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[Namikaze1]

This entire BWU feels like one big ass joke.


Oh wait, it's because it is.


-___-

 

[Lnkn52]

I think there are a few different levels to the communication problems. The first is there's a general uneasiness about the future of the game we're all invested in. Destiny is a 10 year journey, and one year in Bungie initiated a major change to how the game will be supported and funded - and barely communicated their intentions to the community. They pivoted to micro transactions without ever stating what their line in the sand regarding what can go the MTX route, so people are uneasy with each update and the subtle ways the line has shifted. We have no expectations about what kind of scope the Live team will develop, what their planned cadence is, etc. We don't really know where the game is going. I think the community is still on edge about MTX and are waiting for the other shoe to drop. Bungie doesn't seem to recognize this unease. Deej and company have said they want to keep releasing surprises like SRL, with little to no warning. That's fine, but I think they are making a big mistake in providing no compass whatsoever about Destiny's near or long term future.

The other is in how they do bring out information. Deej is needlessly, relentlessly opaque in the BWU's, obfuscating information when there's often no reason to do so. Why was the release of the challenge modes a surprise? Why was the date of the patch saved for PSX? Why does he say things like "in one rotation of the earth" instead of "tomorrow"? Why are so many changes made to the game without context or explanation (the Great Weapons Parts Famine of 2015)?

The moment to moment communication is really quite poor and seems totally detached from what the community, who are clearly very invested in the game, want to hear. I understand there's a lot they can't talk about. They're not going to announce the next expansion / Destiny 2 plans this early. Their long term roadmaps for the game may still be in flux. But it just feels like there's a fundamental disconnect with what the community is interested in and what ends up in the BWU's and other communication channels.

TY, very well put. All I want to know is if I want to keep investing my limited gaming time with this game.

 

[inthrall]

Look Bungie, either you start giving your players some straight information or you just don't post anything at all. This is kinda ridiculous.

Isn't that what the current post is? The values shown now are correct, and not the "under the scenes" numbers that were previously shown in error

 

[Sentinalprimus]

'some events and some activities that will become additions to your Director.'

Oh cool, actual things!

 

[JohnOfMars]

What is the point of posting values if we can't see them ourselves? They must be felt?

Come on!

 

[KINGofCRA5H]

those back to back gifs, perfection.

 

[Spizz]

Did I just read someone trying to justify a 0.04% damage increase?

 

[lt519]

Even his hypothetical example of landing 50 crit head shots on a moving target with an increase of 0.2 damage still does only 10 more damage than before. That isn't a weapon re-balancing. Even if it was 1 more damage per crit over 50 rounds that just won't matter.

Isn't that what the current post is? The values shown now are correct, and not the "under the scenes" numbers that were previously shown in error

It's still in terms of base damage. His explanation of it being one factor in many variables rings true but it still obfuscates the end result. That 14% base damage of Heavy Archetypes still translates into 19% final damage for some guns. They need to communicate that final damage in a better way so there are no surprises.

 

[JohnOfMars]

Even his hypothetical example of landing 50 crit head shots on a moving target with an increase of 0.2 damage still does only 10 more damage than before. That isn't a weapon re-balancing. Even if it was 1 more damage per crit over 50 rounds that just won't matter.

HE DIDNT EVEN FINISH HIS EXAMPLE!

He starts out with a lot of numbers then just ends up with "feel the difference"

What?

 

[Smiley90]

So auto rifles get buffed 0.4% and pulse rifles nerfed 15% and in some universe that results in NOT a 40-fold impact because of "other factors"?

How can one justify a 0.4% buff with ITS NOT THE FINAL VALUE and then nerf another gun by 15%?!

 

[Strangelove77]

Someone post the Tony Montana stare gif. It's appropriate here.

 

[Frenden]

I remember back in, like, OT5 or so, that I said I didn't want to commit to Destiny if it meant ten years of arguing with community managers over seemingly obvious fixes to all but them. Apparently I did not heed my own warning.

 

[JohnOfMars]

So auto rifles get buffed 0.4% and pulse rifles nerfed 15% and in some universe that results in NOT a 40-fold impact because of "other factors"?

How can one justify a 0.4% buff with ITS NOT THE FINAL VALUE and then nerf another gun by 15%?!

0.04%, mind you. 0.04%.

 

[Lnkn52]

 

[Frenden]

zero point zero four fucks sake

 

[Namikaze1]

Someone post the Tony Montana stare gif. It's appropriate here.

 

[xVaalbarAx]

lol more events.

 

[SnakeEyes]

Someone post the Tony Montana stare gif. It's appropriate here.

I got ya fam.

 

[KINGofCRA5H]

The new pulse rifle numbers don't make any sense.

 

[BreezyLimbo]

Hey guys, remember when we gave Bungie a benefit of the doubt because coding is hard.

