WrenchNinja
Member
You're right, it isn't really the game's fault for having repetitive mission design, poor rewards system and misleading level requirements.
Destiny - Review Thread
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Ivory Samoan
Gold Member
Agree entirely, you got to keep it varied at end-game to avoid fatigue.
This may not be everyone's cup of tea... but for me, it's dang Earl Grey son.
Hate, is entirely the correct word for how many people felt about Phantasy Star Universe. It wasn't a simple case of "ah, I'm not feeling this much"... this game was highly anticipated by a large group of players that would probably say the original was one of their most defining video game moments. PSU not only didn't provide what they wanted, it outright destroyed most of the core values of what most liked in the original, to an extent that the series would never fully return to (PSO2 has a lot of PSU in it still). The word hate simply describes a passionate dislike for something, and that word describes many peoples' feeling of PSU perfectly. I still enjoyed it though, but I'm not going to act like those people's feeling on it were invalid. They were right... what they loved was gone.
Anyhow, I have no problems with someone saying they're enjoying Destiny. But to claim there's nothing like it and use examples like meaningful loot and encounters as your basis (especially when trying to differentiate from Borderless) is very unconvincing. If you like the core game from moment to moment, then you'll probably enjoy the grind to level your character. But if you don't, none of that's going help. It's not people looking at the game wrong.
The AI is weaker. Their awareness in terms of finding places to hide is good (in fact, it's so good it's kinda BS... like Halo sometimes is), but they do not have the range of combat ability or team synergy that the Halo AI does. The enemies in destiny don't work to suppress you as their teammates circle around for an ambush. They don't become emboldened by the fact that they have a larger teammate fighting alongside them. They don't freak out and change behaviour because that teammate was dropped. They don't realise that they need to take a risk and chase you down because your shield is low. They don't even react as well to getting beat. They don't think "fuck it YOLO" once they're about to die, and go in guns blazing. They don't do pretty much any of the stuff that makes Halo's AI truly special. They just run... and hide.
And forget detailed explanations. There's enough videos posted of them being stupid to speak for everyone.
And you're not in here posting the same thing over and over? How many times have you told someone they "need to play the game", or that "if you haven't done X at Y setting yet, you just don't know", or "well us in the OT are loving it"?
If this is a backlash thread, then the OT is a circle jerk. Your opinion isn't better or more valid because you happen to like it.
cripterion
Member
The more I play it the more I dislike it. I might have spent too much time with it and should have probably spaced it out but really besides that raid thing I think I've seen all I needed to see here and I find what Destiny offers to be a mostly boring, repetitive affair.
The fact that the loading times are extremely long doesn't help. Hell I just feel like they should scrap the tower which is absolutely pointless and just do a menu tab where you decrypt, sell, buy your stuff, etc..
Trickster
Member
Most of the activites in Destiny sorta suck though.
Strikes are terrible designwise. All the bosses are just bigger version of normal enemies, and they are only made difficult because of the adds that spawn every so often. And Since there's only 5/6 of them, it gets old really quickly.
The raid is absolutely not gonna be for everyone due to the requirements needed. And we still don't know how it will actually play. If strikes are any indication, it will be pretty damn boring and uninspired.
Daily/weekly is just you doing stuff you've already done. That might not be so bad if the story missions or strikes were well designed, unfortunately they're really not.
Collectibles? What collectibles?
Public events, like so much else in this game, are simply poorly designed and not that interesting. Chasing some random fallen captain with a ridiculous regenerating shield and a ton of hp isn't really exciting, neither is standing within a glowing circle and fending of waves of enemies while dinklebot scans something for the millionth time. etc. The fact that it's not a thing you choose to do, but have to wait around hoping that it happens doesn't really help either.
Crucible is really the only thing in the game that I'm currently doing for fun, and even that is wearing thin thanks to the abundance of things that OHK.
Jacksinthe
Banned
I don't think simply adding players you meet in game on XBL or PSN is a Destiny social feature. Any online game where you can see player names has this ability. As for nonsense typical to chat, you are rolling the dice by adding random people to your friends list. I'd personally rather interact in game first, then decide if I want to friend someone based on their etiquette. There is still no way to send items or messages in game, no trading, no clans, etc. Its as bare as online MP can get for a "connected" game and social aspects.
Nothing you've mentioned happened because of Destiny's social features. I'm curious as to how the game can open up when it is so closed in that regard. You are creating your own social network due to the lack of in-game social aspects.
sometimes i game
Member
I love the fact that the media wasn't scared to give fair reviews to this game. It's beautiful and fun but really nothing new from the look to the gameplay. Usually reviews are glowing for hyped games but the media put their foot down this time.
