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[optimus8936]

What's the bet those complaining loudest regarding it are scout/sniper corner camping warlocks? PvP is basically ruined now with the balance being so off with those two classes of weapon. Moving and shooting is a thing of the past. :'(

I am a Hunter. I use HCs and used Doctrine when it was prevalent and am a Bladedancer main, so generally my setup forces me to play aggressive 24/7. And you know what? I think it was OP in HoW, without a doubt and it makes the game way less fun than any Warlock with a scout/sniper that seem to be the ONLY people that hate Thorn.

Like Frenden said, I want to know where you get the Warlock-scout thing.

 

[NeOak]

Thorn hate is delicious, it was never really OP - especially now and when it was first on the scene. There was a period in the middle where it became viable in PvP and could finally compete with its contemporaries TLW and Hawkmoon but that's about it.

What's the bet those complaining loudest regarding it are scout/sniper corner camping warlocks? PvP is basically ruined now with the balance being so off with those two classes of weapon. Moving and shooting is a thing of the past. :'(

What the....

Thorn wasn't OP? LOL

Did you even play the game? Pls.

Oh, and you may think Sniper is overall the most used special. There are more shotguns in use than snipers according to trackers.

 

[JohnOfMars]

Thorn hate is delicious, it was never really OP - especially now and when it was first on the scene. There was a period in the middle where it became viable in PvP and could finally compete with its contemporaries TLW and Hawkmoon but that's about it.

What's the bet those complaining loudest regarding it are scout/sniper corner camping warlocks? PvP is basically ruined now with the balance being so off with those two classes of weapon. Moving and shooting is a thing of the past. :'(

Never really OP?

Here's how it was last year:

Currently [in Year 1], Thorn with Aggressive Ballistics works as follows:

• 1 Headshot deals 84 points of damage.
• 1 Bodyshot deals 56 points of damage.
• 1 Thorn Burn deals 7 x 6 points of damage, totaled at 42.

Doing the math, that would mean:

2 Thorn Headshots + 1 Thorn DoT = 210 points of damage.
3 Thorn Bodyshots + 1 Thorn DoT = 210 points of damage.​

210 pts of damage kills everything, but Year 1 Ramlocks.

You could kill with 3 body shots, at maximum fire rate. With a range greater than Hawkmoon (base range of only 32). It was only counterable by TLW at close range.

So let's go over that again.

• A gun that kills with 3 body shots.
• And it's the highest Rate of Fire archetype. That's 0.8 seconds for 3 shots.
• With a best in class range stat of 38, when every other gun in High ROF has a max range of 25(!). Guess what other gun has a base range of 38? Eyasluna.
• Oh yeah, and it has Send It! for a range boost.

And that's before you get into the -2 to recovery, the damage DoT, the tracking. You can maybe make claims about how it is now not OP, but come on.

"Never really OP"

Sincerely,

A titan who loves all weapons, and loves Destiny for its skillful movement.

 

[WipedOut]

You must have played a different game than I did during HoW.

Plain and Simple. Thorn was a gun that allowed the average PvPer to compete at a high level.

Oh, for the record, I use Shotguns and don't camp. Instead of needing a crutch to beat snipers I just got better with movement and gun skill.

18 kills with universal remote/sidearm bladedancer/bones combo. Was just whipping around frontier. Open area maps like that and rusted land are great for it. Can't wait to tear up some thorn users and tea-bag their scummy corpses.

 

[Dez_]

All of this new info looks really great. I'm really excited for this expansion, though I am trying to keep expectations in check. Kill confirmed mode sounds pretty great. I enjoyed that in Call of Duty. Artifacts actually doing something sounds pretty great too, though I wonder how long until stuff gets nerfed due to pvp. This

Memory of Skorri: speeds super recharge for all nearby allies

I'm curious about. I can see this a very frustrating thing to go against in pvp, depending on how much faster this increases the super meter. Getting chain killed by supers over and over is not something I enjoy experiencing.

Also, LOL at sprint cool down being an artifact perk. Why not just remove that silly cooldown?

 

[Glendemonium]

So, came here after watching MoreConsole hype the RoI news.

Game looks fantastic compared to Year One, I was so burned out farming Crota for days on end and lost my raid static to Trials of Osirus, and the other one that was three people. The other half of our static were pretty flaky and unreliable so I was left to my own devices and quit before TTK released.

I'm considering getting back into the game, but on PS4. Started on Xbox One. Has Bungie said anything about letting us transfer our guardians over from one system to another? Or is that still a no go?

Thanks.

 

[Namikaze1]

What's the bet those complaining loudest regarding it are scout/sniper corner camping warlocks? PvP is basically ruined now with the balance being so off with those two classes of weapon. Moving and shooting is a thing of the past. :'(

Shotgun Titan scumbag here.
I don't camp. I rush like hell.
I don't like using sniper. It's just not my playstyle.

