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[Waldini]

Lol @ the reactions to the patch notes. Why do you people still play if you're always so miserable? Shit never changes with this fanbase. Embarrassing.

Shit never changes? O, it does though. Yet the biggest complaint the fanbase has will never get fixed.

What was the major complaint in Year 1? TLW and Thorn. Done. They nerfed ALL hand-cannons. Even with these weapons tearing up PvP I still had more fun then I have now.

Then they nerfed the Auto-Rifles, Shotguns, Sniper Rifles, Fusion Rifles.. the only thing that is dominant in PvP now is a fucking Pulse Rifle. Tell me, how many times did you get killed by one?

What do you mean, shit never changes? How can you maintain a positive state of mind when, instead of fixing the biggest issue called LAG, they nerf everything that didn't need nerfing at all.

 

[Kadey]

The people who are "complaining" have a reason to complain. Nobody is right or wrong. It's a matter of perspective.

If people think this is bad they really have no clue about actual competitive play.

 

[figadapaura]

I still can't get over Hawkmoon getting nerfed again. 😂

Oh, Bungie.

 

[Psychoward]

So how does gear work in non trials Crucible? I have the 1000 yard stare with 285 attack and a shotgun with 268 attack but I prefer using shotguns in pvp, can I equip the Shotgun and be fine?


Also any vendors sell legendary ghost shells or artifacts? Two last legendary slots I need.

 

[P44]

The people who are "complaining" have a reason to complain. Nobody is right or wrong. It's a matter of perspective.

If people think this is bad they really have no clue about actual competitive play.

What's the competitive scene like now? I played and watched the competitive streamers during year 1.

 

[Kadey]

So how does gear work in non trials Crucible? I have the 1000 yard stare with 285 attack and a shotgun with 268 attack but I prefer using shotguns in pvp, can I equip the Shotgun and be fine?


Also any vendors sell legendary ghost shells or artifacts? Two last legendary slots I need.

Light and levels do not matter in regular PVP.

What's the competitive scene like now? I played and watched the competitive streamers during year 1.

I wouldn't say Destiny even has one. Doesn't involve actual sponsors and money so stakes really aren't there besides pride. In other communities it's a lifestyle and nerfs and buffs could literally change people's lives.

 

[DrDrizzay101]

So how does gear work in non trials Crucible? I have the 1000 yard stare with 285 attack and a shotgun with 268 attack but I prefer using shotguns in pvp, can I equip the Shotgun and be fine?


Also any vendors sell legendary ghost shells or artifacts? Two last legendary slots I need.

Regular Crucible modes (excluding Trials and Iron Banner) don't account for Attack rating at all. So it doesn't matter if a given sniper is 100 or 335 Light, it will do the same damage. If you wanted to use shotguns instead, go right ahead. What does matter are the stats (Impact, Rate of Fire, Stability, Range, etc.) and the perks on the guns. Each weapon class is balanced around Impact and RoF, so higher Impact means each shot does more damage but also the RoF will be lower so you can't shoot as fast. The perks can either boost these stats (like increase a shotgun's range) or give another type of bonus entirely (maybe bonus grenade energy after a kill). Bottom line is don't worry about the Attack/Light Level but do make sure the perk nodes are upgraded if it's a gun you like.

As for legendary Ghosts, you can buy them at the Crucible or Vanguard vendors in the Tower. Don't sweat the perks too much, but the stats can be important if you want more Intellect for faster Super charge, for example. Check out those two vendors and pick whatever you like, just remember you'll need Legendary Marks. As for Artifacts, you'll need to do Court of Oryx for that. I don't think any vendors sell Legendary ones, except maybe Eris, but she might only give them in faction rank-up packages. You can check out this website to see the Tower ghosts for sale:

https://towerghostfordestiny.com/index.php/tower-vendor-rolls/#selectedArmorType=Ghost

 

[HigXx]

Anyone for a Nightfall?

 

[mehrmantrout]

What's the competitive scene like now? I played and watched the competitive streamers during year 1.

There is no competitive scene anymore. What was there was singlehandedly carried by a small group of players, they all play Overwatch now. Which has a developer that encourages competition

 

[the_id]

Anyone worried that the lack of ROI in E3 is not a good sign for the expansion? Bungie said there will be more details on the game but so far only a 5 min talk with keighly with nothing new to say.

