Snapshot King
Member
Yeah, DMC2 is in a far off future after all other possible games and spinoffs are concluded.
It does, interestingly enough, take place before Shin Megami Tensei: Nocturne.
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Devil May Cry Collection |OT| Over a Decade of Style
- Thread starter gunbo13
- Start date
Yeah, DMC2 is in a far off future after all other possible games and spinoffs are concluded.
It does, interestingly enough, take place before Shin Megami Tensei: Nocturne.
So swordmaster might be better than trickster then, assuming I can dodge roll?
Edit: Ok I understand RG, it's primarily counterattacking. I actually like it. It's like full assault.
2nd Edit:Well due to the way I'm more offensively attacking, I'm going to go back to SM even though I do like Trickster alot.
3rd edit:Wow unlimited continues?
Story order of the series is officially DMC3 Manga -> 3 -> 1 -> DMC Anime -> DMC4 -> DMC2.
Time difference between them are DMC3 Manga and DMC3 about a year, DMC3 and DMC1 10 years, 1 and Anime is a few years, Anime and DMC4 anywhere from 5-10 years, DMC4 to DMC2 is unconfirmed time after DMC4 Capcom usually just says "a very long time after DMC4.
Trish is in DMC2 as an unlockable playable character. She actually plays more like DMC1 Dante than DMC2 Dante.
In DMC3 the best style is Royal Guard hands down but also the most difficult as it's entirely timing based. Swordmaster and Trickster are good starter styles, SM is better if you like a lot of moves in your arsenal that are good at crowd clearing and racking up style points plus giving you more attack options in the air. Trickster is better if you don't like having a ton of moves and would rather have better mobility and rushdown/evasive capabilities. Gunslinger is good too but difficult to pick up your first time around.
Time difference between them are DMC3 Manga and DMC3 about a year, DMC3 and DMC1 10 years, 1 and Anime is a few years, Anime and DMC4 anywhere from 5-10 years, DMC4 to DMC2 is unconfirmed time after DMC4 Capcom usually just says "a very long time after DMC4.
Trish is in DMC2 as an unlockable playable character. She actually plays more like DMC1 Dante than DMC2 Dante.
In DMC3 the best style is Royal Guard hands down but also the most difficult as it's entirely timing based. Swordmaster and Trickster are good starter styles, SM is better if you like a lot of moves in your arsenal that are good at crowd clearing and racking up style points plus giving you more attack options in the air. Trickster is better if you don't like having a ton of moves and would rather have better mobility and rushdown/evasive capabilities. Gunslinger is good too but difficult to pick up your first time around.
Free Showtime atleast...don't know what the hell they were thinking there. I mean, that seems to go for a lot of dmc2, but ESPECIALLY those enemies.
Wolf Akela
Member
There really isn't an all around best because it's so situational and you have to ask "best at what?".
Royalguard generally has the faster boss clear times because of the ridiculous damage though, but it isn't always the fastest.
Doppelganger kills Cerberus the fastest (After Image + A&R).
Swordmaster kills Gigapede the fastest (Prop Shredder)
Quicksilver kills Hell Vanguard the fastest IF you don't start with a full Royalguard meter (Aerial Cross rape)
IIRC Swordmaster has the fastest Leviathan kill because of Ultimate Tempest.
etc etc
Royalguard generally has the faster boss clear times because of the ridiculous damage though, but it isn't always the fastest.
Doppelganger kills Cerberus the fastest (After Image + A&R).
Swordmaster kills Gigapede the fastest (Prop Shredder)
Quicksilver kills Hell Vanguard the fastest IF you don't start with a full Royalguard meter (Aerial Cross rape)
IIRC Swordmaster has the fastest Leviathan kill because of Ultimate Tempest.
etc etc
I had to time a jump to get hit. He aims at your previous location two seconds late, if that makes any sense. So I would jump and then land and see the cannonball in the air later. DMC2, where you have to go out of your way to get hit by shit.
Yeah, there's also turrets on the top that hit you if you stay on top...and the main cannon shoots fire but is long enough that you can just stand beside the tank and have it go way over your head. I've noticed most of the enemies are barely aggressive, but jesus christ. That whole level was godawful the chopper is one of the stupidest bosses I've ever seen.
My bro got me the DMC Collection for my bday and I just played through the first 3 missions from the original Devil May Cry. It's been quite a bit of time since I've booted up the original masterpiece and holy shit is it as great as I remembered. The first DMC is definitely my favorite game of the bunch still. Sure, DMC3 is a better game mechanically, but there is just something about the first game that appeals to me more. The castle setting, the remnants of older Resident Evil games, the atmosphere, etc. It's unparalleled! I love DMC3 to death and arguably it's the better game, but the first game overall is just fits me like a glove.
