Hopefully we don't move back to barter. I like the auction house because I can sell my items and continue to play the game. In D2 if you wanted to sell items in game it involved advertising the items in chat, or joining trade games and lucking out. Either way that was time taken away from actually playing the game.
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Diablo III |OT3| Turn On Elective Mode, Get an Authenticator
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Hopefully we don't move back to barter. I like the auction house because I can sell my items and continue to play the game. In D2 if you wanted to sell items in game it involved advertising the items in chat, or joining trade games and lucking out. Either way that was time taken away from actually playing the game.
arts&crafts
Member
awesome I will check ah and price it less than average
Shouta
Member
Monk is the worse to buy gear for, Not only do you need a single resist , all resist and vitality on the majority of your gear but now it seems you need as much life on hit as possible as well and anything else is worthless.
On top of that since all monks get pidgeonholed into some form of defensive build all the properly itemized gear gets price skewed and you cant reliably farm the same content as wiz and DH do nor do it as effectively to make money
You can tell my main is a monk.
I can actually kill elites in Act 3 with my Monk now, varies a little depending on modifiers but it's quite possible. I just killed an Arcane, Vortex, Missile Dampening, Reflect Damage monster a minute ago.
Evasion > Defense for Monk.
I've been doing the build for a week and a half so yeah, it works.
Trojita
Rapid Response Threadmaker
This has probably already been posted, but just in case it hasn't I thought I'd share.
http://www.alexc.me/a-scientific-explanation-why-diablo-3-is-less-addictive-than-diablo-2/417/
http://www.alexc.me/a-scientific-explanation-why-diablo-3-is-less-addictive-than-diablo-2/417/
I really don't see Barter coming back aside from the other communities perhaps. Circuimventing the AH is already more profitable, it's just not got the reach the AH does. Nobody WANTS barter to be part of the game. Barter is fucking annoying.
Are you on US server? i might be interested in purchasing depending on how much you're putting it up for.
FieryBalrog
Member
Not compared to the ongoing population. Population of "total sales", yes.
Also very much agreed. Liquidity has a very high premium on it right now and is to be avoided until and unless Blizzard gets bots / gold sinks under control.
Again, agreed. I think we're "stuck" with a gold based economy, which causes its own litany of problems as already discussed. It isn't just that barter is annoying, exactly -- it can be fun -- it's just so inefficient without a proper, effective search mechanism. Even the deficiencies of the current, gold based AH are really annoying (limited to three search paramters, cannot search by DPS, cannot set stat maximums in addition to minimums, cannot sort by some modifiers like +damage, cannot sort by time left, cannot sort by no buyout, not to mention the AH has been frequently down and the commodities are still offline). In comparison, going back to the archaic system of literally spamming "ISO XXX!" at the top of your lungs and hoping someone is listening sounds dreadful. That is the problem, not bartering itself, I think.
5 SoJs for dual leech ring. Its a good deal! C'mon!
arts&crafts
Member
Yea I am, i will let you know before I put it up.
FieryBalrog
Member
Fireball projectiles (morloks, goat shamans), arcing projectiles (lacuni, subjugators), special ranged attacks (heralds of pestilence, wasps), special melee attacks (fallen champions, oppressors) etc. are all dodgeable perfectly.
Spears and arrows are only dodgeable if you're moving when the projectile is released.
WTF? Fix this shit blizzard.
Spears and arrows are only dodgeable if you're moving when the projectile is released.
WTF? Fix this shit blizzard.
aliencowz7
Member
Yeah, it's just one of those things that contributes to the perfect storm type deal.
We require more gear then other classes to farm better gear, and our gear costs more then average since its so focused stat wise. All the while even with better gear to be able to farm, we cant do it as quickly or as efficiently nor can we drop stats for MF like the range so we end up just being incredibly inefficient at everything.
Ive been using various builds between evasion / heavy armor / LoH and evasion does seem to have the best possible results but also has the most RNG so it can still be pretty frustrating.
I figured you had been; it seems the way to go for Monks once you get over "omg resists" shock. Mitigating to the point of surviving a few hits in a row when Dodge fails and then being able to recover it as fast as possible seems to be the best way to go for a Monk.
helloresolven
Member
I win.
This armor should make you completely immune to fire. Perhaps even makes you more susceptible to cold damage in return. Honestly, I want to see Blizzard's notes from the item planning meetings. It just seems so wrong.
hitsugi
Member
Trash blue weapons with a random + damage mod.
