reading this while the current nightfall still grants bonus-damage for every element available in-game is so surreal.
I can't go back to the bulletsponges I escaped through honest and hard videogame-labor. i just can't.
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Destiny |OT7| "In the Garden of Suros" by I. Ron Banner
- Thread starter The Librarian
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reading this while the current nightfall still grants bonus-damage for every element available in-game is so surreal.
I can't go back to the bulletsponges I escaped through honest and hard videogame-labor. i just can't.
whats so weird about their pvp over pve mentality is how incredibly bare bones the pvp component is, there is practically nothing to it outside of the four matchmaking playlist.
Um, unless I was watching the wrong video that's the opposite of 'on the disc'. The player spent ages jumping through broken scenery and terrain to reach the new area, and even in there it wasn't finished. I'm not sure 5 minutes of trick jumping through grey expanses counts as finished content.
Tbh, I'm beginning to think these leaks are deliberate - I cannot imagine how someone could find the area highlighted in that video without someone tipping them off. The player jumped through multiple grey voids and invisible platforms without any indicator of where they were going or why.
Tbh, I'm beginning to think these leaks are deliberate - I cannot imagine how someone could find the area highlighted in that video without someone tipping them off. The player jumped through multiple grey voids and invisible platforms without any indicator of where they were going or why.
AusRoachman
Member
Still takes him 2 months to randomly spawn in some enemies and add shitty dialog.
AusRoachman
Member
Watch the video in this link
http://www.bungie.net/en/Forum/Post/72764027/0/0
Most definitely is content ready, just needs enemies.
of the course the first time I decide to pvp and use pocket infinity it gets nerfed 3 days later! >.<
Glitched up leftover content? Clearly held back DLC.
I'm going to assume areas introduced with the release of the DLC will be reachable without it. I'm also going to assume that the only way to get certain mobs, enemies, or bosses to show up will be to own the DLC.
You know, like the way the rest of Destiny works already, where if you Patrol to an area, there's no boss, but if you're on the Strike or Story, you instance into them being there.
Note: I haven't prebought the DLC and will wait for it to actually release before purchasing, but this is my assumption and makes the most sense.
I'm going to assume areas introduced with the release of the DLC will be reachable without it. I'm also going to assume that the only way to get certain mobs, enemies, or bosses to show up will be to own the DLC.
You know, like the way the rest of Destiny works already, where if you Patrol to an area, there's no boss, but if you're on the Strike or Story, you instance into them being there.
Note: I haven't prebought the DLC and will wait for it to actually release before purchasing, but this is my assumption and makes the most sense.
Here is what I don't get. They made the Templar map. They made it possible to jump out there and snipe the boss.
Did they think no one would try and do it?
The same thing with the cheese spot under the deck for archon priest nightfall. They had to know you could get in there, would be super simple to close off.
I'm wondering if they put this stuff in as backdoors to beat stuff easily for playtesting and just didn't think anyone would find them?
Did they put the mytho in the game and think no one would get it? I just don't understand. They had to know it would wreck PvP! What I really don't get is that we now have 3 damage models. PvE, normal cruicible and iron banner. Why are they nerfing it across the board when the modes are all different? The differences are minimal but they don't have to be.
Did they think no one would try and do it?
The same thing with the cheese spot under the deck for archon priest nightfall. They had to know you could get in there, would be super simple to close off.
I'm wondering if they put this stuff in as backdoors to beat stuff easily for playtesting and just didn't think anyone would find them?
Did they put the mytho in the game and think no one would get it? I just don't understand. They had to know it would wreck PvP! What I really don't get is that we now have 3 damage models. PvE, normal cruicible and iron banner. Why are they nerfing it across the board when the modes are all different? The differences are minimal but they don't have to be.
BreezyLimbo
Banned
If it's anything like the phasing, having the DLC will simply 'phase' you into the area entrance(IE Kings Watch/Jovian Complex both have a good stretch before you reach the actual title load of the area, perfect for phasing...)
Dhruv_hanom
Member
You don't understand, it takes time to spawn enemies and make dinklebot talk.
Honestly tough the more I play this game the more I feel like something went seriously wrong during the development.
That or bungie just doesn't know what they're doing.
Der Flatulator
Member
0.98 (nerfed damage, no precision)
1.50 (current damage, with precision)
(1.25 * 0.98) / 1.50 = 0.82 (nerfed damage, with precision)
i.e. this is an ~18% nerf to ARs. Abysmal, without taking into account the stability nerf. :/
1.50 (current damage, with precision)
(1.25 * 0.98) / 1.50 = 0.82 (nerfed damage, with precision)
i.e. this is an ~18% nerf to ARs. Abysmal, without taking into account the stability nerf. :/
re: mapsploits: In house testing can't beat the effectiveness of a million people hammering on the same playspace.
