things we really want like cool sparrows or guns. Nearly every gun in VoG was usable in some way at the time. Atheon's Epilogue was the only gun I didn't care for. FB, VoC, FV, CM, PR, I wanted them all and used them all. And nobody bring up the Foil because I never got one and it still hurts.

Spoiler

Anybody have Oracles checkpoint?

There's hardly a piece of KF gear/armor that I or most people really want. The MG with Persistence is the only thing people kind of want.

It's pretty sad. They took away our carrots and fed them to the rabbits.

 

[ocean]

Psychologically speaking, a player would rather feel more powerful than weaker. Instead of everyone using pulse rifles like they do now, we can people using whatever they want.

Pulse rifles don't "feel powerful", they're just effective. And this concept of effect Needs only makes sense relative to alternatives. Take away PR range and flinch a bit and they lose an effectiveness edge over Scouts, which all of a sudden will be more effective and viable.

Buffing isn't always the right call. Consider how PRs are no better than they were a few months ago but nobody used them back then.

The game is probably closer to being balanced now than its been since near-launch. HC accuracy buff, PR range cut, slight AR crit multiplier buff and give scouts the flinch. Erase Felwinter's archetype and limit to Invective tier impact. Cut sniper AA. Less special ammo in PvP to avoid "I run my secondary as a primary". And voila, effectiveness is more even across the board and the game is better off for it.

 

[Gammacide]

Anyone else having trouble logging in? Is this to stop people glitchy get into the rumored iron banner today?

 

[GlamFM]

Deleted my worthless Warlock to make yet another Titan.

Feels good.

Feels right.

rumored iron banner today?

What?

 

[bitsurugi]

Anyone else having trouble logging in? Is this to stop people glitchy get into the rumored iron banner today?

Me too, in fact, our whole group does. PSN error it seems?

 

[Rollo Tomasi]

Last night I finally got Qullim's Terminus after 11 raids. It was at 309. This is my 2nd heavy ever from KF. I also got the 312 RL from HM a couple weeks ago.

I also finally got NM helms for my hunter and titan (only two chars I'm playing Destiny with right now). Smart loot at work?

 

[Kyne]

Artifacts are kind of a bust, right?

Everyone I know slaps on the highest light one they have and just is done with it. They don't drop anywhere near as frequently as they need to actually capitalize on their diversity without sacrificing light.

I also use my artifact mostly for a light boost. It's 310, so I can sub-in a lower light weapon that actually does significantly change my gameplay.

It's the same with ghosts. They added stats and perks to them, but everyone I know has the King's Shell on unless they're doing their exotic sword materials quest. They don't drop frequently enough with the glimmer bonuses to actually make it worth chasing. And again, it's another thing I can use as a dependable light boost so I can use lower light weapons.

I think across the board legendary drop rates are way too low for the game's health, especially with the stated goal of Year 2 to be a loot game. You can get legendaries from the Gunsmith every week and one from your first Heroic Strike, but that's not enough for a game as big this.

Legendary drop rates should be doubled.

So when I got my Warlock deleted (RIP first char, you will always be my first!) and bought the game on Xb1 a few months ago, I had to make new characters. 4 of them.

With each character, I played PvP as soon as I was able to. I basically just had a single jump and a grenade (Pre TTK, you didn't unlock the super ability or any of the first few nodes like you do now, or maybe that's just for the 3rd subclass). Regardless, you start off basically without power. As you progress and play, you unlock more abilities. From having no super to a super, to different jumps, nades, super abilities, etc. It felt like I was regaining my powers back. In the other sense when you haven't played that character class at all, it was like becoming a superhero. You also started off with fairly crappy guns (What's up Khovostov).

The whole thing with becoming more powerful and earning more powerful guns, combined with fighting harder and more powerful enemies while exploring new places and lore was fantastic.

This then brings up when you're finally ready for Vault of Glass, such an epic place and raid with so much mystery. Earning your powerful Found Verdict, Vision of Confluence, etc. felt so right. It's the ultimate climax of leveling up your character and abilities.



Fast forward to today...

We can become more powerful... by getting crappy gear/weapons that we can infuse our current stuff with (or use it until we have good stuff to infuse)! But we have to rely SUPER heavily on DOUBLE luck of both obtaining something and it being high enough light. That's our new end-game. No more chasing things we really want like cool sparrows or guns. Nearly every gun in VoG was usable in some way at the time. Atheon's Epilogue was the only gun I didn't care for. FB, VoC, FV, CM, PR, I wanted them all and used them all. And nobody bring up the Foil because I never got one and it hurts.