Shouta
Member
http://us.battle.net/d3/en/calculator/monk#aYXigh!YXU!acbZYc
That build helps me almost melt Act 3 mobs with my stats. It's pretty sick. It has room to be adjusted as well.
Earlier I said that a million gold would buy you 100 more DPS on a crossbow at the high end (all other stats ignored).
Nope, more like twenty to fifty, depending:
Sort by 2h - 1m: Top Bow/Xbow - 1113 DPS
Sort by 2h - 2m: Top Bow/Xbox - 1170 DPS
Sort by 2h - 3m: Top Bow/Xbox - 1190 DPS
Not to say that these bows will sell or anything, but this is awful.
Nope, more like twenty to fifty, depending:
Sort by 2h - 1m: Top Bow/Xbow - 1113 DPS
Sort by 2h - 2m: Top Bow/Xbox - 1170 DPS
Sort by 2h - 3m: Top Bow/Xbox - 1190 DPS
Not to say that these bows will sell or anything, but this is awful.
I feel like crafting was specifically designed as an outlet to keep AH prices under control, although it's obviously not working. The price of crafting materials is tied to the price of "worthless" items, so if they start inflating, people will profit-take by salvaging crap, which at the very least will raise the baseline. (For example no magic item that drops in Inferno, no matter how worthless, can have a lower value than the value of 1 Shimmering Essence (plus a soupcon for the rare chance), or people will just buy them, salvage them, and resell the materials. So if the value of Shimmering Essences inflates, you can keep pace with it just by salvaging more -- which will bring the price back down.) Similarly, as the prices of AH items go up even higher, eventually your expected value from buying crafting materials (which must be relatively cheap), crafting, and using or reselling your product will be greater than the cost of the materials, which will mean a flood of crafted items, theoretically increasing supply and lowering prices again to equilibrium.
However, the combination of crafting being pretty uneconomic right now and the commodities AH being down is clearly throwing this mechanism out of whack. (There might also be a problem with Tomes of Secrets being supply-limited, I'm not sure).
Bartering wasn't nearly as bad as everybody is making it out to be. All we need is the ability to open trading lobbies with custom names. Gold should only matter for minor things like repair costs.
I guess a lot of people like not having to talk to anybody but I miss the social aspect of the series and trading was a big part of that. Am I the only one who hates feeling like a number (present) instead of a player within a community (past)?
I have so much stuff to off load onto Commodities, I want to help intstacrash the market.
FieryBalrog
Member
Quite honestly, trading was by far the best part of D2 for me.
aliencowz7
Member
Curious, do you feel transcendence passive is good enough to take over some of the other ones? I get the feeling its not healing me for enough often enough alot of the time to be worth the slot but I am curious to see how other monks feel.
I like Gold having a Value, and I think most people really hated bartering. Its why sites like TF2WH are so popular, because it takes out the bartering and just gives everything a point value.
Also, I find random weapons I feel are subpar actually have a good value. 550 DPS 1H Axe? Well, has some Strewth, Life of Hit, and Vit, worth a check... 750k? No. No, that can't be right. 10000 Starting bid, uh, 500k buyout. Alright.
*10 minutes later*
"Your Subpar Axe has sold!"
Trends are odd.
Crafting with the methodology at work in D3, can literally NEVER be a solution. Unless they just make it so that you can craft any item in the game, the longterm goal of every player is still going to be gold/items worth gold (IE things you cannot craft). Crafting won't get you there. Items you craft cannot by definition be valuable unless they can be scarce, see helms of command, the scarcity of the pattern is what makes it a profitable item to craft, but that also means that the crafting is still not actually functioning: you or I cannot simply go craft a helm of command, I need the pattern to drop first. The drop is what matters, the crafting after the fact is just a technicality at that point, you already won and made money by getting the pattern drop. Eventually if the pattern becomes common enough that crafting helms is barely/not profitable, then only those who got there first made anything from it. It's exactly the same pyramid scheme the rest of the game operates under.
Crafting cannot yield profit unless it's just a random rare crafting pattern, period. It's a mathematical impossibility. This makes crafting completely pointless in the game.
Dreams-Visions
Member
Ploid 3.0
Member
I think I'm hanging up WD until something is done with their pets (bliz is apparently looking into it). Heck I'd take a spirit pet that deal out damage but can't get hit like Hydra.