Neither do I!

 

[GunnerZ]

Straight Savage lool those where the days.

 

[inthrall]

Did I just read someone trying to justify a 0.04% damage increase?

If this base damage increase is based on each bullet doing 0.04% more than before, that adds up to 2.4% more damage in the same timeframe, assuming a 60 bullet clip.

Spoiler

I'm uncertain if they are referring to base damage or dps though, if its base damage then the above is correct

It's still in terms of base damage. His explanation of it being one factor in many variables rings true but it still obfuscates the end result. That 14% base damage of Heavy Archetypes still translates into 19% final damage for some guns. They need to communicate that final damage in a better way so there are no surprises.

Oh it is base damage, yay!

 

[SnakeEyes]

Hey guys, remember when we gave Bungie a benefit of the doubt because coding is hard.

Neither do I!

Sadly, this is true ~_~

 

[ACR0019]

Yes, 0.04% is ridiculously insignificant, but wasn't there a consensus about how Arminius-D was already a pretty strong AR before the patch?

 

[mehrmantrout]

It still doesn't make sense because of the pulse rifle numbers, presumably he checked it yesterday when they edited the patch notes. I'm still calling shenanigans, not that we'll ever know

 

[Smiley90]

What's 0.04% base change in final
What's 15% base in final

How will those numbers be even REMOTELY similar

Somebody explain that to me.

 

[Rollo Tomasi]

go

https://www.bungie.net/en/News/News?aid=14179

Oookay....

 

[GhaleonEB]

Well, after my little rant, Urk's portion of the update was a good read. Nice to know there are multiple new events coming in the near term. Sounds like the next is not long on the heels of this one. Hopefully they can expand on that roadmap in the new year.

 

[KINGofCRA5H]

It still doesn't make sense because of the pulse rifle numbers, presumably he checked it yesterday when they edited the patch notes. I'm still calling shenanigans, not that we'll ever know

Not to mention that the pulse rifle numbers have been different about 4 times now, and we have no way of knowing what the actual values are now. The numbers posted today make no sense what so ever given the context.

 

[Kor of Memory]

Hey guys, remember when we gave Bungie a benefit of the doubt because coding is hard.

Neither do I!

This could have all been avoided if the weapons we got in game had actual numbers and stats show on them instead of obtuse progress bars with little meaning.

 

[someday]

While Last-Year’s-Me is glaring through space-time with a look of pained jealously over this newfound enthusiasm for DLC, it was This-Year’s-Me who decided to make a quick Tweet to address the issue.

This was a little irritating. Has there ever been a time where we didn't look forward to DLC for Destiny?

 

[lt519]

At least acknowledging they screwed up the communication and that they will hopefully learn how to better communicate weapon balancing in the future.

As for Auto Rifles they need to play test more if they think a fractional change in damage per bullet on precision shots within range is actually going to make a difference in a fire fight.

What's 0.04% base change in final
What's 15% base in final

How will those numbers be even REMOTELY similar

Somebody explain that to me.

They don't need to be. The idea was to bring Pulse Rifles down significantly and provide a little buff for Auto Rifles. They weren't meant to be even. They actually accomplished what they wanted with Pulse Rifles (albiet the numbers were obfuscated from us in the preview). Whether that Auto Rifle buff is enough is highly questionable. But the numbers don't need to be the same. Especially because its on a per bullet basis and you need to factor in fire rate and magazine size.

Hypothetically:
A 10% difference in Auto Rifles could drop 20 per bullet to 18 per bullet and over a 50 round clip that you can fire in two seconds that would be 100 damage over two seconds. For Pulse Rifles a 10% change in damage from 33 to 30 per round when you can fire 15 rounds in 2 seconds only drops 45 damage. It's all still just obscured behind a lot of formulas, which i get they don't want to give away, but they need to find a better way to interpret this information to us and explain it. Small percentages will affect Auto Rifles more than they will a Pulse Rifle because of these factors. On top of that they wanted a slight buff to Autos and a decent sized nerf to Pulse Rifles. You need a higher percentage number to have an effect on something that fires slower.

 

[BreezyLimbo]

So wait

if we assume that you fire a 50 bullet clip at 60 fps, does that mean it's a .08% increase?

Bungie where's my extra 30fps to get that sweet auto rifle buff

 

[Terrordactyl]

I'm fairly ambivalent toward the BWU. On one hand, it sounds like Urk gets it, and like Gheleon said, we need a compass for content, I'm glad that something is coming and I really hope it's substantial. Hell, I'd take a new MP mode like banner or trials, not necessarily a mode but a new event with new maps. That would be substantial enough in my opinion. I'd love an event that was nothing but well designed skirmish maps, maps that actually are designed specifically for the damned mode type.