 

[E92 M3]

Tripmine - 3% dmg reduction and you can't stick people with it not the end of the world

Arc blade - increased by 2 seconds which in PVP terms it's enough. It lasts longer when you actually hit someone instead of spamming it like a mad person.

Shadestep - use it more carfully know that you have 1 dodge.

Wombo Combo - well that thing is just damn annoying, smoke grenades needed a nerf.

I'm on the same boat with you on Hawkmoon they really need to stop touching that gun.

Their not telling you to not use hunters in crucible but to take these changes and integrate them in you play style as a hunter.

Trivial maybe the Wrong word to use but all these changes don't seem like a big deal to me.

Those changes aren't trivial for players that actually commit to the hunter class.

Oh bungie...

what the actual fuck at some of the nerfs. Good job at nerfing bladedancer, that was like the single most OP thing in the game. /s Do you expect me to just run around on the ground hoping for people not to teamshoot me? I mean... who thinks of that stuff?

It feels like the people who balance the game don't actually play the game. It seems like all they do is look at a stats screen and the most popular streamer and go like "let's nerf the shit out of that."

Blade was fun to play. It had a super high skill ceiling that very few people actually reached AND it was also arguably the worst super in the game. And now it's even worse. GG bungie, I guess I'll play even less pvp than before.

What data sources do they use when deciding which part of the game needs rebalancing?

We know they keep an eye on K/Ds of weapons, class and subclass and Urk have been on record saying that one of their principles of weapon balancing is to keep K/Ds around 1.0.

But what data source do they use when deciding what particular perk of a weapon or subclass node to buff/nerf? Relying on data that they collect on the crucible is one thing, but do they actually watch how the players are playing with these weapons?

This current round of rebalancing shows that they're relying too much on the data they collect but not actually SEE how their game is being played.

I wish they would at least do a playtest or do a closed BETA whenever they want to rebalance things.

That's the problem, gents - they only look at spreadsheets. Otherwise I see no justification for a random tripmine nerf. Also, they tend to overnerf. The doctrine did not need a 6% reduction - that's huge.

Lol @ the reactions to the patch notes. Why do you people still play if you're always so miserable? Shit never changes with this fanbase. Embarrassing.

http://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/passion

 

[WeTeHa]

Anyone for a Nightfall?

I can run NF x3.

 

[Trakan]

Just read the patch notes. I feel like the tripmine changes are unnecessary but I'm not gonna get salty about it. Gunslinger is probably my 2nd favorite PvP subclass next to Bladedancer, so I am definitely getting "hurt" by the changes but it's not going to destroy my playstyle. Everything else though is solid. PvE super buffs are great, bringing Sunbreakers back a little bit is great, buffing the unused grenades is a great move, and honestly, the viking funeral change makes Sunsinger an even more interesting Support build character, which I am way more interested in.

Overall I'm not too bothered? Reddit's really rustled by this and I know a few friends of mine are sounding like they are done with the game over it.

Ever since the patch notes dropped people are just nit picking and complaining about the most trivial things and blowing it out of proportion.

It's really how and why things are nerfed that matters to me. I personally don't use tripmines, but can see how this is a stupid change. It's something that was not overpowered, and nobody ever complained about. It was all based on usage/popularity and data. The tripmine was the only sticky grenade that had absolutely no "magnetism" and required skill to stick to someone. There are still plenty of sticky grenades that will stick to you and one shot kill you.

I'm more upset that they're wasting time and resources nerfing pointless things based on data instead of dealing with the real problems with the balance of the game, like sniper aim assistance. It's at comic levels and absolutely absurd.

thats the biggest thing, until they introduce flinch when ADS it's all moot

That's not even enough IMO. That doesn't stop the ridiculous AA when you're turning a corner or shooting at someone else. They need to bring it back to Y1 levels and everything would be fine. It was too easy then, but it wasn't gamebreaking like it is now.

 

[P44]

There is no competitive scene anymore. What was there was singlehandedly carried by a small group of players, they all play Overwatch now. Which has a developer that encourages competition

Is there much scene on console competitively in Overwatch? I always figured majroity of the scene was on PC.

 

[Kadey]

Well I'll be around for a train when the patch hits so...