The beta was fun enough. I picked this up from GS with store credit, and will likely trade it back Oct 8 to get $40 credit back.
The beta was fun enough. I picked this up from GS with store credit, and will likely trade it back Oct 8 to get $40 credit back.
I'm not sure about that. FFXIII did that and got a lot of hate because they didn't have towns or whatever with hotel + stores. Many people like that stuff, adds to the immersion I guess. Of course, the load times are total shit, especially considering the amount of extra ram available on ps4x1.
cripterion
Member
1/2 public events I had, it was so ridiculous, I blasted the guy and his shield kept regenerating and then he just vanished and appeared on the other side of the map, I chased and disappeared. End of event. Absolutely ridiculous.
Other event was the one in the beta with shit appearing at 3 spots and just kill everything around...
The game is terribly uninspired all around.
I want more immersion too but going back to the tower just to collect bounties and wasting minutes with each loading time (when you don't pop in tower and get disconnect from gameworld to redo it all over again...) is such a drag. There's nothing to do in the Tower.
Jacksinthe
Banned
I have to agree. Every boss fight is broken down into
If room: move
If distance: shoot
If close: ground slam
Always: spawn add
There is something to be said about boss fights where the real threat is never the boss, but the countless add that spawn en masse in an attempt to challenge the player NOT with mechanics, but overwhelming the player. I haven't come across a single interesting boss design or mechanic outside of a walker, which only has a "SHOOT THE CORE WHEN ITS EXPOSED" mechanic.
If your boss fights rely on spawning add to make it more difficult and add padding for ammo drops - you are doing something stupidly wrong with your game.
Yes, obviously, and I think Bungie should streamline this and simply make it easier to add people and support that with more seamless matchmaking and other QOL updates instead of opening it up to public chat.
As I said, adding people directly makes people more considerate, at least in my experience.
Then add clan support and clan chat channels so you can create your own controlled "public" chat environments.
Would give the best of both.
Yeah, that's what I hope for.
But Bungie really needs to change their attitude. I don't want to hear them come with more bad excusing or defend the game.
You must be playing a different game to me, because...
They do.
Play with heroic modifiers and his happens dangerously often.
Halo did this better as the grunts vocalised and made it more apparent, but it does happen in Destiny.
Many times I've been holding grunts at bay only for a Captain to run into the fray and the grunts start moving forward more aggresively.
Again, happens much more on harder difficulties.
Not with the same personality, no (which is a real shame). But they do change behaviour and retreat or YOLO.
They do this very often. I notice it even on normal.
Yes they do. As above.
Are you playing exclusively on normal? Even so, I notice these behaviors on normal so I'm not reall sure what to say.
soxinthebox
Member
The tower would make more sense if it acted like a PSO lobby where you can chat with randoms. I mean it's almost it but everyone is muted so there's no reason to hang around.
I'm torn.
I love public chat but I hate it too.
They definitely need to add more options. Maybe with clan support where you get an exclusive clan tower with an open chat channel, things like that.
Or just open up public chat and role the dice.
The Elite
BOSS
After completing the story I am starting to enjoy the game a lot more. It does have an addictive quality. I love running Strikes with randoms. The whole thing definitely has a PSO vibe.
The loot is finally starting to get better as well.
I'm still immensely disappointed by the campaign and characters though. I expect better from Bungie.
The loot is finally starting to get better as well.
I'm still immensely disappointed by the campaign and characters though. I expect better from Bungie.
I kinda wish it had the semi-randomized dungeons from PSO.
How is it misleading? There is a giant "recomended lvl" above everything and a list of modifiers explained.
Now were talking, yes the mission design is lackluster and the bosses are a joke but complaining about farming for hours to level a vendor is not the games fault.
There are golden chests and dead ghosts to collect.
Personaly I find the gunplay to be fun enough to do strikes over and over again, I also loved firefight and this seems like the next step ( at least better than spartan ops).
But I as well would love more gameplay elements to mix it up and bosses that are actually dangerous and not just a bullet sponge with a ton of adds, the sword of crota mission was nice, saddly that is the only mission like that in the game.
For me personally this game feels exactly like diablo 3 did, awesome core gameplay with lacking missions and story.
Hopefully bungie can do what blizzard did with 2.1 (I also think the destiny story still has potential, diablo wasted it all)
They stated that they are waiting for the Raid content. So their review will likely release Wednesday.
JimmyRustler
Member
btw.: Am I missing something or is public chat in a strike not on by default?
Too Human was great
BloodMoney
Banned
Does anyone know the GameStop trade-in value for Destiny?
Man we tackled this before. Please read from about 8 pages ago. There are videos posted and explanations that the AI only become more aggressive based on if their LV is simply higher than you. They never become more advanced than what it is when you play from the beginning straight on Hard mode, where they are 2 LVs above.