On the other side of things though, festival of the lost is not the kind of content they should be pursuing to keep people playing. That's not much of a reason to play IMO

 

[j0hnny_385]

But, but, but...guys... Professor Broman said everything is fine now and we should all just relax and enjoy this amazing game.
Because...BWU like... explained stuff...and you know... all's good nao?

 

[BreezyLimbo]

This could have all been avoided if the weapons we got in game had actual numbers and stats show on them instead of obtuse progress bars with little meaning.

That's the thing. They think bars are a good thing. Everybody fucking loves bar. You see that light level? You get to fill in a bar. Levelling gear? Fill in those damn bars. Bars bars bars. Even the goddamn Sparrow Race is one huge goddamn bar you progress through shown on the side.

Hey Bungie, you can stick your bars up your ass.

 

[xVaalbarAx]

I'm at the point where if they add a new 3 player PVE end game mode I'd be excited. I'm glad that we are getting CONTENT in 2016. Because these events are not great :/

 

[Rainmaker]

This was a little irritating. Has there ever been a time where we didn't look forward to DLC for Destiny?

Yeah. That irritated me too. Their little passive aggressive "jokes" are insufferable and they keep making them.

 

[Liamc723]

But, but, but...guys... Professor Broman said everything is fine now and we should all just relaxed and enjoy this amazing game.
Because...BWU like... explained stuff...and you know... all's good nao?

Yeah they have a road map now so everything is fine!! I can't wait for the next event that last time gave me a mask!!!

God, his positivity is just ridiculous sometimes.

 

[Deku Tree]

Second event of 2016 is going to bring a level cap increase IMO.

 

[Sentinalprimus]

Hell, I'd take a new MP mode like banner or trials, not necessarily a mode but a new event with new maps. That would be substantial enough in my opinion. I'd love an event that was nothing but well designed skirmish maps, maps that actually are designed specifically for the damned mode type.

Still waiting for the Arsenal mode that was datamined a while back.

"It takes improvisation to win with what you find on the battlefield." —Lord Shaxx
Take the Armament and destroy your foes.

 

[Kor of Memory]

Second event of 2016 is going to bring a level cap increase IMO.

And maybe if we're lucky we'll get to spend another 4 months rolling the dice to reach that cap...

Spoiler

I'm sorry, that's a shit post. The BWU didn't really do anything for me regarding this whole situation.

 

[Blue Ninja]

Isn't that what the current post is? The values shown now are correct, and not the "under the scenes" numbers that were previously shown in error

What is the point of posting values if we can't see them ourselves? They must be felt?

Come on!

What he said. It just doesn't make any sense.

 

[inthrall]

What's 0.04% base change in final
What's 15% base in final

How will those numbers be even REMOTELY similar

Somebody explain that to me.

Necrochasm does 2.16% more dps
Name a pulse rifle and I can tell you how much less dps it does

 

[Sentinalprimus]

Doing a Nightfall, join if you need it.

 

[Spizz]

If this base damage increase is based on each bullet doing 0.04% more than before, that adds up to 2.4% more damage in the same timeframe, assuming a 60 bullet clip.

Spoiler

I'm uncertain if they are referring to base damage or dps though, if its base damage then the above is correct

Nothing game changing, but a step in the right direction. Although it may be more than enough because of other the other guns' mediocrity. PR got hit way too hard IMO.

 

[Kor of Memory]

Necrochasm does 2.16% more dps
Name a pulse rifle and I can tell you how much less dps it does

The Stranger's Rifle.

 

[TheAquaticApe]

So I just keep using my Hawksaw sprinkled in with MIDA? Got it.



SIGH.

 

[SnakeEyes]

Necrochasm does 2.16% more dps
Name a pulse rifle and I can tell you how much less dps it does

Nirwen's Mercy.

(The only gun I'm currently using in PvP.)

Still waiting for the Arsenal mode that was datamined a while back.

"It takes improvisation to win with what you find on the battlefield." —Lord Shaxx
Take the Armament and destroy your foes.

That would actually be hella fun, and being some chaos to a PvP game. Kinda like theat one CoD game type, whose name I can't remember.

 

[Slammin_Hammon]

Ugh. We don't need events, we need content. I want additional strikes and raids, not transient microtransaction stuffed bullshit. Speaking of bullshit, I'm calling bullshit on the auto rifle non-explanation. The crux of it was "there's lots of numbers so you might feel it." Why won't they admit that they improperly buffed the ARs? On 2 different instances they said they planned to Buff by actual percentages, not fractions of a percent. I could care less about ARs but the lies and backtracking need to stop. I swear Bungie started year 2 strong with the Taken King and it fixed a lot of problems, but they have continously pissed away all of the goodwill they earned at an alarming rate.