 

[mehrmantrout]

Is there much scene on console competitively in Overwatch? I always figured majroity of the scene was on PC.

They're trying. Gamebattles have a leaderboard and tournaments and War and Co got sponsored by Paradigm. Though the future will probably be PC due to console life-span

 

[Arrrammis]

Man, everyone is just flipping their shit over the tripmine grenade changes. IMO, they should have been like this from the beginning. They aren't sticky grenades FFS, they are the same type of grenade as lightning and spike grenades: you stick them to a surface and they have a cone of damage perpendicular to said surface. Spike and lightning grenades didn't stick to players, why should tripmines? As far as the damage change, it could only one-shot players with minimum armor or low light players in IB, at least now it's consistent so you know that you'll need to shoot them at least once, instead of waiting until after the grenades explodes to see if they're dead or not.

 

[jmvmadeira]

OK guys, thank you for the raid. That was really good. Sorry about the last part with Orix, i was getting really muddled up with the platforms
Got my first KF raid done, with a challenge on the mix and everything.

I can get Touch of malice now. YAY

 

[all of my hate]

Bungo should release a patch that addresses the issue with them nerfing shit.

 

[Daemul]

There is no competitive scene anymore. What was there was singlehandedly carried by a small group of players, they all play Overwatch now. Which has a developer that encourages competition

They're trying. Gamebattles have a leaderboard and tournaments and War and Co got sponsored by Paradigm. Though the future will probably be PC due to console life-span

I haven't been following the Destiny PvP much lately so a lot of this is new to me. So War and Co have completely left the game and gone over to Overwatch and even gotten sponsers? Damn, thats cool, they deserve it, but without the likes of War high profile sweaties on Destiny are basically done.

 

[MagnetoWasRight]

Regular Crucible modes (excluding Trials and Iron Banner) don't account for Attack rating at all. So it doesn't matter if a given sniper is 100 or 335 Light, it will do the same damage. If you wanted to use shotguns instead, go right ahead. What does matter are the stats (Impact, Rate of Fire, Stability, Range, etc.) and the perks on the guns. Each weapon class is balanced around Impact and RoF, so higher Impact means each shot does more damage but also the RoF will be lower so you can't shoot as fast. The perks can either boost these stats (like increase a shotgun's range) or give another type of bonus entirely (maybe bonus grenade energy after a kill). Bottom line is don't worry about the Attack/Light Level but do make sure the perk nodes are upgraded if it's a gun you like.

As for legendary Ghosts, you can buy them at the Crucible or Vanguard vendors in the Tower. Don't sweat the perks too much, but the stats can be important if you want more Intellect for faster Super charge, for example. Check out those two vendors and pick whatever you like, just remember you'll need Legendary Marks. As for Artifacts, you'll need to do Court of Oryx for that. I don't think any vendors sell Legendary ones, except maybe Eris, but she might only give them in faction rank-up packages. You can check out this website to see the Tower ghosts for sale:

https://towerghostfordestiny.com/index.php/tower-vendor-rolls/#selectedArmorType=Ghost

Technically Trials and Iron Banner don't use the attack rating either. It's a comparison of your average light to their average light and then scaled based on that. It's why the Icebreaker could still one shot headshot people at 170 attack.

 

[optimus8936]

Bungo should release a patch that addresses the issue with them nerfing shit.

"We are nerfing Bungie by 10%, please give us feedback when the patch hits!!"

Spoiler

kappa

Why did they need to nerf doctrine? Here's a better solution! Make it where you can't get persistence and CB on the same gun and boom, it's harder to use but still powerful. It seems like when I start having fun with a gun, they nerf it. TLW is the biggest example of this. I'm still butt hurt over that nerf, completely ridiculous. Here's an idea Bungie. Instead of nerfing thing that don't need nerfing, how about you buff the things that need buffing. Like all the crappy perks that are worthless. Also, instead of looking at spreadsheets, how about you listen to the community on GAF and Reddit and you'll see that what you are doing is hurting your community.

 

[MagnetoWasRight]

A nerf is a nerf and it's easy to see

A nerf is a nerf, and it's easy to see, that it's hard being Snoop D O double G?

 

[optimus8936]

What time does the patch hit?