You seriously cannot catch everything.
You would be amazed at how easy this stuff is to miss during development - never ascribe to malice what incompetence can cover. The issue isn't with there being exploits (every online game has them), it's the speed and the response to how you deal with them that's key. So far Bungie appear to be a lot slower and lax about these things than other online games - if the Atheon bug is still in for this week expect to see an almighty amount of cheese!
Twilight Gap
Member
templar spots were intentional and now bungie's blocking them off to prolong the content.
the jumps are too convenient to be unintended. everything is the perfect height and the perfect distance with the perfect lines of sight and the perfect amount of cover for those "cheese" strategies. two positions from the spawn let you see all the oracles but one, which you can see from another platform conveniently placed on the other end of the map within jumping distance. you can also jump from the templar back up to the spawn. almost all the hobgoblin platforms have cover allowing you to hide and regain your shields. that cover isn't there for the AI.
the jumps are too convenient to be unintended. everything is the perfect height and the perfect distance with the perfect lines of sight and the perfect amount of cover for those "cheese" strategies. two positions from the spawn let you see all the oracles but one, which you can see from another platform conveniently placed on the other end of the map within jumping distance. you can also jump from the templar back up to the spawn. almost all the hobgoblin platforms have cover allowing you to hide and regain your shields. that cover isn't there for the AI.
BananasWithGuns
Member
The strange thing to me is that Pocket Infinity never even seemed that good in PvP. I mean, yeah, you could light up an area of the map a couple times but after that you're going to need to go on the hunt for ammo before you can do it again. And even with special ammo being ridiculously prevalent I just don't see any way you could keep your Pocket Infinity full enough to do that consistently.
Like, I think Pocket Infinity pales in comparison to the Invective from a PvP standpoint.
I just have to imagine the change is coming from a PvE standoint, but even then I don't even use my Pocket Infinity that much anymore now that I have Ice Breaker so the nerf is just baffling to me from all standpoints.
SPACECADET
Member
never played the strike before, got an invite right at atheon. after a good bit of grease we nailed him and it was one of the best feelings i've had in a game.
this crew, i'm so glad they invited me. thanks guys.
this crew, i'm so glad they invited me. thanks guys.
definitely agree. though in those 3 days I did pretty well and I don't have the full auto upgrade yet. so since I wasn't spamming as much as I possibly could I wasn't running out of ammo and such. but I will say (maybe it's all fusion rifles I don't know I suck at pvp) .. I was 1 shotting people left and right.
True but this is a level with a jumping puzzle in it... You can't tell me they don't have guides and shit to make a platform unjumpable.
It just so happens the platform is right in jumping distance, has room for a team of 6 and great cover? They had to know about it before... I think they just thought we would not find it.
Yes, I agree.
It shouldn't be more than 6-7% MAX
Having Fusion Rifles staying as they were, MP will continue to be very annoying place.
Duebrithil
Member
True. I'm glad they are trying to fix the exploits (as slow as the progress may be), but if the platforms can be reached by jumping normally just adding a kill volume seems kind of lazy (if it does indeed put them out of bounds). I'd rather they added some new dynamics to the boss so the platforms aren't an unbeatable safe haven.
LollipoPReapeR
Member
These nerfs are bullshit.. Does PvE even exist for you bungie? Why oh why would you nerf weapons for PvP balance than nerf them across the board instead of for the game mode intended.
MagicWithEarvin
Member
Got a legendary Engram from the Cryptarch just now and it turned into an Ice Breaker. Too bad I don't need it since I already have one.
Like I said a few pages back, they're amateurs at this. Hopefully they learn and make a much more refined game if they decide to make another Destiny game. There's still lots of things that need to be fixed/improved.
Like I said a few pages back, they're amateurs at this. Hopefully they learn and make a much more refined game if they decide to make another Destiny game. There's still lots of things that need to be fixed/improved.
Wired All Wrong
Member
never played the strike before, got an invite right at atheon. after a good bit of grease we nailed him and it was one of the best feelings i've had in a game.
this crew, i'm so glad they invited me. thanks guys.
It was fucking awesome (MrJellyBean here). What a great feeling after beating our heads against the wall so many times to get through it. Multiple teammates in and out, routers shitting themselves and just figuring it all out with our limited experience. We became a well oiled machine after a while. Raids are where it's at and I can't wait for more of them. We need to do that again soon. This week hopefully. No Raid gear for me this time around but at least I got Red Death and The Truth on the same run. I'm definitely happy with that.