Thorn is an OP weapon. No one can't deny that. There's a lot of data out there that clearly shows this. Hell, just check John's post.


Anyway, Thorn is a trash weapon.

 

[SpecX]

Thorn is coming back the way Gjallarhorn is - a shadow of their former selves.

I wish it stayed behind but only so they wouldn't nerf it and I could still use it in PvP. Bringing it forward will = Hawkmoon treatment (nerf it until nobody wants to use it).

And for what it's worth: OP Thorn / TLW was way way way less annoying a meta than shitty primaries + sniper city which is what we've had for a year.

Yes, I hated Thorn, but compared to snipers all over the place, it was a much better time. I can't run any map with a long distance without snipers destroying me. I play frontier and get sniper at almost all doorways from spawns A and C. Love this salt and tears about the return of thorn.

 

[optimus8936]

If anything, it was Warlocks who loved Thorn the most lol. Thorn+Firebolts back then were a dirty combo.

 

[ocean]

Re: Thorn not being OP in Y1

2 head shot kill.

That's 0.4s

At range. With a primary.

(Disclaimer: still better than current meta, but "not OP" is laughable)

 

[Namikaze1]

If anything, it was Warlocks who loved Thorn the most lol. Thorn+Firebolts back then were a dirty combo.

Having Year 1 Trials flashbacks. So many Sunsinger Ramlocks with Thorn.

 

[ocean]

Having flashbacks to year 1 ToO. So many Sunsinger Ramlocks with Thorn.

Best combo tho. Best combo. Firebolt for + 1 Thorn tap.

 

[soultron]

I'm trying COE (or POE, whatever the boss rush one is) on PS4 if someone wants to jump in with me.

PSN souItron (the lower case L is an upper case i)

 

[Namikaze1]

Best combo tho. Best combo. Firebolt for + 1 Thorn tap.

Best combo? Nah, ocean. That was nightmare inducing. I hated playing those teams. Thank god I had Capitan Todd sniping fools then.

 

[E92 M3]

If anything, it was Warlocks who loved Thorn the most lol. Thorn+Firebolts back then were a dirty combo.

Thorn plus Firebolts was a thing of nightmares.

*shudder*

 

[Rainmaker]

I dont give a shit about pvp meta. i just want these cool guns to be fun in pve. so many of the weapons i have to use now are bland and boring. give me that thorn and gjally. so tired of pvp dictating almost everything about the weapons.

 

[todd360]

Best combo? Nah, ocean. That was nightmare inducing. I hated playing those teams. Thank god I had Capitan Todd sniping fools then.

What are they doing? We can't go back to those days! Can't they ban thorn from Trials and Iron Banner at least?

Thorn plus Firebolts was a thing of nightmares.

*shudder*

Firebolts are so broken. Add thorn to the equation and your already dead.

 

[optimus8936]

Make Gally great is all I ask for. I don't want this imposter they are advertising. Where is the Gally I grew to love that I got like a month before Xur sold it anyways? Where is the gun that I only used on bosses?

Give it me Bungie. Bring back the greatest gun to ever come to Destiny. I don't want this thing that doesn't even proc Wolfpack Rounds half the time, I want the real deal.

 

[Namikaze1]

Prepare for the return of Triple Thorn using Ramlock Sunsingers, ToO players. The nightmare has return.

Spoiler

Kill me. ;__;

 

[Rollo Tomasi]

Yeah, screw this bladedancer quest. No way in hell I'm getting 30 multi-kill with it.

Load up Mayhem Clash, the weekly crucible playlist for this week, and you should be able to get this done in a few matches pretty quickly.

 

[soultron]

Only need 1 more for COE if anyone wants in

 

[todd360]

Prepare for the return of Triple Thorn using Ramlock Sunsingers, ToO players. The nightmare has return.

Spoiler

Kill me. ;__;

It was fun beating those teams though. You have to feel like shit when you can't even win with the most OP play style in the game.

 

[Namikaze1]

Give it me Bungie. Bring back the greatest gun to ever come to Destiny.

You talking about Necrochasm right? RIGHT?!

 

[TheTylerDurden]

All this fear of Thorn is rational.

IF.. and only if, it's power is increased over what it is now.

But since we don't know if it will be and how that will all play out, then it's hard to get too upset about it right now.

We all know that Bungie knows the gun was overpowered. They would not have changed it (nerfed it)otherwise...and their decision to not advance it to year 2 doubles down on that.

I'm going to go out on a limb and that the I think Bungie knows better than to repeat that mistake, and they will mitigate any power spikes by changing characteristics of the gun to make it not such a big deal. I do not think the artifact that is being discussed that deals with DoT damage is designed primarily for thorn as there are several other things that do DoT damage, and RoI may introduce us to more.