 

[all of my hate]

Man, everyone is just flipping their shit over the tripmine grenade changes. IMO, they should have been like this from the beginning. They aren't sticky grenades FFS, they are the same type of grenade as lightning and spike grenades: you stick them to a surface and they have a cone of damage perpendicular to said surface. Spike and lightning grenades didn't stick to players, why should tripmines? As far as the damage change, it could only one-shot players with minimum armor or low light players in IB, at least now it's consistent so you know that you'll need to shoot them at least once, instead of waiting until after the grenades explodes to see if they're dead or not.

Because it was fun and we're tired of losing functionality?

 

[MagnetoWasRight]

What time does the patch hit?

The same time that almost every patch has hit ever? 1 pm EST.

How do I raise Queen's Wrath reputation? I finished the house of wolves questline but don't get any other options to raise my rep?

Need that rosegold shader

Not sure if you'll see this, but if you do PoE 34 and 35, you'll get an etheric light, which is worth Queen's Rep when you turn it into Petra.

 

[optimus8936]

The same time that almost every patch has hit ever? 1 pm EST.

I see, thank you, didn't know that they do patches at a set time, good to know that.

 

[DrDrizzay101]

Technically Trials and Iron Banner don't use the attack rating either. It's a comparison of your average light to their average light and then scaled based on that. It's why the Icebreaker could still one shot headshot people at 170 attack.

Of course they use attack rating: when calculating your average light.

 

[P44]

I've worked out why I enjoyed year 1 more. Yeah the balance was a bit fucked, but the weapons at least had character.

 

[E92 M3]

I've worked out why I enjoyed year 1 more. Yeah the balance was a bit fucked, but the weapons at least had character.

Yes, they did. These days it's all about the perks and not the actual weapon as much.

Overall, the biggest problem is that Bungie is pushing for homogenization across the board.

 

[LTWood12]

Lol @ the reactions to the patch notes. Why do you people still play if you're always so miserable? Shit never changes with this fanbase. Embarrassing.

Why not explain why you think some of these complaints are unfounded instead just saying "lol play another game."

People are going into fairly good detail as to why they object to specific changes. We're here to discuss this sort of thing and in this kind of detail. If you disagree and want to contribute your perspective in the discussion then please do.

 

[optimus8936]

Yes, they did. These days it's all about the perks and not the actual weapon as much.

Y1: I got a hopscotch!

Y2: I got a pulse with CB and braced frame!

Definitely not as exciting as it used to be.

 

[LTWood12]

Y1: I got a hopscotch!

Y2: I got a pulse with CB and braced frame!

Definitely not as exciting as it used to be.

Yes everything has an asterisk now. No one is excited about getting weapons now. They're excited about getting rifled/reinforced barrel. That's a hell of a lot less exciting.

 

[deviant1]

All these nerfs

Does Bungie even test this stuff? I feel like every time they buff or nerf any weapon archetype by x% that they go way overboard and any buffs are so small to be insignificant (0.04% buff anybody). Their goal shouldn't be to make whole weapon classes so bad they're unusable but to go for balance so that more weapons are viable. Guess we're back to pulse rifle and Mida meta with this patch.

 

[HigXx]

Start of the Nightfall is a bitch

 

[jmvmadeira]

Start of the Nightfall is a bitch

And in the end i got a 330 ghost. Why do i even bother....

 

[E92 M3]

And in the end i got a 330 ghost. Why do i even bother....

I like doing it for the rep.

 

[all of my hate]

And in the end i got a 330 ghost. Why do i even bother....

I might just skip this. I tend to only do ones that have a burn and no trickle.

 

[mehrmantrout]

I haven't been following the Destiny PvP much lately so a lot of this is new to me. So War and Co have completely left the game and gone over to Overwatch and even gotten sponsers? Damn, thats cool, they deserve it, but without the likes of War high profile sweaties on Destiny are basically done.

He was picked up after a week Imagine that two-years of (near on) singlehandedly trying to hype Destiny PvP and get a community going and end up with Bungie not even acknowledging your or a tournaments existence. then one week of Overwatch and you get sponsored

 

[edukate]

Quick question- is KF and it's weekly challenges still the best way to get loot (335)?

 

[JohnOfMars]

Slept on the changes. Here's where i'm at with them: I like the principle behind *a lot* of the changes.