Man, playing this again just continues to solidify my love the PS2 era. It still saddens me that Capcom (and other old school companies) is so terrible these days. I can't believe there is no DMC game to succeed DMC4. I mean, I liked DMC4 a lot, put 100 some hours into it, but I would like to see a TRUE action game from Capcom that rivals the greatness of DMC3 or feels as classic as DMC1. Too bad most of the old heads that made these games great are gone now. Oh well.
Man, playing this again just continues to solidify my love the PS2 era. It still saddens me that Capcom (and other old school companies) is so terrible these days. I can't believe there is no DMC game to succeed DMC4. I mean, I liked DMC4 a lot, put 100 some hours into it, but I would like to see a TRUE action game from Capcom that rivals the greatness of DMC3 or feels as classic as DMC1. Too bad most of the old heads that made these games great are gone now. Oh well.
The boss right after that is garbage too. Ran straight up to him and used the shotgun. Never hit me till his second form.
Fuck the targeting system though. Many of the boss fights were unnecessarily hard because I kept targeting the fucking grunts.
The broken camera angle, the bad/lifeless VA, and the backtracking really killed it for me. Not to mention some of the puzzles really are unintuitive.
So far I am at Chapter 4 in DMC1 and wow I forgot how different the original is compared to the other games in the series (never played 2). However the game feels so stiff after playing countless hours of Bayonetta. But I am sure I will get my groove back soon enough, I guess I should start upgrading the moves.
I really did not want to stop playing, but I guess I have to work
I really did not want to stop playing, but I guess I have to work
Haha yeah the targeting is a mess, its been giving me a lot more camera issues than 1 with the way it focuses on enemies. The one boss(bolverk or something) had two wolves with him, and I was trying to shoot him with my missile launcher. The dogs kept jumping in the way and making the targeting go back and forth. I eventually just DTed and got right in his face to easily kill him. Of course...
Why did they think water levels were a good idea? Man, this one even went as far as including an underwater boss fight. Also, is it just me or is there absolutely no sense of direction in this game? I feel extremely lost most of the time and luckily end up going the right way.
DMC2 is just fundamentally broken on multiple levels. The targeting system is beyond garbage. I had issues with the power plant when I had to escape because I had to target those goddamn orbs and the targeting system went after the fucking birds. The bosses are nothing more than HP tanks with the ridiculous multiple HP bars. Like the final boss had something like six HP bars. WTF? The AI is pretty much trash even for the bosses, atleast on a couple of them I just ran up to them with the shotgun and unloaded with minimal damage. The game itself feels like a shooter due to the heavy emphasis on range combat. The melee attacks sent enemies flying which is a pain in the ass as you have to go and chase them down. Weapon selection was pitiful. Congrats you can have any weapon you want. As long as it's a sword. Character and enemy design went down the shitter.
The highest praise I can give the game is that it technically works.
Truth.
It's true some styles/weapons are just better than others in certain cases. No "practical" DMC player would even think of tackling Enigmas with Royal Guard on DMD mode, you can't consistently parry multiple arrows like that when it's 100x easier and more effective to use Nevan with Artemis on GS. Like wise, I wouldn't use anything aside from Gunslinger against Chess pieces/Chess board because those enemies are perfect for the long ranged game (don't attack often enough for Trickster/Royal Guard to be useful, can't be juggled for SM to be useful etc.).
Royal Guard is the theoretical best and even then it's only the best against opponents who attack a lot (like Vergil) or against crowds. Against opponents who don't attack a lot you are better off using something else.
Crazy part about DMC3 is that it's depth is pretty much untapped because a lot of the people who used to play DMC a lot moved on to DMC4 and then to other games (like UMVC3). Some really hardcore Chinese players still dedicate themselves to DMC3 and they discovered some crazy tech and strategies in the game that is really eye opening. They basically put up videos of beating bosses with every possible style/weapon set up possible which led to some genuinely new tactics/tech.
TyrantGuardian
Member
Just picked up my copy. Can't wait to blitz through another DMC1 dmd no item run. And by blitz I mean spending less than 8 months trying to defeat the last boss. Ugh.
prodystopian
Member
I agree with you and wolf. Someone else might like Swordmaster for the options, but I felt like Trickster was really helpful for helping me staying alive longer when I first went through the game.
I do love Royal Guard, though. Especially for Beowulf.
DevilPower
Member
You could be a man and pick Yellow Orbs instead of Gold.