There's hardly a piece of KF gear/armor that I or most people really want. The MG with Persistence is the only thing people kind of want.

It's pretty sad. They took away our carrots and fed them to the rabbits.

I just got that MG. It's amazeballs.

I also want the Titan IB set..

..and that new exotic chest that lets you dodge in mid-air..

.. and those legs that make you fast like sanic.

mhm... that's about it.

 

[E92 M3]

Yeah, but making weapons more powerful reduces the strength of the class abilities. Having too strong of weapons means supers, grenades, and melees become a lot weaker by comparison.

Unless you want to buff those, too.



I like most of this. But the main point your'e making is synergy, and dear god yes please can we have more of that? That would be great...

I don't think they should go crazy, but would it be like if the ARs were as good as in the beta, pulses remained the same and TLW was still prominent? It would be chaotic and it would be a lot of fun I wager.

Pulse rifles don't "feel powerful", they're just effective. And this concept of effect Needs only makes sense relative to alternatives. Take away PR range and flinch a bit and they lose an effectiveness edge over Scouts, which all of a sudden will be more effective and viable.

Buffing isn't always the right call. Consider how PRs are no better than they were a few months ago but nobody used them back then.

The game is probably closer to being balanced now than its been since near-launch. HC accuracy buff, PR range cut, slight AR crit multiplier buff and give scouts the flinch. Erase Felwinter's archetype and limit to Invective tier impact. Cut sniper AA. Less special ammo in PvP to avoid "I run my secondary as a primary". And voila, effectiveness is more even across the board and the game is better off for it.

Yes, pulse rifles are the antithesis of "feeling powerful," but players will always gravitate towards the best.

Speaking of scouts getting flinch, I am shocked they don't have it now.

 

[SpecX]

Deleted my worthless Warlock to make yet another Titan.

Feels good.

Feels right.



What?

Lol, I thought about doing the same, but I keep telling myself I will give the Warlock class another chance.

 

[VE3TRO]

Anyone else having trouble logging in? Is this to stop people glitchy get into the rumored iron banner today?

I got booted twice with messages about partner issues. No error code.

 

[LTWood12]

possibly incoming patch?

 

[Ruthless_Barbarian]

I also finally got NM helms for my hunter and titan (only two chars I'm playing Destiny with right now). Smart loot at work?

Same, I got titan and hunter normal helmets today for the first time, both at 300. This is after almost 2 months of raiding.

 

[Feorax]

Playing with my Titan today makes me realise how shit the post- game story rewards are too.

I've finished the story, I'm probably level 40 at this point, I've just completed the Darkblade strike quest.

What possible use am I going to have for a blue 200 RL?

 

[LTWood12]

Same, I got titan and hunter normal helmets today for the first time, both at 300. This is after almost 2 months of raiding.

Your loot luck has been unbelievably shitty since TTK launched.

 

[Ruthless_Barbarian]

Playing with my Titan today makes me realise how shit the post- game story rewards are too.

I've finished the story, I'm probably level 40 at this point, I've just completed the Darkblade strike quest.

What possible use am I going to have for a blue 200 RL?

Weapon parts bruh

 

[Rollo Tomasi]

Dammit...if the IB gear is helmet this week I'm going to have to play. Might just wait until the weekend when the buffs are increased though. Need time for Fallout 4.

 

[Kor of Memory]

Last night I finally got Qullim's Terminus after 11 raids. It was at 309. This is my 2nd heavy ever from KF. I also got the 312 RL from HM a couple weeks ago.

I also finally got NM helms for my hunter and titan (only two chars I'm playing Destiny with right now). Smart loot at work?

The smart loot system is only there for faction rep packages to make sure you have the emblem, class item, and shader by the time your each rep level 25 to do the quest.

The "Smart Loot" system is not part of king's fall.

 

[GhaleonEB]

If anyone wants a quick Nightfall, I just got to the Brothers solo. Probably can't beat them solo but I'm gonna try. :lol

 

[Slammin_Hammon]

Dang everyone on my friends list is playing fallout and here I am about to play crucible while waiting for my pip boy to arrive.

 

[Ruthless_Barbarian]

The smart loot system is only there for faction rep packages to make sure you have the emblem, class item, and shader by the time your each rep level 25 to do the quest.

The "Smart Loot" system is not part of king's fall.