Hunter-Zero
Member
Heh, that buff to scout rifles makes me happy, it was my main weapon anyway, but always felt underpowered, Proxima Centauri II 4 life, but that nerf to Pocket Infinity? really? out of nowhere and totally random wtf, i was excited to playing with it but now i am really glad that mine was not fully upgraded already, straight to the vault it goes, why would i want to waste time triying to upgrade it now? this just cements my opinion that in this game exotics are just a pain in the ass, fucking exotic bounties with stupid conditions to obtain weapons that are hardly exotic, you can only equip one, and could be nerfed?... give me legendary equipment any day of the week.
I very, very much doubt it. It's incredibly easy in game development to miss this sort of thing, and if you don't have a robust test server that allows a decent number of people to test the content for you tons of things can slip through. Internal teams can miss things that you would think were completely obvious.
It's why WoW has such a vigorous test server schedule - when they released an instance without external testing (Blackwings Lair) the content was so bugged and exploitable it was ridiculous. Players were able to use vanity pets to switch off bosses main abilities to beat the fights... ;-)
I was thinking the same thing in regards to the PVE aspect. I mean, I do like playing PVP sometimes but I'm more of a PVE person and I just don't know what Bungie is doing anymore. You put exotics and different weapons in the game, but as soon as some soft ass people start complaining cause their getting owned, here comes the nerf.
Also, Iron Banner was pretty much a joke IMO. These "events" that basically rehash the same content but add a few weapons/armor that will be obsolete as soon as you get raid gear or a better legendary. I'm tired so excuse my early morning rantings but Bungie needs to step their game up prior to DLC.
SPACECADET
Member
definitely, count me in for whatever. after all that i'd even go on an evening patrol gladly. i said i was getting off but lied. gonna wind down for the night by doing bounties to level up the new weapons so i can get ready for the next time.
Hunter-Zero
Member
Please...
Those spots even have 2 heights with enough room for 6 players, 3 on the bottom and 3 above them, with perfect cover and lines of sight.
It can´t really be more intentional than that.
Unknown Soldier
Member
Phaethon0017
Member
I know for regular Crucible it was allowing me to hold my own. I was in that awkward transition when you just hit level 20 and you equip some light gear you've been saving...
Really wish Ranks and Marks transferred between characters.
Yeah I'm pretty sure I scrapped it too, and since high levels tend to never get white Engram drops it may be gone for good
. Will keep checking the Vendor since he never sells anything good.It's better than that.
You're not the only people to cater for.
Allowing the raid to be cheesed removes accomplishment. It allows people to obtain the gear without the required effort. It removes prestige from end game gear and while you may balk at that, that stuff is Important in a game like this. There are issues with end game gear and RNG though, more about that below...
Groups working together to discover exploits are examples of inginuity and determination, unfortunately the public exploiting their discoveries is far from those things and needs to be removed for the good of everyone.
However these fixes don't address the reason why people took to the exploits so readily in the first place.
What they need to do is add sure fire ways to gear up with raid completions. Have a token system where you receive a guaranteed amount per run, maybe with bonus amounts for fast completion of each section.
Then the good players will devise strategies to get this done that others can use. It will require all elements of the encounter to be engaged with, and each player to play a specific team role. This is a good thing. Currently standing on a platform and shooting the boss while ignoring the other mechanics is a weak accomplishment.
The actual issue here is that the raid rewards are adice roll, and the raid takes a lot of effort to get through. If that effort had a guaranteed reward it would be worth it, working for multiple hours just to get shards you no longer need or some repeated items (essentially not ass you don't need past a certain point) is not worth it.
And it needs to be worth it in a loot game.
it also means the prestige items are tied to random chance, which means the best player(s) in a raid may not get the chance to show off their accomplishment while the ones who made less effort or didn't play as well may find the best items.
Reward everyone equally with guaranteed chance and if the good players want to carry worse players for the same reward it's up to them.
Bungie may know this.
They may be working on content changes. If they are I just wish they'd tell us. Thier communication is dreadful, especially as most of their community news is fed through a guy with the most self-important and condescending prose I've read in a long time.
I'm losing faith they know. I hope I'm wrong.
Everywhere something else was nerfed.
TLW is godly in the right hands already. This gives it even more edge.
The in air accuracy is a nice touch, too.
Kamina
Golden Boy
The platforms are out of bounds.