That's my preference, as it is for a bunch of people here.Yellow Orbs came from the original NA release of DMC3, where the orbs served as continues, and you would otherwise have to start at the beginning of the Mission. The Japanese version had Gold Orbs, where you had unlimited continues, but the Gold Orbs could resurrect you on the spot if you chose. The Special Edition allows you to choose between the two.
You could be a man and pick Yellow Orbs instead of Gold.
Yellow Orbs came from the original NA release of DMC3, where the orbs served as continues, and you would otherwise have to start at the beginning of the Mission. The Japanese version had Gold Orbs, where you had unlimited continues, but the Gold Orbs could resurrect you on the spot if you chose. The Special Edition allows you to choose between the two.
So, wait. The NA version of DMC3 was actually harder than the JP version? That's gotta be a first.
Muchi Muchi Pink
Member
NA Version Normal mode: JPN Hard mode + Yellow check point system (continues limited to the number of Yellow orbs you have)
JPN Version Normal mode: NA Easy mode + Gold check point system (infinite continues, Gold orb revives you instantly)
You can try out the original NA difficulty on DMC3SE. Just start a fresh no stats game on Hard and set checkpoints system to Yellow. You will get a taste of the original difficulty of DMC3 like the forefathers before you.
Wolf Akela
Member
All this "manning up" for Yellow is pretty silly. You can pick Gold and play like it's Yellow. Seriously, even pros pick Gold just for the convenience when practicing. I intentionally die to bosses just to redo them. It'd be a hassle to have to shop for Yellow Orbs once in a while.
Yeah, and I believe it caused this weird occurrence where Japanese players imported the NA version of a game.
brain_stew
Member
Where does the PAL version fit in.
Well, if someone complains that it's too easy because of unlimited continues, and there are obviously other options, then I think it's appropriate to suggest using Yellow Orbs.
I think that Yellow Orbs are great way to experience the game for people just starting. At the end of the day, it won't matter much because good players won't really be dying very much at all.
I forgot, I think it might be something in between like having difficulty of NA but having checkpoint system of JPN (or vice versa).
Honestly Yellow checkpoint system is a relic of the past. It's an artificial difficulty increasing mechanic. Games should be difficult on their own right, not be difficult because you have to start a 30 minute mission from the beginning because you fucked up at the end against a boss you have never seen before. Most people including myself ended up beating DMC3 for the first time after like 20-25 hours thanks to either farming or retrying. That number would've been halved if it was gold checkpoint system yet keeping the exact same difficulty.
R
Retro_
Unconfirmed Member
I think Chaos Legion was the same way.(IIRC legions require more EXP to level up in the US version)
Capcom always doing that shit
and yeah I hate Yellow Orbs
I disagree. I don't find it artificial at all. Games like Dark Souls and Demons' Souls use the same mechanic to great effect. The Missions in DMC3 were never that long. 30 minutes for a mission is probably as long as it gets... and the successive playthrough is quicker and easier because the player is already knows the puzzles and enemy types he/she'll be seeing.
The ever present threat of a new encounter was something refreshing in the NA DMC3. It was part of what made each boss fight so intimidating and special.
Yeah I heard about Chaos Legion too, game was fairly difficult when it came out although I enjoyed it's difficulty because this was right after the mind numbingly easy DMC2 and I wanted a challenging game for once.
I disagree. I don't find it artificial at all. Games like Dark Souls and Demons' Souls use the same mechanic to great effect. The Missions in DMC3 were never that long. 30 minutes for a mission is probably as long as it gets... and the successive playthrough is quicker and easier because the player is already knows the puzzles and enemy types he/she'll be seeing.
In DMC3, aside from Mission#3 against Cerberus all the missions were at least 30 minutes in length and some more (A&R mission was like 45 minutes long or higher if you hadn't memorized the pattern of the area down pat). There were multiple styles to choose from and most of the time you didn't know if you were using the right style for a fight or the right weapon (the weapon thing isn't a problem before Mission#5 but after that you have to start making choices). There is no sense of experimentation in this "succeed or start mission from scratch", you basically have to revert to cheese tactics to survive and I can bet you that everyone in here including all the pros cheesed the fuck out of the game to beat it the first time (and that includes farming in the first few stages). Since this was the JPN Hard version which was balanced around you having your equipment carried over from Normal, it made things tougher. At least NG had save points before boss fights.
Because of this the game pretty much had a front loaded difficulty curve. Game was at it's hardest in the first 5 missions then it hit a plateau from which it rarely spiked aside from a couple of boss fights. I have been playing games since the Atari days and I am used to this stuff... but those games were shorter and bite sized compared to the mission structure of DMC3 plus the more complex combat system. Those games sort of needed the "start all over" checkpoint system to increase their replay value, DMC3 doesn't because normal is supposed to be the training mode and DMD is the real shit. You know something is wrong when Normal is kicking your ass more than the game's Hard mode.