Here's the usage by class for Trials:

Looking at that chart, which would you say is the only class that hasn't been through a Year 2 Balance update?

Hunters are extremely over-represented in high level play. Shadestep, wombo-combo were broken. And from a weapon's side dependence on single perks to make entire archetypes of guns work was legit awful. I've gotten 2 Eyasluna's ever and immediately sharded them. Etc, etc. These things needed looking at.

But LT's tweet to `newsk` hit the nail on the head. They didn't fix the need for Counterbalance, they just made Counterbalance worse.

As far as guns go, fixing every guns bullet spread "personality" is a massive change, but nerfing counterbalance is a single line change. Similarly, buffing or creating new perks that are just as good as Counterbalance is also a huge undertaking. And for class balance, I'd say that Titans and Warlocks came through mostly okay, but these Hunter changes are mostly negative. Bungie's baseline for acceptable fun and power fantasy as it turns out, is very low.

There's truth to phrase "it's easier to sand a single bump than raise the entire road." I think we're going to have to stop expecting significant buffs to happen during the live game. They're too much effort. We'll hopefully get buffs with saleable DLC and then slight "adjustments" throughout the year. My hope is that since we're not getting new subclasses this fall that the Sandbox team is a taking a really hard look at subclasses and making them more powerful, rather than less.

 

[Lee]

30 flawless runs in year 2. Literally just got my first doctrine with counterbalance (non-adept) this weekend.

This fucking game...

 

[noomi]

OT42 - Now with more sodium!

I still can't get over Hawkmoon getting nerfed again. 😂

Oh, Bungie.

Well hello there Miss Fig ^_^

My once beloved weapon, I only wish that I could have experienced it year 1 before any nerfs

 

[JHall]

He was picked up after a week Imagine that two-years of (near on) singlehandedly trying to hype Destiny PvP and get a community going and end up with Bungie not even acknowledging your or a tournaments existence. then one week of Overwatch and you get sponsored

Bungie has always hated competitive PvP. It's been like that since Halo CE and continues to this day.

 

[BenjaminBirdie]

RIP fun. All my hype for ROI just went out the window with the weapon and subclass NERFS. Thanks Bungie!

are you saying you think ROI won't have enough...ROI?

(lol its the same abbreviation for two things)

 

[Zocano]

Man, everyone is just flipping their shit over the tripmine grenade changes. IMO, they should have been like this from the beginning. They aren't sticky grenades FFS, they are the same type of grenade as lightning and spike grenades: you stick them to a surface and they have a cone of damage perpendicular to said surface. Spike and lightning grenades didn't stick to players, why should tripmines? As far as the damage change, it could only one-shot players with minimum armor or low light players in IB, at least now it's consistent so you know that you'll need to shoot them at least once, instead of waiting until after the grenades explodes to see if they're dead or not.

Basically how I feel about the tripmine grenades. Thought they did "too much" compared to the other nades. There was little reason at all to use anything else.

Also Blink always needed to get fucked and I'm glad it's getting a nerf.

I think they need to figure out if they want the classes to all be super different or just all feel like the same shit. And while it's almost always been the latter, I would prefer the former (but this would be a much bigger effort and probably require a lot more fundamental changes rather than superficial number adjustments). But I would like to see a bigger move with Destiny 2.

 

[Frenden]

My preferred class, subclass, grenade, melee, and primary were all nerfed in this patch.

 

[Ruthless_Barbarian]

Quick question- is KF and it's weekly challenges still the best way to get loot (335)?

Yes, but it's not the only source of 335 gear.

 

[everyday math]

I still can't get over Hawkmoon getting nerfed again. 😂

Oh, Bungie.

Fig

 

[DrDrizzay101]

Basically how I feel about the tripmine grenades. Thought they did "too much" compared to the other nades. There was little reason at all to use anything else.

Also Blink always needed to get fucked and I'm glad it's getting a nerf.

Blink got f'ed plenty with huge nerfs at the end of Y1. The current nerf is comparatively very minor but honestly confusing. Why a -1 penalty to Recovery? Blink is a really fun and unique movement ability with a high skill ceiling. The game needs to lean into its tremendous sense of motion as a focal point for "feeling Legendary."