By the sounds of it I lucked out when I bought the Crypt Dweller scout rifle from Dead Orbit and fully upgraded it. Scouts were in desperate need of some kind of buff though. They just weren't anywhere near as effective as autos or hand cannons.
Also got invective from an exotic bounty. Probably the easiest one I've done so far as everything was left in my hands (unlike the pocket infinity fusion rifle debacle). I've not had a chance to use it yet though. Any good?
What mission is it? Just got online so not had a chance to check it out yet.
Also got invective from an exotic bounty. Probably the easiest one I've done so far as everything was left in my hands (unlike the pocket infinity fusion rifle debacle). I've not had a chance to use it yet though. Any good?
I'm up for the nightfall/weekly in 20 mins
PSN cyborg1
What mission is it? Just got online so not had a chance to check it out yet.
It never occurred to me, or any of the people I've been grouped with, to even attempt to jump onto those platforms.it would be incredibly believable that the same happened with an internal testing group.
You need to ask yourself *why* the designers would deliberately put geometry in place that allows you to exploit the fight. There's no logical reason for them to make their fights an useable in that way, and hence when the exploit was discovered they have hot fixed it out. Anything else starts straying into conspiracy theory land whereas Occam's Razor is a far more realistic and believable option - the platforms were missed during testing, and now they are being removed.
I do sometimes feels I'm showing my age with Destiny. All these arguments about exploits and designer intentions are word for word the same debates we had back in Everquest, and then World ofWarcraft, and all the other mmo's released over the last decade. Realistically, everything we have seen about Destiny's end game and the nightfall strikes so far would point towards a complete failure on their internal testing team rather than a deliberate plan to put secret exploits into every end game activity.
iRAWRasaurus
Banned
Yeah I am down I will add you in a few mins.I'm up for the nightfall/weekly in 20 mins
PSN cyborg1
LollipoPReapeR
Member
What about the one you start on?
Perhaps the maps were made with one jump height in mind, and a tweak later by another team made them reachable very easily.
I was a Community Cartographer for Halo Reach and 4, so I'll use an example from that. I was one of the most paranoid Cartographers in the group with map killzones and softkills. Whereas most other map makers would just put a kill volume across the bottom of the map and call it a day, I would box that shit in on all four sides, and then make the kill boxes themselves (what bungie is using in Destiny) really big to make sure people couldn't phase through them due to latency. Even if it was impossible to reach a spot from inside the map to the outside, i'd still killbox it, just in case.
And people would STILL find cheap spots in maps. What happens is when one spot doesn't work, people will just try other ones. And when one is found, that knowledge spreads like wildfire through the internet, and by the end of the first 24 hours the map is out, people have evolved into finding an exploit spot even better than that, because other players found counters for it. In interntal testing, you are limited by free time (as a volunteer) or paid time (as an internal tester). On the internet, everyone can poopsock the map for 10 hours straight and any cracks in the system will be made larger and apparent. I'd download films anonymously from the in game file share, watch someone break into something i thought was unbreakable, and think to myself "you clever son of a bitch", sigh, and address it in the next update wave.
It hurts even more when the company stops updates and doesn't let you get the exploit fixes in. It hurts when you CAN fix it, because you feel like you let people down, but not as much.
And even if you're super militant with your killboxes, you'll draw negative responses from the playerbase for doing so. It's a balance between them feeling like they're in a location vs "playing on a map". On one of my maps I put softkills in the playable space to keep Humans from having too cheap of a spot to kill Zombies from, since I didn't have to worry about any held Objectives from being reset (ball, flag, etc). You could reach it by simply hopping or walking to it, but it was either that or block off that entire side of the map. I figured it was better to allow people to transition through it but tell them "shoo, go play the game" if they decided to try and stay there. Some people liked it, some people sent me threats over it.
The most important part is that you have the ability to and do address the issues as they come. They can't patch as fast on console as they could on PC, but they're also much faster than they could be with Halo (hotfixes could be one to two months, actual title updates half a year to a year apart). Changing how a boss works touches a lot of systems. Putting killzones in a trouble spot is faster, touches less systems, and addresses the problem.
Kamina
Golden Boy
Good question. I guess not.
Aztechnology
Member
Anyone running hard mode at reset?
LollipoPReapeR
Member
I'm sorry what does kill volume even mean? (And kill box)
Sleepy Buddha
Member
Now I'm itching to see how my maxed out Vision of Confluence does. I use it a lot, but it always felt underpowered compared to my maxed out Suros Regime.
I just hope this week's Nightfall has solar burn, it'll just melt enemies.
I just hope this week's Nightfall has solar burn, it'll just melt enemies.
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