I disagree. I don't find it artificial at all. Games like Dark Souls and Demons' Souls use the same mechanic to great effect. The Missions in DMC3 were never that long. 30 minutes for a mission is probably as long as it gets... and the successive playthrough is quicker and easier because the player is already knows the puzzles and enemy types he/she'll be seeing.
The NA DMC3 version wasn't balanced around this at all. DMC1 was balanced around this because you started off with more yellow orbs to compensate for a few deaths plus the missions with bosses were very short (the first boss encounter with Phantom, that mission is like not even 5 minutes long, it's like 3 rooms). In addition, there were no weapon set ups to choose from or styles meaning you basically knew you had the tools to fight something.
In DMC3, aside from Mission#3 against Cerberus all the missions were at least 30 minutes in length and some more (A&R mission was like 45 minutes long or higher if you hadn't memorized the pattern of the area down pat). There were multiple styles to choose from and most of the time you didn't know if you were using the right style for a fight or the right weapon (the weapon thing isn't a problem before Mission#5 but after that you have to start making choices). There is no sense of experimentation in this "succeed or start mission from scratch", you basically have to revert to cheese tactics to survive and I can bet you that everyone in here including all the pros cheesed the fuck out of the game to beat it the first time (and that includes farming in the first few stages). Since this was the JPN Hard version which was balanced around you having your equipment carried over from Normal, it made things tougher. At least NG had save points before boss fights.
Because of this the game pretty much had a front loaded difficulty curve. Game was at it's hardest in the first 5 missions then it hit a plateau from which it rarely spiked aside from a couple of boss fights. I have been playing games since the Atari days and I am used to this stuff... but those games were shorter and bite sized compared to the mission structure of DMC3 plus the more complex combat system. Those games sort of needed the "start all over" checkpoint system to increase their replay value, DMC3 doesn't because normal is supposed to be the training mode and DMD is the real shit. You know something is wrong when Normal is kicking your ass more than the game's Hard mode.
Wolf Akela
Member
Found this old message from Joch.
http://www.gamefaqs.com/boards/930014-devil-may-cry-3-special-edition/41545205
PAL also has a slower loading time. The logo for "NOW LOADING" is "DEVIL MAY CRY 3".
Air Zombie Meat
Member
The original pal version had the yellow checkpoint system as well. I didn't mind it that much at the time but playing with the gold system now is so much less frustrating. One benefit is that I feel I can experiment more with bosses. With the yellow system I always used to have to play it safe because of the penalty of doing the whole level again.
Vergil 3 during the first playthrough...jesus.
Vergil 3 boss fight had unlimited checkpoints.... because the entire mission was the boss fight. Thank god for that... I couldn't have imagined playing a full mission and having to fight him at the end. Must have died a good 15 times on him the first time. Then I died an additional 10 times when fighting him on Hard... then about 20+ times on DMD mode. By that time I had memorized all his lines that he smack talks to Dante during the boss fight.
You will not forget this devil's power....
You are not worthy as my opponent.
You are going down.
Where's your motivation?
Now I am a little motivated!
Rest in peace.
This is the power of Sparda.
You will not forget this devil's power....
You are not worthy as my opponent.
You are going down.
Where's your motivation?
Now I am a little motivated!
Rest in peace.
This is the power of Sparda.
You could always experiment on Mission 18. I thought they set it up pretty well so that you could always make your way to any boss fight with only a little effort if you wanted some practice.
I can understand this sentiment, but I feel the game was designed around replaying missions and saving before boss fights. Yeah, you wouldn't be able to experiment to find out the different bosses' weaknesses, but how would you be able to do that with Gold Orbs anyway? Gold Orbs would just resurrect you on the spot, without the option to weapon swap. Going through the first time, I remember that I refused to give up Rebellion until towards the end and made it that much harder on myself.
In my humble opinion, Resurrection Orbs simply make the game a little too lenient for the first time through... especially considering that the SE features the Japanese Normal, not the NA Normal.
True. I would say most people got hit hard on mission 5 the first time through. A&R are trolls.
My history with DMC3 is weird though.
- Went to China Town to snag the DMC3 demo with JPN Resident Evil Outbreak File #2.
- Played the living shit out of it 100x.
- Played JPN version on normal (NA easy). Didn't have an issue cause I played the demo like crazy. Beat everything through.
- NA version came but I just played it coming from JPN version.