I spent a bit of gold on trying the crowd control idea. Basically you buy freeze, stun, and blind on hit items. I got the best ones I could find for a good price (max is 4% and such) but the fact that the pets are doing aoe effects give it a better chance of proccing. It procs but they still get murdered. I put dex all up my character's nose and they still get beat down, vit don't work for pets.
http://youtu.be/Qe3sv7o4EHw
I'm enjoying Wizard's hydra play though. The venom hydra hits so hard and it ticks, so good constant damage. Also it's a fast cheap recast and it can't get 2 shot.
Edit: at above, it's because they are xbox's and now xbows.
I spent a bit of gold on trying the crowd control idea. Basically you buy freeze, stun, and blind on hit items. I got the best ones I could find for a good price (max is 4% and such) but the fact that the pets are doing aoe effects give it a better chance of proccing. It procs but they still get murdered. I put dex all up my character's nose and they still get beat down, vit don't work for pets.
http://youtu.be/Qe3sv7o4EHw
I'm enjoying Wizard's hydra play though. The venom hydra hits so hard and it ticks, so good constant damage. Also it's a fast cheap recast and it can't get 2 shot.
Edit: at above, it's because they are xbox's and now xbows.
I'm probably the most broke as 60 here on GAF. I rock 10K gold. Jelly? You should be.
Granted I only need to upgrade the Bsmith twice more, then he hits level 10. (Currently 9 and 3/5ths done) Once he is 10 I can save my money up if I do Inferno runs with my Monk, though I'll most likely go hit up playing my WD more.
Granted I only need to upgrade the Bsmith twice more, then he hits level 10. (Currently 9 and 3/5ths done) Once he is 10 I can save my money up if I do Inferno runs with my Monk, though I'll most likely go hit up playing my WD more.
-Pyromaniac-
Member
aliencowz7
Member
Considering that some of the best items in the game are from the patterns with 6 modifiers that drop in inferno you can absolutely make a profit from crafting. The issue stems from the fact that without absurd luck right now you most likely will spend more gold then the item you eventually get a perfect roll on will sell for trying to get it.
This is a problem they said they already intend to repair by lowering the cost of crafting. I think they should also either implement the crafting materials in a better way or scrap them all together and just make it a gold cost which would make crafting even more profitable.
I have gone from having a Million+ to 5k about 5 times in the past week. I feel I should really start saving up about 2 Million+ per new piece of gear though, since all the 500k-1M pieces that look good on paper turn out to only be really marginal increases.
I know everyone hits a wall in Act 2 Inferno...but I think I'm giving up on my WD in that area. It is 100% unfun.
If I'm going to be a glass cannon, I might as well be a DH. I can't even take a hit on the WD really and my DPS isn't anywhere near that of DHs...so I might as well jump on the wagon. Both suit my style.
If I'm going to be a glass cannon, I might as well be a DH. I can't even take a hit on the WD really and my DPS isn't anywhere near that of DHs...so I might as well jump on the wagon. Both suit my style.
Yoshichan
And they made him a Lord of Cinder. Not for virtue, but for might. Such is a lord, I suppose. But here I ask. Do we have a sodding chance?
Was all hyped up about playing DIII tonight (haven't been able to do it for 2 days now) but then I watched the season finale of Game of Thrones. Turned out to be such a big fucking cliché disappointed that I now don't feel like doing anything.
Shouta
Member
Yes, life on hit isn't good enough to keep yourself alive all the time. It's good for steady HP at high amounts but LpSS provides a Burst of Health when you get hit hard and want to keep a buffer from taking huge hits. Transcendence + a strong LpSS item, either weapon or helm will give you that. it also means you don't have to take a lot of extra healing within your skill and rune layouts. A lot of people use Peaceful Repose on Serenity for example but I've only used Ascension since Act 1 when, at one point I had a 160:1 LpSS ratio. I could hit my Mantra and get most of my life back.
Maximus.
Member
the AH inflation is RIDIC! Luckily I was able to find some decent gear for cheap to help farm in inferno before the shitty items started going for high prices. My cheap ass auctions that I have put up arent even selling and I know I am selling for way less than other people :/
aliencowz7
Member
Do you not run into resource generation issues to have it as a heal for when you really need it? Even with IaS It seems like I wouldn't have enough spirit to use that as a reliable heal with that build.
Public game trick man.
Less than 8k right now, neither JC or BS at max level. I also have shit gear. I win!
Soon as RMAH happens you're going to see another downside of the current system. I pretty much dumped all of my gold last night into random items that may or may not be worth anything in a week. I'd much rather have the option of sitting on items like sojs and skill lifers of old that always retained some value.