If only. It doesn't work that way. 'smart loot' only works on shaders by taking out the ones you already have from the loot pool.

 

[MagnetoWasRight]

The smart loot system is only there for faction rep packages to make sure you have the emblem, class item, and shader by the time your each rep level 25 to do the quest.

The "Smart Loot" system is not part of king's fall.

I did not get a cloak on my hunter and I went from 12 to 25 Dead Orbit in the past eight days.

 

[xplicitone]

Dang everyone on my friends list is playing fallout and here I am about to play crucible while waiting for my pip boy to arrive.

You're supposed to sell that thing for an XB1!

My pipboy was out for delivery this morning. Can't wait.

 

[Kor of Memory]

If anyone wants a quick Nightfall, I just got to the Brothers solo. Probably can't beat them solo but I'm gonna try. :lol

Are you on my friends list?

Kor_of_Memory

 

[perineumlick]

Need one for NF. At the brothers right now, join on perineumlick PSN.

 

[E92 M3]

possibly incoming patch?

Doesn't seem like it, unfortunately. No notification on Bnet or anything.

 

[Slammin_Hammon]

You're supposed to sell that thing for an XB1!

My pipboy was out for delivery this morning. Can't wait.

Reception of Halo 5 has been too tepid. I'll wait to worry about getting an xbone once more features are added and things like aiming are fixed.

 

[xplicitone]

Actually, my computer started making SUPER loud noises last night and my gf said that's the 2nd time she's heard that. I just shut it off so I have to inspect that today.

I'll probably just do a hard king's fall on XB1 if Voidfang Investments LLC needs a 6th.

 

[Kor of Memory]

Actually, my computer started making SUPER loud noises last night and my gf said that's the 2nd time she's heard that. I just shut it off so I have to inspect that today.

I'll probably just do a hard king's fall on XB1 if Voidfang Investments LLC needs a 6th.

9 times out of 10, you have a fan wire thats gotten loose and is bumping up against a fan blade.

 

[Mindlog]

Basically you want the guns to be different. Right now everything boils down to TTK with weapons at some range variant. All Bungie has done is tweak those two things, so let's try something else. It's a good idea, but I don't think it'd be enough to push people to a weapon class. It'd be very hard to come up with a perk for each weapon type and not end up with one weapon class that is OP again.

I think the opposite should happen. Your class should determine what type of loadout you play with. Gunslingers should be better with Hand Cannons, give them a faster reload node, a LitC node, and make them choose what additional Hand Cannon perks they want. Have one tree be reload speed, rate of fire, and magazine size perks. Blade Dancers are better with snipers. Nightstalkers are better with Fusion Rifles, etc.

Make Defender Titans the defacto Shotgun class. Want to run around with a Shotgun? OK you'll probably have to live with the fact that you won't have an offensive super. Give these guys the option to chose between Automatic, Final Round, and Rangefinder in one node tree. See here I'm going? It's a lot like Borderlands 2. My Lawbringer was totally focused on increasing reload speed for Pistols, ammo capacity, rate of fire, and specials that do more damage with pistols.

Sounds half assed now that I read it again, but there's a better way to tie classes into the weapons than they have right now. They've tried that to some extent, a Shotgun that doesn't use ammo inside of Ward of Dawn. But what if that was a global perk to Defenders if one so chooses? Diablo takes the same approach, the weapons play into the class perks. You end up with a lot more variation in build types.

TL;DR A better synergy between Character Classes and Weapon Classes is needed to make more viable builds and load out options. Take some hints from Borderlands 2 and Diablo III.

I like the intention, but all it would do in practice is bring standardized loadouts to class selection. Players would naturally gravitate toward the class that best serves the existing weapon meta. We've seen a limited form of this with the Bladedancer Quickdraw perk. Current ToO stats are tainted by the fact that players can only complete the bounties once per week per character. I bet that if ToO worked like the weekly heroic stats would see much bigger peaks and valleys in regards to class selection.

I do believe Destiny 2 would be much more interesting if the class powers moved to a loadout system. We need more differentiation than grenade, jump, and super.
Weapon archetypes should just be the weapons.
SMGs definitely have a place.

Basically, Mass Effect :]

 

[LTWood12]

Doesn't seem like it, unfortunately. No notification on Bnet or anything.

Well pooh. Was hoping there'd be some kind of cool new content this week to compete w/ Fallout.