Have to say though...those of you saying that gun was not overpowered at it's peak, well, you really didn't play much PvP around that time I guess.

 

[Arrrammis]

So, came here after watching MoreConsole hype the RoI news.

Game looks fantastic compared to Year One, I was so burned out farming Crota for days on end and lost my raid static to Trials of Osirus, and the other one that was three people. The other half of our static were pretty flaky and unreliable so I was left to my own devices and quit before TTK released.

I'm considering getting back into the game, but on PS4. Started on Xbox One. Has Bungie said anything about letting us transfer our guardians over from one system to another? Or is that still a no go?

Thanks.

You can transfer from xbox360 to Xbox one or PS3 to PS4, but I don't think you can transfer from Xbox one to PS4. Still, on Gaf most people are playing on PS4, so you'll probably find a group faster if you're playing on PS4. Welcome back to DestinyGaf!

 

[Namikaze1]

It was fun beating those teams though. You have to feel like shit when you can't even win with the most OP play style in the game.

It was fun but it got tiresome coming across mostly triple Ramlock teams quickly. I'm now expecting the first team I come across in ToO year 3 to be a full Thorn+Ram Sunsinger team. It's just not fun playing against those teams. We groaned a lot whenever we came across them back in HoW days.

Anyway, I should get off. So sleepy.

 

[Kadey]

Thorn in its current state is fine.

 

[BreezyLimbo]

Year 1 Thorn should be the baseline for all exotics. They're exotics, not pea shooters.

Thorn is the most balanced weapon in its hey day.

 

[todd360]

Year 1 Thorn should be the baseline for all exotics. They're exotics, not pea shooters.

Thorn is the most balanced weapon in its hey day.

Also we want prenerf mythoclast! The people have spoken!

Todd out.

 

[BreezyLimbo]

Also we want prenerf mythoclast! The people have spoken!

Todd out.

Hey I agree, Mythoclast and Thorn.

Gjallahorn could stay in the dumpster tho

 

[RichiRamjag]

You must have played a different game than I did during HoW.

Plain and Simple. Thorn was a gun that allowed the average PvPer to compete at a high level.

Oh, for the record, I use Shotguns and don't camp. Instead of needing a crutch to beat snipers I just got better with movement and gun skill.

Preach!

Yes, I hated Thorn, but compared to snipers all over the place, it was a much better time. I can't run any map with a long distance without snipers destroying me. I play frontier and get sniper at almost all doorways from spawns A and C. Love this salt and tears about the return of thorn.

If you're getting eaten alive by snipers, then that's an issue with your movement and environmental awareness mate. Thorn isn't going to help much.

You guys need to stop acting like everyone who didn't like thorn just snipes all day. I'm not salty and I rarely touch my sniper, but it was a trash tier weapon and a crutch for many and I couldn't stand the meta.

I'd kill to go back to the era of Thorn and blink Shotgunning.

Annoying as those two were, the current state of the Crucible is even more infuriating to me. It's Snipers: The Game. I'm so sick of everyone just sitting back watching every doorway on the map with their dumb low-skill no-sway sniper rifles.

I want snipers to be majorly overhauled for Destiny 2 PvP.

It definitely needs to be addressed, but let's not trade one trash scenario for another.

 

[Double Donut]

I'd kill to go back to the era of Thorn and blink Shotgunning.

Annoying as those two were, the current state of the Crucible is even more infuriating to me. It's Snipers: The Game. I'm so sick of everyone just sitting back watching every doorway on the map with their dumb low-skill no-sway sniper rifles.

I want snipers to be majorly overhauled for Destiny 2 PvP.

 

[Kadey]

I killed myself more by accidentally falling off a ledge or blowing myself up with a rocket or grenade than getting sniped. One, stay out of lanes, two be more aware of your surroundings unless you're like me and you like to get into sniper battles.

 

[LiveFromKyoto]

Gjallahorn could stay in the dumpster tho

Enh. Anybody who wants to waste their exotic weapon slot on a special can have it imo.

 

[BreezyLimbo]

Honestly you know what I wanna see? I don't want to see them shy from 'powerful' weapons. Whether it's primaries, specials, or heavy. Thorn SHOULD be the baseline. It's up to Bungie to make stronger Primaries to compete with it.

If they really need to, separate the PvP and PvE balance. Players shouldn't be punished for wanting to use one type of weapon over another. If it's an issue in PvP, then flatline stronger weapons, but in Iron Banner/Trials let players go all out.

The artifacts are a good step in variety. There's some obviously catered towards PvP and some towards PvE, but it's obvious that Bungie is risking their philosophy of balance by adding Artifacts that change the way you play.