They should have tried something like forum gold from jsp if they wanted to bring a universal currency. Give everybody a certain amount and let players purchase more if they would rather do that than earn gold the hard way. That'd fix the mass devaluing of gold due to gold runs and GF bots. These are the types of things they can do through a patch and ladder reset.
It just seems like they probably were leaving those ideas for an expansion or they were running out of time, which is all sorts scummy. Same deal with sets. A 5 piece set affix that gives you 5 maximum fury just screams "we couldn't even be bothered with balancing these, so we just made them plain stupid and underpowered."
This game has all sorts of design decisions that show they didn't have either time or a clue about a lot of stuff. Didn't they transform runes out completely like 4 months before launch or something?
The market doesn't exist in a vacuum, though -- it exists in relation to gameplay. If a crafted item is as good (in terms of stats) as a "scarcer" item, then the two will eventually equalize in price (with maybe a slight surcharge for the bling factor), because people go to the auction house looking for upgrades first and foremost. The fact that there's technically an infinite supply of crafted items is not relevant to this, except to ensure that the eventual equalized price will be lower. This may mean they aren't "valuable" but that's fine -- if a player can get the items they need to progress because they aren't considered "valuable" then the existence of a shadow market of decorative upgrades with much higher prices is not really relevant to the functioning of the economy. It just becomes a luxury market.
It's pretty obvious that there was very little testing done with max level classes and Inferno.
Shouta
Member
That's why I have LoH as well. LoH when normally fighting, burst with abilities when you need it.
1.80+ AS was the best for me but I'm doing ok with 1.60ish right now.
aliencowz7
Member
I see, maybe ill give it a shot with more LpSS on my gear and see how it goes. Thanks.
Absolutely none of the best items in the game are available from the 6 affix patterns - they are all SECOND BEST base items. You will not make a profit if you're just praying for that one good craft to pay for the bad ones, that's a logical fallacy. CAN you craft once, get lucky, and stop crafting? Sure, it's just like the lottery. You cannot make long term profit, however.
There's no bling factor at work, items drop OR are crafted. Rares that are just as good as crafting drop in the game, and your average cost to purchase one on the AH is the only factor you need to compare crafting to, if you could somehow get an as-good item from crafting it would either drive supply up or demand down, instead the demand for near perfect items is always there, but the demand for the garbage you craft while trying to get good items shrinks, because theoretically if it were profitable everyone would be doing it, that drives the 'cost' of crafting even higher.
As it stands for instance, I have the BEST 2h craft in the game. 6 affix Crag hammer.
It costs almost 300,000 gold in pure gold and material costs. Maybe evne a bit more, who can say easily with commodities down.
A) It is STILL only the second best possible 2h, even if I crafted the absolute best crag hammer ever gifted to this earth. A doom hammer is better. You can't craft that. That already puts a ceiling on the price due to its lower dps potential, since it's now competing with doom hammers that roll X-10% on all of its stats
B) Any Crag Hammer I craft without 3 damage affixes is almost entirely worthless on the AH. If I roll less than 1100 dps, I can just vendor it. It vendors for ~2k
C) I now have to, when I finally make 'decent' ones, sell them at enough of a profit to then cover ALL of my failed crafts, yet their value is still determined by the availability of all of the non-crafted craghammers, crafted craghammers, non-crafted rare doomhammers, even non-crafted MAGIC doomhammers that beat them. Just a quick glance at 2 handed weapons on the AH will tell you how completely ridiculous that is. You cannot profit off of these.
Now even in theory, if you could craft the best item (and weren't relying on a drop to be able to craft them, which is just as bad. The difference between a pattern and non-pattern drop is just that you have to sink more gold into a pattern to get the item you want) it would STILL not be profitable. The profitability is determined by the scarcity, and crafted items are not scarce at all, they're an unlimited resource. Sure, there are gold/commodity costs, but let's face it those are unlimited resources in diablo. If it is suddenly profitable to craft, somehow, EVERYONE starts crafting and the market crashes. Only the people who crafted first make any money, It soon becomes just as cost effective for you to purchase a hammer you want for less than it would cost you to craft one and with none of the risk. Those selling them dump them at wholesale prices rather than vendor them as the market moves more towards perfect rolls.
Shouta
Member
If you can gather the LOH from accessories, you can get LpSS from your weapon or helm, that'd be the ideal, IMO. Unfortunately, I don't have much extra LpSS at the moment, only 5 points from my monk-only headgear.
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