 

[xplicitone]

Reception of Halo 5 has been too tepid. I'll wait to worry about getting an xbone once more features are added and things like aiming are fixed.

Ahh yea, it's been mixed for sure. I've had fun doing Slayer in spurts. It's basically like being a Titan. The not so fun part is having only 1 sniper on the map and trying to take it So many times I'll get it for 1 second and die instantly. Shotties and Snipers mode just came out, but then that's like playing Destiny

9 times out of 10, you have a fan wire thats gotten loose and is bumping up against a fan blade.

I was thinking it sounded like it was the fan. Everything seemed to be working so hopefully it's just that!

 

[Ruthless_Barbarian]

Yeah I don't believe there will be IB today. With activity so thin and no word of fixing the loot drop bug, it's highly unlikely.

 

[Ghazi]

Well pooh. Was hoping there'd be some kind of cool new content this week to compete w/ Fallout.

I don't think they're competing, Bungie's probably fine with people going and playing other games and coming back later.

 

[Rubenov]

Pulse rifles don't "feel powerful", they're just effective. And this concept of effect Needs only makes sense relative to alternatives. Take away PR range and flinch a bit and they lose an effectiveness edge over Scouts, which all of a sudden will be more effective and viable.

Buffing isn't always the right call. Consider how PRs are no better than they were a few months ago but nobody used them back then.

The game is probably closer to being balanced now than its been since near-launch. HC accuracy buff, PR range cut, slight AR crit multiplier buff and give scouts the flinch. Erase Felwinter's archetype and limit to Invective tier impact. Cut sniper AA. Less special ammo in PvP to avoid "I run my secondary as a primary". And voila, effectiveness is more even across the board and the game is better off for it.

Dang, ocean. Bungie should just hire you.

 

[Trakan]

If Iron Banner was coming back, Bungie wouldn't announce it. They don't want people doing the glitch to get rank 5 stuff right away.

 

[noomi]

Wait, so no IB today?

 

[Highwind]

Who is up for some nightfall?

 

[TheAquaticApe]

Wait, so no IB today?

The reflection of an Xmas tree in your Avatar's eyes is a nice touch. Good job Nami.

 

[robertsan21]

So is there IB this week or?

 

[Ruthless_Barbarian]

Nope, no IB.

 

[GhaleonEB]

Sorry you guys drew blanks on the NF, but thanks for the help. This boosted my scout quite well, up from 294. Inching toward 300.

 

[E92 M3]

Sorry you guys drew blanks on the NF, but thanks for the help. This boosted my scout quite well, up from 294. Inching toward 300.

Have you done a normal KF yet?

 

[noomi]

The reflection of an Xmas tree in your Avatar's eyes is a nice touch. Good job Nami.

Nami is Mr. Photoshop lately.

Nope, no IB.

Hmm... too bad. Ah well, I'll get my raids done today at least.

 

[SpecX]

Thank God Bungie didn't put out IB today. I can only imagine the time I would have lost trying to rank up, especially if they had the helmet and play through FO4.

Edit: top of page!

 

[E92 M3]

Gotta say: Bungie's gear manager beta is really nice. I have so much infusion fodder for special, yet there is no reason waste them on anything other than a sniper rifle. And all of my rifles are already above 315. In the same sense, I don't want to delete them either lol.

More vault space, please Bungie

 

[GhaleonEB]

Have you done a normal KF yet?

Yes, twice. I have a 300 ghost shell, and used a 310 drop of the raid sniper to boot my 1000 Yard Stare to 307. But that's about it for my 300+ gear.

Nice surprise having leftovers from the Festival in my inventory, was fun opening the spoiled bags. I totally kept the raisins and expired candy.

 

[Feorax]

So who thinks the next exotic quest is going to have something to do with that Ultra Knight in the sealed off room on the Dreadnaught?

It's bugging me why he's there. Other than the emblem he drops and 3oC grinding of course.

 

[E92 M3]

Yes, twice. I have a 300 ghost shell, and used a 310 drop of the raid sniper to boot my 1000 Yard Stare to 307. But that's about it for my 300+ gear.

You know, you can probably do Totems and Warpope on Hard for some loot. May get very lucky.

 

[GhaleonEB]

You know, you can probably do Totems and Warpope on Hard for some loot. May get very lucky.

I might run the normal KF this weekend again for infusion fodder. Every few days I inch some gear forward, so its getting there.

I'd actually be closer with weapon parts. I have three more infusions I could do if I had'em. (Got a 300 blue drop yesterday.)