And that's what should matter. How you play. Not how Bungie wants you to play their game. They should give you the tools, it's up to the player how to utilize those tools. What Bungie has been doing this past year, is slowly removing tools to use. Whether it's nerfing playstyles to the ground, or in general just nerfing things, that's a wrong approach, especially in a game that already feels constricted in how you play it.

Hopefully this new vision of the game-Bringing back exotics deemed 'Broken', making artifacts change the way you play, hopefully it's the new direction Bungie is going in.

 

[Number45]

Yeah, screw this bladedancer quest. No way in hell I'm getting 30 multi-kill with it.

You... probably don't want to start up the Sunsinger equivalent.

Yes, I hated Thorn, but compared to snipers all over the place, it was a much better time. I can't run any map with a long distance without snipers destroying me. I play frontier and get sniper at almost all doorways from spawns A and C. Love this salt and tears about the return of thorn.

The best counter to most snipers (except for those that are legitimately amazing) is to stay mobile, and close distance. Sounds obvious, but when I play with a scout (which I do a lot of the time) I fall foul to snipers because I have a tendency to engage at a distance at which snipers can be effective.

As long as I stay mobile, I tend to get killed far FAR less with snipers.

Spoiler

Fuck shotguns too!

 

[mehrmantrout]

I'm fine with Thorn coming back in its current state, though seeing as Bungie giveth with one hand and take with the other I'm guessing it will be nerfed to some degree (hammer forged for send it is my guess)

Hopefully its not as that would then mean you don't have to put up with the current bullshit of hoping an Eyasluna drops with rifled/reinforced to be able to use a HC (a god roll Eyasluna will beat Thorn hands down)

 

[BreezyLimbo]

Also they should leave year 2 weapons behind.

 

[NeOak]

Also they should leave year 2 weapons behind.

Sometimes I wonder if you actually played this game.

The Dark Below and "331 upgrade" says hi.

 

[j0hnny_385]

Also they should leave year 2 weapons behind.

 

[TheTylerDurden]

Also they should leave year 2 weapons behind.

 

[BreezyLimbo]

Sometimes I wonder if you actually played this game.

The Dark Below and "331 upgrade" says hi.

hey that's ok, you wanna keep using your old weapon that's ok. More new weapons for me that will have relevant perks.

I just don't want to hear any complaining that your year 2 weapons feel underpowered.

 

[TheTylerDurden]

hey that's ok, you wanna keep using your old weapon that's ok. More new weapons for me that will have relevant perks.

I just don't want to hear any complaining that your year 2 weapons feel underpowered.

I don't think anyone will have a problem with that, provided we don't hear any complaints from you when Thorn isn't the second coming you are hoping for.

Deal?

 

[NeOak]

hey that's ok, you wanna keep using your old weapon that's ok. More new weapons for me that will have relevant perks.

I just don't want to hear any complaining that your year 2 weapons feel underpowered.

That would require you to play this game.

Since you don't currently play, the only option you will have is to get the new weapons with the possible shit rolls that we already have weeded out.

Good luck. I'm happy with my current weapons and I will infuse them to 400 LL.

 

[BreezyLimbo]

That would require you to play this game.

Since you don't currently play, the only option you will have is to get the new weapons with the possible shit rolls that we already have weeded out.

Good luck. I'm happy with my current weapons and I will infuse them to 400 LL.

Don't worry, I'm sure when RoI comes out it'll be easy catching up~ And unlike some, I shan't have spent hundreds of hours looking for the "Perfect Roll"~ Because min/maxing is is only important for those who fret about Trials/Banner.

Spoiler

srsly tho Neoak, don't be angry that I don't play this game daily, and that it'll be easy catching up when RoI hits. No need to be so elitist about your perfect rolls, cause I don't really care about that jazz

 

[NeOak]

Don't worry, I'm sure when RoI comes out it'll be easy catching up~ And unlike some, I shan't have spent hundreds of hours looking for the "Perfect Roll"~ Because min/maxing is is only important for those who fret about Trials/Banner.

You really don't play this game.

 

[Kadey]

Exclusive look at year two thorn.

 

[BreezyLimbo]

You really don't play this game.

So elitist! NeOak, chill out. I've put my time in my game, I don't have to play it daily to 'prove' anything. Go outside, you'll hurt your eyes playing Destiny all the time.

 

[NeOak]

So elitist! NeOak, chill out. I've put my time in my game, I don't have to play it daily to 'prove' anything. Go outside, you'll hurt your eyes playing Destiny all the time.

Says the one glued to GAF to complain about the game he doesn't play in the OT thread about said game.

Had, you know, actually played the game instead of complaining so much in the OT and even getting banned, you would actually have weapons with good rolls.

 

[EloquentM]

*sigh*