- SE came and did the same...again.
EDIT:
I honestly never used items or yellow/gold orbs. I was such a fan that I considered it a failure on my part and I needed to polish up my skills. So I would start the mission over on every single death. It was certainly frustrating at times.
I played the DMC3 demo too and yet when the NA version came I still got ass raped by A&R (not so much Cerberus because I had gotten his patterns and strat down to a tee).
One of the rites of passages of the DMC series is beating one of the brothers and then saying "FUCK YES MUTHA FUCKER I OWNED YOU!!!" only to have to face a suped up fused version of the two.
For the record I was one of the first people who discovered that Revolver is super effective against A&R. I spammed the shit out of that strat on the boards and then it spread like wild fire.
Edit: I used yellow orbs (not gold orbs, that shit is mad cheating) if/when I have them but I don't use vital stars/holy water whatever the crap. It took me like several walkthroughs to realize that the Untouchable didn't even exist in DMC3. lol
One of the rites of passages of the DMC series is beating one of the brothers and then saying "FUCK YES MUTHA FUCKER I OWNED YOU!!!" only to have to face a suped up fused version of the two.
For the record I was one of the first people who discovered that Revolver is super effective against A&R. I spammed the shit out of that strat on the boards and then it spread like wild fire.
Edit: I used yellow orbs (not gold orbs, that shit is mad cheating) if/when I have them but I don't use vital stars/holy water whatever the crap. It took me like several walkthroughs to realize that the Untouchable didn't even exist in DMC3. lol
I refused to use any items on my playthroughs of the game, aside from Blue and Purple Orbs. I also considered it a failure to use Yellow orbs. I'm a masochistic gamer, though. I recognize that it was a stupid pride thing, but it was important to me.
Hah, I remember reading to use Revolver against A&R on a messageboard. I wonder if that was you. I felt so dumb because I had been using Rebellion only at first.
Oldschoolgamer
The physical form of blasphemy
Man, I thought was amazing when I cleared one of the twins. Then I got crushed when the wonder twins power activated. Shit was heartbreaking. lol. Felt amazing when I beat them(Thanks to Dahbomb's strats on gfaqs..lolololol).
Everything was cool until I got to Vergil 3. Holy shit @ how bad that was. Cleared him on normal and didn't have any problems with him on hard/very hard thanks to trickster and jump canceling beowulf. Then I got crushed by him on DMD mode. He was easily more motivated than I. :| Took forever to beat him...
Everything was cool until I got to Vergil 3. Holy shit @ how bad that was. Cleared him on normal and didn't have any problems with him on hard/very hard thanks to trickster and jump canceling beowulf. Then I got crushed by him on DMD mode. He was easily more motivated than I. :| Took forever to beat him...
I just finished DMC1 for the first time last night and didn't use any items till the last few missions. God damn did I need them then.
Air Zombie Meat
Member
Honestly thats how I felt at the time too when people were complaining about it. I even started out on yellow again when I got the collection. The thing that got to me in the end was having to do all the backtracking and taking item x to location y over and over again which is something I've already done my time with. And all that time you're not getting any orbs which is annoying when I just want to get all the movesets unlocked again. Being able to continue does makes the game a lot easier as you don't have to nurse a single life bar through a whole mission anymore but I'll be going back and playing all the levels again for rank anyway.
And yeah, I never use items either.
It would have happened to me too if I didn't play DMC3(JPN). I got lucky on JPN normal cause I luckily whittled them down as a pair. I had to fight the fusion form but the health was nothing. So I learned, got lucky, and was playing on the equivalent of NA easy.
No rite of passage for me. Lame player.
I'm sure I used yellow orbs at some point early on. I believe the demo had them right? Cause I certainly sucked at the very start playing the demo. But I'm pretty sure I dropped them before my JPN play-through. I basically said "Hey, I played the demo over and over restarting constantly on my own. So why not just do it for the game?" And I did die due to surprises in JPN play-through. Stuff like the pointless fight against dual vanguards. The demo didn't prep me for that shit. lol
Holy waters are great for mission 18 to get past the chess board on DMD. That's the only time I ever used them so I could do boss runs.
Same. Nowadays if I play, I create a setup for myself with custom rules. No DTE, no items, no DT regen, yet DT allowed in fights for boost + damage shedding, SM only, etc... I have to revisit RG soon though...I miss it.
I was certainly tempted to use items against Nightmare 3. I'd forgotten a lot of little tricks, and there were a bunch I never knew about, like de-activating DT during a DT move to earn back DT (thanks, DahBomb!). I was never all that proficient with combat in DMC1. Now I'll have a chance to change that with this collection.