They only move forward if they are 2 LVs above, or retreat often if they are 2 LVs below. Whether they are LV4 enemies or LV22 they react the same way.
Suggesting that he has never played the most advanced AI is dumb for many reasons, especially since you consider that a LV18 and a LV22 can both play in the same game against a LV20... The AI doesn't suddenly change, it just changes when aggro. All bugs and lack of strategy is apparent in the beginning and endgame.
Just to clarify, they will NEVER "Yolo" due to low health, this is a random attack pattern. If they are thrall, they only do it, if they are Warlock, they never do it. If they are Captain, they only do it when they are scripted to like on the tower area where you fight the scarab boss. Dregs and Stealth guys will do it when you are outnumbers, but never when not. Destiny AI is super predictable and the difficulty ONLY comes from LV differences, never smart AI. Play Halo 1 on Legendary and tell me that it's no more challenging, despite enemy ttk and player ttk being roughly the same as equal levels in Destiny...
--
Dear whomever wants to suggest I dunno what I'm talking about. I have an exotic, I'm an expert now.
Seriously I am playing Destiny more than I have played Halo 4 in the year it came out now. I am playing it more because there is loot to get etc. That doesn't suggest I don't dislike the game, or that I outright hate the game from commenting... AI is no where near Halo 1's level, let alone Halo 4. Gunplay is stripped Halo, and the RPG elements are confusingly rubbish.
As a discussion thread, this AI thing about Destiny, saying they get "more aggressive" is hilariously wrong. From the beta I knew what Destiny was doing. There is a skull in Halo that does the same thing, except in Destiny being higher level will over right the "Heroic" skull. You can never have challenging AI if they are the same level.
Trickster
Member
1. If leveling said vendor is one of the best way to get good items, it kinda is the games fault when it's a game focused on loot.
2. I know there are collectibles in Destiny, but they are very few, and again, not that intersting. Whenever I'm zooming through one of the countless empty areas in Destiny, I can't help but just think "why the fuck isn't the place full of shit for me to find?!"
3. Gunplay is absolutely Destiny's strongest feature, it's why I'm still bothering to play the game. But the strikes are just a lost cause for me, even the most mediocre mmo's have dungeon designs that are vastly better than what's on display in Destiny, it's truly pitiful.
4. I was actually saying just the day before Destiny released that I could see it being like Vanilla D3 was. And I agree that the story ( and overall game concept as well ) still has potential. But they need to do so many thing better with upcoming patches, dlc and Destiny 2
Ingueferroque
Banned
Really? It is similar to Too Human now? We are really taking this too far.
AgentOtaku
Member
You know what's funny?
Lost Planet 2 is a VASTLY superior coop experience
Lost Planet 2 is a VASTLY superior coop experience
I agree with everything but 1.
1. just isnt the case, leveling the vanguard by doing bounties gets him to rank 2 in a few days.
If you cant be bothered to spend 1-2h for 3days to level him you cant really complain about "farming" him with missions for hours.
Its just not how you are supposed to do it, you can (and that is good) but of course it wont be a fun experience.
Hardcore farming never is.
You know what's funny?
Lost Planet 2 is a VASTLY superior coop experience
=( Lost Planet 2 was awesome.
Even had fairer loot if we want to go that far.
The demo boss, or especially the 3rd stage boss (with the ship that had guns you needed to reload with heavy bullets etc, cool down with switches etc,) were far better than anything Destiny offers with coop.
And when playing Lost Planet 2 solo, those bosses had actually strategy to beat and were never really damage sponges.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9RcuM1Pa5xM <- not the best player, but still...
The Elite
BOSS
It could use that.
I've been playing on both normal and hard. The AI has been identical between them. Playing a hard mission when I'm a higher level has been equivalent to playing a normal mission at a lower level. There's only any difference if I play the hard mission at a lower level, and that's simply the enemies being more aggressive if they outlevel you, and defensive if they don't. Heroic is only applying the same logic to the enemies, giving them the responses of a higher level enemy. It's a fixed modifier and isn't making the AI any more dynamic.
The enemies simply CANNOT "YOLO" you or chase you down with any sort of effectiveness whatsoever, because they can't wander very far from home without being told to immediately return to their room. The offensive AI in Destiny simply falls flat even when attempting to be aggressive. They can do defense well because that plays nicely with the strict rules the world has placed on them.
Regardless of the difficulty level "+back" defeats Destiny's AI effortlessly. It's simply not very good, and the videos show it as such.
That tether only exists in the open world. In the actual missions it doesn't hold them back ever.
In the open world I've barely noticed it either. There's no reason to ever backpedal away from their spawn areas, and usually the areas are quite large anyway and they never be. Get the chance to +back.
Heroic makes enemies more aggressive. They YOLO more, they flank more, etc... It says this on the modifier itself and I notice it constantly.
As I said, feels like we're playing different games.
So we're back to the "Review scores and people's opinions that don't mesh with mine don't matter, only the number of posts in an OT do" thing again?
1. Tether exists in missions man. It exists everywhere, even for bosses and boss rooms. As I said go back and watch my video with the scarab, or hell actually stop lying that you don't notice the "tether" from happening in a Strike or mission. I farm 2 hit Fusion kills from Thralls in level 3 using the same strategy I used to solo Hard mode solo in the beta.
2. NO IT FUCKING DOESN'T. They do not flank more. All Heroic does is make the enemies higher level. The aggressive play is only there when they are at least 2 levels above you. If I jump on the weekly playlist right now with my LV24 and broadcast it, and you also watch them when someone else plays as a LV20, the AI will change. Heroic skull was in the beta, when you are LV2 and play against LV4-6 enemies, it's exactly the same as endgame.
3. We seem to be. Are you sure you're not playing Halo Reach instead by accident?
REMEMBER CITADEL
Banned
I don't know if it's the same in the full game, but in the beta those underground boss sections all had safe spots around the spawn points, almost no enemy would follow you there; past a certain point they would just turn around and go back.
Not going to continue this with you if you can't stay calm and refrain from calling me a liar.
I've honestly not noticed it during respawn restricted areas. Not absolutely anyway. Even those horrible Psions on the mars strike sometimes chase me around the entire area if I get too bold.
Actually you haven't replied. Sorry for capping because it's quite annoying. Show me a comparison of them apparently flanking more or YOLO just because they are low in health.
Also what is YOLO even mean in this sense? Kamikaze rush? I am 100% certain they only do that when higher level or if they are Dregs that outnumber you, or stealth enemies -- or Thrall.
Heroic describes those things because that's what it does (which is the same as fighting an enemy higher level than you). But it doesn't make them more dynamic they simply trade defense for offense, regardless of if the situation calls for it or not. An Elite in Halo for example will dynamically shift between both states is the situation dictates.
And yes, it does feel like we're playing different games, if you're going to claim Destiny's AI to be on the level of Halo's. I have not once had an encounter in Destiny that felt like fighting a sentient being rather than a set of switch cases (which admittedly is all AI ever really is). In Halo the AI is regularly extremely convincing, making decisions that to me as a human make sense.
Most of the actions and reactions I've seen in Destiny aren't far removed from what I saw in Perfect Dark Zero. The enemies in that game was awesome at being cowards too.
Also the tether does exist in the instances. The first time I ever noticed it was in the early Old Russia mission where you climb the steps and are ambushed by the cloaked sword vanguards. The second time I play that area, I stepped back slightly after triggering them... and they ran back into the room.
Footage showing that would help your point.
brb, I'll show all examples, may take a little while.
sandkiller
Member
I've seen it happen as well, I agree with you.
Basically yea. Like how when you mess and Elite up and he basically just yells out "fuck it" (in whatever language they speak) and then simply charges at you with the last of his life guns blazing. Or when you headshot an Elite and a group of Grunts decide that they're as fucked as you know they are, and just light up a bunch of plasma grenades and run at you with them.
Maybe I don't notice the tether as much because as a Titan I push I to the fray, punch stuff to activate my over shield, use my ward to defend while surrounded, etc... I never give the AI the chance to retreat or notice it tied.
I've also had reactions like the wizard chasing me around the room as my health is blinking and I desperately try to reload. Before that he was just hiding behind two boxes in the adjoining room and strafe bombing me.
It's not on the same level of Halo, I never claimed that. Halo has vocalisations, much more personality for individual units, inter squad reactions, and the battles with Elites in the first game sometimes felt like actual pvp moments.
Destiny is not as good, sure, but it isn't bad like some are claiming.
MaximusPayne
Member
So is anyone else bothered that these missions on PvE are pretty much the same map just a little further every time? I thought I was getting more terrain with Destiny. 
TheExecutive
Member
Tethering exists in every boss room. Go where you came in and you cannot lose.
Wind's Howling
Member
So is anyone else bothered that these missions on PvE are pretty much the same map just a little further every time? I thought I was getting more terrain with Destiny.
One of the reasons why the Patrol aspect is best done after all the story missions on each planet.
So is anyone else bothered that these missions on PvE are pretty much the same map just a little further every time? I thought I was getting more terrain with Destiny.
It only bugged me on Venus for some reason, having to sparrow through all those buildings every time i start a mission was frustrating. The more "open" areas weren't so bad.
But yeah, this game is faking being a big open game more than it actually IS a big open game.
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